New beginnings, old patterns

[snowglobe]

We are in a midst of moving houses. I didn’t anticipate to accumulate so much stuff over the years. Although the biggest part of the biggest chunk has been packed away, little things are still all over the place. It’s taxing. Ubpdh is in a midst of a total mental and psychotic melt down. In top of realizing a price tag that comes with the luxury lifestyle, he is experiencing significant issues at work. Yesterday, after finalizing all of the paperwork at the lawyers office he asked me for a rope “to hang himself”. He says he doesn’t know how he will support the extravagant house, two children and me. I emphasized and validated his fears. It is a scary experience. I’m not concerned. He has the assets to sell. We can stay at the house for a year and then resell it. I’m secretly excited for him to experience the consequences of his actions, I’ve lived in fear and dread for the past 6 months. I need him to learn, but then again, probably not. As soon as the scale tips the other way he will go back to arrogant, cocky and devaluing human being. I’m much better off, in a financial aspect. The assets that he had hidden away and stored are now finding their way into a mutually accessible asset- the house. I feel like I’m about to go on vacation. Not sure how long this will last, but I should enjoy it while it lasts. I feel almost sorry for him. Had this discussion with his partner yesterday. His partner is overwhelmed by their work related issue. I’m overwhelmed with ubpdh freaking out at home. Parted says ubpdh doesn’t experience the consequences of his actions because I step up and save him at home, and his partner caretakes at work. It’s a very real possibility that I will have to move again soon, as I don’t see how he will be able to manage. I like the area, so I might start looking into something close by so I don’t move the kids schools. It’s supposed to be an exciting time, he pushed for it for many years. Yet, all he wants to do is die.

[Notwendy]

He's the one who wanted this high priced house. I think it's good that you allow him to experience the consequences of this decision. It doesn't sound like an easy path but I hope you can resist soothing him. He may threaten you- which works to get you into soothing gear, and I hope you can resist the pattern on your part, which is to do things for him that calm him down. This is a pattern between you.

I think, as long as consequences aren't extremely deleterious, ( and in some cases we can't even help with that), allowing someone to learn by natural consequences is the way to go. It's also the premise of parenting. Let the child face the teacher if they forget their homework. Let the child run out of allowance if they spend it all.

Your part is to manage your own discomfort at your H's discomfort and resist his threats- to let him self soothe. Chances are, he may not choose a healthy way to do this. He may do drugs, or go on a diet like he did - but these are his choices. I hope he doesn't venture into self harm but keep in mind that someone in this state needs medical care. Call 911 if you fear he is doing something or you think he is considering doing something to harm himself.

[formflier]

Do you think the likelihood of you children being assaulted again is higher or lower, due to the decisions you made?

Best,

FF

[AskingWhy]

SG, I am sorry this is happening.  Not accepting the consequences of one's decisions is a part of BPD that is APD.  I understand with BPDs that they, at various turns, exhibit aspects of the other PDs.

My own uBPD H is like this.  At turns, he can be paranoid, APD or NPD.    He can turn his charm on or off at will.  Last week, H and I went to a dinner party.  As we prepared to go, H was saying how much he hated our marriage, how much he hated me in the way I interacted with his adult children  (he is enmeshed with them and they abuse and emotionally black mail him), and how he feels he is trapped in the marriage.  Once at the party, H was pleasant and happy, putting his arm around me and telling me what a wonderful wife I was to the hosts.  BPDs are chameleons.

I know the feeling of secretly being happy to see the consequences of a BPD partners actions. 

For years, my H idealised his children while he devalued me.  Again, H said how much he hated me and our marriage, saying one of his Ds and her H were so much happier than us.  (She is 30 and with young children; she is in the NPD spectrum.)  Then this past year, all of his children forgot to acknowledge his birthday.  They are all nearly 30, and yet not one card arrived in the mail.  I was laughing to myself.  I thought, "This serves you right, a$$hole."

He was depressed that day when none of his children contacted him.  He said he wanted it to be be "just himself and me" and not rely on his children for anything;. he said he valued me as a loyal, considerate wife.  Then, late in the day, a short phone call from each of them, "Hey, Dad, I just wanted to wish you happy birthday."  He was angry at his children, and that lasted only a week.

Then it was back to their idealisation and me being devalued.   

SG, keep your chin up.  You know what you are up against.  Your H, as you know, is not a well man.  You are in one who knows the truth about your marriage.

[snowglobe]

He's the one who wanted this high priced house. I think it's good that you allow him to experience the consequences of this decision. It doesn't sound like an easy path but I hope you can resist soothing him. He may threaten you- which works to get you into soothing gear, and I hope you can resist the pattern on your part, which is to do things for him that calm him down. This is a pattern between you.

I think, as long as consequences aren't extremely deleterious, ( and in some cases we can't even help with that), allowing someone to learn by natural consequences is the way to go. It's also the premise of parenting. Let the child face the teacher if they forget their homework. Let the child run out of allowance if they spend it all.

Your part is to manage your own discomfort at your H's discomfort and resist his threats- to let him self soothe. Chances are, he may not choose a healthy way to do this. He may do drugs, or go on a diet like he did - but these are his choices. I hope he doesn't venture into self harm but keep in mind that someone in this state needs medical care. Call 911 if you fear he is doing something or you think he is considering doing something to harm himself.

Hello Wendy,
I’m sorry it took a while for me to reply to your kind guidance. Last 3 days been a big blur. We moved into upscale affluent neighbourhood, which he wanted. He is riding different emotions from extreme pride and boasting with joy to extreme irritation and anger. We have mostly unpacked, he has been home “to help”. Mostly just walking around and cussing. Kids have been adjusting and I feel tired to the bones  and depleted. It’s like having a mild fever, I think I am so exhausted from the roller coaster.

[snowglobe]

Do you think the likelihood of you children being assaulted again is higher or lower, due to the decisions you made?

Best,

FF

Hi Ff,
Your question caught me off guard... it isn’t a first time my daughter was “corporally punished” by ubpdh. It had been a while since the last time, 3 years. To answer your question- I don’t know. Nothing that I do/don’t do excuses my unpdh. It’s like blaming a rape victim for wearing a short skirt. He was physical when we were living at our old address with lesser financial strain. From the bitter taste in my mouth left by my previous run ins with the law, I know nothing will come to him. He can afford qualified legal representation.

[formflier]

  It’s like blaming a rape victim for wearing a short skirt.

I don't think this is an appropriate analogy for this situation.  For a "first time offense" it likely is.  Nobody deserves to have rape or a physical assault happen to them.

Yet if a person gets assaulted, does nothing about it and goes back to the same situation with a person know to repetitively  do this, well that looks really different..doesn't it? 

I'm worried that you are now using the language "corporal punishment".  Are you trying to "clean up" what happened and not use the word assault?

Help me understand the change in language...it's worrisome (along with many other things)

Best,

FF

[ct21218]

So I recently ended a relationship with someone with serious anger issues.  There would be literally no provocation, the first time he attacked me I was lying in bed.  I called the police that night, he left and we talked several weeks later.  I invited him over and once again he lost his temper and attacked me.  I got an order of protection because I was afraid for my safety.  It has been financially difficult but I am not going to live my life in fear.

I am having a hard time understanding why you would knowingly put yourselves and your children in that situation.  It will happen again and I pray that no one is seriously harmed. it seems like you chose the bitcoin over your own family's safety and security. He is a timebomb and you went into this eyes wide open of what he is capable of.

[snowglobe]

I don't think this is an appropriate analogy for this situation.  For a "first time offense" it likely is.  Nobody deserves to have rape or a physical assault happen to them.

Yet if a person gets assaulted, does nothing about it and goes back to the same situation with a person know to repetitively  do this, well that looks really different..doesn't it? 

I'm worried that you are now using the language "corporal punishment".  Are you trying to "clean up" what happened and not use the word assault?

Help me understand the change in language...it's worrisome (along with many other things)

Best,

FF

Ff, the analogy of the rape victim goes to your question if I think that kids are more/less likely to get assaulted. It does not matter the geographical location, he does it because he is out of control, not what I do or don’t do. Don’t worry, I still stand with my d16 on the assault charge. His lawyer is pushing the “corporate punishment” gone wrong version. To which he is incredibly sorry. His “father of the year” tale is quite believable. If I didn’t know better, I would eat it too.

[snowglobe]

So I recently ended a relationship with someone with serious anger issues.  There would be literally no provocation, the first time he attacked me I was lying in bed.  I called the police that night, he left and we talked several weeks later.  I invited him over and once again he lost his temper and attacked me.  I got an order of protection because I was afraid for my safety.  It has been financially difficult but I am not going to live my life in fear.

I am having a hard time understanding why you would knowingly put yourselves and your children in that situation.  It will happen again and I pray that no one is seriously harmed. it seems like you chose the bitcoin over your own family's safety and security. He is a timebomb and you went into this eyes wide open of what he is capable of.

I’m sorry, but I believe that this is a support group and a judgement free zone. You don’t know me, not do you know my life’s struggles and circumstances. For that, I would hold your judgement of my actions.

[AskingWhy]

Ff, the analogy of the rape victim goes to your question if I think that kids are more/less likely to get assaulted. It does not matter the geographical location, he does it because he is out of control, not what I do or don’t do. Don’t worry, I still stand with my d16 on the assault charge. His lawyer is pushing the “corporate punishment” gone wrong version. To which he is incredibly sorry. His “father of the year” tale is quite believable. If I didn’t know better, I would eat it too.

pwBPD are chameleons and are able to change depending the person or people they are with.

For instance, uBPD H and I attended a dinner party in which H was raging at me only an hour before we left.  He screamed, said how much he hated our marriage and how much he hated me, a horrid, spiteful woman.  When we arrived, he put his arm around me and kissed me on the cheek in front of the hosts, said I was such a wonderful wife. 

Likewise, BPDs are very convincing in front of police and others.  We once found a marriage T, and she was eating out of his hand after the hour, saying what a bad wife I was and that if I did not shape up, I would lose this man who loved me so much.

Utterly unreal.

[Enabler]

Hey Snowglobe,

Hope you enjoy the new house. I have visions of queues of flamboyant interior designers pouting around your new pad, all itching to help you bleed the Etherium bank dry... darling!

Does the new house have a safe room?

Enabler

[formflier]

Ff, the analogy of the rape victim goes to your question if I think that kids are more/less likely to get assaulted. It does not matter the geographical location, he does it because he is out of control, not what I do or don’t do. 

Can you help me understand this better?

After writing a bit about how you see this and how you want me to understand the analogy I would encourage you to grab your favorite morning beverage and then spend some time thinking about how FF and others might have a different point of view.  If you could write out a bit about that point of view.  What would we likely say and why?

Best,

FF

[ct21218]

My judgment does not matter.  The laws in most states say that if you fail to protect your children from abuse (and this includes him abusing you), you are also guilty of child abuse.

Another member here lost custody of her children because she stayed with an abusive boyfriend. If your children are under 18, you are required to protect them.  If you do not, the state has to power to intervene.  I would imagine that the laws are similar in Canada

[snowglobe]

Hey Snowglobe,

Hope you enjoy the new house. I have visions of queues of flamboyant interior designers pouting around your new pad, all itching to help you bleed the Etherium bank dry... darling!

Does the new house have a safe room?

Enabler

Hi Enabler, I laughed when I read your reply to my post. The house is massive and in the top 3 best areas of the city. It’s reclusive, private and upscale. However when it comes to the designers and general help- its all me. I’m trying to convince ubpdh to buy the furniture he doesn’t mind sleeping on the bare mattress. Smoke and mirrors, daaarling, smoke and mirrors. When the neighbor saw me washing my own deck they stopped and looked. Ubpdh is alternating between disbelief that it’s all his and the fact that he hates that the bills went up ten fold. The house isn’t fully finished yet, there is a lot of work that needs to be done, it’s almost brand new, only few years old. A single guy, who also built it, lived there. There is no safe room, it’s grand in size and storage but doesn’t have that many “extra” rooms.

[snowglobe]

Can you help me understand this better?

After writing a bit about how you see this and how you want me to understand the analogy I would encourage you to grab your favorite morning beverage and then spend some time thinking about how FF and others might have a different point of view.  If you could write out a bit about that point of view.  What would we likely say and why?

Best,

FF

Dearest Ff,
Thank you for many years of continuous emotional support. Here is my take on the move and probability of ubpdh getting physical with the family members. Ubpdh is probably both borderline and bipolar. He goes through states of mania, followed by depression. Sometimes it’s mixed. He does not rage when he is only manic. It’s more of a sense of grandiosity and overachieving in life. He is mostly happy manic. When he is depressed he only “bites back”, like clipping tactic. “F off, leave me alone... etc”. When he is mixed, manic and depressive, that is when trouble happens. He both attacks and has lots of energy to do so. That is when assaults and provocations occur. In the close to 20 years I learnt to recognize those states. We loved at the one bedroom rental with one kid, I was working and supporting us whilst he built his business, during those “mixed” episodes he would assault me pregnant! And lock me out of the house with our firstborn. During the years of living in the previous house he would grab whomever would be closest, provoke and then assault us (remember toothpaste, driving, and other incidents?) d16 would get Slapped on the butt so hard that he would leave an imprint. Assault happens at the second notice. It isn’t something I can predict. He momentarily strikes physically and poof, goes to depressive state. I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT HE IS MORE/less likely to assault us here or anywhere else. It depends on his brain chemistry, not our place of living. As long as he has access to the children, if I am not around, children are MORE LIKELY TO GET ASSAULTED. When I see his mixed episode I remove them from his presence. Imagine if he was having only visitations with them. They would be like moving targets to his unhappiness with life.

[snowglobe]

My judgment does not matter.  The laws in most states say that if you fail to protect your children from abuse (and this includes him abusing you), you are also guilty of child abuse.

Another member here lost custody of her children because she stayed with an abusive boyfriend. If your children are under 18, you are required to protect them.  If you do not, the state has to power to intervene.  I would imagine that the laws are similar in Canada

I’m not going to justify, explain, defend or argue. You are entitled to think/believe whAtever you want. I welcome you to read my previous posts and how I protect my children.

[formflier]

you to read my previous posts and how I protect my children.

I'm interested in reading the bolded part as well.

Can you take some time and highlight that part of your posts/plan going forward?

Best,

FF

[snowglobe]

I'm interested in reading the bolded part as well.

Can you take some time and highlight that part of your posts/plan going forward?

Best,

FF

Ff, i think last incident reporting that was related to our d justifies protecting her. Taking her out of the house whilst he was raging also justifies protecting the kids. Having therapy for our son justifies protection, doesn’t it?

[Enabler]

Can I quickly confirm for clarity that justifies = "qualifies as" e.g.

"Ff, i think last incident reporting that was related to our d qualifies as protecting her. Taking her out of the house whilst he was raging also qualifies as protecting the kids. Having therapy for our son qualifies as protection, doesn’t it?"

I just want to be clear.

Enabler