It's been a while... Lots happened, and is she a Psychopath?

[GoingBack2OC]

Sorry for the novella length post-- a lot of things have happened. Some borderline insane. So here goes:

It's been a while since I've posted here. It's also been a while since my ex gfuBPD discarded me before the holidays.

Since then, I've been on such an emotional roller coaster. I knew I shouldnt have, I even told her the first time we saw each-other after she dumped me and gave me roughly a month of total silence; that I thought in the end she would hurt me.

We saw each other maybe a half dozen times from January to March. Each time I got my fix in terms of "missing the person I was in love in", the physical intimacy, the warmth, but each time I left I had a deep feeling of sadness and shame. I knew up front that she did not have any care or concern for my feelings or state of well being. She would say such nice things to me, but they would come across almost "generic", phony. On my birthday she sent me an email in the morning, telling me all the things she loved about me-- and while reading it I felt this could be about anyone. "She loved my sense of humor, how I make each day brighter, lift her up" all very-- this could be anyone statements.

There was also... .A lot of games, and now, in many ways, I am convinced (or nearly) that my uBPDex is actually a Psychopath.

So that's my question... .do Psychopathy and BPD run hand in hand, and do any of you have experiences with it, or is it that BPDs just come of as psychopaths/sociopaths; reflections of their BPD traits.

During the last few months:

My Exgf told me she (we) had actually gotten pregnant about a year ago, but there was a complication (wont go into details), and it had to be terminated. I was heartbroken. I started to cry on the phone. She seemed perplexed -- and -- irritated by this... .almost like (oh god look I dont have time for your emotions). After that- 7 days of silence. After telling me this HUGE news, she just disappeared.

When I finally did hear back from her:  "I was joking".  She claimed it was a lie. I was angry, I didnt know if she was lying then, or lying now (she is and always has been a pathological liar of the worst kind).  She was actually angry at me for being upset about it. Again I felt I was being cornered into -me- saying I'm sorry. "I'm sorry for making you feel like you had to lie to me and to tell me we got pregnant, created life, and that you never told me, kept it a secret, aborted it, never told me, then told me, then told me it was all make believe... .I'm very sorry I made you feel you had to do that."

The most insane thing I think she's ever said was on that call. I was crying... .and I told her how hurt I was hearing that news. That she felt she couldnt tell me, and she had to go through the medical process alone, I would have been there. I told her how hurt I was that she would make me think all that, then just go silent, and then tell me it was actually not true.  I spent the whole week in bed- literally.

I said: "You have no idea how much what you told me hurt me".

She responded:  "It really hurt me too".

HELLO?

How could it possibly hurt you if you were just making up a story?  Sorry. There was so much of this during our insane relationship. She would literally just make up lies... .I am not talking about lying like -where you were - what her plans are for today - etc. I am talking about Pure Fiction. 

She told me she cheated on me with her ex during our first year... .a year after it happened. Then a few days later she said it was a lie. (But the story was highly detailed).

She told me her parents were forcing her into an arranged marriage (which I though was insane who does that). She had an entire story all roadmaped out- who he was, his family connection, what he does, all the details. That her parents were worried that I was taking too long to put a ring on the finger... .and if it didnt happen by X she was contracted to marry this other man.  Then- a lie. She was lying.

She literally made me insane. I still feel insane. I feel like I have been violated I really do.

So 2 weeks ago she flew off to the bahamas with her "parents", and I havent talked to her since. (She didnt go with her parents- a lie she admitted to but refused to tell me who she was going with).

So I guess the reason I ask about the Psychopathy aspect: Those kind of lies, they are just too pre-meditated. Like she was thinking well in advance what she could do or say to hurt me. To tell me she's going on a great vacation, but make it fishy... .so I'd be hurt as to why I wasnt invited. To tell me I had at one point been pregnant with her, all the details of what happened, and then to say it was a lie. As if I was out of line for being upset or hurt.

She vehemently claimed she was not a liar in general. And she only lied to me because she has to because of A B C. (Lie).  But since she broke up with me before the holidays, she has kept the fact that she was seeing me a secret from all her family and friends. Her mom and dad. I asked her:  "If that's true, then why do you lie to your parents? Why do you lie, for months, to your mom and dad?  You havent told them you've seen, in fact you've told them you are doing great, moving on, etc." She just said: "Well what do you want me to do not see you?"   - Oh ok again your lies are my fault.

It seems like the actions of an emotionally void Psychopath. She was always so incredibly shocked that I would be become upset with these lies.

In the end, 2 weeks now of No Contact. I'm holding strong. I trying my best. I am actually starting to make progress. I cleaned up my condo. I am getting ready to move.

Yesterday in the wholefoods I was standing in line behind such a beautiful young woman, probably just out of college. It reminded me that there are people out there who can make me forget about "her" and all the pain she caused.

I perked my shoulders up, when she turned around for a second I made direct eye contact and smiled. I tried to remind myself to be the confident awesome person I used to be. She quickly looked away. Then a minute later, she looked back again, and made eye contact again-- and held it, and smiled back.

We didnt talk, but that little moment, just making eye contact with someone who I just felt like I'd love to talk to, to know, reminded me I'm going to be ok.

For those of you who are struggling... .You are not alone. We've been manipulated, violated, pieces of our soul were stolen from us. Our ex's robbed us in many ways, of happiness, of a future we hoped for, of life, of time. We've been lied to, screwed with, called the most horrible names. We've been victimized by being blamed, ridiculed, shamed, taunted. It's not fair. What happened to us. Because it wasnt like that when we fell in love. People don't fall in love with that. That-- was the first lie. Of them pretending to be someone they were not.

But also for those who are struggling... .that little moment for me, not making eye contact the first time and she looked away, but when she turned around again, and I smiled again... .confidence... .and that time she smiled back, she seemed flattered, in a blushing sort of way. In that tiny moment I forgot completely about my ex... .and just wanted to talk to someone knew.

So as hard as it is, get out of the house. Go to a cool coffee shop. Just interact with people. Work on confidence, little by little. Meet people.

I am still hurting, daily, by what my ex put me through and took from me. But I know time will heal. Time heals. And it's not because the passage of minutes, hours, days and months. Its because of moments. In time, you will have moments, that will remind you of the good, remind you of your old hopes and dreams, moments that remind you that you too can be ok and still have a great life, and I know in time, there will be a moment, a moment where I'll again be standing next to a pretty girl, and I'll be ready to do more than just smile.

[NCEA]

This might be silly but she doesn't sound to me disordered, but just plain dumb. Does she display other traits? Identity issues, self harm, substance abuse, etc... .

[Violettine]

This might be silly but she doesn't sound to me disordered, but just plain dumb. Does she display other traits? Identity issues, self harm, substance abuse, etc... .

Yes, doesn't sound like ASPD (psychopathy) to me, but definitely emotionally stunted. BPD, maybe. Who knows?

[WoundedBibi]

Most of us here (if any) are not professionally trained to assess others on psychiatric issues.

A psychopath is a very different type of personality than a BPD.

PwBPD are very capable of playing games. Especially the 'game' which makes you wonder which part was a lie. It's all about control. As long as you're busy wondering about the lies you're distracted from seeing through her and as long as you're busy with the lies you're pouring energy into it which she feeds off; narcissistic supply.

All I can conclude from what you wrote is that she lies. A lot. About anything. That would lead me in the direction of a compulsive liar. Not a pathological one but a compulsive one; they are not the same. Compulsive lying is a symptom of an underlying mental illness. This can be a lot of different things, such as BPD.

What would be the benefit for you to "assess" your ex as being a psychopath instead of BPD? In other words: what does it matter?

She lied to you. A lot. About anything. That is no basis for any relationship.

The relationship is over, what mental illness she has is no longer important. You will never get a diagnosis from a psychiatrist for her so stop trying to make one yourself. It is not going to be accurate and chances are you are going to get it very wrong.

What is important is how you are going to move away and detach from having been in a relationship with a mentally ill person. And why you got into a relationship with a mentally ill person in the first place so you can prevent it from ever happening again.

[HarleypsychRN]

GoingbacktoOC,

Yes, there can be co-occurring pathologies (such as what they refer to as the "dark triad"... .BPD, anti-social PD, and OCD).

The bigger question may be why you find her so appealing knowing she is so unhealthy. You deserve better... .we all know how hard it is to detach, but to keep putting yourself through the cycle will suck the emotional life right out of you. I finally came to the realization after two ah-ha moments in four days, that she was toxic and that continuing to pine and wish for her return was toxic for my well being.

"The calendar changes, they don't"- Unknown

[NCEA]

GoingbacktoOC,

The bigger question may be why you find her so appealing knowing she is so unhealthy. You deserve better... .

"The calendar changes, they don't"- Unknown

Don't want to hijack the thread but I want to answer this for myself.

I didn't have contact with my exBPD for 3-4 days now as she's travelling and we went low contact. I woke up at 4:30 am, with no other reason than thinking if she was ok and wanting to know that she is.

As a partner or even just as a friend she can be goddamn awful. But she's trying. Meditating, stopped having sex, stopped dating, goes on long stretches without alcohol. We spoke about her being BPD and going to do CBT.

If she didn't show sings of wanting to be better, I would have cut it all together.

But yes, when they're just totally on the dark side of the force, it's better to cut it and never look back.

[wanttoknowmore]

Telling lies is a normal human behavior as almost everyone lies at times ,some more often,some rarely.

The more important issue is "WHY SOME ONE IS LYING ... .WHAT'S THE PURPOSE ?"

Psychopath lies to take advantage /exploit the other for his/her personal or material benefit and lies consciously with full knowledge that he/she is lying.

On the other hand, pwBPD lies for all the different purpose... .to gain attention or to test a lovers devotion or simply to create drama.

They lie when they are emotionally overwhelmed and trying to create a mini break up settle their out of control feelings.

pwBPD mostly have  no conscious knowledge and purpose is not purely to hurt the partner (BTW,sometimes it is ... .if pwBPD has some psychopathic traits)

lies and distortion of facts is part of the BPD condition.

[Violettine]

PwBPD often lie because they're afraid of being judged as a bad/inferior/unworthy person. They'll hide things so their SO doesn't leave. But if they're lying to make themselves seem "worse," maybe it's what was said above, or maybe they just don't know it comes off that way. To her, maybe she's the woman, so she's the one carrying the embryo/fetus, and her feelings are the only ones that truly matter. If the partner's feelings do matter, it's his feelings for her--she thinks he'll dote on her rather than on the loss of the embryo/fetus/potential baby.

Telling lies is a normal human behavior as almost everyone lies at times ,some more often,some rarely.

The more important issue is "WHY SOME ONE IS LYING ... .WHAT'S THE PURPOSE ?"

Psychopath lies to take advantage /exploit the other for his/her personal or material benefit and lies consciously with full knowledge that he/she is lying.

On the other hand, pwBPD lies for all the different purpose... .to gain attention or to test a lovers devotion or simply to create drama.

They lie when they are emotionally overwhelmed and trying to create a mini break up settle their out of control feelings.

pwBPD mostly have  no conscious knowledge and purpose is not purely to hurt the partner (BTW,sometimes it is ... .if pwBPD has some psychopathic traits)

lies and distortion of facts is part of the BPD condition.

[GoingBack2OC]

PwBPD often lie because they're afraid of being judged as a bad/inferior/unworthy person. They'll hide things so their SO doesn't leave. But if they're lying to make themselves seem "worse," maybe it's what was said above, or maybe they just don't know it comes off that way. To her, maybe she's the woman, so she's the one carrying the embryo/fetus, and her feelings are the only ones that truly matter. If the partner's feelings do matter, it's his feelings for her--she thinks he'll dote on her rather than on the loss of the embryo/fetus/potential baby.

Telling lies is a normal human behavior as almost everyone lies at times ,some more often,some rarely.

The more important issue is "WHY SOME ONE IS LYING ... .WHAT'S THE PURPOSE ?"

Psychopath lies to take advantage /exploit the other for his/her personal or material benefit and lies consciously with full knowledge that he/she is lying.

On the other hand, pwBPD lies for all the different purpose... .to gain attention or to test a lovers devotion or simply to create drama.

They lie when they are emotionally overwhelmed and trying to create a mini break up settle their out of control feelings.

pwBPD mostly have  no conscious knowledge and purpose is not purely to hurt the partner (BTW,sometimes it is ... .if pwBPD has some psychopathic traits)

lies and distortion of facts is part of the BPD condition.

I guess what just perplexes me is why she told the lies she did. I mean, it just came off as absolutely "purposeless" - as in, what good outcome could ever, come out of such a story.

She would lie about all sorts of things. If she had a trip for work, and was actually leaving on Wednesday, she would tell me she was leaving Monday, so I would think she was out of town and "expect" nothing from her.

I was never a needy/clingy person, in any releationship, ever. Ive only been in long term monogamous relationships, where fighting and arguing rarely took place. But by the end of my 5 years with her, I was literally stripped away of all confidence, self esteem, good judgement, I have let my emotions take control and acted out of line regardless of what craziness she was pulling this week or that week.

I ended up becoming clingy, needy, because by the end she was nothing but a vapor in my life. Giving me only small fragments of herself, always busy, always giving the silent treatment. Always had plans. Pushing me away basically, while at the same time would say such loving things, I was naive in retrospect.

I'd just never dealt with anyone, ever, on any level like this before. The lies were beyond normal even in a pathological/compulsive sense.

She crafted stories. She spent time thinking them up. Then she would release them. Always planned to incite a reaction of being upset, stressful, angry, sad. Basically anything that would get a rise out of me, and I've always been such a level headed person, calm, good at communicating with people. But when your gf of 5 years tells you a week after christmas she was pregnant a year ago, and it had to be aborted, goes silent, for a week, just to let me go crazy, then says, she made it up, it was a lie. Her reason... .because.

So in the end I saw it as deliberate actions on her part to hurt me, with no care for my feelings or well being. And after, no remorse. I asked for an apology in a text message. She called (after one of these insane stories), and she said "Look I am sorry, but I'm not sure what to be sorry for".

Clueless.

[Violettine]

If she really has BPD, she probably doesn't know why any of this would bother you. The part of her that "carefully crafts" is not communicating with the part that doesn't know why you'd care.

IF it's just BPD... .