Civil Suit For Fraud and Malice

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I am now 4 + years into my High Conflict Divorce Case in Los Angeles. Has anyone ever sued the opposing "High Conflict Personality" Ex Spouse and In Laws in "Civil Court" (an oxymoron) for emotional distress, financial fraud, child and grandchild abuse due to the minimal time with my kids related to Hostile Aggressive Parenting techniques, false health allegations, pain, suffering, and above all else - Malice?

If so, please let me know the best potential ways to proceed or your own experiences as well.

Thank you.

[SeaCliff]

I am now 4 + years into my High Conflict Divorce Case in Los Angeles. Has anyone ever sued the opposing "High Conflict Personality" Ex Spouse and In Laws in "Civil Court" (an oxymoron) for emotional distress, financial fraud, child and grandchild abuse due to the minimal time with my kids related to Hostile Aggressive Parenting techniques, false health allegations, pain, suffering, and above all else - Malice?

If so, please let me know the best potential ways to proceed or your own experiences as well.

Thank you.

[1stand10]

No, but please let me know if you find an L who will take that on.

[BentNotBroken]

Shhh! Keep it down, my ex might overhear what's coming next after the custody fight. I may start looking for a lawyer for this soon.

Unfortunately she has no assets and a tremendous amount of non-dischargeable debt, so it would be like trying to squeeze blood from a turnip.

It might be worth it just for the vindication though.

[SeaCliff]

My potential strategy is to go after my ex in laws in Civil Court since they are the ones who traumatized my ex as a young girl which led to her "High Conflict Personality Disorder" traits. Her own Borderline / Narcissistic Father was forced into "Anger Management Courses" and A.A. by his own wife, and even my ex wife blamed her Father for her almost lifelong "depression" (or BPD traits).

They initially falsely alleged that my health magically worsened in my final week with my ex wife even though I have been a "Health Fanatic" the bulk of my life who is sober, and hates Big Pharma. In fact, I have helped many people get off booze and drugs over the years. Instead, I prefer to drink organic fruit and vegetable juices.

Two years ago, everybody stopped suggesting that my health magically worsened since I ACED all of their third party tests. I literally was challenging the opposing law firm's entire staff to debates on health topics without using any notes partly since I was so disgusted with the irony and hypocrisy of their typically morbidly obese legal staff, who looked like a bunch of pill popping "Boozers" like so many other attorneys, falsely allege that I had health problems.

I noted in my last declaration as it relates to the alleged "Health and Relationship Experts" who work as Divorce Attorneys and Psychiatrists this bit of sarcastic and truthful information:

":)ivorce Attorneys and Psychiatrists, by profession, tend to have some of the highest rates of booze and drug addictions, highest rates of suicide and shortest life spans, and some of the highest rates of divorce so their opinions about health and relationship topics should rarely be validated by the Court."

I exercise almost every single day and eat very healthy foods so I was fed up with a bunch of unfit and unethical Divorce Attorneys talking to me about health issues. The main irony in my case is that my ex wife has more admitted, diagnosed, and perceived health problems of any woman who I know, and her own Father has more formally diagnosed health problems of any man who I know.

Her Father is the angriest man who I know, and his daughter is the most fearful woman who I know. Anger and rage are just opposite sides of FEAR ("False Evidence Appearing Real". Even the CDC (Center for Disease Control) states that FEAR is responsible for at least 85% of all types of physical and emotional illnesses. Other natural health experts who I follow and respect suggest that the percentage numbers may be closer to 95%+.

Now, they are allegedly fearful that I may tell our sons that she is "sick" even though her own doctors tell her the same thing, yet I have NEVER told my boys that she is sick or "Borderline". I still have some compassion and empathy for my ex wife as I know about her numerous health problems, but I do focus my anger towards her Father and their pathetic and very famous Divorce Attorney who represents some of the craziest, drug addicted celebrity Borderlines in Hollywood.

I have filed or am in the process of filing numerous complaints with the California Bar, Judicial Superiors at our same L.A. Central Courthouse, Parent's Rights Groups, and the media primarily because of the infamous attorneys who I am battling which may make my case more interesting to them.

I have also reached out to or am in the process of reaching out to my opposing firm's past clients, opposing clients, and opposing attorneys as well am in the process of reaching out to their celebrity client's publicists, agents, and business managers in order to teach them about how "Negative Advocate" Attorneys may tend try to worsen, manipulate, and coerce their typically "High Conflict Personality Clients", and knowingly take advantage of their unhealthy clients (emotionally they tend to be "scared 3 year olds" solely for the almighty Dollar.

In every famous "High Conflict Celebrity Case" which the opposing firm has worked on to date, they try to separate the opposing parent as long as possible from the innocent children so that their cases last for many years. This is child abuse in it's worst form against the children who typically love both of their parents equally.

I am trying to figure out a way to reach out to the children of these "High Conflict Divorce Cases" (their firm was incorporated initially back in the '80s so many of these children are now adults) so that we may hopefully pursue a Class Actions Law Suit against the opposing firm for knowingly taking advantage of their unhealthy clients, and their children.

In addition, I am well aware of questionable investment strategies made by her family for numerous decades as I have noted many times in court declarations. Her family is primarily concerned that I may share their "questionable investment strategies" with various 3rd parties since my main business background is in finance and investments too. From my perspective, their desire to hurt me in Family Law Court stems from their fears about me sharing their dark family secrets with others which is complete FRAUD on their part.

As such, I state in court that my nightmare "High Conflict Divorce Case" is related to two fearful topics: 1.) Fear of Abandonment, and 2.) Fear of Financial Loss.

If I bury them with paperwork in a Civil Case, then their civil attorneys will have to work closely with their incredibly expensive Beverly Hills area Family Law attorneys so they may be spending upwards of $1,000 to $1,200+ per hour to respond.

I have had many articles published nationally over the past fifteen (15) years so it is quite easy for me to generate 100 to 200 pages at a time of legal documents. The more that I write, the more their billable hours increase.

The emotional distress which I have endured, in spite of my 20 years of faithfulness, compassion, and love for her, may never be offset by a huge financial victory in court, regardless. Yet, my main focus is on spending more time with my two young sons which is more valuable to me than any type of financial reward.  

My hope and belief is that a civil case which includes emotional distress, pain, suffering, false health allegations, child and grandchild abuse for the continued long term separation, mixing of my personal assets with their family's assets as well as non-disclosure of large amounts of investments to the Family Law Court and to me, and above of all else - MALICE may hopefully bring me a concurrent global settlement with the Family Law Case too.

I know several people who endured "High Conflict Divorce Cases" which lasted 6, 10, 11, and even 20 years so I will do what I must do to try to end this illogical and unjustified High Conflict Divorce Case any way possible. In every case, the "non-Borderline" man or woman was a friendly, compassionate, empathetic, and healthy person just like me. Yet, their ex "High Conflict Personality" spouses tried to destroy them too once they sensed potential "abandonment" (real or perceived).

If someone here on this board is an attorney who may be interested in possibly helping me with both a civil suit against my ex wife's family as well as to help me with a potential Class Action suit against their very famous Family Law firm, then please let me know.

While it may be somewhat challenging for opposing clients to sue this firm for FRAUD, it may be quite easier for this firm's past clients and their children to sue them for knowingly taking advantage of them. Some of their past famous celebrity clients paid them several million in "legal" fees for each "High Conflict Case", and a few of them have publicly admitted to BPD or "anxiety-like" traits today.

Since I love to speak as well and have been organizing events and parties for over 30 years, then it is quite easy for me to round up people and lead the charge against these pathetic "Child and Emotionally Ill Client Abusers" who work at this "law" firm.

Many health experts publicly state that the # 1 most traumatizing event for a young child is continued long term separation from at least one loving parent. To learn more about "High Conflict Divorce Cases" and their negative impact on the children primarily, I like this linked article below as well as Bill Eddy's many brilliant articles on his own website (www.highconflictinstitute.com).

[SeaCliff]

As I also noted in one of my last declarations, Bill Eddy (a famous attorney, mediator, therapist, speaker, and author) suggests that upwards of 80% + of all "High Conflict Divorce Cases" which last more than two (2) years involves at least one person with a personality disorder trait partly due to their inability to settle or mediate which tends to feel "abandoning" to them.

I have tried to settle or mediate at least five (5) times, volunteered to attend therapy sessions with her for her own perceived and formally diagnosed anxiety problems, and offered to attend co-parenting courses with her for "the sake of our children" who want us to get along. Yet, she says "No" every single time in spite of her readily admitting that I literally NEVER once yelled at her, harmed her, or cheated on her during our twenty (20) year relationship together.

I have also endured 4 years+ of the "Silent Treatment" from her so I actually haven't even heard her utter the word "No". There is NOTHING worse than the Silent Treatment. I would prefer that she yell at me instead of being treated like I was invisible.

Once my ex wife thought that I had stopped loving her towards the end of our relationship even though I had not, then she "split" me from "all good" to "all bad". If I had never learned about BPD traits, I would swear that she were possessed by some dark entity as I have NEVER seen anyone change that dramatically. Even though she has had the BPD traits since her early teenage years, she was usually very kind towards me while primarily being very hard on herself.

To learn more about "High Conflict Divorce Cases", this is one of my favorite articles written by Bill Eddy (entitled "How Personality Disorders Drive Family Court Litigation" which I have submitted to Court as well. www.articlesbase.com/divorce-articles/how-personality-disorders-drive-family-court-litigation-403019.html

[GustheDog]

I am now 4 + years into my High Conflict Divorce Case in Los Angeles. Has anyone ever sued the opposing "High Conflict Personality" Ex Spouse and In Laws in "Civil Court" (an oxymoron) for emotional distress, financial fraud, child and grandchild abuse due to the minimal time with my kids related to Hostile Aggressive Parenting techniques, false health allegations, pain, suffering, and above all else - Malice?

If so, please let me know the best potential ways to proceed or your own experiences as well.

Thank you.

Don't know all the facts, but just to the availability of a potential cause of action... .

Emotional Distress: No, or very unlikely.

Fraud: Claim exists, fact-dependent as to whether you can assert it.

Abuse: Maybe, if the allegedly abusive actions violate a related California statute.  You'd have to consult a lawyer in your jurisdiction.

False Health Allegations: Quite possibly you have a defamation per se claim available, but the particulars depend on your state's statutes and common law, and whether you can show you've suffered economic damages (although, that may not be necessary - again, consult an attorney).

Pain and Suffering: Usually you can't sue on this basis, but it can be a factor in assessing any damages you're ultimately awarded.

[SeaCliff]

Thank you for your reply, Gusthedog. I do appreciate your feedback and very valid points. I do have much information to assert that this case against me was partly due to my knowledge of their family's years of financial fraud which I plan to make the "heart" of any civil case against them.

[GustheDog]

No problem, glad to be of (admittedly limited) assistance.

"My potential strategy is to go after my ex in laws in Civil Court since they are the ones who traumatized my ex as a young girl which led to her "High Conflict Personality Disorder" traits. Her own Borderline / Narcissistic Father was forced into "Anger Management Courses" and A.A. by his own wife, and even my ex wife blamed her Father for her almost lifelong "depression" (or BPD traits)."

To be honest, I wouldn't put your chances of success very high here.  I've never heard of any jurisdiction to recognize a cause of action under such a theory (although, if any did, it'd be California).  It seems like what you're saying is that your former in laws should be held liable to you for emotionally abusing their daughter, who, later, emotionally abused you.

In addition to the thoughts in my previous post, I would suggest that you consult a lawyer/look into the availability of "frivolous litigation" or "vexatious litigator" claims in your state.  In my experience, courts don't really concern themselves with emotional distress/abuse (unless it was *very* extreme and the abusive/distressing actions were *extreme and outrageous* and done with the *intent* to cause such emotional harm - and this is difficult to prove).

"In addition, I am well aware of questionable investment strategies made by her family for numerous decades as I have noted many times in court declarations. Her family is primarily concerned that I may share their "questionable investment strategies" with various 3rd parties since my main business background is in finance and investments too. From my perspective, their desire to hurt me in Family Law Court stems from their fears about me sharing their dark family secrets with others which is complete FRAUD on their part. "

Be careful here.  Whether true or not, you may risk exposing yourself to a defamation suit with statements of this type.

[GustheDog]

P.S. - In conjunction with frivolous/vexatious litigation, also look into "malicious prosecution" and "abuse of process."  These are all similar theories, but rooted in the same idea.  It just depends what language your state's courts and statutes have adopted.

[Seahorse1]

Your situation sounds terrible. I'm in two situations right now, one in regards to my mothers estate, and one involving my bf's ex wife trying to get a court order to prevent me from seeing her son.

I feel very wronged in both of the cases but also am just so sick of fighting, drama etc... .

I don't want to walk away with my tail between my legs by any means but deliberating on whether my peace of mind in my daily life is more " valuable" to me than fighting legal battles.

[SeaCliff]

Thank you, Gus and Seahorse. I am also requesting that the Family Law Court appoint a financial auditor, accountant, and a Special Master to potentially audit my ex's complicated estate. I have provided the Court with numerous large financial accounts which my ex wife did not submit to the court. I just sent her attorney updated FL-145 and FL-141 forms (form interrogatories which include asset information requests).

I have much proof to back up my financial fraud allegations which may hopefully void our complicated prenuptial agreements which primarily protected her lifelong large net worth. If and when that may happen hopefully in the near term, then they may wish to settle.

Again, I was faithful to her for 20 years, she never had to work during our marriage, I never yelled at her or harmed her as she has admitted in court, our sons love me, and I am a SOBER "Health Fanatic" who prefers to joke around.

Yet, she filed a DVRO against me solely based upon "fear" and "flight risk" allegations with nothing to back it up. I have learned that many people falsely allege fear and file DVRO's in order to try to avoid paying the other spouse any alimony or child support.

My ex's main fears were "abandonment fears", and her parent's main fears were "financial fears" as I just wrote in my latest declaration for court. Thanks again for your feedback. I greatly appreciate it.

[kj1234]

Troyman,

I admire you for all you are planning to do.  I think you know enough to know some of these things are very difficult and expensive.  I think you said that.  I'm not an attorney and I know there is a lot I don't know, but I will give you my support and advice anyway because I have been and continue to be involved in some similar challenges and plans.

In my divorce case I chose the approach of maximum exposure, maximum accountability, as much as I could.  I found it is very difficult at timies to get Ls to go along with you in this.  It may be something about me--I say that because in my divorce and in a past civil case the opposing attorneys were very aggressive and broke the law very materially, while my attorneys did not break the law and sometimes were not as aggressive as I would have liked them to be.  However, I did get some impressive action from some of my attorneys (I have had many, so I don't want to wrongly criticize or commend as a group)  There is that constantly overhanging cloud of the entire judicial system wanting everyone to play nice and settle, even when that is not the approach in your best interest.

I think attorneys and the entire judicial system--maybe more so in family court--have a tendency to want to keep things (clients) under control.  As I'm sure you know, sometimes you have to play chicken with the opposing attorney and opposing client.  When they believe they have you outfinanced, outesquired (i.e., Who the F do you think you are challenging an officer of the court or any agent of the court, etc.?).  But the bigger and more arrogant they are, the harder they fall.  Plan it out and fight each battle with the intent of living to fight another day.

You have a lot on your plate.  I think you need to break it up into as many pieces as you can and decide which to go after first, or which group, etc.  Also, think about what government agencies, if any, you can get to do some work for you.  When there was some illegal stuff going on in my civil case, I couldn't find any police department, prosecutor's office, etc., to do anything.  But threats of ethics grievances, filing motions exposing behavior, reporting things to state agencies, federal agencies,etc., where appropriate, can help and did help me.  In the game of chicken, you have to make them believe you will never back down and never quit.  But do it in a reasoned, justified, rational way--i.e., don't allow people to paint you as crazy.  Take a good look at every player and what makes him/her tick.  What are their hot buttons, their objectives, their fears, their weak spots, their duty, the rules they must follow, etc.  Also know your own.  You probably know all this already, but it doesn't hurt to hear it.

Document everything.  Keep very good records and keep them well-organized.  It sounds like you have great skills for this and for writing, so you can put together good cases with lots of evicence.

Expect just about everyone to say what you want to do can't be done, but know that, for that very reason, doing it is very important.  If you don't, who will?  You may not win them all, but win the ones you can.

If you want to change things, or get a different result from the usual, you may have to take the next step of an appeal that challenges the status quo of procedure.  Get used to the idea and approach your cases with that in mind, so the information you need for the appeal will be in the papers and on the recofd.  Begin with the end in mind.

There was a recent appellate court decision in NJ in which a father sued his ex for parental alienation.  www.disgustedwiththesystem.blogspot.com/2010/05/segal-v-lynch.html .  The story is interesting.  In addition, the same guy (I think) also filed a complaint against a parenting coordinator.  After he followed grievance procedures and outlined his grievances, she charged HIM around $30k for her time to answer his grievances in writing.  The court upheld it, but there was a dissenting opinion.  If you have the money for all this, I really hope you will do whatever you can--not just for the win in the personal situation, but to challenge some of the maladies of the system and of people who abuse it and/or abuse other people.

Thanks for those links to Bill Eddy's stuff.  I read one of his books and some other stuff before, but I just found some things on his site that might really help me in some of the efforts I am putting together going forward.

All the best to you.  Keep us informed.

[SeaCliff]

Thank you for the kind, inspiring, and encouraging words, KJ. I was a bit frustrated earlier tonight after learning that my 37 page "Memorandum of Points and Authorities" was potentially well over the L.A. Family Law limit of 15 pages. As a result, I must modify my "Memorandum" over the next two days prior to submitting it to the court for the next requested OSC hearing.

Again, I am personally battling perhaps the most famous or infamous, or one of the most famous, "High Conflict Attorneys" by myself Pro Per in at least the L.A. region, if not nationally. While I enjoy a good debate as well as writing, the opposing Counsel tries to win points by getting my work or third party work struck from the Court's record or OSC hearings vacated from the calendar over very technical or benign matters.

Just recently, this unethical attorney filed their 7th Ex Parte to date in order to get my scheduled OSC hearing vacated. This "law" firm "forgot" to serve me once again prior to their latest Ex Parte hearing so I wouldn't hopefully show up in Court. Now, I must file again with much more detailed paperwork.

I do plan on filing my civil case against her family by myself with the help of numerous friends and family who work in the legal profession. Most attorneys are unwilling to pursue it, yet I may wear out my opponents with lots of paperwork and discovery efforts which may force them to settle both the civil and family law cases, concurrently.

As my ex wife fully knows and understands, I NEVER give up. Nobody on this Earth loves my children more than me so I am willing to battle 100 opponents if need be in order to protect them. My ex's biggest fear is that our children may abandon her for me which is why she tries to keep us separated. These "Hostile Aggressive Parenting" techniques are some of the worst forms of child abuse, sadly.

As I have told many close friends and family, the most dangerous opponent in this world is someone who is primarily motivated by LOVE (for my children), not anger. High Conflict People, in turn, tend to be motivated primarily by fear and anger (flip side of fear), and eventually they wear themselves out or harm themselves even further so they eventually may give up. Love is energizing while fear, in turn, zaps people's energy levels at some point.

[ForeverDad]

and eventually they wear themselves out or harm themselves even further so they eventually may give up.

Don't count on that.  Many of us here have experienced firsthand as you have the extreme tenacity and never-ending conflict.  Often it doesn't end (legally) until the children are adults and/or out of schools and colleges.

[SeaCliff]

You are quite correct in your assessment that people with BPD or "High Conflict Personality" traits may be quite tenacious in Family Law Court, ForeverDad. Ironically, a high percentage of people with BPD traits can not handle stress as well as most people, yet they maintain the conflicts which makes no sense whatsoever.

Criminal Court cases may last one year, and some of the worst Civil Cases may last between 1 1/2 and 3 years. Yet, I know of several "High Conflict Divorce Cases" which lasted 6, 10, 11, and even 20 years. There is NO logic involved when legal cases are governed by illogical emotions and overwhelming abandonment fears.

Ironically yet again, I am incredibly tenacious myself as partly noted by the literally THOUSANDS of pages which I wrote myself, and submitted to our Family Law Court over the years. In recent days, I created a 37 page "Memorandum of Points and Authorities" which I later modified downward to 15 pages, with a separate Table of Contents, after learning that L.A. Family Law Court may limit the "Points and Authorities" to just 15 pages with a Table of Contents.

If the paperwork is less than ten (10) pages, then I may not need a Table of Contents. The "Points and Authorities" section is in addition to my ten (10) page Declaration (the maximum page count allowed in my case), and a few other sections which I created.

Sadly for me, the opposing Counsel may currently chair, or at least be on the "Rules and Procedures Committee" for our courthouse. Yet, I have filed or am in the process of filing numerous complaints with the California Bar, the media, and her Judicial Supervisors against her for Fraud, Perjury, and other deviant and convoluted actions.

As I have said in Court, my opponents will NEVER outdebate me on topics associated with "Health, Relationship, and Financial" issues so they try to defeat me with codes and procedures. I have been a self-described "Health Fanatic" for over 34 years so health and financial (my business) topics are my two favorite topics.

I have also helped lead NAMI (www.nami.org) Family Support Groups over the years which helps family members deal with the pains associated with dealing with a family member with perceived, diagnosed, and / or admitted personality, anxiety, and / or mood disorder traits. In these groups, I offer natural health solutions as opposed to Big Pharma "solutions" (a "Pharmaceutical Cure" is an oxymoron along the lines of an "Ethical Divorce Attorney).

One time in Court, I literally challenged the entire opposing legal staff to debates about health topics without using any notes, and volunteered to hold it in their Beverly Hills conference room while being videotaped. Yet, they strangely declined, and have yet to try to depose me even once while I try to use as much Discovery as possible against them.

This opposing firm again has represented some of the most famous Celebrity "High Conflict Divorce Cases" over the past twenty (20) years. I once named off at least seven (7) of their most famous celebrity clients in front of their lead partner in the court's hallway (he used to appear on "The Larry King Show" many times over the years), and noted their client's BPD, PPD, DID, Agoraphobia, Anxiety, Suicide attempts, and admitted drug and booze addictions. I then asked this famous lead attorney if they ever represented any healthy clients like me.

Again, I love a good debate, and I am a writer on the side with hundreds of published articles so depositions or debates in court are "OK" with me. To defeat my opponents, I must battle them, though, in more neutral locations.

This is why I will soon file my Civil Suit in another Southern California county where the opposing attorneys are not on the "Family and Juvenile" (ironic because the opposing counsel has no spouse or children as I have sarcastically noted in past declarations) or "Rules and Procedures" Committees (ironic once again due to the 40+ counts of Perjury which I once noted in a 27 page chapter created for the Court last Fall), and where the opposing attorneys are not on so many panels and legal committees with the Judges (or "Administrative Assistants" under Maritime Admiralty Laws).

In my "High Conflict Divorce Case", my opposing attorneys seem to be running the show. In a Civil Case, I will gain control which is the last thing that pwBPD traits want to give up even though they feel so out of control themselves, ironically. As I refuse to let my Divorce Case last 10 or 20 years, then I will battle them in various other courts until one of us gives up.

Since I NEVER give up and was a running back in my younger days who was used to getting knocked down on the football field, then I would not bet against me. I will do what I must to protect my two wonderful children from the opposing Bullies and Cowards (same thing).

Tragically ironically, my ex wife was a kind woman to me for 20 years UNTIL she thought that I was about to leave her for an old childhood girlfriend even though I was loyal and faithful to her for 20 years. If I did not study BPD traits so in depth over the past (I was LITERALLY reading upwards of 5 health books PER WEEK, read thousands of articles, watched hundreds of videos, and reached out to many of the top BPD and Anxiety experts around the world like Randi Kreger, AJ Majari, Tami Green, Charles Linden, Bill Eddy, etc.) trying to resolve my nightmare divorce case while trying to help my ex wife, I would swear that she were possessed by some Demon entity.

I still wonder if she may have a benign Pituitary Gland (or some "Limbic System" ("Emotional Brain" region like near the Amygdala ("fear and stress center" of the brain) as suggested by my neurosurgeon client a few years ago with a 90% probability after I told him about her traits (weak thyroid, adrenal glands rated at "dangerously low levels" per  two endocrinologists, severe insomnia, anxiety, panic attacks, early menopause in her late 30s, hormone issues, and severe paranoia against me). My neurosurgeon client told me that one of the main warning signs of Pituitary Gland tumors is severe paranoia against the spouse for no valid reason.

I am a friendly and funny man in person who is a total "Healer" just like my Dad, and his two Catholic Priest brothers. I have NEVER had anyone fear me. Ironically yet again, I try to resolve relationship conflicts between my friends and family while enduring the worst Family Law Case I have ever heard of in my entire life. Amazingly, I still have empathy for my ex wife because she was my Best Friend for 20 years even if she never speaks to me ever again.

[GaGrl]

and eventually they wear themselves out or harm themselves even further so they eventually may give up.

Don't count on that.  Many of us here have experienced firsthand as you have the extreme tenacity and never-ending conflict.  Often it doesn't end (legally) until the children are adults and/or out of schools and colleges.

Although it may end legally when the children reach adulthood, it often continues with conflict over adult children and the grand children.

[SeaCliff]

Has ANYONE ever successfully repaired their co-parenting relationship with their ex BPD spouse? I volunteered to attend co-parenting therapy sessions with her, requested at least 5 different Mediations, and offered to help her with her obvious BPD, PPD, and Anxiety traits, yet nothing has worked.

Do they EVER split us back "all good" again? Forgiveness, once again, is more for us than for them. Holding onto anger and grudges typically hurts the angry person more so than the other person so this is why so many Borderlines tend to live on average 20+ years shorter than other people, allegedly.

Fear causes cancer, and cancer causes more fear in a vicious downward spiral, sadly. I even visited The Gerson Institute (www.gerson.org) in San Diego at least six times over the past 1 1/2 years trying to better understand the Anxiety and Cancer link, as suggested by my Neurosurgeon client. I also had lunch three (3) times with Charlotte Gerson who is considered the top natural health expert for Cancer, Diabetes, and other chronic illnesses in the world. I base half of my own diet off of The Gerson Therapy (organic fruit and vegetable juices).

Even the CDC (Center for Disease Control) themselves report that FEAR ("False Evidence Appearing Real" causes at least 85% of all physical and emotional illnesses worldwide. Nothing causes more fear than "abandonment fears" for most people worldwide, with or without BPD traits.

“Holding onto anger is like drinking poison, and expecting the other person to die.” - Buddha

[Matt]

Has ANYONE ever successfully repaired their co-parenting relationship with their ex BPD spouse?

Many of us here have worked out ways to parent our kids, without fixing the other party.  But I wouldn't necessarily describe it as "repairing the relationship" or even as "co-parenting".

Not to dwell on semantics, but there are a couple of terms used here that are worth talking about.

"Co-parenting" means you make decisions together.  You agree on stuff like which activities the kids will do.  You talk regularly with each other and take the other parent's views into account.  You come up with plans that you both feel good about, and then execute those plans as a team.

It's how most divorced parents aim to help their kids, but for most of us here, it's not realistic.

Another concept is "parallel parenting" - when the kids are with you, you make the decisions, and when they are with the other parent, she makes the decisions.  Some really big issues - major medical issues, or which school they go to - have to be agreed to, maybe with the help of a professional third party.

Parallel parenting works for some of us here, and you'll find articles on this site about how to make it work.

My own view is that what works best, when the other party has BPDish behaviors, is just "parenting".  That is, put your focus on the kids and their needs, and find ways to meet those needs, and don't focus at all on the other parent.  Of course you have to trust that they are safe when they're with her, but you can find out from the kids - unless they're very young - that they are at least safe and healthy.  And it's up to you to meet all their needs even though they're not with you all the time.

This is how I view it, and yes, it works.  It requires a lot of disengagement and distance from the other party - hard to do while the legal stuff rages on.

I would suggest you make it your top priority to shift your focus from the conflict between the parents - "winning" or "repairing the relationship" - to meeting the kids' needs.  I do realize that sometimes (probably all the time) the legal outcomes affect the kids a lot.  It may be important to follow through and find a solution that will allow you a good amount of time with the kids.  But 99% of your energy should be focused directly on the kids - their education, emotional development, exercise, diet, etc. - and above all on being there with them, each moment, listening and hearing them and figuring out what is best for each kid at each moment.

You can't do that well if you have too much energy and time going into a protracted legal battle.

[ForeverDad]

As a general rule of thumb only, my ex is nice only when she wants something.

While it's nice that you've read many books articles, met with many doctors, etc, much of that may be ignored by your court.  You may even get a reputation as PITA - a royal pain in the a$$.  I worry that the judge may tune you out if you focus too much on the side issues of health, nutrition, possible cause of behaviors, etc.  So what if she's the way she is?  Courts don't try to change people, they deal with them as they are.

No one tried to change my ex, in fact they studiously avoided mention - on the record - of any mental issues or misbehaviors.  The single time my ex's testimony was referred to as "not credible" (court-speak for "liar!" was when she tried to excuse blocking my vacation notice during Winter Break with claims that though she wasn't Jewish, she could observe Kwanzaa holidays and demanded having our son during that time.  (Seems she was the only one that didn't know Kwanzaa is actually not a Jewish observance but an African heritage event.)  Her multiple unsubstantiated allegations over the years that I was a child abuser?  No mention and no direct consequences over the years.  Her misuse of a minor holiday to shorten a 1000 mile distant vacation to 4-5 days max?  That got mentioned.  Go figure.

While I don't know your courts or your opposing law firm, I wonder if they're trying to paint you as an extreme health nut and are just running a years-long holding action until the clock runs out and the kids are grown or mostly so.  The longer the kids are with their mother the majority of the time, the more likely the court is willing to leave them with her.  However, I think you're currently restricted to supervised visits or that was the case a couple years ago, if so then that should have been resolved long before now.  I guess what her lawyers are trying to claim is that you're enough of a 'risk' to not allow them with you?  I can't imagine how they could have done that for this long, despite their delays, etc.  That's why I worry how they've painted you to the court.  I get the feeling you need to focus not on being a super healthy parent citing all sorts of books and articles but a reasonably normal parent.  Yes, you need to do all the support and documentation for your court actions, but you have to look for ways to show you're just a normal dad wanting to be a meaningful father to your children despite the other parent's obstructive actions.

[SeaCliff]

Matt: Yes, I realize that I may not change her, and she may not change me as I have noted in Court too. "Parallel Parenting" may be a more realistic option as you suggest. I even requested in my latest declaration that my ex wife and I be allowed to use the "Our Family Wizard" (www.ourfamilywizard.com) website which is used by many Family Law Courts here in the U.S. and in Canada for "High Conflict Families".

ForeverDad: My main focus is on my boys. As such, I believe that I may gain more leverage by battling them in Civil Court simultaneous to Family Law Court. I have a girlfriend who cares about me so my main focus is on my boys.

My ex wife knows, both consciously and subconsciously, that I treated her better than anyone else in this world for almost half of her life, including her own parents. Yet, she continues to act like the equivalent of "a tantrum throwing 3 year old who lost her candy". L.A. Central has a reputation for potentially being the most corrupt Family Law Court System in America, and her attorneys have horrific reputations so I prefer my chances in other venues.

I am actually on my 3rd Judge now in the case over the past four years and four months since the judges seem to rotate courtrooms every year or two. As such, I do not know how fairly this judge may act in this case. I tried to get the last judge to recuse himself on our case since he was on so many legal panels and committees with the opposing attorneys, and they all went to the same law school.

I am focused more on the financial matters as well as to try to get more time with my boys without any supervision. Initially, they falsely alleged health problems on my part due to my ex's alleged concerns about my usage of IODINE DROPS (I call my divorce case "The Sea Salt Illness Case", sarcastically). Yet, I have NEVER been diagnosed with a physical or emotional illness in my entire life.

Now, I just describe my ex wife as a "High Conflict Personality" as opposed to a pwBPD or PPD (Paranoid Personality Disorder) traits which may typically be the most common concurrent personality disorder traits these days so I am trying to back off of the health allegations against her since they try to use it against me.

A few years ago, everybody in my case stopped alleging health problems against me, including the morbidly obese opposing counsel and the last two judges, partly since I aced every test they threw at me. Every 3rd party legal or medical expert in my case gave me a solid report which included the Minor's Counsel who my ex wife refused to meet with based upon the advice of her unethical attorney. In fact, my ex wife refused to be tested by anyone, or see any Family Therapist even after the Minor's Counsel suggested it for her.

Yet, their strategy in recent years is that they are concerned that I may tell my children that their Mom is "sick" or "Borderline" even though I never have either prior to or after the divorce case began. Since I am sick and tired of their games, I will battle them on a more neutral field in "Civil Court" (another fine example of an oxymoron).

[SeaCliff]

I am sending in my next OSC request for modification of visitation and our financials within the next two days which includes my declaration, Memorandum of Points and Authorities, and a few other smaller sections. Depending upon the outcome of this next hearing, I may request a change of venue to San Diego County where my ex wife just moved.

Since I despise L.A. Central and none of us live in L.A. County any longer, then I hope to get this case moved to San Diego County where I also plan to file my Civil Suit. Does anyone have any advice in regard to how to best request a "Change of Venue" since none of my immediate family members (or ex-wife) now live in L.A. County?

Does anyone have any thoughts on the San Diego Family Law Court System, and / or any thoughts on the San Diego Courts for Civil Cases? I believe that there are at least four (4) potential venues which I may select from in San Diego County, and I hope to choose one outside of Downtown San Diego. If so, I hope to hire Bill Eddy or one of his associates, and other "High Conflict" specialists, as potential "Expert Witnesses".

Also, does anyone know what is the paperwork or page limit for filing an initial civil complaint? I hope to file a very lengthy and complex formal complaint in order to initiate the Civil Suit which may be quite challenging to get dismissed for any type of a "Summary Judgment". I have close friends who were paralegals or attorneys who are helping me as well with my case as well.

What I learn from my Civil Suit pursuit, I will later share here as well so we may all hopefully learn from each other's failures and / or successes. Thanks for any feedback.

[SeaCliff]

Forever Dad. Your quote: "The single time my ex's testimony was referred to as "not credible" (court-speak for "liar!" was when she tried to excuse blocking my vacation notice during Winter Break with claims that though she wasn't Jewish, she could observe Kwanzaa holidays and demanded having our son during that time.  (Seems she was the only one that didn't know Kwanzaa is actually not a Jewish observance but an African heritage event.)"  

It is quite funny how bizarre our Borderline's allegations are against us. Your ex should better learn her holidays prior to making wacky allegations against you.

My ex was allegedly concerned about my two week usage of IODINE DROPS even though I am a sober man who hates all forms of drugs (even Aspirin). In turn, I countered with my concerns about her usage of Ambien (or "Zombien" as I call it) and Lunesta. Many Borderlines have shortened R.E.M. (Rapid Eye Movement - our deepest sleep state) levels so they tend to have insomnia. Insomnia is also the #1 cause of anxiety worldwide. Prescription sleeping pills are the # 1 most common prescribed drug in America today as well.

In my case, the ex also alleged that "I read too much." My response was that most health experts consider reading to be "a very healthy and passive activity." I also asked if I should be watching her attorney's celebrity drug addict clients on "Reality TV" (another fine oxymoron) instead.

[GeekyGirl]

I can only imagine how frustrating this situation is for you. It sounds like this divorce case has been going on for a lot longer than you had expected and has been quite a burden on you.

How would civil action affect your kids and what effects do you think it would have on your relationship with them? While it's understandable that you're frustrated and angry with your ex and her family, at some point the kids might feel that they're forced to choose sides.

[SeaCliff]

Yes, this case is quite frustrating for me, Geeky Girl. Again, I know at least 20 people who endured "High Conflict Divorce Cases" against perceived Borderlines, and none of them endured what I have endured to date.

I have had a children's supervising monitor now for over four (4) years in spite of the Monitor attending Court twice as a witness stating that "I am the last Dad who needs a Monitor", "The Best Dad of his entire career", and that "my case is the longest case of his career."

From what I have researched, people who end up with Monitors typically have alcohol or drug abuse problems, or physically harmed their spouse or children. I am SOBER, and even my ex wife has stated in court that I LITERALLY never once yelled at her. Yet, I have a DVRO in place against me due to "FEAR" or "Flight Risk" allegations with nothing to back it up.

My boys know that I am trying to get my money from my ex wife. I was the ONLY one who worked during our marriage while I provided her with nannies and babysitters up to seven (7) days per week partly related to her insomnia and health problems.

I will either sue my in laws or my in laws and my ex wife. It will be more challenging to get my civil case thrown out if I include my ex wife. There are a lot of complex financial matters and "financial secrets" which are involved in my case which their family doesn't want released. As such, I allege that my case is related to both "Financial Fears" and "Abandonment Fears".

To me, it seems like the opposing firm is "too friendly" with our judges so I feel more confident battling them in San Diego Civil Courts. Even though I am not an attorney, I have a lot of experience with public speaking, and love a good debate so I am not intimidated by the courtroom process. In fact, I usually speak more than others in L.A. court without using very many notes.

I am willing to be the guy who fights back and wins. If I set case precedents for other "Nons" who endured horrific "High Conflict Divorce Cases", then that will make me feel quite happy that I was able to help other loving spouses, parents, and children.

Borderlines or Bullies are the biggest cowards in this world. Since they feel so unlovable and unworthy, they try to hurt others closest to them for their negative internal feelings. The best way to defeat a Bully is to confront them head on as they are not used to it.

In my case, I am actually battling three (3) Borderlines - my ex wife, her Father, and her pathetic and infamous attorney who has a reputation as the "most evil Divorce Attorney" in Los Angeles by many people.

I actually make fun of my opposing counsel's speaking and writing "skills" in Court for such a famous attorney. I also ask her what makes her a "Health and Relationship Expert" since she is morbidly obese with no spouse or children of her own. It is NOT my nature to be cruel to others, but she is the most evil person who I have ever encountered in my life. A friend of mine works as a Divorce Attorney in Downtown L.A., and she also describes this attorney as "EVIL."

Fortunately, my boys are still very close to me in spite of my ex's "Hostile Aggressive Parenting" techniques. Ironically, two months before my ex wife split me, she even called me "the best Dad in town" as I used to babysit upwards of ten (10) of her closest friend's young children by myself since they trusted me too.  

As I tend to say partly related to my Irish traits, "you can't spell the word Compassion without the word Passion" so I tend to be quite focused and relentless on matters or people who interest me or who I love. For me, there is no "off" switch when I am determined to succeed.

Unlike my cowardly, Narcissistic, Borderline ex-Father in Law who was forced into both A.A. and "Anger Management Courses" by his own family back when my ex wife was a very young girl, my own Father (California High School Football Player of the Year, leading Running Back at USC, successful self made businessman) instilled in me as a very young boy that "it is OK to try and fail because that is how you learn in life." He also told me that I lose if I don't try. As such, I FEAR no opponent in life.

So, if I have to be the guy who takes on 100 opponents in Court, then BRING IT ON. In a "Battle of Wits or Brawn, my opponents tend to be unarmed" as I tend to joke as I prefer to laugh instead.

I am tired of attorneys telling me that it can't be done. They may sit back and watch me do it because I understand "High Conflict Divorce Cases" better than them. Divorce Attorneys and Psychiatrists, as I wrote before in this post, tend to have some of the highest rates of booze and drug addiction levels, shortest lifespans and highest suicide rates, and highest rates of divorce so their "Health and Relationship" viewpoints should rarely be validated by others.

Regardless, this Al Pacino speech inspires me to battle anyone and everyone "one inch at a time." Otherwise, we may stagnate and die if we let our respective Bullies in our lives try to destroy us for their negative self-worth. To blame is to b-lame.

I once read that many children of Borderline parents later asked their healthy parent why they didn't fight back enough assertively to protect them. My boys will NEVER need to say that to me because I have NEVER stopped fighting back, and I NEVER will on their behalf.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WO4tIrjBDkk