She Wants Rings, Marriage and Kids

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hello,

In a mini dilemma here. If you followed my older posts, my bipolar exgf left town back in late October to move 2 hours away from here. She went from a great full time job downtown to a highly stressful call centre there.

She told me that I was ugly, that she deserved better and felt she would meet "the right guy" where she moved to. This is a person that was intimate with me off and on for just over 6 years! She said that everything that I did was annoying.

Fast forward two months and she unblocks me from Facebook, starts talking about liking speaking to me. We did not start as friends but our relationship had a strong friendship-quality from the very beginning. My New Year's gift was her new phone number, which she said I could text but let her know if I was going to call her with advanced notice.

Since then she has been telling me parts of her life, how her call centre job bombed, how we needed to work on things and she would need space when she asks for it, etc.

Now she seems to urgently want kids and for us to buy a ring and a marriage licence. She lives two hours away. I am reluctant to buy a ring because I bought her a promise ring and an expensive engagement ring ($800+ back then, probably worth $1200+ now because it is an amazing ring). Shortly after I gave her the engagement ring things soured fast!

Is it possible that this can last? She has already bought a $384 dollar ring and wants me to buy the ring that goes with it too. When I said that I wanted kids and marriage separately, she said 'sign me up' both times. How can I do this without it going to hell?

[rosesarered777]

Hello,

In a mini dilemma here. If you followed my older posts, my bipolar exgf left town back in late October to move 2 hours away from here. She went from a great full time job downtown to a highly stressful call centre there.

She told me that I was ugly, that she deserved better and felt she would meet "the right guy" where she moved to. This is a person that was intimate with me off and on for just over 6 years! She said that everything that I did was annoying.

Fast forward two months and she unblocks me from Facebook, starts talking about liking speaking to me. We did not start as friends but our relationship had a strong friendship-quality from the very beginning. My New Year's gift was her new phone number, which she said I could text but let her know if I was going to call her with advanced notice.

Since then she has been telling me parts of her life, how her call centre job bombed, how we needed to work on things and she would need space when she asks for it, etc.

Now she seems to urgently want kids and for us to buy a ring and a marriage licence. She lives two hours away. I am reluctant to buy a ring because I bought her a promise ring and an expensive engagement ring ($800+ back then, probably worth $1200+ now because it is an amazing ring). Shortly after I gave her the engagement ring things soured fast!

Is it possible that this can last? She has already bought a $384 dollar ring and wants me to buy the ring that goes with it too. When I said that I wanted kids and marriage separately, she said 'sign me up' both times. How can I do this without it going to hell?

[Zen80]

I'll be honest here.

No it won't last. Yes your life will be miserable. Move on if you can and don't look back.

[Turkish]

First, it sounds like she has split you white (for now)... You've experienced splitting before.

Second, and this is the most important question, what do you want, regardless of anybody else?

[rosesarered777]

First, it sounds like she has split you white (for now)... You've experienced splitting before.

Second, and this is the most important question, what do you want, regardless of anybody else?

To answer to first fellow:

I suppose this won't last. However, I will only be seeing her for 3 days so I am hoping that I won't be split black in that time. She wants me to buy a ring and get a marriage licence in that time. Then the next time I see her, she wants a civil marriage. The licence only lasts 3 months so it is a big deal to pay that much for something that may not happen.

I am surprised that she has bought (supposedly) a $384 ring. She said she did that and now says she doesn't want to move in until I am established in her city.

I do want to be with her and let her know that getting a divorce would cost $1000's compared to the cost of a civil wedding ceremony.

[HopefulDad]

Assuming she put no pressure on you, do you want to *marry* her?  Or do you want to continue to see how things go?  Are you letting her pressure dictate your decisions within a direction you are not comfortable?

Having been through marriage and divorce with my BPDxw, I can tell you that I will never be threatened or pushed into marriage.  When I'm ready, then I'm ready.  If my love interest's timetable is different and she's willing to leave because I'm not ready, then I'm fine with that.

[rosesarered777]

I do wish to marry her. It is what we have been talking about for years and years. I am just concerned that she will paint me black if I pay for this marriage license mostly.

[steve195915]

I do wish to marry her. It is what we have been talking about for years and years. I am just concerned that she will paint me black if I pay for this marriage license mostly.

It's so obvious as an outside observer what's going on but when you are emotionally involved it's really difficult to accept the facts. 

The facts are that your relationship didn't work out and she left.  Now her "new" life isn't working out as she had hoped so now it's time to try you again.  I think you sort of know that if you do get back together with her, she will eventually paint you black and you'll be emotionally devastated again, and financially distressed as well   Why do you think things will be different this time vs the first time?  Marriage and children won't make a relationship work, usually it makes things much worse.  I also think you somewhat know that a marriage with her will be full of pain and chaos but it's so hard to accept it when you feel for her so much.  It's almost like we can say it, and think it, but somehow we don't accept it and think everything will be alright.  There's nothing that anyone can say that will make you change your ultimate decision.  The only thing I suggest is you set a date in the future so at least you give your relationship some time to see how it goes.  What if you suggest to her that you get engaged and set the date in the future 8 -12 months to allow you time to get situated in her city and for you too to get closer so you have a great marriage.  You should not ever get married because you are pressured. 

You asked is it possible to work out?  Yes anything is possible but you should expect at best a very rocky relationship and you better work on yourself to accept her illness and learn how to respond that won't make matters worse.  Most likely it won't work and you'll regret the decision to be with her but again it's only you that can make that choice.  Yes it's so hard to walk away from someone that you feel so deeply about. 

[tryingsome]

Why do you want to marry her besides love?

Love is a cop out answer here. When you say that it means you don't actually know why.

So what attracts you to this person?

She said you were annoying.

And she will find the right guy.

Are you trying to prove you are the right guy?

Understanding relationships is understanding yourself.

[unicorn2014]

I don't think a marriage should be a financial transaction. That sounds fishy to me. It sounds to me like she's treating you like a meal ticket which is a bad idea. It talks about not allowing others to depend on you in the article on healthy relationships. Have you read that one yet?

[rosesarered777]

I am fully aware of her manipulative nature. I have no doubt she is looking for a sugar daddy but I don't want to marry or date anyone else.

[unicorn2014]

I am fully aware of her manipulative nature. I have no doubt she is looking for a sugar daddy but I don't want to marry or date anyone else.

I think there is a difference between a meal ticket and a sugar daddy. I have read that women with untreated  BPD are incapable of financially supporting themselves. Have you done work around evaluating why you want to be in the relationship? There is a really good post that talks about the reasons that we stay in BPD relationships. I know from my own experience that the answer to that question can be a bottomless pit that represents a lot of hard work to get out of. If you have any codependent tendencies at all i would caution you to take a very hard look at them before proposing marriage to this woman. Having been through one failed marriage to a disordered person I would strongly caution against marrying a person who has disorder who is either in denial about it or has not taken steps to treat it. The prognosis is not good. Marriage ups the ante to a whole new level, then you become morally and legally obligated to the other person.

[Zen80]

To the OP,

Sometimes you need to see things for what they are, and not what you want them to be.

Which is not always easy to do - I think those of us that end up in relationships with pwBPD tend to always think that the person could be this or the relationship could be that and hang onto the hope of what things could be like.

[Turkish]

To the OP,

Sometimes you need to see things for what they are, and not what you want them to be.

Which is not always easy to do - I think those of us that end up in relationships with pwBPD tend to always think that the person could be this or the relationship could be that and hang onto the hope of what things could be like.

My T had me see that I was expecting my Ex to be someone she was not; pwBPD probably see us this way. Truthfully, most relationships break down due to missing the target of failed expectations. Accepting the other person for who they are is crucial, PD ot not. If you've radically accepted who she is, rar777, then that's a good foundation.

We can radically accept the reality at hand; it's known. What is unknown is the future. A marriage may work, based upon the work that you do both on yourself, and when interacting with her. The act of marriage in and of itself won't. Nor will having children, which is a life-changing stressor. That is a whole other issue... .

In addition to members' experiences, there are books in our review section which you can read to see some of what it takes to work towards a healthier r/s with a person with BPD or NPD. Martiage can be taken back. Kids can't. Lots of things to consider here.

[HopefulDad]

I am fully aware of her manipulative nature. I have no doubt she is looking for a sugar daddy but I don't want to marry or date anyone else.

Try to step outside of yourself and imagine a family member or good friend saying this to you.  What would your reaction be?

[Knight]

I tend to feel the same way about not wanting to be with anyone but my pwBPD ex gf.

But I left -her-

Why did I leave her?  Because the more I learned, the more I realized the behavior was not going to stop.  All the things that she does that are unacceptable to me are going to continue forever.

Even though mine is the most awesome girlfriend; hands down THE most awesome... .  She is only awesome 40% of the time.  The other 60% is a nightmare.

So I moved on.

Your choice is your choice.  It's been quiet with her gone, but try to remember the worst days with her.  Is that what you want?

[steve195915]

I tend to feel the same way about not wanting to be with anyone but my pwBPD ex gf.

But I left -her-

Why did I leave her?  Because the more I learned, the more I realized the behavior was not going to stop.  All the things that she does that are unacceptable to me are going to continue forever.

Even though mine is the most awesome girlfriend; hands down THE most awesome... .  She is only awesome 40% of the time.  The other 60% is a nightmare.

So I moved on.

Interesting way to look at it but I always ask myself if the positives outweigh the negatives.  Mine is maybe 30% awesome, 40% normal, and 30% an absolute nightmare.  I still have contact with mine but no way will I live with her or marry her or put myself in a position where I would be stuck.  Definitely a tough call though as the awesome is very awesome! 

[rosesarered777]

She was awesome all weekend. Neither of our families know that we went to City Hall, got a marriage licence, bought a temporary ring from Walmart and a real gold band from Peoples. Now we both have proper rings that we will wear for the marriage.

She said that she was angry at me and that is why she left. She said she did not stop loving me. I asked her why she came back and she said that a friend of hers told a story about an off-and-on-again relationship that eventually turned into a blissful marriage.

The account that I thought was hers was not surprisingly hers. I showed her the conversation I had with the account and she was shocked that the person was speaking to me. It seemed genuine. We we outside waiting for the bus at the time when I showed her my 'text dump' of the conversation that I had.

In the past, we would sometimes have a really good day and then a bad day. I also wanted her to meet some of my friends over the weekend and she said she had work videos and quizes to do. The old me would have been pushy and demanded that she come and meet these guys. The newer me (from the last year or so) said that I understood how she wouldn't want to go due to her work and said I'll see her afterwards.

She says she really misses me and is super excited for our marriage. When we were waiting for my bus, she said she forgave me for sleeping in at her Aunt's place years ago... .So that's a huge step forward for her to forgive me for something she has never let go before.

We definitely both cheer each other up. I remarked on Saturday how she seemed down when we met this weekend but after we were around each other for a day, we both seemed 1000% times happier. I still feel like a billion dollars after this weekend.

[Turkish]

Now that you are committed, it would probably be good to close this out and start posting on Improving. Thanks for the update. 

[Euler2718]

Why did I leave her?  Because the more I learned, the more I realized the behavior was not going to stop.  All the things that she does that are unacceptable to me are going to continue forever.

They'll wear you down to a little nub, then discard you. The longer you hang around, the less of you there'll be. Of course I still think about it -- like maybe she's special and high-functioning and could make it work. the rest of my brain knows that's insane.

[Circle]

Hi,

I haven't read the whole thread; just your original post.

If this is a person w/BPD, you don't want to get married to them.

You have to keep your boundaries up. Which means, not trying to please them too much.

Do what is right for yourself. If they depart, you will survive, be patient and they will come back around. Just keep being kind. Keep calm and don't get sucked into fighting. Leave the premises when things get too fired up.

But don't lock yourself into anything as foolish as marriage with a BPD person.

Unless you want to lock yourself into Hell. Be wise; you are worth having happiness. Finding happiness means you have to figure out for yourself what your limits are in relation to this person. If you don't want them to spend the night, that's a limit. If you don't want to give them money, that's a limit. If you don't want to say 'I love you', that's a limit. Whatever your limits are, keep them; they are your boundaries. You gotta figure out what you won't accept, and stick with it.

Stay strong! You can do it!