When one stays with a BPD spouse (in denial), one lives a lie.

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I do not understand why a person will choose to stay (and try to "work things out" with a another person that is "BPD-in-denial". In my humble opinion, this is just living a lie (for the rest of one's life)  ... . and choosing a life of chaos. To me this is just bizarre. It the BPD afflicted person is able to at least admit that a problem exists, then there is possibly a chance that this  relationship can work. But anyways, ... .  

[ogopogodude]

I do not understand why a person will choose to stay (and try to "work things out" with a another person that is "BPD-in-denial". In my humble opinion, this is just living a lie (for the rest of one's life)  ... . and choosing a life of chaos. To me this is just bizarre. It the BPD afflicted person is able to at least admit that a problem exists, then there is possibly a chance that this  relationship can work. But anyways, ... .  

[Newton]

ogopogodude ... .  I understand your confusion... .  it doesn't sound like this situation would work for you.  We are all individuals and own sovereignty over our choices... .  some people will choose to accept what they have... .  for their own reasons.

From my reading it does seem that unless a person with BPD manages to break through their denial and commit to long term therapy, their symptoms will continue to manifest... .  

I haven't had a chance to read your previous posts... .  where are you right now with all of this?... .  

[crashintome]

It's hard to explain unless you are actually in the situation.

I spent over a year with a girl who is undiagnosed.  We went back and forth.  She refused to make any commitment to me, yet piled all the expectations of a GF on me.

Bottom line, I love her.  Even after all of the abuse-mental, physical, emotional-I love her.  It's that love that keeps hooking me.  It's the hope that "this time will be different - she learned her lesson" that keeps a person hooked.

Someone with BPD knows exactly what to say, how to act, what to do, to keep up coming back.  Once they have us, they can slip right back into the abuse.

[Newton]

crashintome a definition of "love" will end up in a debate of semantics 

I have recently posted this... .  and I will again... .  

I think it's really important for members to research the concepts of "intermittent reinforcement" and "trauma bonds"... .  

Once we understand our part in a dysfunctional dynamic, it becomes much easier to make sensible decisions... .  

[KellyO]

Person will choose to stay for myriads reasons. And when person is in the middle of it, even "choosing" can be too much.

I know now I stayed and recycled and allowed more abuse and more withholding and pure cruelty because for me it was normal. For me it was love. That was how I was treated by my mother, and now I know this: for 40 years I was a person who fell in love with people who never loved me back, and who made me to work myself to exhaustion for tiny bits of affection. My consious rebelled and I tried to leave many times, but my subconcious got better of me until I realized why I kept going back for more pain. For me, it was love.

Some people have children, and they believe children should have both parents. That is their upbringing. They have property together, even business. This combined with the reasons that got them together with disordered person to begin with can make people wanting to try to make the rs work at least somehow, even by sacrificing themselves in process.

[VeryFree]

For me it was about the folowing triangle:

love - hope - my own issues.

Love and hope say enough I think. My own issues are the ones, that I'm trying to explore right now: what happened in my life, that caused me not to stand up against abuse? And: what will I have to not be in that situation again?

[dickL]

uBPDw of 35yrs has always been in denial and I only recently entered this world of BPD . She fits every category listed for BPD . I have suffered her sexual affairs , verbal abuse , and no intimacy for decades . She ran away w/teenage sweatheart, 3rd try for him , 5wks ago nc .Sounds easy , keep my distance, shut my mouth, and divorce her . Save myself . We are the people with assets , debts , a home , and most importantly a S25 mentally handicapped living at home . He needs a family to support him to achieve a level of independent  living in his future . I'm 64 and have advanced liver disease and daily housework,taking care of our son, responsibility for fixing our disastrous financial state , not loosing our home. Tall orders. So any decision about my needs have to be are secondary to what may be best for our son. There is no one to help w/S unless I pay for it. I am learning my role in this , I allowed the lies , it was easier to believe them. I once mentioned her denial , war erupted . I sent her text telling her if she could become honest w/herself , we would welcome her back and get to work . In all probability she'll return, she's never had an affair that she wasn't dumped after the " honeymoons" . I feel a parents most important duty is to prepare your children for the day when your not alive and your personal wants are secondary. I do love her , she's ill not evil . But I do not intend to be emotionally assaulted by her any longer . One day at a time .

[Vindi]

yes, because I am in a FOG, i know the right thing to do, why don't I just leave? cuz of the FOG, cuz I owe it to him to be with him, cuz I am so codependent, its not funny. Yes, I have alot of work to do on myself. I do put up with only so much, others would call it a high tolerance level. To me its a FOG, low self esteem and not believing in myself. So yes, I have alot of work to do and maybe someday I will be ready to walk away.

[ogopogodude]

It was so very hard for me to walk away, ... . but I did. My emotions were like a  yoyo but I knew what the choice HAD to be, ... .  and I do not have nay regrets. Yes, ... . I still weep at times but as each day goes by, ... . I know that I made the wisest choice for my sanity.

[Iced]

Just because someone chooses to stay in a relationship with a pwBPD doesn't mean necessarily that they are living a lie.  The denial and lie only exists in a continuing relationship if the spouse/partner doesn't see BPD for what it truly and literally is.

If someone truly understands what BPD is and how it can affect the things that it does, then their conscious, voluntary, INFORMED choice removes the possibility of 'living a lie' as it was their conscious choice to go ahead.

That said, I once had a romantic partner who had BPD.  Their willingness to gain self awareness and confront the disorder by means of regular therapy sessions and my willingness to stand by them and go through therapy myself to both help myself and help me help and support them was what allowed us to enjoy a relationship with one another.

Things ended, but it wasn't the BPD that did it and though we have since literally grown apart, we were able to remain friends for the remainder of our time spent together as they saw actual recovery in the end and we were both able to communicate better.

To me, there's a difference between loving and caring for someone and being willing and prepared to walk down the challenging road to possible recovery with them knowing and understanding that 1) it IS a challenge, 2) there CAN be hard and harder times ahead, and 3) that THOUGH recovery IS possible... .  so are relapses, non-linear periods of progress, and even complete setbacks or even refusal for more treatment... .  

And simply staying without the full awareness of what it means to BE in such a challenging sort of relationship.

Relationships are a two-way road for me with both partners making the conscious choice to work on the relationship together.

If only one partner is making the conscious effort, the relationship will not work.  After all, a relationship broken down to its barest elements is a relationship between one and another.  Without participation from another, how can there be a relationship?

[ogopogodude]

Wow, ... .  I really like your post. (Seriously).  Me thinks you are a registered therapist of some sort (or at least some human behaviour training in the past).

    There are several sentences that caught my attention. That is when only one of the persons in the rel'ship is making a conscious effort towards betterment (presumably the non-BPD). etc.

   And you are right in the very 1st paragraph meaning it is not living a lie if the non-BPD CHOOSES to stay in the rel'ship if he/she totally understands the affliction etc.

   Thus, ... .  my apologies, ... . I was being too black and white with the inference in my thread title.

[MockingbirdHL]

It's hard to explain unless you are actually in the situation.

I spent over a year with a girl who is undiagnosed.  We went back and forth.  She refused to make any commitment to me, yet piled all the expectations of a GF on me.

Bottom line, I love her.  Even after all of the abuse-mental, physical, emotional-I love her.  It's that love that keeps hooking me.  It's the hope that "this time will be different - she learned her lesson" that keeps a person hooked.

Someone with BPD knows exactly what to say, how to act, what to do, to keep up coming back.  Once they have us, they can slip right back into the abuse.

This is my situation EXACTLY - jus like so many others I hear or read on here.

[tuum est61]

A person with BPD is not generally so disabled that they can't "work on the relationship." To some extent they are "trying" harder than the non.  I see my wife trying to work on our relationship every day.  Shes loves me very much and is truly frustrated with our difficulties.  A pwBPD just doesn't have the emotional regulatory mechanisms to make much progress.   That's where therapy can help - but therapy is a goal not a given for BPD relationships.

It does put the responsibility to make changes on the non, since the pwBPD's capacity is so low.  And it's always up to us nons to "decide" whether those changes are worth it.  Love, health, and family matters are perfectly reasonable reasons to stay.  Its why we don't counsel people to leave or stay - but to make changes that protect their physical and mental health if they find themselves in the situation.  

[whatisthetruth]

For me it was about the folowing triangle:

love - hope - my own issues.

Love and hope say enough I think. My own issues are the ones, that I'm trying to explore right now: what happened in my life, that caused me not to stand up against abuse? And: what will I have to do to not be in that situation again?

Exactly.  How the hell did i get into this?  What in me allowed this to occur? 

is there something in my family dynamic i need to heal?



good writing and good food for thought

[whatisthetruth]

uBPDw of 35yrs has always been in denial and I only recently entered this world of BPD . She fits every category listed for BPD . I have suffered her sexual affairs , verbal abuse , and no intimacy for decades . She ran away w/teenage sweatheart, 3rd try for him , 5wks ago nc .Sounds easy , keep my distance, shut my mouth, and divorce her . Save myself . We are the people with assets , debts , a home , and most importantly a S25 mentally handicapped living at home . He needs a family to support him to achieve a level of independent  living in his future . I'm 64 and have advanced liver disease and daily housework,taking care of our son, responsibility for fixing our disastrous financial state , not loosing our home. Tall orders. So any decision about my needs have to be are secondary to what may be best for our son. There is no one to help w/S unless I pay for it. I am learning my role in this , I allowed the lies , it was easier to believe them. I once mentioned her denial , war erupted . I sent her text telling her if she could become honest w/herself , we would welcome her back and get to work . In all probability she'll return, she's never had an affair that she wasn't dumped after the " honeymoons" . I feel a parents most important duty is to prepare your children for the day when your not alive and your personal wants are secondary. I do love her , she's ill not evil . But I do not intend to be emotionally assaulted by her any longer . One day at a time .

35 yrs... .  you must be a superman.  seriously.  i understand the affairs and that its easier to believe the lies.  emotionally easier to some degree.  but what do you do with the anger from all the bs?

[gettingoverit]

I stayed for  variety of reasons; I loved her, I thought things would get better, I knew something was "off" about her but had no idea it was BPD, I was co-dependent and addicted to her and the drama, and I really believed that love would prevail (cheesy I know). Looking back now, I realize I stayed because I was very unhealthy. I am not making any judgments to those of you who choose to stay, but I believe that people who choose to stay with their abusive partner, BPD or not, have some serious issues that need to be looked at. Healthy people do not attract people like this, and on the off chance that they do, they often run for the hills as soon as a few red flags present themselves. They certainly do NOT stick around for years on end putting up with that kind of abuse. For me the scary part is the fact that I didn't even realize how unhappy, stressed and emotionally depleted I really was until she left me for another. When the dust finally settled, I was a shell of the person I used to be, and I will never be the same person again after being with that woman for almost 7 years. The upside to all of this is that my xBPDgf did me a HUGE favour by leaving me for another. Although it was the most painful thing I had ever gone through, I know deep down I would have never left her and she would have eventually killed me with all the stress and drama. A person can only take so much before the body begins to say "no" and starts shutting down. I want to live a full joyful life, not one of constantly looking over my shoulder and half expecting another Ram truck to hit me from behind. That's not living... . that's waiting to die.