Can someone explain

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello everyone

Wondering how my exgf can be so kind and rational now and when we were together she was completely psychotic and abusive. How do pwBPD change and then what happens to snap them back to psychotic again?

I mean she was seeing things, hearing things, accusing me of cheating and saying I lied about everything.

Will she stay nice, rational and for how long?

Another strange thing I've encountered with her, she's still out there with her ideas but not out of touch with reality... .today.

Strange and bizarre

[JerryRG]

Hello everyone

Wondering how my exgf can be so kind and rational now and when we were together she was completely psychotic and abusive. How do pwBPD change and then what happens to snap them back to psychotic again?

I mean she was seeing things, hearing things, accusing me of cheating and saying I lied about everything.

Will she stay nice, rational and for how long?

Another strange thing I've encountered with her, she's still out there with her ideas but not out of touch with reality... .today.

Strange and bizarre

[schwing]

Hi JerryRG,

Wondering how my exgf can be so kind and rational now and when we were together she was completely psychotic and abusive. How do pwBPD change and then what happens to snap them back to psychotic again?

It's partly this inconsistent behavior that got "borderlines" the name; they used to think that borderlines were on the border between neurosis and psychosis.  If they consistently acted "psychotic" then it would be far more obvious to everyone else that they have a disorder.  As it is, only the people who are closest to them see this aspect of their disorder.  And that tells you a little bit about the nature of their disorder.

I mean she was seeing things, hearing things, accusing me of cheating and saying I lied about everything.

My understanding of borderline personality disorder (BPD) is that their irrational fear of abandonment can be triggered by feelings of familiarity/intimacy.  I believe they experience this fear because of their primarily abandonment trauma which they experienced in early childhood -- and this trauma and their way of coping with this trauma has led to all their disordered behavior.  Because they were hurt/abandoned/betrayed a long time ago by someone that they trusted, since that time *everybody* that they come to trust/depend/become familiar with, will trigger (perhaps) the memories of this trauma.  

So as she started to feel closer to you, to depend upon you, she started to accuse you of cheating and lying to her because you started to remind her of this early abandonment trauma she experienced -- which she has still yet to come to terms with.  She may not even be consciously aware of this -- she only knows how she feels and how she feels changes.

Will she stay nice, rational and for how long?

She will stay nice and rational so long as she does not feel sufficiently close to you to trigger her irrational fear of abandonment.  I don't know how long that will take because all this depends upon what is going on in her head.  But if you want to keep her nice and rational, then my advice is to stay as distant and formal as possible.  If you start to act towards her in any manner that makes her think of you no longer as an "ex" then expect her behavior to escalate again.

Another strange thing I've encountered with her, she's still out there with her ideas but not out of touch with reality... .today.

The only part of reality which becomes distorted for her is with respect to those that she forms an attachment.  When she starts to feel too close to you, then her feelings take over and her feelings dictate the distorted reality she perceives.

I hope this helps.

Best wishes,  Schwing

[JerryRG]

Yes it does help schwing

She seems to be getting along with her new bf but keeps saying things that say maybe not. Like she loves him but it seems dull compared to our relationship.

Her bf is jealous of her being around me and I've been told he's codependent too, his pastor told me he has mental health issues.

[bunny4523]

Yes Jerry... .just like Schwing is saying... .

The way I like to look at it is they are emotional limited or immature so until you trigger an emotional response you won't see the behavior.  I worked with my exBPD partner for 7 years and he seemed completely calm, rational, just an all around loving nice guy.  Even during the 8 months we courted he kept it in check... .I saw tiny things I questioned that I now see as red flags come out a few times.  But it was just the tip of the iceberg compared to what came out after I moved in and he had all the control... .

Right now, she is not emotional about you nor does she have the control.  That is when it changes because that is when she has an emotional reaction and that seems to be where they struggle.  It is exagerated and irrational and most of the time not even really happening, they just think it is. 

Enjoy the quiet... .keep her distant.

I still work with my ex and he smiles and says "after you" "good morning" and acts like we are just besties.  But he isn't going to fool me... .duh... .we already played this game once, I know how it ends!

My advice is to Just enjoy the quiet and keep her at a safe distance... .

[JerryRG]

Thanks bunny4523

I plan on keeping her at a distance, she's very confusing to talk to. Leaves me with a headache because it's like talking to someone different each time. Never know who's going to show up next.

[schwing]

She seems to be getting along with her new bf but keeps saying things that say maybe not. Like she loves him but it seems dull compared to our relationship.

Here's the rub.  *Sometimes* she gets along with her new bf and *sometimes* not.  Just like with you.  For a while she got along with you and it got less so.  She *wants* to love him.  Just like in the beginning with you, she wanted to love you.  But then when she started to love you, then her disordered feelings kicked in.  Same deal with her bf.  She tells you at the beginning things are going well.  The longer she is with her boyfriend the *more* her disordered feelings will kick in.  Until she can no longer stand being with her and then she will find a replacement.   And her replacement will go through the same cycles.

Her bf is jealous of her being around me and I've been told he's codependent too, his pastor told me he has mental health issues.

So is the problem her boyfriend or her?  (or both?)

You don't know how she's behaving with her bf that makes him feel insecure.  Is his pastor good at discerning mental health issues?  Is his pastor able to recognize *her* mental health issues? 

More importantly, why do you care?  Are you trying to detach from this relationship?  Or are you trying to recycle?

[Confused108]

Yes Jerry I had the same thing. Never knew who I was gonna get. My ex one day loved me and then by that night was ending it! Just like that! It was crazy! She wanted sex she did t. I was her lover one min her friend ( maybe more) the next . Then I was just her friend and then came the Green eyed Monster! I don't love u and don't know why I ever said that to u in the 1st place. Painted BLACK.  It was Insane! I was also accused of flirting with friends on FB . Crazy!

[JerryRG]

I'm not sure what I'm doing half the time. The pastor is well aware of mental illness and the pastor told me I may be of help to my exs bf after she dumps him. I didn't have to bring up my exgfs mental state, the pastor called it after being around her a while. He said the church cannot help her issues and she will eventually crash and hopefully end up in a long term facility so she can get well.

I do empathize with her bf because he looks half scared most of the time and desperate for a gf.

I will focus on my son and myself I just think it was my issues that made our relationship not work but I did everything I could. One doc told me it was her nature to hurt people  

[Confused108]

Swig you are right on the money!

[Herodias]

Thanks bunny4523

I plan on keeping her at a distance, she's very confusing to talk to. Leaves me with a headache because it's like talking to someone different each time. Never know who's going to show up next.

This is exactly how they leave you feeling... .You never know who you are going to be dealing with. That's the "walking on eggshells" part. I always wondered this too- how can they control it for so long? The last time I talked to him he said he was doing great, no incidents. Now I know life wasn't great for him because he lost his job and other things, but I suppose he meant he wasn't ending up in the hospital. Like that was my fault.  My ex would accuse me of all of the things HE was doing... .projection.

[heartandwhole]

Hi JerryRG,

Wondering how my exgf can be so kind and rational now and when we were together she was completely psychotic and abusive. How do pwBPD change and then what happens to snap them back to psychotic again?

It's partly this inconsistent behavior that got "borderlines" the name; they used to think that borderlines were on the border between neurosis and psychosis.  If they consistently acted "psychotic" then it would be far more obvious to everyone else that they have a disorder.  As it is, only the people who are closest to them see this aspect of their disorder.  And that tells you a little bit about the nature of their disorder.

I mean she was seeing things, hearing things, accusing me of cheating and saying I lied about everything.

My understanding of borderline personality disorder (BPD) is that their irrational fear of abandonment can be triggered by feelings of familiarity/intimacy.  I believe they experience this fear because of their primarily abandonment trauma which they experienced in early childhood -- and this trauma and their way of coping with this trauma has led to all their disordered behavior.  Because they were hurt/abandoned/betrayed a long time ago by someone that they trusted, since that time *everybody* that they come to trust/depend/become familiar with, will trigger (perhaps) the memories of this trauma.  

So as she started to feel closer to you, to depend upon you, she started to accuse you of cheating and lying to her because you started to remind her of this early abandonment trauma she experienced -- which she has still yet to come to terms with.  She may not even be consciously aware of this -- she only knows how she feels and how she feels changes.

Will she stay nice, rational and for how long?

She will stay nice and rational so long as she does not feel sufficiently close to you to trigger her irrational fear of abandonment.  I don't know how long that will take because all this depends upon what is going on in her head.  But if you want to keep her nice and rational, then my advice is to stay as distant and formal as possible.  If you start to act towards her in any manner that makes her think of you no longer as an "ex" then expect her behavior to escalate again.

Another strange thing I've encountered with her, she's still out there with her ideas but not out of touch with reality... .today.

The only part of reality which becomes distorted for her is with respect to those that she forms an attachment.  When she starts to feel too close to you, then her feelings take over and her feelings dictate the distorted reality she perceives.

I hope this helps.

Best wishes,  Schwing

I think this is a wonderful summary of why the behavior of many of our loved ones with BPD/traits can feel so confusing. Thank you, Schwing!

JerryRG, my experience has also led me to believe in the idea that eventually we partners become triggers for pwBPD. That means the closer the relationship, the (often)more erratic the behavior (push/pull, impulsive changes, etc.). As Schwing suggests, we now have a role in the mind of pwBPD, and it can be a real roller coaster as we don't know what "assignment" we have from moment to moment. At least that was my experience.

I may be that your ex acts more rational and kind when she is at a distance, because there is less chance of her becoming triggered to the point where she doesn't feel okay about herself or in control of her reactions anymore.

Thanks for bringing these important insights to light!   

heartandwhole

[JerryRG]

Hi heartandwhole

Thank you and I love the word "assignment" because that single word describes what my role in our relationship was. I was simply an assignment, tool, just a function.

Strange but true... .

[once removed]

important to note is that in some ways, the relationship has changed; perhaps not as much in terms of dynamics (or the fundamental aspect of you or us as triggers), but in emotional, and physical proximity.

we all have a very particular value to our respective partners/exes. this is subject to change based on their needs.

as heartandwhole suggests since you are out of the picture romantically, and around her less physically, abandonment and engulfment fears may be somewhat mitigated as a result. and in other words, there may be less of a need to cast you in the role of scapegoat, and you may be more valuable in the role of rescuer.

triangulation plays a role here as well and cant be ignored. in your case, you know that there is trouble in paradise. as the non romantic partner, you may again be seen as a safe haven (rescuer), and for what you have to offer, which in this case is primarily a shoulder to cry on (this may be a reminder of what she saw in you in the beginning). the current partner is a more fitting place in which for her to project negative feelings. again, this is subject to change; it was very recently that she was smearing you to him and others, and using the child against you. each of you has a role in the drama triangle. your first step to getting off that triangle is recognizing your role.

[JerryRG]

Thank you once removed

Her getting beat up by her bf would explain her taking my son so far away and setting up an overnight in the hospital then calling me to rescue our son. She knew how this in raged her bf that I spent the night with my ex. Then losing her engagement ring may have also been on purpose to anger him. It was all a delicately woven manipulation to solve all her current problems and me by doing the right thing used as a pawn.