Something I thought of

[EaglesJuju]

Things have been going pretty well with my bf since the visit.  I have had another unfortunate loss recently. I have been having a hard time coping with two significant losses in my life in such a short period of time. I have been reaching out to my bf for support. My bf has been really depressed lately and tries to support me the best he can. The other night, I found myself getting really frustrated and annoyed by his "lack of validation and support."  

All of a sudden it hit me and the   turned on. As a caretaker/codependent/helper I have very high expectations of what support or validation should be. Actually I base my own expectations off of my own behavior. Honestly, having expectations this high is unreasonable; not many people can live up to that standard.  I started thinking my expectations are similar to his unreasonable expectations when he is idealizing me. I almost set him up to fail with my own expectations, like he has done with me.

Has anyone else thought this?

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[misuniadziubek]

Things have been going pretty well with my bf since the visit.  I have had another unfortunate loss recently. I have been having a hard time coping with two significant losses in my life in such a short period of time. I have been reaching out to my bf for support. My bf has been really depressed lately and tries to support me the best he can. The other night, I found myself getting really frustrated and annoyed by his "lack of validation and support."  

All of a sudden it hit me and the   turned on. As a caretaker/codependent/helper I have very high expectations of what support or validation should be. Actually I base my own expectations off of my own behavior. Honestly, having expectations this high is unreasonable; not many people can live up to that standard.  I started thinking my expectations are similar to his unreasonable expectations when he is idealizing me. I almost set him up to fail with my own expectations, like he has done with me.

Has anyone else thought this?

I'm pretty sure that's a very common issue.

It's kind of like as caretakers we adopt this view that we will do things for others with the expectation that we will be later repaid in some form. Being constantly validating to others means that we expect nothing less in return.

pwBPD have a hard time empathising/validating often because the emotions are too intense to mirror.

If I had a problem and shared it with my bf, I'd probably get a solution first. Empathising with me would make him too sad and depressed.

[pallavirajsinghani]

I agree with you.  Most of the people (including myself... .until I learned better) expect the same methodology from our loved ones that is rightfully given by Counselors, Grief Counselors or other type of clinicians.  And we feel let down because we do not feel that validation.  It is there, we just do not feel it because it has not been given to us in a language we understand.  We try to impose a role of a clinician on our loved ones... .not fair to them, not fair to us.

I learned this lesson in my personal life and now I understand that people can love me, support me, comfort me... .in their own ways little and big... .but they may not be able to take the pain away.  That I expect only a clinician to teach me how to... .

You have just had a fantastic Eureka moment!

[Loosestrife]

Yes, this amazing self reflection 

[married21years]

Yes, this amazing self reflection 

exactly, there is nothing wrong with going elsewhere for validation, i have a Councillor to help me help her. and she is wonderful!

[enlighten me]

I dont think I wanted the same amount of care as I gave. Certainly not when ill but an "are you ok?" Or "can I get you anything?" Rather than do you have to cough so loudly or cant you be ill somewhere else would have been nice.

There expectatoons of us in the idealisation phase are probably mirrored by ours of them. Unfortunately they never mirrored our caring. Mine didnt even try.

[EaglesJuju]

Most of the people (including myself... .until I learned better) expect the same methodology from our loved ones that is rightfully given by Counselors, Grief Counselors or other type of clinicians.  And we feel let down because we do not feel that validation.  It is there, we just do not feel it because it has not been given to us in a language we understand.  We try to impose a role of a clinician on our loved ones... .not fair to them, not fair to us.

You described exactly the level of expectations that I have with my bf and certain loved ones. That has been a huge problem that I struggle with. I have been stuck with my own way of thinking for quite some time and have ignored times where my bf has told me that he does not cope with certain emotions/feelings very well.

When I omit my unreasonable expectations, I find that my bf actually does a really good job validating and supporting me. I realized he just reciprocates validation, support, and empathy in a different way than I do. I think his way of being supportive, validating, and empathetic are many times based on the situation. If he is struggling with his emotions/feelings and the situation directly adds to those feelings/emotions, the level of support is not as evident as it would be if he was not.

[vortex of confusion]

All of a sudden it hit me and the   turned on. As a caretaker/codependent/helper I have very high expectations of what support or validation should be. Actually I base my own expectations off of my own behavior. Honestly, having expectations this high is unreasonable; not many people can live up to that standard.  I started thinking my expectations are similar to his unreasonable expectations when he is idealizing me. I almost set him up to fail with my own expectations, like he has done with me.

Has anyone else thought this?

I have had that thought. I have spent years thinking that my expectations were too high. I kept lowering them and lowering them until I had no expectations, no standards, and no boundaries. Any time I would think about raising the bar, I would talk myself out of it by telling myself that my standards were too high.

[Ceruleanblue]

There was a point where I had no expectations of BPDh, and he still managed to disappoint me with his outrageous behaviors. I think it's hard to have zero expectations of someone? Hard as we try, we have this image in our heads of "normal" reactions(meaning things within the norm, not just what we would do). People with BPD just seem to act totally outside what us nons think of as normal. But sadly, that is their normal.

I tend to give, thinking that BPDh will reciprocate the same way, but of course he likely never will. He's incapable, or unwilling to do so. If he met my emotional needs in others ways, that lack would be easier to overcome, but it feels like it's all me giving emotionally, and him taking, but giving nothing back. I'm learning to meet my own needs, and keep my relationships with others intact(even if he doesn't like it), because clearly as of now, any emotional needs won't be met by him.

I want to think once they've had enough therapy, we can have some slight expectations, and maybe won't be let down. My BPDh is in DBT for a year, so I'm not to that point yet. Maybe he'll never get there, maybe he will. At this point, I'm just so happy that his rages and anger have lessened. Having a few expectations met would just be icing on the cake for me.

[an0ught]

Things have been going pretty well with my bf since the visit.  I have had another unfortunate loss recently. I have been having a hard time coping with two significant losses in my life in such a short period of time. I have been reaching out to my bf for support. My bf has been really depressed lately and tries to support me the best he can. The other night, I found myself getting really frustrated and annoyed by his "lack of validation and support."  

All of a sudden it hit me and the   turned on. As a caretaker/codependent/helper I have very high expectations of what support or validation should be. Actually I base my own expectations off of my own behavior. Honestly, having expectations this high is unreasonable; not many people can live up to that standard.  I started thinking my expectations are similar to his unreasonable expectations when he is idealizing me. I almost set him up to fail with my own expectations, like he has done with me.

When dealing with low self esteem it is said that the so called "inner critic" plays a big role in undermining ourselves. To deal with it it is recommended to judge others less. The more we judge others the more we strengthen the inner critic who will turn on us as soon as the attention turns inwards.

I believe there is a real need to have very, very good validation skills when in a relationship with a pwBPD. Being on that level also helps you in other areas of your life. Getting on that level requires willingness, learning and practice, practice and practice. Our relationships are intense and the learning one goes through on this board can be also intense for someone who steps up to it. You are giving feedback that touches the core of others and you are receiving feedback that touches your core. We need to challenge ourselves and also be critical at times. It takes attentive listening, willingness to be vulnerable, being careful and also to take the risk to be wrong. Learning has to be intense to a degree - it is more effective that way.

There is an intensity where focus on validation can turn against us. Focus becomes unhealthy perfectionism. Good judgment turning into b&w thinking. We are not professionals but by necessity of our living situation we are practicing certain skills in an intense manner. Intense is good but is super, super intense better? In many professions people move up to a certain level based on functional skills - then this levels off and what becomes more important is to be wise. Balancing competing interests and points of view. Balancing compassion and judgment. Balanced self judgment too  .

[formflier]

 

EaglesJuJu,

Great topic.  My educational background is in communications.  That has been my professional focus in the Navy for most of my career (keeping thousands of people on same page... .communicating effectively)

For a long time... .I erroneously though that I could just educate my wife on how to communicate with me... .and our problems would vanish.

It's not that my expectations were wrong... .but I had to realize my wife doesn't share them. 

I see very similar thinking in this thread... .as caretakers... .we expect big things when we need to be taken care of... .that's a fine thing to expect.

It's not a bad thing if our partners don't agree... .it's just not their thing.  Hopefully we can see... .or acknowledge that they are trying... .in their own way.