How to Respond?

[LifewithEase]

Among many other things, my uBPDw tends to belittled my work/profession/success.

I currently work for myself and the business is sophisticated, successful but has regular up and down cycles. This inconsistency makes her uncomfortable and is a huge issue in our marriage. She thinks that I have "never contributed to the household," "You're a deadbeat," You're only a taker," "You are unable to provide for your family,"... you get the picture.

During a recent significant dysregulation, she emailed me that she was going to take me off of her employer's health insurance.

I'm torn between responding: "This email is hurtful and inappropriate. It feels to me like a fear tactic and shaming."

Classic trap for us Nons:

A. If I respond, I can work on boundaries and start a pattern showing she can't talk to me that way

B. If I respond, it could be JADEing, I know she'll say similarly terrible things in the future so why feed her drama

C. If I don't respond, I am not dealing with the situation

D. If I don't respond, I'm benignly letting her know she can make the decision without me

E. If I don't respond, I don't have to deal with the resulting subsequent rage from her

I'm just exhausted and frustrated I can't get clarity on a respond.

Thoughts?

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[Couscous]

This is definitely something you should bring up at your next marriage counseling session.

[kells76]

Agreed with Couscous, this seems like an important discussion to bring to marriage counseling.

One way to approach it in MC is to bring a printout of the email, and maybe adopt a posture of "befuddlement":

"I received this email, and this is certainly a big statement. I don't understand... can you help shine some light on how to have understanding when an email like this gets sent?"

This is a really, really, really neutral opener. There's no blame or finger pointing. I suspect any MC with experience would see that email, hear your opener, and be able to put some pieces together.

(I was tempted to suggest something like this in the middle: "I need help understanding my W -- should I believe that she means this? Should I somehow understand that she does not really mean it? " but it may be too much for starters. I do think that ultimately a "double bind" like that would be telling about your W. If she "means it" then that certainly paints her in a bad light that she isn't going to want the MC to see. If she "doesn't mean it" then again she comes across as someone who just says hurtful things pointlessly. Again she won't want the MC to see it. If the MC can somehow raise that question to your W on his/her own: "W, did you really mean to do what you said" then... well, she won't like it, but the MC will see the dynamic between you two).

If the session is coming up soon, you can ponder not responding, and the way I might frame not responding to myself would be -- responding gives weight and meaning to her hurtful email that it doesn't have and doesn't deserve. pwBPD say all kinds of things in the moment that reflect their inability to manage their emotions, versus a rational plan moving forward. We've dealt with it too. Engaging extensively with the far-out content validates it to the pwBPD as "Oh, maybe there is something real there". My gut instinct is that she doesn't have the executive function or planning to actually follow through with this threat. (Plus, isn't it illegal?) Not responding isn't necessarily "not dealing with the situation". In a way it is dealing with the situation by not rewarding her with engagement for saying something so hurtful and pointless. It could be modeling "trying to engage via hurtful and inappropriate remarks gets no response" -- versus trying to explain in words that it was hurtful. Explaining to a pwBPD in words why they were hurtful is typically a losing battle, as there will always be some reason why your explanation is wrong, and they are right, and then it just blows up again.

If the session isn't coming up soon, that's where I might ponder a brief response that avoids JADE (the explanation of why it hurt you) and is more to make a paper trail on your end.

It could look something like: "Babe, while I would feel incredibly sad if you chose that, I don't have control over what you do".

or, "Babe, while that wouldn't be best for us, I respect the fact that you make your own choices"

Something to get on paper that you don't want it, you don't think it's best or helpful, and you're also not participating in fighting her on it.

I really, really would be surprised if she actually did it. That is to say:

I really don't think it'd be your argument against it, or expression of hurt, that'd be the thing to stop her from following through.

It's that she probably can't, and also was using that move as "blow off valve" for her feelings, versus a rational expression of a plan.

That doesn't make it OK to say things like that "just to blow off steam", which is why taking the email (or the two emails, if you reply) to MC, and saying, "What do we do with this, how do we work with this, how do we move forward" is probably your wisest bet.

Hopefully some of that is helpful...

kells76

[LifewithEase]

So this is how it played out.

I talked with my T. She suggested replying. I sent a very concise note saying her threat email as inappropriate and mean-spirited. My uBPDw replied in full blow anger. I didn't take the bait.

Later, I brought up the threat email in MC session and the body language and facial expressions told me that the MC got it right away.

Other mean examples were brought up, discussed, the MC asked my wife directly if she thought she was mean to me, why she was mean and abusive towards me. Wife disagreed that she was abusive. In reply to being mean, said she agreed being mean due to my inability to xyx and how I was a disappointment about abc... you know the drill. Not about them.

This exchange was so important to me. It will be the baby steps to openly bringing up BPD. I think the MC challenged me to be more open during the next session but I'm just too hesitant to add the language / concept of BPD into an already complicated situation.

And just between all of us... I'm afraid and burned out by the rage that would come with it.

[kells76]

This exchange was so important to me. It will be the baby steps to openly bringing up BPD. I think the MC challenged me to be more open during the next session but I'm just too hesitant to add the language / concept of BPD into an already complicated situation.

Tell me a little more about bringing up BPD in a session -- is this something you personally would like to do, or is it something coming from the MC, or...?

I wonder if we're on the same page, that whatever BPD is called, it's the behaviors that are the real problem for you, not inherently the name. So, if BPD were called "emotional challenge syndrome" or literally whatever, it isn't about bringing up a specific label, it's about bringing up the constellation of behaviors/traits/etc that the label umbrellas.

Close?

Could there be a way to bring up "BPD" without calling it "BPD", at least for starters, if part of your concern about your W's potential rage response is her response to that specific label? Again, if the price to take a path forward to make things less worse and then better, where your W actually participated, was the price of "but we don't say BPD explicitly", BUT the behaviors and traits were addressed... could that be worth it?

Just brainstorming ways to move forward so you can address some core concerns in the "least worst" way possible.

[yellowbutterfly]

Among many other things, my uBPDw tends to belittled my work/profession/success.

I currently work for myself and the business is sophisticated, successful but has regular up and down cycles. This inconsistency makes her uncomfortable and is a huge issue in our marriage. She thinks that I have "never contributed to the household," "You're a deadbeat," You're only a taker," "You are unable to provide for your family,"... you get the picture.

During a recent significant dysregulation, she emailed me that she was going to take me off of her employer's health insurance.

Hi @LifeWithEase

Number one, I completely identify with you as this same scenario happened with me and my stbxH who is uBPD.

He was threatened by my business and as any small business goes there are ups and downs in the revenue/work stream. DO not allow your partner's jealously and misunderstanding of how hard you've worked to get you down. I was treated the same way. He told me my business was fake and I was a fraud. He even made up stories about how I had no real clients, NOT TRUE. They are upset and don't understand anything that takes attention away from them. Be proud of your work and continue to show up for yourself in business.

I lost clients in the process because I couldn't keep up with being abused by my H and my workload. Take care of yourself.

Number Two, at least where I live, your spouse CANNOT legally terminate you from insurance. We are in a court battle over this right now. You should speak with an attorney about this. My H constantly threatened this all summer then finally did it once I said I was leaving. It has been a nightmare for me. I hope this is not the case for you.

Your story here was all too familiar so I wanted to let you know you are NOT alone.

I can't help with answering your W approaches you have below because I feel as though I'm not sure what I'd do either. I can just tell you from my experience it was horrible and I am frustrated and insurance-less right now.

These things they do to us DO NOT make sense. I'm sorry this is happening to you but you are in the right place with as I've found a great and knowledgable support group.

[yellowbutterfly]

My gut instinct is that she doesn't have the executive function or planning to actually follow through with this threat. (Plus, isn't it illegal?)

I really, really would be surprised if she actually did it. That is to say:

@kells76 you always give great advice here and I've been so appreciative. I will a few things re: your points above.

1. YES it is likely illegal for her to remove LWE from insurance, though, she can do it.
2. I thought my stbxH wouldn't have the executive function or planning to follow through. Sometimes he was even as aware enough to tell me they were empty threats. BUT...

I've learned with my uBPDH to NEVER put anything past him. I don't know about other pwBPD but even when my H threatened things when it got bad he eventually did THEM or worse.

I don't want to scare you LifeWithEase but this is just what exactly happened to me when I thought wow he'd never do that, it's another empty threat like all his suicide threats or taking other things away from me. HE DID IT. Now I have thousands of dollars of insurance bills and legal bills. It is a total nightmare. Worse than I ever imagined.

From the helpful book, "Stop Walking on Eggshells"

"Hope for the best; prepare for the worst"

[LifewithEase]

Yellowbutterfly,

Much appreciated. Nerve racking but good to hear and to consistently internalize...

"Hope for the best; prepare for the worst"

[LifewithEase]

P.S. She never did take me off the insurance. T reminded me of the years of many false threats, bluffing.

Even though you know a BPD will make extreme proclamations and you can use boundaries to protect yourself,  some are just so alarming a part of you can not ignore it.