Pornography/Live Sex Cams

[hopeful1073]

The drama continues and with each day comes a new issue and it seems to be getting harder and harder to deal with the mountain that continues to grow.

The latest is my bpd bf entered an online live sex cam chatroom for a private session with a woman.  I found out about it because he used my credit card to pay for it.  (For all I know, he has been doing this for quite some time behind my back.  He has used my credit cards to buy gift cards in the past, so it is something he could have hidden.)  When I confronted him about it, he refused to talk to me about it for a couple of days.  While I am ok with him viewing pornography - this is something that has been discussed - I am not ok with selecting a woman to have a one-on-one paid session with so he can pleasure himself.  In my eyes, this is close to cheating because he no longer just watching, but an active participant.

When we finally discussed it, he told me that in his mind it is not a big deal.  He also made excuses about it - the last time I visited him (we are in a long distance relationship, but I see him frequently - at least a couple of times a month), he said we only had sex a 2 out of 4 days, so what should I expect.  (Mind you, we were fighting the other two days.  I guess I was supposed to set that aside and then act excited about having sex with him in between the hurling of insults, etc.)  He has zero empathy for how this has made me feel.  And, after me telling him how upsetting it all was to me, he essentially said he is sorry for how I feel - BUT - he is not sorry for what he did.

This does not seem like something that can be resolved.  I want to be in what I consider to be a more secure relationship.  One where I do not need to worry about him connecting with someone else through an intimate setting.  Of course, it does not help that he has a past history of hanging out with women (behind my back) who sold their services.  That was last summer, and I thought we had finally put that behind us.  But this really brings it all back.  He is not happy or content with our sexual relationship and he has/is looking beyond the relationship for pleasure.

He does not understand that I view this as disrespectful, hurtful, or something that is not appropriate.  He simply wants to do what he wants to do even if that means that it harms me emotionally.

Has anyone dealt with similar issues?  I realize that this comes with the territory, but where would one even begin to try and resolve this issue?  It seems like something where a compromise cannot be found.  It's not something I am comfortable with and, quite frankly, not something I want to tolerate.  At least not long term.

Sigh...

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[Lola B]

I am sorry to read that you are experiencing your partner using live sex services. I exited my marriage due to pornography addiction (in 2002 when porn was film) knowing that it was only a matter of time before I was encountering a much more difficult issue or a disease I had no business having. Again I exited an LTR with a man who was my best friend because he was compelled to take secret photos of me and other women. I am lonely and it is uncomfortable to feel lonely, but I never stay lonely for long. Sometimes it is a chat with a neighbor or time with friends or consulting a pro about a hobby, but I have found a way to cultivate myself to cushion the sharp edges of loneliness. It really depends what kind of person you can tolerate being: a sometimes lonely, cultured woman with interests and hobbies or a coupled woman who bears some secret shame. I judge neither and don't know if I've chosen right, but it suits me because I remember the pain. To me, it is infidelity, so the pain was too great. As I sit among partnered folks at events I feel lonely... until the food comes out or the music starts playing. Then my hobbies (cooking and dancing) are ignited and I'm glad not to have an unfaithful partner distracting me from the arts I love.

This is long-winded, but in short, look for the longer term feeling and take the steps to achieve it. Sometimes it is risking therapy that may or may not work if you stay, sometimes it is occasional loneliness and the awkwardness of trying a new skill if you walk. Again, I do not know what is right or best, but we come in this world alone and go out alone, so if we are lonely in the middle it might not be bad for us.

[hopeful1073]

Thanks, Lola B, for your thoughts.  It helps me view this from another perspective - one about whether I will want to stay if the behavior does not change.  I am like you in that, if feeling lonely, I find a way to fill that void with happy things.  I have always been that way - and I have found that when I am alone, I am ok with it for this reason.  There are so many good, enriching things in life - family, friends, hobbies, experiencing life - that I do not feel lonely often or for any lengthy periods of time.

I will not stay just for the sake of staying.  The question for me if really what will finally be the thing that makes me leave if things do not change.  I do not yet know the answer to that question.  It is one my therapist has asked me and I continue to think about it...I want to hope for the best, but I am realistic in that I know that not all stories - which may include the one I am in right now - have a happy ending.  And that is ok.

[Radcliff]

I want to be in what I consider to be a more secure relationship.  

Don't lose site of this goal.  One limitation that we need to acknowledge is that we can invite others to behave in a certain way, but we can't force them to do it if they don't want to.

Let me give you a bit of a puzzle.  Take a look at this page on setting boundaries.  How might you use the concept of boundaries to protect yourself in this situation?  Sorry, this is not an easy puzzle!

RC

[hopeful1073]

Thanks, Radcliff.  I have always liked homework (yes, I am weird...), but this type of an assignment is hard!  I am still trying to get the hang of boundaries and how to assert them.  It has been a rocky start and my bpd BF is not thrilled about the idea of having any boundaries in place.

On this topic, my boundary would be that I offer to my partner a monogamous relationship that will not involve any one-on-one sexual activity with anyone else - virtual or otherwise - and I expect the same in return.  I am loyal to my partner in this way and believe that this type of loyalty is required to make each other feel secure.

In the past, I was more conflicted about pornography itself, but I was open to compromise on that issue so long as there was honesty about it and continued intimacy between me and my partner.

Please let me know if you think I am on the mark in how I have articulated this boundary!  Since reading the link you provided, I have come up with a list of 9 boundaries including the one above.  I realize that I cannot spring them all on my bpd BF all at once (although there are many on the list that he has heard about before - it just has been difficult to make them stick), but I need to start talking with him about them so I can feel more secure on a day-to-day basis.

[Joro109]

Oh hopeful:(    I hate to be a Debbie downer but if you feel at all you are capable of being lonely and are confident that that is more OK than disrespecting your boundaries, more power to you.     

I just found this group and I just made a first post...about impending divorce.   But oh how I remember being exactly where you are now.  That was 6 cheatings (that I'm aware of) and 3 years ago. 
 He wasn't open and sharing about it like even a  basic friend would be. He dodged it for a while too. Then gave half truths. Then also tried to backup why it wasn't that bad.  Tried to explain it by a bad upbringing and messed up prior relationships.  Wanted me to believe he had bad experiences in those relationships and therefore reason to do bad, selfish things and also believed that everyone was probably doing those things. Wanted me to believe that he could control it or that it wouldn't happen again...

 It seems evident that without a massive shift and real commitment to frequent therapy, it's all just whatever it seems like will make you happy to hear.   It sounds immensely disrespectful but they seem to do whatever works to comfort THEIR feelings in the black or white. 
 If they could control it, they would already just be wholly happy and not damaging/deceitful  to themselves or others. 

 Back then, mine was willing to discuss boundaries.
But then he would just move the goalpost to a very particular new lie or cheating that we hadn't technically discussed. 
 Now he refuses to even acknowlege that his behavior is problematic to me or for himself or others. He just blames me for "bitching". 

I really don't think he probably has a direct issue with you or your sex life.   He might not even know what a good one could/should feel like. Mine used to call it a
soul f¿@×.   He had never done anything besides an empty act, so he was surprised by this exchange of connection/emotion thing.   It's how he doesn't feel about him  that causes the need for excess attention in any form. 
For example, after finally verbally ruling out all possible bad things, mine started claiming to have made it look like he did things that he supposedly didnt, just to leave fake evidence for me to find to make me jealous.   

THAT'S  what you're up against.  (Unless mine was just lying his face off) 
Any way of attention, even if horrible, just to feel briefly shallow positive, from wherever feels best or easy to ONE person. 

 I think your next to last paragraph says everything but unfortunately unless there is a good amount of good therapy involved, I really don't think sympathy/empathy tends to improve on it's own. 
 In my experience, he seems to have learned that You just look out for your own interests at heart because that's what everyone else does.   And also failed to learn anything about truly considering others and therefore can't grasp or practice it without intervention.  Even if they have or want to, these are supposedly  compulsions, not choices

[Radcliff]

That's totally awesome that you've got 9 boundaries stacked up!  It can be hard for us in the beginning to understand where to set boundaries, so it's great that you're actively thinking about it!

W.r.t. the way you've articulated the boundary, the thing you didn't say is what you'll do if he doesn't take you up on the offer.  Let's say you implement that boundary, and his actions cross over that boundary.  What is your protective action in response?

One other quick question -- how long have you been in this relationship?

RC