Just a vent

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

 I'm stuck with EOW + 1day per week while my attorney and I are building our case.We're trying to depose one of my childrens doctors,but the stbx's atty is stalling this.This is my weekend to have them.They needed haircuts,so I took them yesterday and we also went and bought them some new clothes.STBX hoardes all of their clothes and only sends them with what they're wearing,so it's easier to just buy new clothes to keep at my home than to argue about it.

The kids were excited that they got new clothes.They wanted to call their mom,so I let them.S9 told her that they got their haircut yesterday too.Soon after,I get a text from stbx telling me I had no right to get their haircut and she has full custody.She doesn't have full custody as we haven't even had a hearing yet,but we do have a standing order.I explain this to her,once again,and tell her that she has no say in what the kids and I do on my time. The next text is that she's showing the texts to her atty,so I politely told her that if she has a problem with me taking them to get their haircut,take it up with my atty,otherwise,stop harassing me.She texts again and I finally have to tell her directly to stop texting me unless it invoves the welfare of the kids.This is the last time I'm telling her.The texts finally stop.

I once thought that the stbx had BPD,but I'm seeing more signs of NPD.She thinks very highly of herself,which a BPD generally doesn't.Anyway, although this bothered me,because she's seems to think she can control what I do with the kids when they're with me,I get this laughable picture in my head of her going to her atty Monday morning and telling him we need an emergency hearing.When asked why,she tells him,... .  "he took them to get a haircut!"

The wierdness just continues and I'm so GLAD to be out of it.The fight now,is to get our kids out of it as much as I can.

[marbleloser]

 I'm stuck with EOW + 1day per week while my attorney and I are building our case.We're trying to depose one of my childrens doctors,but the stbx's atty is stalling this.This is my weekend to have them.They needed haircuts,so I took them yesterday and we also went and bought them some new clothes.STBX hoardes all of their clothes and only sends them with what they're wearing,so it's easier to just buy new clothes to keep at my home than to argue about it.

The kids were excited that they got new clothes.They wanted to call their mom,so I let them.S9 told her that they got their haircut yesterday too.Soon after,I get a text from stbx telling me I had no right to get their haircut and she has full custody.She doesn't have full custody as we haven't even had a hearing yet,but we do have a standing order.I explain this to her,once again,and tell her that she has no say in what the kids and I do on my time. The next text is that she's showing the texts to her atty,so I politely told her that if she has a problem with me taking them to get their haircut,take it up with my atty,otherwise,stop harassing me.She texts again and I finally have to tell her directly to stop texting me unless it invoves the welfare of the kids.This is the last time I'm telling her.The texts finally stop.

I once thought that the stbx had BPD,but I'm seeing more signs of NPD.She thinks very highly of herself,which a BPD generally doesn't.Anyway, although this bothered me,because she's seems to think she can control what I do with the kids when they're with me,I get this laughable picture in my head of her going to her atty Monday morning and telling him we need an emergency hearing.When asked why,she tells him,... .  "he took them to get a haircut!"

The wierdness just continues and I'm so GLAD to be out of it.The fight now,is to get our kids out of it as much as I can.

[tog]

My SO's stbxw has both NPD and BPD traits, IMO. She's high-functioning and would NEVER have the public meltdowns that lower functioning BPDs have. She also sees herself as superior and is very condescending and haughty. She would like very much to control everything SO does and has tried. The coparent counselor recently told her that she was trying to tell SO what to do when she insisted he agree to a punishment she wanted to give SS. She did not like that, and could not see how it wasn't her right to dictate that. Yours sounds a lot like SO's stbx.

Maybe next time, take pictures of the kids prior to their haircuts (you could make it fun, like, "hey kids! Let's do before and after photos!" so if it comes up, you can show that she is neglecting their care and you were forced to do it. Even though I agree with you-what court will punish you for giving your kids haircuts and buying them clothes?

We found that confronting her just triggers more rage, so ignoring her works best. Took us a long time to figure that out, and a lot of her showing SO's "abusive" texts and emails to everyone, ones basically saying what yours did.

[david]

You are one of their parents and you can get their haircut when they are with you. You don't need to engage with stbx about it. Just make sure you have copies of all emails and texts from her. Negative engagement is still engagement. The picture idea is good so you can show the court if you have to.

My ex left 5 plus years ago and still does the clothes nonsense. It hasn't stopped but I work around it by returning them in the same clothes I picked them up in. That minimizes things to some degree when they are younger. Our youngest is 9 now. Our oldest is 14 so he can wear what he wants. This winter ex decided that she wasn't buying him any long pants. All the long pants that he brought over to her place disappeared except for the one he was wearing to school. He found a hiding spot at his mom's that he puts things he doesn't want to disappear. The clothes he likes he keeps at my place along with things that he values. He figured this out on his own.

I would have described my ex as high finctioning years ago but the more I detached the more she seems to be spiraling into an abyss. She tried alienating the boys from me in the beginning and that eventually back fired on her because she was lying to much to the boys and they figured it out. She needs to feel in control and will do some pretty unusual things to keep that illusion going.

[DreamGirl]

Anyway, although this bothered me,because she's seems to think she can control what I do with the kids when they're with me,I get this laughable picture in my head of her going to her atty Monday morning and telling him we need an emergency hearing.When asked why,she tells him,... .  "he took them to get a haircut!"

That is pretty laughable.  

My stepkiddos mama is diagnosed with BPD ~ and her mood is kinda where she stands with the haircut debacle that so many of us endure. She did the whole "I'm their mother, I get the haircuts".

My husband - "OK"

Then she realized haircuts for three girls meant she had to PAY for haircuts for three girls. So she did the whole "I ALWAYS pay for their haircuts! You do it!"

My husband - "OK"

So then, *I* (stepmom) took the girls to get their haircuts. So she did the whole "I'm their mother and she doesn't get to decide about my daughters hair! I''ll do it!"

My husband - "OK"

Then she realized haircuts for three girls means she has to PAY for haircuts for three girls. So she just stopped.

My husband "Hey the girls need haircuts - you want me to take them? Or you?"

Her: "You do it"

My husband has a boundary "Just because she goes off the deep end over nothing, doesn't mean I'm going with her."

marbleloser, the thing about some pwBPD (and NPD) is that it is only a MASK of having a high sense of worth, when in reality their really low self-worth has them so full of self-hate, they contemplate suicide (suicidal ideation being one of the diagnostic factors). They are not really full of them self - it's a grasp at something outwardly that they can't provide inwardly.

Your wife is going to likely keep up the weird behavior - she's dysregulated. Like most of us going thru court, her stress levels are heightened, and she doesn't have the skill set to regulate her stress.  When there is a BPD element invovled, her baseline is already off the charts... .  and so this stress is going to have her acting like a haircut is the end of the world. She thinks you are trying to control her (the kids) - so she's gonna grasp at that control by emotionally vomitting all that anger in your direction.

Don't get involved in it.

I think you did really well in saying "hey, sorry you're upset over a haircut, I don't see it the same way as you, talk to my attorney."

Bottom line is that you're right. So let her do all the barking she wants, you don't have to listen anymore.  That's the beauty of divorce.

[tog]

Yeah, the clothes thing seems common. We just buy SS lots of nice, second-hand (read cheap) clothes (while he still doesn't care what he wears) and he can sort the rest out himself. Everything we buy does seem to disappear, but she seems to feel the same way, so we just don't engage over it. At 13, he'll need to work that out himself. She always projects that we're the ones hoarding clothes, but considering my trips to the thrift store are quite frequent, I think that's not the case.

Despite getting CS, SO's stbxw doesn't get seem to like getting him haircuts, but we don't get them either. When he asks for one, she will get it, so we just leave that up to him too. He doesn't ask us.

[mamachelle]

Yes, yes. Ditto for above with haircuts and clothes. I could tell many stories... .  

I am lucky now that BPDmom lives across the country but I endured the clothes weirdness with EoW for many years. Change of season was the worst! I would just buy extra shorts and pants at target once  i realized the pattern. My oldest SS also began putting his jeans into his backpack and taking them with him so he would not lose them.

She was/is terrible about  doing laundry. couldn't manage to send my then 9 yo SS to camp in 98 degree weather first day in shorts. It's poor functioning and gets expensive and now seeing all these other stories its nice to see I'm not crazy or alone.

I remember when I took SS then 4 and 5 to get haircut. The hairdresser kept referring to me as mom. I politely corrected her. She turned to me, looked me straight in the eye, and said "you are a good mom. You really are a very good mom. "

Marbleloser I think you handled it well as others have posted and you are def not alone in the fight 

[marbleloser]

Thank you all!  I appreciate your comments.It's good to know I'm not the only one going through this,although I'm sorry you all are as well. Thank you for the validation. I needed that! It's wierd how I can see the dysregulation and know I'm in the right,but it still brings anxiety. That's where my boundary comes in.I don't have to continue the dance (text) if I don't choose to. Thank you all so much.

[marbleloser]

BTW, I did take pics of the kids haircuts. In the stbx's text she claimed I had their hair "chopped off",without even seeing it, so I did take pics. I've learned I have to cover all bases against accusations.

[sanemom]

We have had the haircut debacle as well... .  maybe it is a diagnostic feature.     "You are not to alter their appearance without MY permission"--of course, that doesn't go both ways.

Next time go get those magnetic tongue rings... .  just to scare her.   

[david]

My ex used to complain if she took the boys for their haircut since that is what a "father should do with their sons." Since we divorced she gets very angry if I get their hair cut. I let her take them since she does do it on a regular basis.

Good idea with the pictures. Also, think about recording anytime you are physically near each other. My ex falsely accused me of assault and I went to jail for two weeks.

[marbleloser]

Thank you David! I always record when I'm around the stbx for such reasons. Exchanges take place at an area where there are surveillance cameras as well.

sanemom- She's lucky they didn't tell her I clipped their toenails too.! She woulda had a coronary!

mamachelle- Same here. She bought only shorts at the beginning of school,so I went and bought jeans,long sleeves,and coats.Of course,they never came back with them. The clothes they get sent to me with,have holes in them and are basically rags. S9 really wanted to take his new jeans with him tonight,but I couldn't let him. The only thing I could think of,was to tell him to ask his mom to buy the same kind.He said,"But,I know she won't ever do it"  :'( It's sad,but the rest of the story is even sadder. I've signed them up for therapy. Their first session is Wednesday. I'm hoping it will help them cope,and at least give them someone neutral to talk to.

[david]

So I pick the boys up today at school. S14 tells me mom left them at her place for several hours on Saturday to go shopping. Well, she came back with 6 pairs of jeans for S14. She showed him the receipt because she bought him good jeans at $68 each. I just listened. He tried to get mom to return 5 of them since he already has some (the ones I bought him two weeks ago) and spend the money on something else. That was a mistake and he heard about it from her. Apparently he is ungrateful and should be ashamed of himself.

We bought jeans two weeks ago at Sams Club for 13.98 each.

I just let him vent and really didn't say much. They are going to be with me this weekend and I'll think about it until then.

[Catsmother]

We learnt a long time ago, that whatever the child came over in is what they wore back. Pickup for ex was about 7.30pm, and we asked her to include pyjamas so that she didn't have to change the child when she got home. Well she forgot. Frequently. So we put him in pyjamas, which we never saw again.

We are now back at EOW, and there have already been a couple of times that the child has come wearing school uniform (Australia). Well the child went back to her in school uniform on the Sunday. Embarassing for the child we know. But we already pay child support, and she nevers sends any clothes with the child.

And as for haircuts. We tend to get the extreme haircuts from her. The child has had a mohawk and more recently was sporting a rats tail. The mohawk was done by the stepfather in the two hours between the finish of school, and the child boarding a flight to us. We were long distance at the time (the ex moved). Hubby texted her about it, and she said that that was what the child wanted. Given that the child, at the time, was on a reward chart system, him getting the haircut was unreasonable as he had in no way shape or form gained enough stars to even get hald a reward.

So when the child turned up with the rats tail, we left it the first time. But then he turned up with it again, and he had been given a haircut only a few hours before we got him. So this time, hubby just cut the rats tail off. The child was not concerned about it one way or the other.

[scraps66]

Don't explain, just tell her to stop.  Telling her only text you if it has to do with the welfare of the kids is her license to continue texting.  IN her twisted mind everything she is thinking now has to do with the welfare of the kids.  I used to get some texts like this, professing very elementary things that she need and, "I have to talk to S8, it's very important," and these turning out to be things she should talk to me about, not S8.  It's another avenue to interfere with your time with the kids.

[SayWha?]

I have learned that the less you say, the better. DH now ignores emails that are sent to try to gain control. He also tried the ":)on't talk to me unless it is about our son" line. At the time she was hounding DH to give her baby stuff for her new baby with another man.   She claimed that emailing about her new baby was emailing about my SS because if she had to spend money on the baby it was less she could spend on SS. (Yeah, think about that logic for a little bit.)