Credit Card Bills

[Verbena]

I discovered over the weekend that my husband has run up our joint credit card and cannot pay it off this month.  I called and tried to get my name removed from the card.  At first I was told that would not be a problem but since he is the primary card holder, he would have to authorize my name being removed.  So I handed the phone to my husband. 

As he talked to the person from the credit card company, I could tell there was some problem.  Husband gets off phone and says account would have to be closed to take my name off and that he cannot close it as his credit score would take a hit.  He is currently looking for a house to buy.  I am waiting for the closing of my loan to pay him for his share of our house.  Divorce has been filed and I am staying in our house. 

Thoughts? 

[Herodias]

Do you believe him? Sometimes my ex would put me on the phone after he approved my talking with them, so I could handle what needed to be done. If they just told you they could take you name off then I don't know what changed. Is it a joint account or his account with your name added to it? That may make a difference.

[formflier]

More thoughts later.  Think about how to put this in a written agreement.

Neither will use the cards anymore.  Perhaps you physically hold the cards.  When home loan approved. He closes account.

He has a legit point about score.

FF

[Verbena]

I wasn't using the card anyway. These are all charges he has made.

He is losing his power over me and has ramped up the passive aggressive games lately, so me holding his card for him is not something he will agree to, verbally or in writing.

I guess I could "lose" his card, but then I would be the passive aggressive one.

[Verbena]

Herodias, I was told he was the primary card holder and I was added to it. He says they told him the same thing until they actually looked at the account and then said it was joint.

[formflier]

Herodias, I was told he was the primary card holder and I was added to it. He says they told him the same thing until they actually looked at the account and then said it was joint.

If it is a joint account, my understanding is that 1 owner can close it.  Not saying to do this, but might be something you want to check on for sure.

If he is not paying it or can't pay it all, it may affect your credit. 

That being said, this is not the place to take a principled stand.  Do whatever is needed to get your loan to buy him and and to help him get a loan to get somewhere else.

At the end of this journey are literal boundaries.  His property and your property.  That is worth gritting your teeth some over some PA games he wants to play.

Just keep going... .don't take bait.

FF

[formflier]

 

Perhaps a small hijack... .but want to make sure you have and we have big picture.

How long until closing on your loan?

Will he move out before, at, or after closing of your loan.  Best to have him move out on or before closing date.

I'm assuming you have a lawyer?   Or a mediator?

Will you be able to stay out of court?

FF

[teapay]

My W and I had joint credit cards, but she was primary and I was put on the account.  For me to get off the joint account the balance needed to be zero, because you are both responsibile for the current debt.  I had to pay off the debit first and then I called the company (BOA )and asked them to remove me.  They did it without approval of my W.  Initially, they said the primary had to remove me, but with the zero balance I pushed the issue and they said, oh yeah, sorry, we can do that and they did.  The account didn't need to be closed.  My W still has it, but I'm not legally responsible for any additional charges.  You might be able to put a hold on the card, so he can't rack up more charges.  If you have access to your other joint checking accounts, pull the money, pay the balance and then get removed.

[formflier]

Paying it off and unilaterally taking your name off would seem to accomplish a couple things.

There is a practical element of removing yourself from the danger of his overspending or other bad financial habits.

There is also a bit of a principled stand that you are no longer tied to his choices.

How many joint accounts do you have? 

Are your other financial details worked out?

Had the status of this account been discussed before? 

Still interested in answers to my other questions to build a complete picture.

There is a nice thought surrounding this and "discussing" it.  Once your name is off... .no more reason to discuss... .that wraps things up nicely.

FF

[Verbena]

My loan closes in about three weeks.  My lawyer is drafting temporary orders that will state he has two weeks to move out after he gets his money.  Other details of who gets what will be spelled out in temporary orders.  He is aware of what those details are, or at least he should be because I typed them up and showed him. He is actively looking at houses and working toward purchasing something.  He will have to move twice because he won't be able to close on his loan in that time frame. 

There are no other credit cards, joint or separate.  This month was the first time we paid bills from separate bank accounts.  He would not discuss who paid what, so I just picked some bills and paid them.  He then paid the others, including the credit card bill.  He just didn't pay all of it because obviously he had run it up too high and couldn't. 

My guess is that he is not worried about running it up because he knows he will get money from me (when my loan closes) and can pay it off then.  Of course, that will mean he has less money to put down on a house, but that's his problem. 

Once he pays it off, I am thinking that what teapay says is true.  If account is paid off, I should be able to have myself removed without his approval. 

**Another issue that I need advice on:  Husband is adamant that he doesn't want to be served papers, so lawyer drafted a waiver for him to sign.  I gave my husband his copies of the divorce petition along with the waiver.  He complained about various language in the petition but did say he would sign the waiver.  He still hasn't and it's due back to lawyer's office TOMORROW.  I reminded him last week that I needed him to sign and get the waiver notarized.  He ignored me.  Remind him again?  Or let him be served which will cost me in additional charges from attorney? 

[formflier]

 

Serving:  My guess is that he is testing boundaries, firmness, reality... .or all of the above. 

"(use is proper name) Bill, I know these are difficult times for you.  You had said that you didn't want to be served and I want to accommodate your desires.  Tomorrow is the deadline for the waiver.  If the waiver is not in the office by tomorrows deadline, the attorney has instructions to serve you the papers.  I will respect whatever choice you decide to make on this matter."

So, one more reminder.  Don't worry about the $$... .it's money well spent.

If you want to wait until your loan closes to pay off card, then put that in temp order.  Check will be cut from funds and sent to pay off credit card, hubby will support removing you from account.

How much money are we talking about here to pay off the card?

Hang in there.  You are doing well to think these things through and put up questions.

FF

[teapay]

Remind him to sign the waiver, so he won't get served because that is what he wanted.   If he ignores and doesn't sign just have them served.  Seems like he is still having trouble facing the whole thing.  It's all sad and probably not what anyone envision or wanted but that's life.  :)o what you reasonably can to help him and his wishes, but not at your expense.  Protect yourself, keep the ball rolling and get across the finish line.  Sounds like you still have life left in you to live.

[GaGrl]

A couple of questions... .

1) Are you obtaining a mortgage that will put the house fully in your name, paying off the former mortgage and cutting a check to your STBX?  That is the best way.  Or are you obtaining a loan that will require you to give your STBX a check and obtain from him a Quit Claim?  Quit Claims can be dicey, as can continuing to hold a mortgage that was in two names.  It's just messy.

2) What will happen to joint credit card accounts following the divorce needs to be clearly spelled out, with consequences for his not doing what you expect (pay off the card and close it/take your name off).  He can choose not to follow through.  Right now, with his credit card debt higher than it should be, both of you with names on the account are getting a credit score hit for debt-to-income ratio. It might not make a difference; then again, it could.

I was getting a mortgage last year to buy a house that my mother would live in.  The mortgage company asked that I get my name off two accounts as authorized signer.  I was not the owner of the account.  One credit card company said, "No problem, send us an email to confirm what you want done."  The other credit card company said, "No, we don't do that."  Same situation, different corporate policies.

[Verbena]

Gagrl, the house is paid for.  At closing, which is in about a month, I will get a check and then cut husband a check.  The divorce won't be final at that point so the house will remain in both our names.  When divorce is final, he will do a quit claim. I hate to hear those are messy, but his doing a quit claim will be in the temporary orders which he has to abide by.  I'd prefer to have the house in my name when loan closes, but we will still be married so I can't. 

My goal at this point is to get him out of this house.  He will not leave until he gets this money that I am borrowing, so I pushed for a loan closing before the divorce is final.

I'm still on the joint checking account even though I have my own account now that I use.  Once he deposits his money that he gets from me into that joint account, I am thinking I will just pay off the cc debt myself from that account, take my name off the cc account (I'll hand him the phone like I did the other night if I have to), and then get my name off the joint bank account too at that point. 

The issue with my husband is that he will not discuss anything, won't participate, won't listen to any ideas that are my idea--because they're wrong since he is always right.  I asked him last night when he got home how long it would be before he got his own loan because I wanted to close out the cc account.  He acted like he had no idea what I was talking about. 

This is probably going to get worse before it gets better.  I just want him out of here. 

[GaGrl]

It becomes messy because you are assuming he will do certain things, i.e., give you a quit claim when you divorce.  Why should he?  It's possible he (passively) refuses to give you the quit claim... .he already has the money and moved to his own house, still has his name on the title of your house, and is holding you over the proverbial barrel.  Yay.

You are also assuming he will still have the joint checking account open on the day you divorce, and you will thus be able to write a check to close the joint credit card.  He could close the account on the way to sign the final divorce papers, or for the final appearance before the judge (however it happens in your state).  Then you can't pay the CC balance, and he still has a CC with a balance that you are liable for.

What do you have that you can mutually exchange?  Is there anything in your state that says you can't transfer title in the house to your name pending the divorce?  That sounds strange, if it is a mutual agreement.  I would exchange the check from the loan for his quit claim -- he doesn't get the funds until you get the quit claim.

My DH gave his then-wife a quit claim when they divorced (she is the uBPD in our life).  She never went to the county courthouse to file it.  We got notices for property taxes for several years.  My DH had to instruct her live-in on how to do it, so he could take her to the courthouse and execute the transfer in title.  She gets waifish about those kind of things.

[formflier]

Ask your lawyer about a quitclaim in exchange for the check.

FF

[Verbena]

FF, as I understand it there can't be a quit claim until we are divorced.   We won't be divorced when the loan happens, and he won't leave until he gets his money. 

So, I could go ahead and do the loan closing but not give him the money until divorce is final and he signs quit claim, but that would drag this out for who knows how long. 

He should already be moved out, but he isn't.  He complained last week that I shouldn't be doing the loan before the divorce was final, so I said we could wait and do it that way but he should go ahead and move out.  He supposedly has somewhere to go while he continues his house search according to him.  Now he says he has nowhere to go.  Basically, he changes his story.  A lot. 

 

[formflier]

I'm pretty savvy in real estate.  Anyone can quit claim at any time.

You can quit claim your interest in a property that you don't own.  You aren't guaranteeing title.  All you are doing is saying that you no longer claim any interest in property X.

I will try to get a L over here to clarify.  If the divorce doesn't go through... .he may have a claim to marital property.

But with a quit claim and a divorce... .he has no claim.

I'm 99.9% solid on this. 

I've signed and received lots of quit claims over the years.  Now... .giving a general warranty deed is an entirely different matter... .

This is where the "legal shield" thing would be huge and give you ability to call and get solid advice.  Just sayin... .

Here is the FF money bet and advice right now.  You hand check and he hands you quit claim.  Record it right away.  Also handle the joint cc bill right then or hold some in escrow.  Much more important to get quit claim right than cc bill.

Hang tough... .this is important.  The details matter.

FF

[GaGrl]

My understanding of quit claim is the same as FF's explanation.

[Herodias]

If you have a lawyer, they can serve his lawyer... .Mine didn't want to accept service either. The lawyers did it in-between the two of them.