Holistic therapist?

[sam-99]

Looking at a holistic therapist who says she does DBT and is familiar with BPD. Anyone went this route and had success?  I like homeopathic when possible but never ventures into holistic therapy.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[vivekananda]

Hi sam-99

What I know of successful therapeutic situations is:

• that the relationship between the therapist and the 'patient' is critically important.



• that the therapy focus on the present not the past or the future (but goal setting could be a part of the present), so this means that mindfulness is central to the therapy. DBT is about mindfulness.



• There needs to be structure to the treatment.



• A long term perspective.



• A focus on emotions.

   

This is based on research by Gunnerson I believe, taken from a recent conference (the last 6 mths).

So, if the therapist is the right one for you, then maybe this is the one. I would also ask them what do they think causes BPD - if they talk about the hard wiring of the brain and the relationship between the emotion centres (esp the amydala) and the prefrontal cortex as limited. Then they are on the right track for my expectations. Did you see lbj's post about the new research?

Treat it like a job interview - you want the best person for the job.

cheers,

Vivek    

[griz]

Sam99:

I have recently spoken with a Dr. who believes that a holistic approach is very helpful.  I am thinking of trying this if DD is up for it but I have to make sure she really wants to do this since my health insurance will not cover it. What the Dr. explained to me is that she would first have a meeting with DD and myself to discuss what is going on presently and what we have tried in the past.  She would then explain what her approach is and we would decide if we wanted to try this route. Next would be a series of blood and urine test to make sure that all of her levels are on target.  She said she would especially like to do some in depth test on DD's thyroid.  Once she gets the results back we would sit down and talk about her findings. 

I asked her if she has had any experience with this and she told me that she has not had any specific treating of BPD although she has treated many people both children through adults that have suffered from anxiety and depression.  She also offered to give me references if I would like to speak with any of them.  The only thing I can say is that she did treat DD once before when she was having tremendous anxiety in the evening and had not been sleeping for about 3 weeks (literally 3 weeks of not more than one hour of sleep a night).  She had her try taking something called L-Theanine and I must say it did work wonderfully.  She also said she would work with me to help with my depression.  Of course I know that DD also needs to resume therapy at some point.  But I am willing to try anything.

Griz

[sam-99]

Well, it sounds promising.  I sent out an email with additional questions.  Tired of wasting time in our search for the right therapist with the right approach.  But don't want to settle for a so so one either.  I know that it will be for an extended period of time.  And looks like it will have to be out of pocket to get what we need. 

Interesting that this thyroid thing keeps coming up... .  hmmmm... .  

The counselor I have found didn't say anything about testing or suggesting remedies, but since you mentioned it, I asked about all that in the email.  My dd talked to her on the phone and said she liked the way she sounded.  Very nice lady.  Here's hoping. 

I'm learning that not everyone who says they do DBT, actually do... .  

Wonder why... .  surely its not just about the money.  Could the world be so cruel... .  

[vivekananda]

ahhh DBT... .  this is what I think.

DBT is a mixture of Zen based mindfulness and CBT. It was developed by Lineham. It involves a highly structured treatment program that involves 4 modules over a 12 mth period. It involves a team of therapists. There is one who takes a module for a group - run like a tutorial - once a week. Then there is one therapist allocated to a pwBPD. It involves 'homework', there is phone contact where necessary and the focus is to ensure that no 'risky' behaviours impede the therapy, eg no drugs etc. It lasts a year and is developmental, building on learning and understanding bit by bit.

Then there is DBT, which is a general understanding of the principles of mindfulness and CBT which the therapist would use as they thought best suited the pwBPD.

The Lineham method is one that was ground breaking, I believe. It relies on the therapists being trained in the particular program described above and they stick to the known format. The development of DBT by individual therapists is more likely to be based on their own learning and is not necessarily because they have been trained in the Lineham method. I read here on this board of many doing 1, 2 or 3 mths DBT. I suspect that they are variations on the Lineham methods mentioned above.

So, if the individual therapist is 'good' then this more 'holistic' approach could be really good. It may mean that the T also includes the ideas of 'mentalization' or Schema Therapy (see Valerie Porr's book 'Overcoming BPD', or Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (I have just read Dr Russ Harris' 'The Reality Slap' or CBT itself or other therapies. The first two are good therapies also that use the ideas of mindfulness and CBT in their own ways. CBT is helpful I understand but not enough in its own right. So, it depends on what the T means by holistic... .  

So that's what I think is correct. If I have misread the situation, someone can put me straight.

cheers,

Vivek    

[cfh]

Too bad that to find a good therapist who is truly trained in DBT and can see your pwBPD several times a week... .  you need to have lots and lots of money.

[vivekananda]

that's interesting too.

Here in Melb Aust, BPD diagnosis doesn't get the govt rebate on treatment I believe. So, it is referred to as anxiety, depression etc, I understand. Except there is a 'proper' DBT clinic that does get the support for the 12 mths of the program. They must have gone through a 'special' process... .  I have heard however that they are not the best therapeutic place. I have spoken to them and it seems to me that that they be excellent for young adults, because they sounded hip and funky, rather than caring and sensitive.

Nothing is easy is it?

Vivek    

[sam-99]

When I asked this therapist what she thinks causes BPD she responded:

While there is no definitive answer there are a number of factors that can make individuals more susceptible, to include:  childhood trauma, extreme periods of stress, vulnerable dispositions, differences in brain chemistry, or possible genetic predispositions.  In my experience, Borderline Personality Disorder very closely mirrors Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, with many of the emotion regulation components being visible in both diagnoses

Then she continues:

[quote I do fully believe that individuals can recover from Borderline Personality Disorder.  A safe, supportive therapeutic relationship, building up client resiliency and emotion regulation skills, mindfulness, learning new tools to express beliefs and needs, as well as being able to ground and be present in daily life without dissociating or "splitting" are key to recovery.  I take a holistic approach to counseling and focus on the health of the entire person.  Much of my work is centered in grounding and being present in the moment, while learning to manage overwhelming emotions. ][/quote]
Not real sure about the first part, but I like the second part.  But, I do know that it has to be a good relationship as well between patient and therapist.  We will meet her on Thursday.  I am worried that if we keep hitting dead ends my dd won't want to keep looking.  Gotta make them count!

[sam-99]

And, yes Vivek , I have not talked to one yet who has mentioned a 12 month deal.  I think they are taking it and making it their own.  Which I am fine with if it works.  The intense course may be worse for my dd as she may want to give up if it is too 'hard'.  And paying out of pocket, it sounds like we'd go broke if we had to 'live' at the therapist office!

Thanks for all the direction.  This is helping us move along so much more effectivly.  I feel like we are floundering as it is.  How much worse it could be... .  

[vivekananda]

sam-99 her response sounds darned good to me. Including the first bit. She would see the length of time as being dependent on how the therapy went... .  she wouldn't want to put a time limit to it and that would be reasonable too.

Because you are so important in your dd's recovery, is there a way that you could have 'review's' or scheduled 'chats' with the T built into the process - perhaps with dd present, or ph catch ups. A way for you to understand how it is progressing and if there is anything you can do to support the process. Since you are paying the bill, it may be ok for you to ask - both your dd and the T.

Now, what about you? Have you grasped the need for yourself to change yet? I see it this way. We expect our dd's to change and it is such a hard thing to do. The least we can do it try to go through the same process ourselves: so, we can understand what they have to experience, so we can see how hard it is, so we can become better people ourselves and develop our relationship with our kid. So much of what I do on this board is directed towards me learning how to change. It has been an immense help to me.

You know, all our pw BPD are different, but the effect on us is the same.

Keep in touch,

Vivek    

[sam-99]

Absolutly!  I have already changed in how I view things and how I talk to dd.  Working hard to reverse old thought patterns as I learn how BPD works in dd.  I have finished reading "Loving Someone With BPD" and am starting "I Don't Have to Make Everything Better".  Her sister and I start the NAMI Family to Family course beginning of Feburary.  I did email the therapist and let her know that we are working on our end to improve things and that we are available to work with her in any way, including coming in for our own sessions, seperatly or together.  We are in this 100%.  Really hoping this therapist is the one.  But, if not, then we will keep trying!

Thanks for all the input!  It has been so helpful!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[vivekananda]

good luck with the T and stay in touch, ok? Let us know how it goes. I always use the site to get support when things are tough or advice when I am about to try something... .  

cheers,

Vivek