Is this empathy?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Yesterday over lunch, W was commenting about how an ex boyfriend made annoying noises when he drank anything.  Then she met his family and said that they all made the same annoying noise.  She paused and then said she felt bad for him.  I asked why, and she replied that she was very mean to him.  After that some kind of justification on her part, followed by a comment about how several men she dated wound up marrying the woman they dated after her. 

Is this a moment of empathy on her part, or more a moment of shame for her own behavior?  Is she recognizing she hurt him, or that he was hurt by her? Was the comment about him marrying his next girlfriend more along the lines of "It's okay, he found someone and is happy" or more of a self pity comment?

[maxsterling]

Yesterday over lunch, W was commenting about how an ex boyfriend made annoying noises when he drank anything.  Then she met his family and said that they all made the same annoying noise.  She paused and then said she felt bad for him.  I asked why, and she replied that she was very mean to him.  After that some kind of justification on her part, followed by a comment about how several men she dated wound up marrying the woman they dated after her. 

Is this a moment of empathy on her part, or more a moment of shame for her own behavior?  Is she recognizing she hurt him, or that he was hurt by her? Was the comment about him marrying his next girlfriend more along the lines of "It's okay, he found someone and is happy" or more of a self pity comment?

[15years]

Interesting, do you think she hurt him more than she has hurt you?

It was kind of a funny observation that his whole family made that same noise. Maybe she was looking at this comically. And also sounds like she feels pity for this man, which indicates that she sees herself as somehow more advanced than him. Maybe it feels empowering to remember ex's "weakness". Saying she feels bad for him in this case makes her feel less shame for herself. That's my guess.

[Notwendy]

I think you were probably interested in her feeling sorry for being mean to an old boyfriend as perhaps then, she might see that she's been hurtful to you. There's no way to know what your wife actually feels. Those are her feelings and these are personal to her but we can see actions. It's empathy that stops us from doing hurtful things to people because we wouldn't like how that feels. Consider that how she treats you is a better indicator of empathy than reminiscing about an old relationship.

[Skip]

It sounds like a moment of self-awareness for sure.

Is it empathy? Maybe a little. Self-awareness is one component of empathy.

Is it shame? Maybe a little. Self-awareness is often a precursor to shame or the "shame lite".

Self-awareness is good.

[maxsterling]

It sounds like a moment of self-awareness for sure.

Is it empathy? Maybe a little. Self-awareness is one component of empathy.

Is it shame? Maybe a little. Self-awareness is often a precursor to shame or the "shame lite".

Self-awareness is good.

Sums it up well.  Thank you.  I can say it was a rare moment of self-awareness, but can't say more beyond that.  I think she has more self-awareness than she admits to.  But, it never, ever happens in the moment.  And it never, ever changes current behavior.  In most cases, those "self aware" moments are later forgotten about.  The self-awareness is only in reflection.

Of note, she didn't nor has she ever said anything nice about this guy.  But she has mentioned him before and mentioned the habits he had that she did not like.   When she does have a moment like this about an ex, her thoughts tend to conclude at "I really had no business being in a relationship with him."  I have never heard her say, "He was a nice guy, but I ______ and hurt him." 

Stuff like this makes me wonder more about what really happened in some of the bad incidents she mentioned from her past.  Not to say bad stuff did not happen to her, but recognizing that her catastrophizing paints a poor picture of what really happened.