Manipulation 101

[JerryRG]

Hello everyone

I was thinking how naive I am about manipulation and I wish I could be educated in it. When it happens I'm the last one to know.

Just have no filter for it.

Wonder if there's something I can read or how can I educate myself so I can establish effective bounderies.

[fromheeltoheal]

I can relate Jerry; when we don't pay attention to what's really going on we can appear naive and can definitely be susceptible to manipulation.  That was one of the upsides of the relationship with my ex: she was always 'workin' it', looking for angles, trying to manipulate, never open and honest, and it was so blatant after a while that noticing it was unavoidable, which really helped me moving forward.

Naivety has a negative connotation, as does ignorance, but really the core of those terms is we just don't know.  There's plenty of things we don't know, not a bad thing really, we can learn whatever we want, it's just a matter of focusing on them.  So more accurately for me is to realize and accept that I had abandoned myself, not only in the relationship, but stretching back decades.  Self-abandonment is not good, it leads to putting other people's needs ahead of our own, codependency, and being manipulated as mentioned.  So what's the answer?  Fully own ourselves and our emotions, which are never wrong, and reinhabiting our bodies and how we feel in the moment, which can tell us a great deal about ourselves and what's really going on.  Hell, if I'd done that with my ex we wouldn't have made it past the second date, but noo, there were lessons to learn, which I'm grateful for.

We weren't born yesterday and we pretty much know when someone's being honest and open with us, or not, even if we have to rely on our gut feel to be sure, and relying on our gut feel means we need to be fully in our bodies and self-aware, not hard really, just a choice, and if we haven't done that in a while it may take some practice, the best kind of practice.

So do you really not have a filter, or would you if you decided to not abandon yourself anymore and pay attention?

[JerryRG]

Thanks fromheeltoheal

I guess in my case I deliberately overlooked the obvious lies because I truly believed she would change. She continues to this very day. She finally texted me around 1pm and said her phone reset itself deleting my number and all her pictures. Highly unlikely but par for the coarse.

[fromheeltoheal]

She finally texted me around 1pm and said her phone reset itself deleting my number and all her pictures. Highly unlikely but par for the coarse.

If her phone didn't reset then that doesn't sound like manipulation, it sounds like a lie.  Is that OK with you?

You said you believed she would change, which is past tense, implying you no longer believe it, and I don't know your whole story, but is there a reason to be exchanging texts with her anymore?

[JerryRG]

Hello fromheeltoheal

We share custody of a 2 year old boy, and yes she lied and she's pathological and I'm not sure if she realizes she's lying. What ever comes to mind blurts out of her mouth.

Feelings = facts

[Herodias]

If she is pathologically lying then yes- it's a manipulation. Compulsive lying is more BPD because they do it out of habit. Google the two. Trust your gut. If it doesn't make logical sense then it isn't true- she just wants you to believe her and when you do she will think you are dumb. If you don't and argue with her then you're mean and it starts a bigger argument. You can't win. You're best bet is to just say you'll have to think about that or say sure. Don't engage really. If you can help it. I'm worried about you're getting caught in the web again. I know you said no way, but you are engaging allot. You are really focused on getting along for your son and that is good, but you can't normalize her and shouldn't try and make sense of what she does it says. I've been accused of this too. We can't fix them and we can't understand what goes on in their heads. Don't even try. Just reply with non emotion and non commital comments if you can.