Coping with black/white thinking toward boundaries

[Depression = 72% of members]

We’ve known my mother likely has BPD for 15 years or so. I am the middle of 3 brothers and my older brother is married to a woman. My younger brother and I are more recently married. Most of our lives since teenhood it’s been a cycle that whoever is bad-object struggles with managing boundaries with my mother around the way that she expresses her deep dissatisfaction with the bad-object du jour. I’ve been in therapy a very long time, because I was consistently bad-object through much of my teen years and throughout college (coming out as queer to a mother with BPD who is not fond of the idea was difficult and traumatic). More recently (roughly the past decade) my older brother and more specifically my sister-in-law have been more consistently the bad object. I suspect this has something to do with my mother’s interactions with women since she doesn’t seem to have nearly the same issues with my husband or my younger brother’s husband. Recently (in the past year and a bit) my nieces who are the daughters of my older brother are starting to get old enough to show signs of differentiation and unique interests. My mother’s reactions to this were troubling about a year ago and triggered all the siblings and partners to really deeply discuss boundary setting as a group rather than as individuals or individual couples, because historically whoever was bad object would be stuck negotiating boundaries while my mom would pit us against each other. Of course, as I am sure you can imagine this did not result in thoughtful listening on the part of my mother. It turned into weekly emails broadcast to the whole family about how awful, heartless, wrong, etc. etc. we are. My mom announcing she can “tell [us] everything we’ve done to hurt her since [we] were born,” etc. We all held fast to our boundaries. We responded compassionately, but firmly about the boundaries set. Eventually my mother has ceased these lashings out, but rather than replacing the lashings out with calm, loving or even neutral contact she has largely ended all contact. My brothers and I (probably me most frequently) reach out with photos of the dogs or my garden, etc. but the most I get in response is a thumbs up emoticon. At first she would try to insert an opportunity to bad object someone or myself or to unleash displeasure but it’s arrived at a repetitive emoji after months of not engaging the negative behavior. My father at first seemed to try to support us, but we realized with time that his priority is upholding the status quo or “keeping the peace” with mom. It was disappointing to realize his faults as I believe I forced myself to believe that he was the emotionally healthy parent in order to survive as a teen. He has essentially joined my mother’s pattern and made it explicit that we must contact them both together and never separately.

So, it’s odd to say this but I am left with this unsatisfying, boundaried state in which it’s forced into “all or nothing” by my mother’s black and white pattern and my father’s complicity. While we all made it clear that boundaries don’t need to mean no contact it seems that this pattern has landed mother in her classic “cut them out before they cut me out” tactic. It’s so emotionally quiet in such an amazing and rare (possibly never in my life) kind of way, yet I feel a tinge of sadness over how it’s unlikely that I can have regular, reciprocated, boundaried contact with my mother.

I guess I am not looking for advice per se, but rather sharing my experience in case anyone can relate. It’s hard to talk about these things with individuals who have not experienced it and even my husband has an easier time just writing them off without much of a sadness. While I know that unboundaried frequent contact with my mom is what has led to so much trauma (and is clearly the lesser of two evils) it is yet challenging to accept the new normal.

Thanks for reading.

[TJCM]

We’ve known my mother likely has BPD for 15 years or so. I am the middle of 3 brothers and my older brother is married to a woman. My younger brother and I are more recently married. Most of our lives since teenhood it’s been a cycle that whoever is bad-object struggles with managing boundaries with my mother around the way that she expresses her deep dissatisfaction with the bad-object du jour. I’ve been in therapy a very long time, because I was consistently bad-object through much of my teen years and throughout college (coming out as queer to a mother with BPD who is not fond of the idea was difficult and traumatic). More recently (roughly the past decade) my older brother and more specifically my sister-in-law have been more consistently the bad object. I suspect this has something to do with my mother’s interactions with women since she doesn’t seem to have nearly the same issues with my husband or my younger brother’s husband. Recently (in the past year and a bit) my nieces who are the daughters of my older brother are starting to get old enough to show signs of differentiation and unique interests. My mother’s reactions to this were troubling about a year ago and triggered all the siblings and partners to really deeply discuss boundary setting as a group rather than as individuals or individual couples, because historically whoever was bad object would be stuck negotiating boundaries while my mom would pit us against each other. Of course, as I am sure you can imagine this did not result in thoughtful listening on the part of my mother. It turned into weekly emails broadcast to the whole family about how awful, heartless, wrong, etc. etc. we are. My mom announcing she can “tell [us] everything we’ve done to hurt her since [we] were born,” etc. We all held fast to our boundaries. We responded compassionately, but firmly about the boundaries set. Eventually my mother has ceased these lashings out, but rather than replacing the lashings out with calm, loving or even neutral contact she has largely ended all contact. My brothers and I (probably me most frequently) reach out with photos of the dogs or my garden, etc. but the most I get in response is a thumbs up emoticon. At first she would try to insert an opportunity to bad object someone or myself or to unleash displeasure but it’s arrived at a repetitive emoji after months of not engaging the negative behavior. My father at first seemed to try to support us, but we realized with time that his priority is upholding the status quo or “keeping the peace” with mom. It was disappointing to realize his faults as I believe I forced myself to believe that he was the emotionally healthy parent in order to survive as a teen. He has essentially joined my mother’s pattern and made it explicit that we must contact them both together and never separately.

So, it’s odd to say this but I am left with this unsatisfying, boundaried state in which it’s forced into “all or nothing” by my mother’s black and white pattern and my father’s complicity. While we all made it clear that boundaries don’t need to mean no contact it seems that this pattern has landed mother in her classic “cut them out before they cut me out” tactic. It’s so emotionally quiet in such an amazing and rare (possibly never in my life) kind of way, yet I feel a tinge of sadness over how it’s unlikely that I can have regular, reciprocated, boundaried contact with my mother.

I guess I am not looking for advice per se, but rather sharing my experience in case anyone can relate. It’s hard to talk about these things with individuals who have not experienced it and even my husband has an easier time just writing them off without much of a sadness. While I know that unboundaried frequent contact with my mom is what has led to so much trauma (and is clearly the lesser of two evils) it is yet challenging to accept the new normal.

Thanks for reading.

[Turkish]

TJCM,



I'm glad that you pulled together as a family, at least the kids, to enact boundaries with your mother. Enabling of the spouse by the other spouse is sadly not uncommon.

At least your mother responds, even with a passive-aggresive thumbs up. It's a Waifish response to communicate that she's hurt. She wants you to rescue her. Love the Waif without rescuing her. It sounds like you are, even if you all are also hurt. She's likely not emotionally mature enough to comprehend that. This might shed some light:

BEHAVIORS: Waif, Hermit, Queen, and Witch

[Notwendy]

Welcome to these boards. I think you are correct in that your BPD mother is more distressed over your brother marrying a woman- the woman may be seen as a sort of competition for your mother. You were a family of all guys before this.

My BPD mother seems more reactive to the females on my father's side than to the males.

Like your father, my father both could be supportive but his priority was to keep the peace with BPD mother. 

We have also alternated with being seen as the "bad guy" by BPD mother. A helpful model to me has been the Karpman triangle. BPD mother is in Victim perspective. This leaves other family members in either Rescuer or Persecutor position- here is the black and white thinking- you are either the Rescuer to her or the Persecutor.

My father (now deceased) mostly took Rescuer role with my mother. So yes, he might understand our concerns but would align with my mother in general- against anyone or anything that she may see as "Persecutor".

I agree that- even if your husband is supportive of you- it is difficult to grasp this situation if someone has not experienced it. My husband sees the dynamics with my mother-and is understanding as much as possible, but his experience with his mother has been very different.

[livednlearned]

We responded compassionately, but firmly about the boundaries set

This is amazing. It seems rare that siblings who have been pitted against each other could come together and find a healthy way to unite. Really impressive.

Eventually my mother has ceased these lashings out, but rather than replacing the lashings out with calm, loving or even neutral contact she has largely ended all contact.

I don't think pwBPD do what they do because they're choosing between a suite of, say, 10 healthy behaviors and 10 bad behaviors and opt for the bad ones. I think of BPD behaviors like "safety behaviors" that are persistent and entrenched and there's not a lot of choice. Learning to respond in a healthy way would require a lot of work to dissemble how your mother thinks about herself and whether there are alternative, safe ways to go through life. It's kind of remarkable that she responds at all, although like you said it' not the optimal response.

I asserted compassionate boundaries with my father and it's sort of how you describe. The optimal response is not there, it's more the absence of the negative thing. I can see him fighting hard to not lash out, which often ends up with him becoming angry and stomping off into a silent treatment. Since one of my boundaries is to not chase him or appease him, more often than not a visit ends up with me saying "see you later!" from another room. I guess for now the absence of yelling is about all he can manage and maybe that's the best he can do period.

My father at first seemed to try to support us, but we realized with time that his priority is upholding the status quo or “keeping the peace” with mom. It was disappointing to realize his faults as I believe I forced myself to believe that he was the emotionally healthy parent in order to survive as a teen. He has essentially joined my mother’s pattern and made it explicit that we must contact them both together and never separately.

I think of the non-BPD parent as the "normal range" parent who is in a dysfunctional relationship, and because of that, is often surviving on a day-to-day basis. It sounds like she is largely adopting a passive-aggressive approach and has put him in a loyalty bind.

I feel a tinge of sadness over how it’s unlikely that I can have regular, reciprocated, boundaried contact with my mother.

For me it's been a full-out grieving process, offset by counter feelings of relief and some surprise that I can assert boundaries with both parents and a sibling. It's not necessarily easy but like you said, the quiet and the absence of being randomly attacked and yelled at is priceless.

While I know that unboundaried frequent contact with my mom is what has led to so much trauma (and is clearly the lesser of two evils) it is yet challenging to accept the new normal.

Amen.