Facial Expressions and Tone

[sabas]

I know it's a common thing to have your facial expressions and tone analyzed by the pwBPD in your life. Does anyone else feel like it's possibly the largest day-to-day issue in their relationship?

I feel like every single day I'm made to feel/believe I've committed murder via my facial expressions and tone. It can turn a pleasant day into a nightmare and I'm fairly consistently terrified of it. Another related faux pas it seems we can make is laughing or smiling and it being interpreted as laughing or smiling at them. It's on my mind way more than it should be, and I even started to believe I had a big problem that was inherent to me, until I found this board and Walking on Eggshells, and realized NO ONE else in my life has any significant issue understanding my tone, expressions and laughs.

Not necessarily looking for a solution, just curious what others experience and think about this phenomenon.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[just_breathe]

Hello,
I have also had my facial expressions analyzed and been accused of being angry when I'm actually just pretty neutral, sometimes even happy. The most common thing I'm told is that I'm looking at my BP like he's done something wrong and I hate him. I've been accused of scaring him "all the time" and that I need to stop or we'll be done. I struggle because I actually started to believe that I was looking at him this way and even started to wonder if deep down I was mad for some reason and just didn't want to admit it. However, I don't think that was the case most of the time. I started telling myself I wasn't good enough because if I was I wouldn't do anything to make him feel worse about himself and sometimes convince myself that he's going to find another, perfect girl that won't ever do these things to him. I too was afraid to show any expression with the fear that it would interpreted as something negative even when it wasn't.
However, I am currently reading Stop Walking On Eggshells as well and am finding it very helpful. I didn't understand the way his emotions worked but gaining more insight is helping me to see that maybe I'm not as horrible as I had grown to think I was.

[ophelia759]

This is a major issue with my BPD husband.
I can't count the number of times I've been raged at for doing something 'without the proper expression on my face' (as he puts it 'with that crusty look on your face'). This got worse three years ago when I lost significant weight, particularly in my face, due to a medication I was on. So I started doing this thing where I smile like a maniac whenever he comes into a room. Like seriously, maniacal smiling with my teeth and my eyes. I could be wishing he would drop dead on the spot, but I smile like my life depends on it.
I've got into this habit (even now that my face is back to normal) and every time I do it, I think 'what have I become?' but interestingly, he has never once challenged me on it, and accused me of being fake, which I totally expected he would given his issues.

[Birddog]

I’ve dulled my facial expressions around my spouse Over the years as a coping strategy,  My thinking’s is it relates to splitting.

I figure now My spouse likes to split, so she is searching for things to confirm her suspicions. It’s nice when she is is in the idealization phase, gets unpleasant when goes the other way. I started emphasizing the gray areas. Sometimes the idealization phase for me now is just as un comfortable as the devaluation phase, understanding for what it is. I’d rather her love me for who I am.

I don’t get over aggressive about seeding the thoughts of gray areas, just address the black and white thinking in way to help lead to better understanding.

So some examples:

French perfume, they put one item in it that is unsavory to give it character, not to be over sweet.

Splitting negative on her dad, there are some gray areas, challenger her to look at the person.

Spitting positive on a friend, I challenge her to see the grays in the person, get a whole picture.

Just some thoughts to kick around.

[Stillhopeful4]

My uBPDw is a people watcher and yes she is always looking at my reactions and facial expressions.  Sometimes if we are arguing she says I don't care enough because I'm not crying.  Birddog you mention about "confirming her suspicions".  My wife always says things like...by doing that you just confirmed I'm doing the right thing by leaving.  She's always looking for things to "confirm her thoughts".

Also, if I am on the phone or texting someone she will watch me and say what did you smile for.  I'm sorry my kid said something funny and I smiled.

One more thing, my uBPDw facial expressions are always ...well grumpy.  Lots of the pictures I have of her she's frowning and looks miserable.  Most of the FB pics she's frowning and people comment hey does your wife ever smile.  It's sad really that she's that miserable inside mostly all of the time.  She claims she only has two feelings in this life...happy or angry.

SH4

[Birddog]

Interesting SH4,

It sounds like the emphasis is on judging the feeling rather than  what the feeling actually is and being able to feel that feeling without judgement.

Yeah, my spouse is hot or cold, no in between, it’s getting better with awareness.

[sabas]

Ophelia, I do the same thing. My wife and I will be hanging out and she will naturally turn her attention to our dog or our son or whatever, and instead of relaxing I keep my eye on her so that if she looks back at me I’ll be smiling and giving her attention, even as she is completely ignoring me. It’s kind of insane when i describe it. And I just can’t relax.

SH4, I relate very much to your post. I was struck by your texting example, I’ve never described that to any of my friends, as it feels like such an obscure issue, but my wife does the exact same thing. To the point where I try to read my texts stone-faced, because even if I say someone said something funny, she’ll somehow take that personally? And the confirming absolutely seems to be at the heart of all of the analysis. That they’re sure you don’t like them and are  going to leave them so they’ll find evidence everywhere, even if it’s fabricated.

[Ray2017]

instead of relaxing I keep my eye on her so that if she looks back at me I’ll be smiling and giving her attention, even as she is completely ignoring me. It’s kind of insane when i describe it. And I just can’t relax.

Chiming in to say this is my experience, too.  My H spends a lot of time on his phone, but if we're in the same room I find myself watching him instead of reading my book or looking at my phone because he'll say I spend too much time on my devices (which I now know is actually projection as I spend a fraction of the time he does), or I'm ignoring him because I'm secretly mad about something, etc.  I then chide myself that this constant observation is part of the walking on eggshells, then I reason it's making sure things don't escalate...  I'd like to just be able to sit and relax without having to go over options in my head!  You're not alone in this at all!

[Jessica84]

More than my tone or facial expression, I try to be mindful of what's happening internally. Am I mad? irritated? annoyed?  If I am, then he's correctly judged my tone or expression. So what? I am allowed to be mad, irritated or annoyed. I try to wait til I'm calmer to discuss so that I am able to keep a lid on my own emotions first. That's on me.

What's NOT on me is when he chooses to misinterpret  how I feel. That's when I just... let him. This took some practice.. and patience! But I realized a long time ago he's also allowed to feel how he feels, even if it's "wrong"--> like when he feels that I'm mad when I'm not. I let him see me how he wants to now. His feelings change on a dime anyway. Eventually he comes back to earth.

We can validate their feelings without agreeing with them, but only to a point. If I detect he's just looking for a fight, no amount of assuring him I don't hate him will work. Best to exit the situation before things escalate - let him calm himself down while I go on my merry way and live happily ever after... til the next blowout. 

[Stillhopeful4]

That they’re sure you don’t like them and are  going to leave them so they’ll find evidence everywhere, even if it’s fabricated.

^^^^^^ THIS...yes...OMG I thought I was the only one who thought this.

SH4

[Stillhopeful4]

My H spends a lot of time on his phone, but if we're in the same room I find myself watching him instead of reading my book or looking at my phone because he'll say I spend too much time on my devices (which I now know is actually projection as I spend a fraction of the time he does), or I'm ignoring him because I'm secretly mad about something, etc. 

WOW Ray.  My uBPDw does the same thing, she tells me that I'm always on my phone, when I'm not and yet she is.  I would purposly not pick up my phone until she fell asleep..but of course she would wake up and I would get yelled at because I was on my phone...she even told our T..."I know I shouldn't get mad that I fall asleep on the couch in the middle of the day (on a weekend) and I wake up and she's scrolling through face book, but it makes me angry."  She always says I'm focusing on everyone but her and that I never make time for her.  So not true AT ALL.

[sabas]

Holy s**t, I experience the exact same thing. I like to scroll on reddit for 30-60 min in bed to kind of decompress and relax with no one to have to pay attention to before I go to sleep. And even if she’s exhausted and falling asleep she says it bothers her knowing I’m doing that. The light doesn’t reach her, I’m completely silent and not moving and it’s just the knowledge. So I do the same, wait until I can hear her snoring before silently reaching for my phone and hoping I don’t knock something or graze it against my nightstand  It’s baffling. And i get told I’m on my phone too much too, meanwhile if she’s zoning out on Instagram it’s totally cool.

And I started believing her constant nagging, I probably am on my phone a little too much, but it’s never actually affected my life. I’ve never neglected my job or my son or my wife because of it. And how i relax should not have any bearing on her. Look at me, even justifying to you all...

[Birddog]

So my spouse started sniping at me about the phone, so I calmly asked her point blank “whats specifically is bothering you about it, I wanted to know, is there something you would like me to do different?”

I’m seriously  curious after this thread. That triggered something. She responded with, “You Know”. So I followed up with “I’m just curious, is it threatening, what’s going on.” Conversation got really weird, ducking, dodging the question, ultimately she immediately changed the subject, and I never got an answer. I didn’t press any further, seemed to have hit a really raw nerve.

[sabas]

I think it's basically that you could be giving your full attention that is both not them and "not productive". Most of the time if I'm not working or doing some sort of chore or home improvement my wife will kind of assume my attention will be on her. I've always struggled with how after we fight about this, she will request that I tell her when I want time to pursue my own leisure, when I've assumed that if I say I'm going to do something that that should be enough. It's like I have to explain that relaxing and enjoying myself is important to my psyche otherwise she will pout and feel sorry for herself.
 
I think in your case, Birddog, your spouse may actually be realizing it's not rational, and that she really just wants to control your attention. That probably makes her uncomfortable and she doesn't want to admit it to you or herself. In a way i'd almost be a little encouraged because it may mean she at least intellectually realizes it even if her emotions don't want her to.

[Birddog]

I think it's basically that you could be giving your full attention that is both not them and "not productive".

Oh man, need major help on this one, thought it was just me.

I can barely sit anywhere in the house without becoming a target and labeled a lazy SOB. This is coming from a guy that runs half marathons for fun. Any ideas on how to better address?

[Ray2017]

Sabas and Birddog- are we married to the same person?  In the past, I’ll throw myself into a project look busy, even though he’s been playing video games for a while. He doesn’t expressly say  I’m lazy, but there are often audible, weary sighs if he has to put a plate in the dishwasher. I know my reaction is not healthy. I second Birddog- good ways to address that doesn’t lead to a fight?

[sabas]

Yes, I've experienced extremely similar things. And she struggles so much with free time herself. I think it's because when she's doing some leisure activity alone her BPD symptoms (namely fear of abandonment) are in the foreground instead of in the background when she has a distraction (in the form of me). Unfortunately I haven't found many solutions ha. I've brought it up to her and she will acknowledge that she struggles with free time, but when it comes to actually feeling okay if I'm doing something else, she doesn't have many tools. It's really rough because even if I do get some rare time to myself, she will create some drama or, like you're describing with the sighing, make it clear she's not happy and it will suck a lot of the enjoyment/relaxation out of my activity. In this way I never feel like I actually get a respite and I end up worn out and detached when she really wants me.