How do I suggest treatment?

[Just A Guy]

Hello, this is my first post here. Im about 99.9% certain that my wife of 13 years has BPD. When she's calm she can see it too. She sometimes makes references to it, or refers to herself as "f----ing crazy." She gets embarrassed of it after particularly heinous rages (physical and emotional abuse towards me), but she does not want to get treatment. I have tried to ask her during the rages, but it only makes them worse. I am usually so happy when she's not raging, that I don't want to poke the sleeping bear and risk a new rage. I know that the abuse is taking its toll on me, and I am finding it harder and harder to forgive her when they are over. I love her dearly. She is my best friend, and I want her to get better, but I feel like she is destroying me piece by piece. How do I help her get treatment?

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[ClingToHope]

Hi. Welcome
I know exactly what yo mean about not poking the bear when there is a calm or level moment.
Unfortunately I think that is the only time you should bring these concerns up. Especially since she is able to at least acknowledge it herself a bit when she is calm.
I am reading the high-conflict couple and he talks about emotion and logic and when emotion reaches a certain point it cancels out the logic in a way.
Which is why mentioning anything about them being wrong just amps things up because the reasonable person we know is dormant.

I have started to talk with my udBPh about some patterns or reactions that I’ve noticed. (Only when he is level ) and I use some of the terms I have learned while reading about BPD but I don’t reference the disorder.

I am really mindful not to say you do this and it’s wrong or it’s unacceptable ect cause it will def set him off because it triggers guilt and their reaction is to try and transfer blame.

But
When I mention that I’ve noticed his strong reaction or mood change to something and then describe what I think occurred.
When I describe it’s not what he’s thinking.
It’s like when an announcer describes a game
The kids broke this and he said that and I said this to him and then his voice raised and I reacted with a negative face and then he said this ect.
I then ask if it’s possible what I said hurt his feelings or embarrassed him ect
If he agrees and is still level I will try to ask about another time (that I have already thought about before and is similar to this pattern) he will usually ponder not necessarily agree and I know I’m close to him feeling criticized so I will then ask if he wants my thoughts about the reaction or something if he says no I leave it and thank him for the chat and change to a light subject
If he says sure I will again describe (he knows I’m reading the high-conflict couple  because we both escalate stuff and I am trying to change my bad habits and he said he’d like to learn too )
The describing is in there and talks about emotions
And is based on Dialetic behavioural therapy which is the key therapy above CBT for BPD
But the book does not talk about BPD and presents it for reactive people in general
There has been some great lightbulb thoughts in there that have given me words that are less diagnosis type

This is all to say I have started these more ambiguous talks to lead up to the seeking treatment talk. I have no idea if it will work but it has empowered me a bit and given me a starting point to open up non accusing discussions about his behaviour.
It’s been the most successful thing ever and finally given me a bit of hope.

I’m sorry I have rambled this road is fairly new and I have not had the extra brain power to be very articulate with it. Lol

All the best. CTH

[Just A Guy]

Thank you. I have to try something different, I guess. It's just so hard!

I find that now, as this has gotten worse, that while she's off the charts, I will be asking myself how long I can do this. How long can I continue to take this? How many more scars, physical or emotional, can I bear? Then it just feels like my marriage is ending if I'm having these thoughts. Then she calms down, and I feel ashamed of checking out of our marriage. Of thinking of running away when she probably needs my help the most -- like I am the one who has done wrong. It makes it that much harder to bring it up then.

[PChemGuy]

Hi Just A Guy,

Let me start by saying -- I feel a lot like you do. I'm also new here. In the last two weeks, the lightbulb went on that my wife of 15 years behaves in a way consistent with BPD. I also am on the rollercoaster of good times that I really treasure and bad times that are terrible and abusive. I also have this really strong feeling that I am near the breaking point, like the whole marriage is hanging in the balance.

Here is how I am thinking about it, and I hope that folks out there can chime in and help us both understand better, because I certainly can't say that I know the answer to anything!

• I think it is wrong for me to tell my partner that I think she has BPD. I just think of how hurt I would feel if my partner came up to me and said that we have problems because I have some medical diagnosis. I would feel really judged and hurt and blamed and pushed away. (Actually, I can tell you first hand that that is how it feels. She has been trying to diagnose me with all kinds of stuff to explain our problems ADHD, Aspergers, autism. Um... .no to all of those. But it was really hurtful and demeaning.) So I have decided not to do that.

• I am focusing on improving me. I am trying to figure out what I can do to make our relationship better and make myself happier. My three major things that I am working on are setting boundaries (I am terrible at setting boundaries and my wife thinks if we have boundaries that we don't have a relationship),  validating (I don't do as good a job as I want to validating my partner, a lot of things that I think are not unreasonable are also invalidating and I understand better now how painful that is to her), and anger management (I feel like a bad person when I get angry and my wife explodes if I express anger so I am trying to find a way to hear the and believe it and still find a healthy way to express it). So, for me, I have a  lot to work on on my side. Do any of these things resonate with you?

• It is not right for me to try to change my partner. Now, this one is really hard for me. (I hope other folks can share their insights!) I am kind of at the stage of I think this is the right point of view, but I have a lot of instincts that don't agree with the rest of me. So... .this is a tricky one. If I think about this calmly, I come to the following conclusion: my partner has the right to behave in any way that she wants -- to say what she wants and do what she wants. I do not have the right to control her. I don't have the right to change her. I don't have the right to fix her and her problems for her. Those are fundamentally not my job. Ok, all of that is easy to say, but it is SO HARD for me to hold on to! When I am scared and upset I want to fix her -- I'd be so much happier if she saw she had BPD and started therapy and learned to get her act together and learned not to explode at me when she feels abandoned or judged and learned that all the amazingly awful things she has said and done hurt me deeply. But that is kind of a cop-out, too. How much responsibility for my own life do I take in this scenario? None. It is my life; I need to control the things that I can control (me) and stop trying to control the things that I cannot control (my partner).

So, I feel you. But I have decided not to tell my partner how I think BPD plays a role in our relationship.

Have you considered couples therapy? If you talked together when she is calm and you brought up that you would like to improve your relationship, you could say that you want to work on what you can do better. Then, you could ask her if she would consider going to couples therapy with you. That might be a good starting place. You haven't blamed her for anything. There is a chance that she won't feel defensive. She might see your gesture in a positive light of you want to be with her and you want to improve yourself so she might view the invitation positively. Does that mean that therapy will only be about you? No way. Every therapist worth their salt will be looking at the roles that you both play. Will you have to show up and be willing to work on yourself. You betcha. And it sucks to fix ourselves. But you want your partner to do way harder work dealing with a possible BPD diagnosis, so time to show some leadership, right? Lead by example. Are you tricking her or manipulating her? If you show up and do your job of improving yourself then, no, you are not tricking her. You are doing exactly what you invited her to join you to do. If being in therapy helps her see how to work on herself, then that is gravy.

Also, if you do start therapy, you could probably talk one-on-one with your therapist and describe your insights into your wife's behavior and the ways that it seems consistent with BPD. Your therapist could then also give you an unbiased feedback and maybe have suggestions for a way forward. (At the same time, know going into therapy that it isn't all about her. You should be there to take responsibility for the role that you play and to learn how you can do things differently to improve the relationship. I say it to you over and over because I know that I had to hear it over and over for it to really sink in. And I'm still working it!)

Again, all that is easy to say, and hard to do! Personally, I am actually trying to find a third couples therapist because my partner refuses to see the others. She blew up in a session and behaved really badly and ... .she blames it on the therapist. He is bad, he doesn't know enough neuroscience. He is biased against her. He always takes my side and has a grudge against her etc etc etc. Same thing happened with the first therapist. Sigh. Now I am looking again to find a third therapist... .

Have you read Stop walking on eggshells? I found that helpful, too.

I guess what I am saying is -- I am in a similar situation. I hear how frustrating and painful it is. Makes sense! At the same time, I have decided that I should focus on fixing me. And, actually, I feel more in control of my life because of it. So even though she hasn't changed a bit, I feel better and stronger.
 
Hope there is something helpful for you in there.