Fast talkers... BPD communication

[Youcantfoolme]

This has been something that's been said by many people, when they engage in "conversation" with my brothers bPD wife. I too noticed it early on when I met her. She speaks EXTREMELY fast. Ar times, it's hard to understand her and follow what she's saying. She will just keep talking and talking and it's like she doesn't take a breath I between words. It's almost as if she's trying to fill every second of space up to a avoid being questioned or something. She really doesn't direct her chatter at anyone in particular if she's in a group setting. She's just going and going, mostly talking about her future plans/goals/ideas. I've observed (so have others) that she'll sort of communicate via proxy through my brother. She'll be looking and directing her conversation at him, as if the third person isn't sitting right there. It's sort of hard to explain. It's like she's talking at you but through him. At first I had chalked it up to nervousness but soon later realized, that's how she communicates. I've even watched her do this with her own friends and family.

On the flip side of that, she doesn't let anyone else speak. Everyone that has conversed with her has noticed this. Because she's talking so much, it's almost impossible to get a word in edgewise. If and when she does let you get a word in, she will either finish your sentence or just talk right over you. Her topics shift rapidly too and a lot of the time, you can't even make sense of what she's saying about one thing, because she's already on to the next thing. Conversations are completely one sided.

Is this a normal BpD trait or is it just specific to her?

[Pilate]

The type of speech and communication pattern that you describe, Youcantfoolme, is something that many people can do, I know I do to an extent, when they are extremely nervous and uncomfortable.

I don't know if your sil is diagnosed w/BPD; my sil is not diagnosed w/BPD, but she demonstrates all of the DSM criteria. With that in mind--that my sil is not diagnosed and I am only focusing on her behaviors--my sil also has some of the verbal and conversational traits you describe. My sil is extremely uncomfortable and agitated much of the time when we interact with her in a group. She can say off-the-wall, grandiose, thoughtful, snarky, pitiful, and demeaning comments in a span of 7-10 minutes--and many of the comments may occur when she is not directly engaged with people in conversation. In my experience, I try to engage more positively with her thoughtful comments and occasionally off-the-wall and grandiose comments. It has taken me a long time to get to this place. I used to get sucked in by the pitiful and demeaning comments and freaked out or irritated by the off-the-wall and grandiose comments. I know that my sil is hurting and she has an untreated illness of some sort. I can't fix her, but I can listen to her for small periods of time.

People w/ BPD are highly sensitive and hyper-vigilent; this relates to parts of the disorder in terms of fear of abandonment, lack of self, and toxic shame.  If your sil has BPD and she is not actively engaged in treatment for her illness, she has created coping methods she has developed over her life to compensate for her intense feelings and fears. The type of conversational patterns or habits that you describe are probably self soothing for your sil, and they help make her feel better when she has to interact with people. Your brother might be part of her pattern in order to self soothe. He is probably the person she feels most comfortable with and most fearful of abandonment by, so she focuses on him.

What are you hoping to understand about your sil by learning more about conversation patterns?

[Turkish]

My uBPDX doesn't talk fast, nor does my BPD mother,.who got an under the table Dx over two decades ago by one of her therapists. I have a family friend who is diagnosed with BPD, c-PTSD, and GAD. She doesn't talk like this either.

In the case you describe, however,. it might be both. It's not a BPD trait per se, but it could be her specific coping and soothing mechanism as Pilate said. A personal affectation related to BPD.

[SlyQQ]

Its called pressured speech common to mania normally in BPD the milder hypomania allows you to get a word in when the individual is in an elevated state pressured speech might indicate co morbid bi polar 1 

[rarsweet]

My ex does exactly this but speaks extremely slow , he will talk in an unspecific way. He uses few nouns and overuses adjectives, an example, he won't say he something simple like " I like that shirt" . He will say " it's super amazing, blue is my favorite color, but the light green makes my eyes change color, they aren't brown anymore, they turn yellow with darker sparkles, everyone always tells me my eyes are my best feature, actually most guys don't have eyes like mine, my eyes change all the time, someday when it happens I'll show you, you will be amazed, no one ever understands me, no one really looks at me, my psychic says that's because I'm not like most people, everyone else is simple, I'm not. But she says thisis my year for money so, keep buying and scratching, and someday I'll have the last laugh" and if I said what are you talking about, he would say " see, you aren't listening, its all about you, can't even pay attention"and the whole ttime he will pause every third word or so, so you think he's done, but he isn't. And absolutely no eye contact with anyone. This was a real conversation that I later realized was about a new shirt.

[rarsweet]

One time I told him that I was upset and I needed to talk about it,  he literally sat me down at the kitchen table , he leaned back against the stove, and started talking about how no one understands him and if I paid more attention to him instead of me I would be better off, and somehow the talk involved goat farming, psychics, destiny, karma, ex girlfriends, birthdays,, etc. The thing is I timed him by looking at the clock on the stove and finally said " do you realize you just talked for 48 minutes straight and I haven't said a word? We aren't even talking about why I am upset." And then he got mad and told me "see you're proving my point all you care about is you and sometimes life isn't about you"

[rarsweet]

Lol the all or nothing speaking too, one time he said" you are the only person I have ever known who doesn't laugh at every single one of my jokes"

[rarsweet]

And his conversations are full of quotes from movies. He'll say some line and then stop and ask you what movie it's from and if you don't know he'll go off on a tangent about the movie. And he is completely monotone and expressionless unless he is mad, like he will tell you he is super excited, super hysterical, but he will be flat no emotion like he is talking about the traffic report.

[rarsweet]

He mumbles and his voice will get lower and he'll just stop talking in the middle of a sentence, it's almost as though he doesn't change the subject because there wasn't a subject to begin with. My boss told him he mumbles the first time she met him, he told her to get her hearing checked.

[jdtm]

I believe that "pressured speech" is a sign of anxiety.  Many of those who suffer from BPD also suffer from anxiety (tends to be co-morbid).  Some would say that fast talkers have fast brains (and that may be true); however, a fast brain is not necessarily an intelligent brain.  Just one opinion here ... .

[rarsweet]

I agree with that I had a teacher tell me that you can't learn anything with your mouth moving. I think they overcompensate with unnecessary talking.

[Seoulsister]

Yes, my mother in law is diagnosed Bipolar and BPD and speaks rapidly. Conversations with her are one-sided; she doesn't pause or take breaks in speaking for others to interject. She often projects this nonstop talk onto others saying, "Oh, so and so practically held me hostage and wouldn't stop talking."

I noticed recently that she seems to realize when others have stopped listening because she'll say their name as she's talking, almost like a teacher points out a student to make them pay attention.

[hergestridge]

I recognize the not listening part. She's even had her hearing checked because of it. She's done the ADHD tests too. The thing is she can listen when she wants to. Movie dialogue is not a problem.

[Tim300]

Is this a normal BpD trait or is it just specific to her?

I am not a mental health professional, but my instinct is that this could be a symptom of rapid-cycling bipolar disorder, not BPD.  She could have both.  I had a girlfriend with rapid-cycling bipolar disorder and what you're describing is often how she would communicate.  I have been around a couple BPDs and I didn't see this behavior. 

[eyvindr]

Not much to add here, but wanted to confirm some of what you're saying,

This very accurately describes how my ex talked when she was nervous -- especially if she was triggered and was lecturing or criticizing me about something:

On the flip side of that, she doesn't let anyone else speak. Everyone that has conversed with her has noticed this. Because she's talking so much, it's almost impossible to get a word in edgewise. If and when she does let you get a word in, she will either finish your sentence or just talk right over you. Her topics shift rapidly too and a lot of the time, you can't even make sense of what she's saying about one thing, because she's already on to the next thing. Conversations are completely one sided.

Is this a normal BpD trait or is it just specific to her?

So, no -- not specific to just your SIL. But remember that everyone's different -- and that includes pwBPD. It's not productive to think of them all as being the same, not that you are.

Sly -- this sounds accurate and likely:

Its called pressured speech common to mania

normally in BPD the milder hypomania allows

you to get a word in when the individual is in an elevated state

pressured speech might indicate co morbid  bi polar 1

As does this, Tim300:

I am not a mental health professional, but my instinct is that this could be a symptom of rapid-cycling bipolar disorder, not BPD.  She could have both. I had a girlfriend with rapid-cycling bipolar disorder and what you're describing is often how she would communicate. I have been around a couple BPDs and I didn't see this behavior.

My ex had what I think was an anxiety attack last year, which landed her in the hospital for a few days, during which she was DXd as bipolar, RXd some meds (which she took for less than a week), encouraged to follow up with talk ongoing one-on-one talk therapy (didn't happen). I'll always wonder if she was just pretty high on the BP scale -- she also had lots of anxiety and OCD issues -- or whether she was just a very high-functioning pwBPD. Tough to tease anything clear-cut out with all the comorbidity issues.

rarsweet... .oh dear... .

My ex does exactly this but speaks extremely slow, he will talk in an unspecific way. He uses few nouns and overuses adjectives, an example, he won't say he something simple like "I like that shirt." He will say " it's super amazing, blue is my favorite color, but the light green makes my eyes change color, they aren't brown anymore, they turn yellow with darker sparkles, everyone always tells me my eyes are my best feature, actually most guys don't have eyes like mine, my eyes change all the time, someday when it happens I'll show you, you will be amazed, no one ever understands me, no one really looks at me, my psychic says that's because I'm not like most people, everyone else is simple, I'm not. But she says thisis my year for money so, keep buying and scratching, and someday I'll have the last laugh" and if I said what are you talking about, he would say "see, you aren't listening, its all about you, can't even pay attention" and the whole ttime he will pause every third word or so, so you think he's done, but he isn't. And absolutely no eye contact with anyone. This was a real conversation that I later realized was about a new shirt.

 Helps a little if we can focus on the humorous side of things. Speaking of --

Lol the all or nothing speaking too, one time he said "you are the only person I have ever known who doesn't laugh at every single one of my jokes."

One of the many global statements that my ex made to me, too. Translation: "When you don't laugh at something I think is funny, it makes me feel stupid and embarrassed and invalidates me." Because, remember -- we're supposed to always experience and feel everything in the same way that our partner does. I think this is tied directly to the lack of personal boundaries issue, and mirroring. If someone with BPD is mirroring you, and they say something they think is funny, and you don't laugh, it conflicts with the image they are trying to project -- a crack in the mirror, if you will.

Hang in there.

[rarsweet]

I say they have mouth diarrhea.

[drummerboy]

So glad you posted this! The one real argument we had was when I wanted to talk with her about something that was going on in my life. Within seconds she was interrupting me and turning the conversation around to her issues, her life, I got cross and said "Why is is that you have to talk about YOU all the time?" She did not take this well, the gas lighting started and I said something like "Is it because all your life you've had therapists and your mum that hang off your every word?" At this point she started hyperventilating and had a full blown panic attack, so what started out me trying to share something in my life with her ended up as all about her. Her defining characteristic was she was SO self absorbed, 99% of her conversations were about her life, her issues, her troubles. So glad its over now.

One time I told him that I was upset and I needed to talk about it,  he literally sat me down at the kitchen table , he leaned back against the stove, and started talking about how no one understands him and if I paid more attention to him instead of me I would be better off, and somehow the talk involved goat farming, psychics, destiny, karma, ex girlfriends, birthdays,, etc. The thing is I timed him by looking at the clock on the stove and finally said " do you realize you just talked for 48 minutes straight and I haven't said a word? We aren't even talking about why I am upset." And then he got mad and told me "see you're proving my point all you care about is you and sometimes life isn't about you"

[rarsweet]

I would try to use " I" statements because supposedly that's what you should do, like I am upset, I get sad, I need, etc. That was a mess, it would turn into how everything wasn't about me. Communicating is really an exercise in futility with them. When I was pregnant I said I wanted to go buy a stroller. He told me I didn't need one. I told him since it's summer taking walks would be good for the baby and help me lose the weight. He nonchantly shrugged and said ya well life isn't about you. Lol well I was so stressed out I lost all the weight in three weeks anyway without a stroller.

[rarsweet]

I also noticed, I don't know what to call it, but he would constantly say things like, I'm a nice guy, I am really generous, I am understanding, etc, it was like he was trying to brainwash everyone, us other people we don't do that our actions describe us. Healthy people don't have to telll people what they are or aren't. I can't think of one time I met someone and told them what I am, 

[Tim300]

I also noticed, I don't know what to call it, but he would constantly say things like, I'm a nice guy, I am really generous, I am understanding, etc,

Ha, yeah, I've seen people do this.  Not sure if it was BPD or what, but it's pretty stupid either way.  Just be nice, generous, etc.

[rarsweet]

They really are like kindergardeners aren't they?

[HowCouldYou]

My BPDW does this whenever she talks with anyone! If I am there she will look at me while she is talking to other people as if wanting me to approve of what she is saying. She has pressured speech, dramatic and manic expressions. I know bipolar has this symptom, but for her this is situational, she has an audience.

The theme of the conversation is often, "look how awesome my husband and I are"

I often feel sorry for her when she is on a roll, because it seems obvious that she is crying out for validation that she has value/worth.

[JustDucky]

My ex does exactly this but speaks extremely slow , he will talk in an unspecific way. He uses few nouns and overuses adjectives, an example, he won't say he something simple like " I like that shirt" . He will say " it's super amazing, blue is my favorite color, but the light green makes my eyes change color, they aren't brown anymore, they turn yellow with darker sparkles, everyone always tells me my eyes are my best feature, actually most guys don't have eyes like mine, my eyes change all the time, someday when it happens I'll show you, you will be amazed, no one ever understands me, no one really looks at me, my psychic says that's because I'm not like most people, everyone else is simple, I'm not. But she says thisis my year for money so, keep buying and scratching, and someday I'll have the last laugh" and if I said what are you talking about, he would say " see, you aren't listening, its all about you, can't even pay attention"and the whole ttime he will pause every third word or so, so you think he's done, but he isn't. And absolutely no eye contact with anyone. This was a real conversation that I later realized was about a new shirt.

My MIL is also a very slow talker (in general... she can get faster when she's nutty).  Good grief, to tell one story, it takes FOREVER.  She draws out every word.  She has to tell you all about how all these other people that she knows (who you don't) also went through something similar.  I think she just likes to hear herself talk.  The majority of my husband's phonecalls with her (the ones where she's not screaming at him) involve him sitting there for an hour going "uh huh" every few seconds.

[hope]

My SIL talks at an unbelievably rapid rate and yet at other times talks normally. When she and my MIL are together they engage in a rapid fire conversation which excludes all others. When she (they) behave like that I usually relate to my husband that they are up to something, and more often than not, they are. It is usually that my SIL is about to announce yet another partner change, house move, job change or some financial recklessness that they are trying to conceal. I have attributed the quick speech to stop anyone asking the wrong questions or making comments not to her liking i.e. the truth.

I have also noticed that it is used to derail other conversations to get the subject back to her (them). If someone else is ill, she (they) is worse or she (they) has that too (they don't). If someone has a friend or relative that passes away, she has too (any of these are yet to be proven and they both don't do that as my FIL keeps a check on comments like that from my MIL).

She rarely phones us but when she does something is usually going on and she doesn’t give my husband or I the opportunity to speak. She even asks questions and then answers them herself so there is no break in the speech.

I recall reading in an article or book somewhere that this rapid speech could be part of BPD but unfortunately I can’t find the reference. No one else in the family speaks like this and at times comments are made about no one else being able to get a word in, particularly when they are together.

[beatup]

 Before I knew about BPD... .My uBPDsis told me she was frustrated & disappointed with our Dad during her long distance phone calls with him because "he doesn't talk"! I replied that if she would pause her conversation... .he does talk... .silence from her end of phone... .I sensed the anger...

I remember thinking I don't have that problem with Dad at all and how sad for my sister... .