Who is a BPD's ideal mate?

[fakename]

Im trying to figure out who they would ideally liketo attach thenselves to and not abuse them and try to make things work.

I'm starting to think what they want is someone who doesn't show they care, is a narcissist, is someone they can brag about. I guess I'm revolving around superficial.

[blecker]

A perpetual doormat.

[MakeItHappen]

I really don't think there is one. More importantly, do your best to not spend time thinking about it. It gives the pwBPD more power, energy and takes away from your own growth. Much easier said than done but... .  

[mosaicbird]

I don't think there is one. There are certainly people with seemingly "compatible" dysfunctional relating styles who are more capable of tolerating a relationship with a pwBPD for whatever reason (dissociation, trauma bonding, etc.), but that doesn't mean it's healthy for either side.

[benny2]

I sometimes think me and my upwBPD are like 2 magnets and you know what happens when you try to put 2 magnets together, theres a magnetic force that keeps them apart.

[King1989]

It's actually impossible, I think. I don't believe there's anyone that  could make a relationship with a BPD work, I'm sorry to say. I just haven't seen evidence, only pain and anxiety for the other person in the relationship. Like the one person said before me, it's better not to think or dwell on the question.   

I can give examples based off experience but that's about it. I spent a year with my BPDx and her BPD mother, no matter what I did, I never did a thing right. I got out of that relationship and eventually started counseling someone who has BPD.  Took an incredible amount of time keeping my bias away long enough to not say "The guy would be better off without you".  Kept trying to warn the BPD of the inevitable though, and the inevitable happened, the guy has now gone NC  (Which I applaud him for, to be honest :/).

Just be careful whatever you do. I don't think there's really a person out there than can escape being abused by the BPD, mostly because it isn't the person. It's the BPD, no matter who it is or how great of a person it is, the one with BPD will always be a problem.

[fakename]

yeah, not dwelling on things makes perfect sense, but there's some questions that pop up that i'd like to examine so i can develop some sort of understanding and through that i think it helps soothe me... .  

the best understanding i've gained so far is that nothing was real and they will never change.

sometimes i wonder if i have BPD or something myself, because i'm currently going back and forth so much. i am going a bit crazy but trying to make sure i get that under control.

king1989, what was it like counselling someone with BPD? was she honest with you or could you tell she was either hiding things or lying? did she acknowledge her wrongdoings but just not care? were all her actions in the name of selfishness?

what about the good things you saw in her - were they a facade? i remember my ex being so charitable and giving to others... .  couldnt understand how she could be so kind (not sure if she was considerate though-and i think that may be because she doesnt have the understanding of how to be considerate?) and try to help others so much yet so ugly at the same time... .  

[King1989]

king1989, what was it like counselling someone with BPD? was she honest with you or could you tell she was either hiding things or lying? did she acknowledge her wrongdoings but just not care? were all her actions in the name of selfishness?

what about the good things you saw in her - were they a facade? i remember my ex being so charitable and giving to others... .  couldnt understand how she could be so kind (not sure if she was considerate though-and i think that may be because she doesnt have the understanding of how to be considerate?) and try to help others so much yet so ugly at the same time... .  

There is a lot of selfishness in this person, but honestly she surprises me as she does acknowledge her faults but she doesn't do anything about it. Honestly, I don't believe the person wants to do anything about her problems, all she wants is someone to sit there and listen to her unload about how bad everyone else is and how screwed up her life is, but she does not listen to advice or suggestions about how to fix these problems.  This guy she was around had laid boundaries, was only at a "friend" level and she was obsessed with him, hated any other woman that was around him and was constantly jealous. That being said, the guy finally had enough of her paranoia and now she tells me she's got this big plan to try and win him back down the road despite his saying "it was over". She doesn't see how her plan could work out to be stalking and refuses to "give up".  Honestly I don't see it ending well.  I do not know what good there was aside from the fact that she did admit to her problems being the reason this guy walked off and why everything else is going on, but the sad fact of the matter is the person will always come up with excuses for her own lies and problems and is quick to blame others.

A person with BPD is like an endless loop, and that's what it is. An endless cycle. My fortune is I counsel this person online so I myself can control whether or not I choose to answer her every day crisis or hold off and not give counsel for a few days.  Every day the crisis problem is the same, there's no change. I've counseled this BPD for about a year and her problems remain there, she will not do anything to better her own situation and literally her everything revolves around this one guy. If it doesn't have something to do with him, she doesn't care, even about herself she doesn't appear to care for her well-being.  But the best way to describe counseling someone with BPD is quite simple:

"Walking around in circles".  That's it, going in circles. How many times I myself have gotten annoyed in counseling and while I've held back most of my biting bias, I've let out some of the lesser bias and told her what I really thought that there is no real hope that things will get better for her unless she willingly works on what ails her, but that will not happen. All someone with BPD wants is someone to sit there and coddle them, to baby them and validate their problems.  This person herself told me in her own words what someone with BPD, or her, wants:

"I just want someone to listen to me and tell me 'it'll be okay' and I'll feel better even if it's temporary." 


Just like my BPDx and her mother, this person I counsel does not change. Someone with BPD always remains the same.  Myself, with my ex, as people on these boards can tell you from having dealt with me, I ALMOST went back. I was almost suckered into a second chance, thinking my ex could change her ways. It wasn't until she made a particular comment that more than crossed the line that I realized, it's impossible. Someone with BPD cannot and will not change unless they truly truly wish it and make an action on their own to make that change and actually work at it. 

[King1989]

As for feeling like you have BPD as a result, likely not. Likely it's a combination of PTSD and "Fleas". There is a board on these forums somewhere that discusses fleas in greater detail but I cannot find it right now.  Essentially it's like a dog scratches and fleas jump onto you and start irritating you. You don't have the affliction of being a dog but you have these fleas that will go away after some time of healing.  Something like that, but it's a bad analogy 

[mosaicbird]

All someone with BPD wants is someone to sit there and coddle them, to baby them and validate their problems. 

I'm curious as to why you choose to remain in a therapeutic relationship with someone if this is your attitude. As someone with immense difficulty trusting counselors and therapists, but who is at the same time aware that I need to be able to in order to heal my own issues, it's very distressing to read things like this.

[fakename]

king1989,

i really appreciate your candor and it provided me with a sort of comfort, because my ex gf was exactly as you describe this girl.

i even remember many times when she would call and complain about whatever, and i tried to console or provide advice, she would yell and tell me that i'm just supposed to listen and hang up. it was ridiculous

my ex gf wouldnt listen to anything from anyone, only did whatever she wanted. i would to overlook it, and think was just adamant, but as i look back on it, why would i want to be with someone so close-minded and stubborn. come to think of it, she would always tell me i'm not open-minded... .  i would get so frustrated because i am incredibly open-minded, in fact, many people know that about me... .  i would always have to argue such ridiculous labels she cast on me that just weren't true and it seemed like i couldnt convince her otherwise. i remember she one time when some other guy dumped her, she called me superficial during one of her yelling at me sessions... .  i figured she was just thinking of the guy she just dated, but i also wonder if she was thinking about herself and casting that ugliness onto me.  ugh, never-ending cycle... .  

i remember after one of our breakups last year, (when she was just using me cause the guy she was actually trying to be with dumped her), i tried dating afterwards and i saw how i had these 'fleas' you speak of... .  thats why i'm trying to just stay single and not think about relationships or being with another girl right now - i'm trying to get back to equilibrium so i can eventually be in the type of r/s that i want-meaningful and with synergy

[King1989]

I'm curious as to why you choose to remain in a therapeutic relationship with someone if this is your attitude. As someone with immense difficulty trusting counselors and therapists, but who is at the same time aware that I need to be able to in order to heal my own issues, it's very distressing to read things like this.

My friend, let me say I understand where you're coming from, yeah.  I'm not a professional counselor however, I am merely a friend to this person. Or well, I try to be as friendly as I can be but it tends to be hard due to my own personal bias. I have pretty much stated that I would not give advice because it's a bit more stressing for me to do so.  I can agree to your distrust for counselors and therapists, but I have seen that professionals are good and would really be able to do a much better job for someone than I could possibly do. Which is another reason that I HAVE or am trying to cease advice.   Another issue with this is the fact that I decided to try and be a friend to someone with BPD because I saw they were having a hard time with something before I knew their case. And now it's come to the clingy issue that BPDs have, where I am unable to basically be the prick by cutting this person off completely. As a friend, I can't do that to someone. If i were a professional licensed therapist, then I would terminate.


Fakename, it is a good idea to take a break from dating after a break up. First and foremost you are your most important person to yourself. Your emotional health, mental health is by far more important than all else.  So it's a good idea that you are taking some time *nod*.  It does get better after time though. It can be hard, and believe me, it was hard for me. But it gets better

[mosaicbird]

Thanks for clarifying. That brings to mind an article I read the other evening -  Toilet Function of Friendships - regarding that type of dumping ground friendship... .  

[King1989]

Thanks for clarifying. That brings to mind an article I read the other evening -  Toilet Function of Friendships - regarding that type of dumping ground friendship... .  

*nod* Hmm, it would appear your link is not going through.  '

[mosaicbird]

Argh, and too late to edit my post to fix it. www.afterpsychotherapy.com/toilet-function-of-friendship/

[WT]

A perpetual doormat.

Ding ding ding!  We have a winner!  My ex left me for another guy who would indulge in her destructive behavior after I said that I wouldn't do it anymore.  Her idea of an ideal mate is someone who will do whatever she says and whatever she wants, regardless of the consequences.

[WT]

Argh, and too late to edit my post to fix it. www.afterpsychotherapy.com/toilet-function-of-friendship/

This is basically my ex's relationship with all of her (few) friends.  They became my friends when we were together, and they would complain to me that the only time that she would contact them was to complain about me and that she wouldn't listen to them when they told her that she was behaving irrationally.  They eventually stopped reaching out to her and inviting her out except for major events like birthdays.

[jp254958]

Someone in a coma.

[Clearmind]

Im trying to figure out who they would ideally liketo attach thenselves to and not abuse them and try to make things work.

You/us - why else would we be here – they attached themselves to you fakename – just like they attached to all of us here.

You didn't see the  and run!

We can laugh and joke about who may make it perfect for them however the truthful/honest answer is You/Us!

Have you ever wondered how a Borderline has met hundreds of people in their life however you were the one that attached?

A BPD does not attached to everyone and not everyone attaches to a Borderline. Figure out why you attached and there you have your answer as to who is the perfect attachment.

It just so happens that the attachment is shaky. You are not responsible for making their own life OK for them to try and make the r/s work. Not your role – this is a form of narcissism if you think you can.

I'm starting to think what they want is someone who doesn't show they care, is a narcissist, is someone they can brag about. I guess I'm revolving around superficial.

No! the attachment was shaky for you and them – it took very little for you to fall off the pedestal.

Our partners smothered us during the idealization phase – did we enjoy it? – you bet we did! Again is this not a form of narcissism? We lavished the attention – we felt whole, we felt wonderful, loved like we had never been loved before….food for thought Fake Name…look in the mirror my friend.

[jp254958]

The narcissist / BPD relationship is all too common.

Narcissists appreciate the idealization they receive from BPD spouses.  I believe that pwBPD value the apparently strong sense of self that a narcissist projects.  pwBPD often have zero sense if self and they look for personalities that they can assume in order to feel some sense of identity.

However, the BPD spouse is unable to retain extended feelings for the spouse because of engulfment/abandonment fears, emotional instability/dysregulation, etc., which damages the weak ego of the narcissist and fights ensue. The narcissist thinks he can fix the BPD spouse's problems and the relationship, but he or she can't, because people can only heal themselves.

Efforts to identify what's wrong with the BPD spouse only expand the wedge and problems in the relationship.

Not all spouses in relationships with BPD partners are bona fide narcissists. But pwBPD are drawn to narcissists.

Accepting people for who they are is the only path.  You can't change them.  If you can't accept who they are, then you need to move on.

[Clearmind]

I assume you mean dx’d NPD when you talk about a bona fide narcissist jp254958? Folks don’t necessarily have to be dx’d NPD in order to carry traits – and you would be right – this is how the dynamic played out for us.

We each get something from the r/s – we each contribute to the conflict. Will it ever be perfect – No! Can anyone person make it perfect – No!

However, unless we each process our role in the r/s and how we contributed we cannot make things better with our partners.

Before You Can Make Things Better, You have To Stop Making Things Worse

[jp254958]

100% correct I don't mean NPD. Should have clarified.

Everyone has some form of narcissism... .  confidence in yourself is technically a form of narcissm. But when narcissistic traits become dysfunctional or get/keep us in bad situations, we need to rethink everything. 

Thanks!

[crashintome]

I don't think anyone is the ideal mate.  They will always find something wrong.

L's ex was a doormat.  She would do anything, and I mean ANYTHING, L wanted and L complained she was a doormat.  She said she wanted a girl with a backbone.  Well, with me, I nagged too much and was too expressive with what I wanted.

I think they ensure that no one is the ideal mate.  They push people away before it gets to that point.

[OTH]

Is there such a thing? An ideal mate for anybody? Isn't fantasy thinking a part of the problem for both partners?

[jp254958]

Well said.