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Author Topic: Subtle manipulation where I always end up losing  (Read 867 times)
tvda
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Relationship status: broken up
Posts: 136


« on: February 01, 2021, 12:11:44 PM »

Hi all,

I'm puzzled about a part of the situationship dynamics with my uBDP-partner or uBDP-ex (hard to say, depending on the mood of the day), that frustrates me to no end.

In short, it's this: while I keep on fighting, fighting and fighting (for her, for our relationship), I always get the feeling that my uBDP has zero fear of losing me. And this leads to a very toxic dynamic that leads me to 'lose' every conflict we are in.

Some examples:
A) Whenever she does something wrong that really hurts me, and I rightfully speak up, she immediately goes into a child-like sadness where she states "oh no... I'm so sad... Now our relationship is damaged beyond repair... That means there is no future for us anymore..."

Predictably this has me going into a "no don't say that, I still love you, we are still a beautiful combination, we can deal with this" type of reaction. In other words: she harms me, and immediately abandons all hope, I swoop in to defend our relationship and say that everything is still okay, that this one thing doesn't destroy all that we stand for.

Obviously, this means that her behaviour is not addressed, I don't get a true apology or sense that she's willing to change and fight for us. She messes up and gives up, and as a result I step up the efforts I put into the relationship, and am not consoled for the hurt she caused me.

B) Another variation: whenever I do try to set my boundaries and call her out on her actions, her go-to reaction is always "you are right... I did treat you badly... I should just bear the consequences and leave you alone..."

The main theme is a sort of "when you call me out on how I treat you badly I will give up the relationship without even blinking." Of course this makes me feel like PLEASE READ. Because there's no making amends on her side, and because it makes me feel like our relationship means so little to her, that she's willing to let go so easily.

And in the end, of course it just enables her to keep on doing what she does. Because ultimately I will always forgive and fight a little bit harder - even though she's the one hurting me, and who should be fighting harder. But she never does.

C) Situations where she knows a certain occurence is super-important to me, and would sort of prove her commitment in some way, and she always bails at the last moment. The sort of thing where she should know: if I mess this up, it's going to be a biiiig breach of trust. And then she messes it up, and comes up with a big sob story of intense emotions, about how she just couldn't do it. About big stress, big sadness, big big emotions. Bigger than mine, you could say. Which immediately puts you in a position where you're kind of forced to be understanding. Even though in the big scheme of things, you're the one being hurt and disappointed, time and time again.

D) edit, I forgot this one: things are volatile of course, so 'small break ups' occur. Whenever she says "this is it, I don't want to hear you anymore, things are DONE." she always pops back into my life a couple of days later, or I respond that I really don't want to lose her. However, when I say something like this, she really disappears. Not a single reaction - making me feel like I'm worth nothing to her of course. When I then predictably stumble, reconnect and ask why she didn't respond at all, her hard-to-find-fault excuse is always "well, you said you didn't want to hear from me anymore so I wanted to respect your wishes." Somehow it doesn't feel like respecting my wishes (as this is the only situation where she does so), but more like a power-struggle, like "So you're pushing me away? Okay then, see how it feels when I don't respond at all, ever."

Does this sound familiar to anyone? This type of conflicts where you feel that no matter what happens, you always lose? And even worse, you're even the one that ends up making more of an effort than before, as crazy and unfair as it sounds.

Summed up briefly: the kind of stuff where your only options are 'accepting her PLEASE READ' or breaking off the relationship. And because the isolated incidents are always just too small to break up, you stay and give up on the consolation you actually deserve.

Somehow it feels extremely manipulative... And it rots your soul to always feel that she's one inch away from breaking up in a big show of tears, because "she realises she's not treating you right, and maybe you are better of alone, deserve someone who is more stable..."

Thanks for any insights / shared experiences.

T

p.s. by the way, this is puzzling, because although she's undiagnosed, she is (quiet) borderline to the max. And I always expect her fear of abandonment would cause her to come through with big big gestures and promises, to keep me from leaving, but no... It's as if she's willing to wrap up everything without even thinking about it, as soon as she hurts me and I speak up about it.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2021, 12:26:40 PM by tvda » Logged
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Scared2Lose
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« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2021, 02:42:13 PM »

Here's my 2 cents now that I'm staring down the barrel of getting kicked out of my home by my qBPD wife.

Don't argue. It's not going to do you any good. Detach yourself from her behavior. It's not about you, it's about how you make her feel. Don't JADE. They are not interested in hearing your explanations, perspective or defense. Doing this only makes them feel worse and by association, worse about you.

Learn to walk away. When things get heated, do not double-down. Do not try to point out to her where her thinking is wrong. Do not escalate the argument. It is not personal, but she does not care about how you feel, and any effort to get her to is only going to work against your interests. Acknowledge that you recognize her feelings in the situation, that you empathize with her need for saying or doing whatever she did. State that those things hurt your feelings, and that she has the freedom to do with that information whatever she wants, then walk away.

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greeneyes25
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« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2021, 12:40:43 PM »

I feel the exact same way in my relationship. I am so sorry that you're going through this. I don't really have any solid answers as I have not found my way out of this cycle with my partner. In the end, as much as it hurts, I think it is about what you are willing to accept. As manipulative and not okay as her behavior is, you are accepting it by going back every time and always being there for her. I am too. For me, I've tried so so hard to get my partner to get help, to try therapy for himself. I've spoken to him time and time again and once even broke up with I'm stating that I need him to be getting active mental health help if we are going to be together. Ultimatum was probably pointless but I was at my wits ends. He cried and pleaded and said that he would do anything to stay with me, but he tried therapy for maybe 3-4 sessions and then quit and refuses to go back. He isn't willing to do it for me. That's for sure. By staying with him, I showed him that I am willing to accept his behavior.  I think the decision has to be for himself.  My question for myself and I guess for you too is are you willing to continue nurturing the relationship with this person and accept his/her behavior?
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Serenitywithin
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« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2021, 01:04:34 PM »

All of these situations are where I have been for years. I am currently in the process of having my wife served papers for divorce, but What described is what i have been dealing with for 16 years .. IF i did not have kids I could possibly stick it out as I can handle it most of the time but it is really causing the kids a lot of problems.
The wierdest thing about the whole dynamic is that you can never have a real conversation with them about it later. for my wife after she calms down she goes straight to sex... Once sex has been had, she wants to forget that there was ever even an issue and never discuss the bad behavior, If i bring up the bad behavior later in a can we talk about this type of way then I get cry'ed on and accused of bringing up the past and wanting to change her. The event what ever it might have been is only a week old and we have never talked about it, no apologies, but she wants to move and and forget it ever happened.

It can be frustrating. You cant ever win without leaving things in a bad place for yourself and your feelings while making her feel like you just threw a grenade at her.
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tvda
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Relationship status: broken up
Posts: 136


« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2021, 12:09:50 PM »

Thanks Scared2Lose, GreenEyes25 and SerenityWithin, for your replies.

GreenEyes, I was struck by your question about whether or not I had the strength and willingness to keep on "nurturing" the relationship... If it was actually truly nurturing, I would probably keep on going. But it does not feel like I'm seeing improvement, but rather the opposite. I don't even have the feeling that I am helping HER fine more calm, balance or sanity - or satisfaction. So what is the use anymore?

I guess in the end the dynamic I described makes the relationship unhealthier with each interaction - with me getting the short end of the stick no matter what. Ultimately, I'd end up a passive puppet undergoing what is essentially abuse... So I'm actually really really really considering stepping out of this situation.
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ThanksForPlaying
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2021, 03:46:10 PM »

for my wife after she calms down she goes straight to sex... Once sex has been had, she wants to forget that there was ever even an issue and never discuss the bad behavior, If i bring up the bad behavior later in a can we talk about this type of way then I get cry'ed on and accused of bringing up the past and wanting to change her.

I was thinking about this today.  It's usually drunk, emotional, make-up sex.  She's even told me "make-up sex is the best sex" and I usually say "nope - I like happy fun sex".  She has some sexual trauma in her past and I think she feels like the only way she enjoys sex is to start a huge argument, say terrible hurtful things, maybe cause some public embarrassment, and then make up.   For me it was kind of thrilling and emotional the first 2, 3, 10, 50 times ... but eventually it just gets tedious and exhausting emotionally.  I think that happens to her too - she can't get the same thrill that she used to get from just a 'little' fight, and she has to keep starting bigger and bigger fights to feel that same emotional connection.  Then there's never any mention of whatever happened.  I've even had this pattern happen two or three times in a single day when on vacation!  Drinking and threatening to leave at breakfast, make-up sex, another fight in the afternoon, "I'm changing my flight and going home", make-up sex, same thing at night, "you don't love me", make-up sex.  And she'll tell people we had a great vacation!  I don't have any answers, but I can relate.
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Chosen
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« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2021, 08:46:50 PM »

Then there's never any mention of whatever happened. ..And she'll tell people we had a great vacation!  I don't have any answers, but I can relate.

Do you think she genuinely forgot the arguments (being in a disassociative state), or what is really on?  Because my pwBPD can be like that too, make up sex and then never mentioning what happened.   
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tvda
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Relationship status: broken up
Posts: 136


« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2021, 02:18:19 AM »

I've noticed that dissociative amnesia is a very real and active process... Truly erasing or blocking out things that are too painful or complex - or don't fit the narrative of the current feelings...
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