Just once I'd like to hear...

[Hmcbart]

Just once I'd like to hear her say, "thank you for working 15 hrs Saturday then getting up today and making breakfast for everyone and then mowing the lawn and then cooking dinner and doing the dishes!"

Instead I get, "how much water did you use, you didn't cook it long enough, but thank you for making dinner it was very good".

I guess that's about as much of a compliment as she can do. 

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Verbena]

I feel your frustration.  At least she thanked you and complimented you on the food.

My husband would not compliment me on anything if his life depended on it.  He is also very uncomfortable when others compliment me in his presence.  He's really only comfortable talking to me at all if it is about a negative topic, and he can take anything positive and make it negative.  It's a gift he has. 

[ydrys017]

Just once I'd like to hear her say, "thank you for working 15 hrs Saturday then getting up today and making breakfast for everyone and then mowing the lawn and then cooking dinner and doing the dishes!"

Instead I get, "how much water did you use, you didn't cook it long enough, but thank you for making dinner it was very good".

I guess that's about as much of a compliment as she can do. 

I know exactly how you feel, and I remember those days well.  Now, I ask the kids to pick a restaurant while I'm getting them into the car.  See, I used to do all that stuff with the expectation that dBPDw would appreciate the extra effort of my playing a dual role - never happened.  So, while you will likely need to continue being over productive, you need to tell yourself 'good job, I accomplished all that was necessary - and then some - for myself, my kids and my spouse.'

I enjoy mowing the lawn, some of my best ideas, solutions and thoughts come to mind during the drone of the mower... .

[CastleofGlass]

Just once I'd like to hear her say, "thank you for working 15 hrs Saturday then getting up today and making breakfast for everyone and then mowing the lawn and then cooking dinner and doing the dishes!"

Instead I get, "how much water did you use, you didn't cook it long enough, but thank you for making dinner it was very good".

I guess that's about as much of a compliment as she can do. 

I can completely agree to this as well. My wife is getting ready to give birth to our 5th child and I have been busting my butt around the house and doing as much as I can to keep her off her feet. Saturday we were going to town on moving things around the house and getting everything ready for the new addition. It went great, I had uBPDw laughing most of the day and in great spirits. At the end of the day, she actually did thank me for everything I had been doing lately and that is has been a great help. Sunday morning, we had to take our dogs to a vet clinic. They aren't socialized well at all with other dogs. It was a nightmare. 4 kids, 2 dogs and myself and my uBPDw all in this tiny pet store. The dog I had was lunging at every dog trying to rip it's throat out. I tried to walk around the store to keep him calm, finally I looked at my wife down the aisle as she was trying to corral the other dog and she asked "is this just too much?". I replied, "with this one it is", referring to the dog I had. When I walked out, there she was with the kids and other dog following behind and then she said as we got outside "this was a stupid f'ing idea". My heart sank, I knew what was coming. We got in the car and I said something about sorry it didn't work out. She snapped at me and said "Not when you're acting like a 5 year old in there" and then I replied "don't snap at me" to which I received a "f**k you" in response.  Our whole Sunday was ruined by 10am. No matter what I did, she wouldn't talk to me. She slammed doors, snapped at the kids all day and took a 3 hour nap. We finally talked some last night, but still... .she is still pissed and distant. I hate this. It sucks all happiness and joy from you.

[Notwendy]

My father did probably all of the parenting. By adolescence, we kids knew the difference. I would go to my friends' houses and see their mothers doing things that mine didn't. Thank goodness for some of these other mothers who were role models for me ( aunts, friends) - something to think about for your kids- do they have "other moms" in their lives?

Although my parents' relationship was clearly dysfunctional to me by the time I was old enough to notice, having one caring parent made all the difference to me. I have so many great memories of my father helping me with homework. Yes, gathering the kids in the car to take us to dinner ( while mom was home having a meltdown). Chaperoning a high school dance ( mom didn't attend any of my high school events where parents attended). To weeping for months after his funeral when I felt truly like an orphan with no parents left.

We have some pretty awful memories of my mom, but that is her own doing. Dad wasn't a perfect parent either, no parent is, but to me, he will always be my Daddy, while my mother and I have a different kind of relationship. In the beginning, all kids love their mommies and daddies, but as they get older, I think the relationship has to be formed the way all relationships are- on trust and authenticity.

You may not get your "thank you" from your wife. Your thank you will be in the relationship you build with your kids over time, your future grandkids if you have some.

[DyingLove]

Just once I'd like to hear her say, "thank you for working 15 hrs Saturday then getting up today and making breakfast for everyone and then mowing the lawn and then cooking dinner and doing the dishes!"

Instead I get, "how much water did you use, you didn't cook it long enough, but thank you for making dinner it was very good".

I guess that's about as much of a compliment as she can do. 

Don't ya hate that?

In agreement:

Maybe if she just walked over, tasted the sauce, looked at me, smiled and said, you are the best baby!

She would say, that smells good or that was good, but to recognize a little "deeper" what it is that a person might put into the chores or into the cooking. Would be nice.

I've ALWAYS given her compliments.  "Honey, I just want to tell you again, thanks for stopping off at the store to get my creamer. I really appreciate it."  I would always be elaborate (sincerely though) with compliments and thank yous.  It was good for the 9yo. to hear and see that also.  Kids don't have manners anymore, and I always stressed good manners and good behaviour. She never really acknowledged it.

I think we are not only dealing with their BPD or PD, we are also seeing how they were raised up, maybe in a household with less than "great" manners.  Who knows. We can demonstrate our good upbringing and be proud of that!  :-)

[ydrys017]

... .I would go to my friends' houses and see their mothers doing things that mine didn't. Thank goodness for some of these other mothers who were role models for me ( aunts, friends) - something to think about for your kids- do they have "other moms" in their lives?

... .having one caring parent made all the difference to me.

... .In the beginning, all kids love their mommies and daddies, but as they get older, I think the relationship has to be formed the way all relationships are- on trust and authenticity.

You may not get your "thank you" from your wife. Your thank you will be in the relationship you build with your kids over time

This was great to read, and echoes my ongoing efforts.  Some days I feel as if I've given up on dBPDw, yet I know that if she were to simply be genuinely nice to me without any subtle strings attached, it would be a rekindling.  Until then, I'm in it for my kids, to nurture, protect, and raise them to best of my abilities.

Notwendy, have you read the book "Understanding the Borderline Mother"?  It is excellent, from 3 different perspectives: 1 from having a BPD Mother, 2 from having a BPD spouse, and 3 how your BPD spouse effects your children.

[Notwendy]

I read that book at the time I caught on to momma!

Much of my understanding BPD came from trying to figure out my family. My parents were very invested in presenting my mother as "normal" but as I grew older, I realized this was not normal.

I married someone who is completely different from her in many ways, yet stayed puzzled as to why I was having similar ( albeit not as severe) issues in my own relationship. Really, I looked at me and my FOO first as the cause. If I brought any issues up, H would blame me, so I assumed that being from a dysfunctional situation, it had to be me.

Yet some things didn't add up. H's raging at me, years of painting me black, giving me the ST. I kept thinking why is this man, who thankfully works hard, is highly functional ( mom is not), doesn't behave like her, remind me sometimes of her, and I feel as if I am with her? It was then that I realized that he has some traits, and I have the co-dependent role- something I grew up with.

The other side of the coin with Dad who did everything- we are influenced by our parents' strong and not so strong characteristics. I had two parents, but I didn't want to be like mom, so I looked at Dad. This was a huge incentive to get myself into co-dependency recovery so I do not model this to my kids. H is good to them, he holds it together with them, but I was modeling being a doormat. I also had to take charge of my part of enabling his traits by being co-dependent. Unfortunately for my father, his situation was far less functional and difficult as my mother is on the severe end of the spectrum. Still- co-dependency was something I had to work on and still do. Although this was my task, I still credit dad for all the good he did for me.

[Hmcbart]

yd- my wife mowed the lawn for me once and asked why it took me 3 hours when she did it in half that time. I just smiled and said "it's three hours of silence".

Castle- I think that's what gets to me most. When I'm accused of acting like a 12 y/o. We were with some friends once playing Putt Putt golf. Our friends wife saw me dancing and singing with the kids and made a comment about me being just like them. She meant it as a compliment in a funny nice sort of way, laughing as she said it. My wife chimed in and said that she tells everyone that she has 3 kids at home and not 2. She then followed it up by looking at me and saying "that wasn't meant as a compliment".

I'm now reading the book Stop Caretaking the Borderline/ Narcisist. I am a major Caretaker. I have noticed this in my oldest son as well. I have not been the best role model in this respect and I am working to change this. As far as have other moms that my boys are around as role models, there really aren't any. I work out of town a lot and she doesn't really go anywhere with them. No real friends that they play with they mostly play video games with each other when I'm not home. I have a lot of work to do to change myself and help them change as well.

[Perez]

Although my parents' relationship was clearly dysfunctional to me by the time I was old enough to notice, having one caring parent made all the difference to me. I have so many great memories of my father helping me with homework. Yes, gathering the kids in the car to take us to dinner ( while mom was home having a meltdown). Chaperoning a high school dance ( mom didn't attend any of my high school events where parents attended). To weeping for months after his funeral when I felt truly like an orphan with no parents left.


You may not get your "thank you" from your wife. Your thank you will be in the relationship you build with your kids over time, your future grandkids if you have some.

Notwendy,

Thank you for sharing your memories.  I am trying to be like your Dad, it is what keeps me going.  I have been able to emotionally detach from my wife, what she says  or does usually does not affect me anymore. 

Dealing with her interactions with the kids is a whole other level.  Where to draw the line between respect your Mom and protecting your children requires lots of prudence, patience, and discernment.

[an0ught]

Just once I'd like to hear her say, "thank you for working 15 hrs Saturday then getting up today and making breakfast for everyone and then mowing the lawn and then cooking dinner and doing the dishes!"

You are doing a lot. Maybe you can shift some of it elsewhere. Not everything needs to be done to perfection, particularly her perfection. Boundaries can help to restructure the work.

The way I read this as a perverted form of SET

s

Empathy(not really, self validating and invalidating you) "how much water did you use, you didn't cook it long enough, but

Truth (she can't speak positive before E step) thank you for making dinner it was very good".

compliments should not start out this way. Still it is good that she sees and acknowledges what you are doing.

How do you think she feels about her own contribution level?

[Hmcbart]

How do you think she feels about her own contribution level?

I think she knows that she doesn't contribute like she should or like I think she should. When I brought it up a few weeks ago she said she didn't do anything around the house because she didn't feel appreciated for doing it. She said that why she volunteers so much at the kids school instead of doing things that need to be done at home. She said she feels appreciated there.

This was a bit amusing to me when she said it. I said almost the exact same thing to her last year when I had given up hope that she would ever do anything for me or say anything nice to be for all that I do around the house and for her. It's actually the second time she's taken something I said years ago about how I was feeling and made it about her feelings. I laughed the first time she did it and made her mad. The second time I just kept it to myself.

[an0ught]

I think she knows that she doesn't contribute like she should or like I think she should. When I brought it up a few weeks ago she said she didn't do anything around the house because she didn't feel appreciated for doing it. She said that why she volunteers so much at the kids school instead of doing things that need to be done at home. She said she feels appreciated there.

This was a bit amusing to me when she said it. I said almost the exact same thing to her last year when I had given up hope that she would ever do anything for me or say anything nice to be for all that I do around the house and for her. It's actually the second time she's taken something I said years ago about how I was feeling and made it about her feelings. I laughed the first time she did it and made her mad. The second time I just kept it to myself.

The way I see it is that in the past you validated her. You said exactly what was going on. And now she is able to express it and self validate. Nothing to be laughed at. Building emotional self understanding is often taking the form of baby steps. Her learning to self validate is a long but important process. The fact that she is listening to you and appreciates your insight to an extent that she adopts it is a good sign.

Now how to get her to do more remains still a challenge. She certainly is behaving in a depressed manner and is seeking out validation elsewhere. Turning validation/invalidating ratio in relationship and family communication towards validation is one building block for change. Home must feel less awful. Then responsibility needs to be shifted in some manner which in some sense will involve boundaries - you doing less and suffering the consequences. Depending on the shift consequences could be anything from stuff not done as well to wife initially upset to wife becoming protective of new area etc... .Change is best brought on in a clearly identifiable manner using SET, DEARMAN etc... .It needs to bring validation so that probably requires her having control and earning the applause - shift in a clearly identifiable area or shift for a clearly defined time (maybe in the context of an external crisis where you have to shed responsibilities).

[Hmcbart]

I never looked at it that way. I so used to everything being about her that I just concluded that even when I was upset she made it out to be about he and how she's the victim.

I'm a bit scared of the idea of her seaking validation elsewhere. I know it's with other ladies at the school now but still scares me. As far as I know she's never been unfaithful but the more I read on here the more I second guess my own feelings. I have always had a fear of this, maybe my own abandonment fear or just the humiliation of knowing that she could want to be with someone else.

I guess this is part of breaking free from the Caretaking role and enmeshed life I've been living for so many years.

Thank you for the outside perspective.  

[an0ught]

I'm a bit scared of the idea of her seaking validation elsewhere.

Well, you are seeking validation here... .

... .and do you truly want to carry the whole load of validating her?

[Hmcbart]

Your are correct. And no I can't carry the load any longer.