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Author Topic: 21-day stay at a Dual Diagnosis Center - progress  (Read 17789 times)
vivekananda
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« Reply #30 on: June 20, 2013, 07:54:19 PM »

Hey RR, do you think it would have been helpful if you had tried to validate him in the car? Maybe a question like: 'you are quiet, do you want to talk?'

I ask this because when I watched the Fruzzetti video recently Encouraging peace in a BPD family he pointed out that not acknowledging the other can be invalidating.

Perhaps your body language and tone in general was implicit validation for how he was feeling... .

what do you think?

Vivek  
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« Reply #31 on: June 20, 2013, 07:56:23 PM »

ps I am so glad you are able to talk to his Ts. You are very much a part of the process of healing and your insight is positive and must be so reassuring for him. It's good the glitch was able to be overcome.

never easy eh?   
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« Reply #32 on: June 20, 2013, 09:05:59 PM »

Hey RR, do you think it would have been helpful if you had tried to validate him in the car? Maybe a question like: 'you are quiet, do you want to talk?'

I ask this because when I watched the Fruzzetti video recently Encouraging peace in a BPD family he pointed out that not acknowledging the other can be invalidating.

Perhaps your body language and tone in general was implicit validation for how he was feeling... .

what do you think?

Vivek   

Yes... . I should've been doing that in the car, and I knew it; I think subconsciously I was just either afraid to have to deal with it--maybe incorrectly--or was hoping he would say something to make the conversation more natural. I whiffed    I'll look at that link you gave; I just haven't had a chance to see it yet  Smiling (click to insert in post)

There always is the chance that my non-verbal reaction was actual validation for him, though... . We got along fine, and he was just depressed; we actually have a good connection with lots of shortcuts to it. I think the fact that I didn't absorb his depression and try to "drag it out of him" was probably a help... . Who knows? But, yes... . it's GREAT I can talk to all of this T's; it saves a LOT of time and helps his recovery a lot  Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #33 on: June 21, 2013, 09:52:09 PM »

Rapt Reader - This quick recovery is such a good thing for you both. It makes such a huge difference when our adult kids sign those releases to involve us in their treatment. Is is essential, especially when they are in our home, to be able to support all sides of the story and have a better understanding of what support our kids need. You and ds are doing great with each other.

The reciprocal nature of your r/s with your son now helps both of you stay connected with each other, and with the professionals that are so essential for his contiued recovery. My DD is just taking some baby steps in this direction, even with huge trauma in past couple weeks, to allow me again into her realm. I won't distract with my story here, but we have had some awful/good days this week. And I have done pretty good at staying composed, if not validating at least not too invalidating (except for those really huge invalid things she was asking of me).

I also watched the Fuzzetti video on validation - it helped me alot with accepting my imperfect use of the principles. And gd's T has encouraged me with the ability to make 'repairs' in my family r/s's when things were not validating or protective enough.

Thanks so much for sharing your story.

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« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2013, 11:42:02 PM »

Hi, qcarolr    Thanks for your reply; I know how stressful your life is right now, and have been reading about how complicated things are with your daughter and how hard it has been for you, so I appreciate your taking the time to read my posts... .    

Yes... . the communication between myself, my son, and all of his Ts and Dr.s is what is making his recovery easier (well, all of that and the support and information I am getting from this site!   ). I do have to keep forcing myself to realize that my son's recovery will take time, however (the subject of this whole thread). He looks and acts so much healthier and better than just 4 months ago, that it's easy for me to be lulled into thinking: "He's OK now... . he's going to get through this in no time; I've got my sane and sober son back!  Smiling (click to insert in post) "

Today after his NFT session (yes, another one since Wednesday), in the car on our way home he opened up on his own about what was making him "agitated" (his word) on Tuesday. Although I believe that the reason he was depressed was the fear of success, there's another facet to what he was going through, and will be going through for a little while more... . {{{{{sigh}}}}} And, as soon as he started telling me, I realized what my subconscious fear of this discussion on Tuesday was: he told me that now that he's been clean and sober for almost 4 months, this is now a few weeks later than the time that he always would start to relapse in the past. In the last 4 years he's been in and out of 3 Rehabs; and the last 2 times he relapsed right after the 3 month mark. I knew this, and it's been in the back of my mind, and I never want to think about it, let alone talk about it. PTSD for me?  

Anyway, this time things are different: the Rehab was a Dual Diagnosis Program that (finally) addressed his mental health issues, and also diagnosed him with the BPD and taught him DBT and gave him and us the tools to use for recovery. And, of course, this time we've added NFT to his recovery process. He told me that he's been "itchy"; that the nice weather reminds him of the days when he had the freedom to go out with his car... . but that all his time was tied up with wanting drugs, trying to find the money to buy drugs, doing favors for "friends" (this was usually giving rides to appointments, shopping, or even a ride to pick up drugs) in exchange for drugs. Drugs gave him a reason to get up in the morning, something to live for in his miserable, depressed and pointless life.

This kind of discussion with him is VERY hard for me... . I hate it, and want to just forget the past and move on and not have to even have my mind think about the seedy, gutter-like life he used to live. I really think I have PTSD over it; the memories of dealing with it for the last more than 4 years prior to 4 months ago are really hard and painful for me. This is why I "whiffed" on the validation or willingness for the conversation on Tuesday. I couldn't put my finger on it before he brought it all up on his own today.

Now, there has been progress in this area... . He told me that in the past he would go 3 months or so clean and sober, and then relapse with just "a little bit" once a week, and have no problems. So then he would use a couple days a week, no problems. Then, he would do more than a couple days a week, and then he would have problems. Then he would have BIG problems, and it would snowball out of his control and things would then be horrible again till the next Rehab. He said he can't have that happen again... . But he's been thinking about all of this, and trying to deal with it. Then he said: ":)on't panic; I'm getting over it... . Smiling (click to insert in post) "

And then I got it: His fear of success is that once he's out in the world again--driving, working, socializing--he's afraid of getting sucked back into the drug lifestyle by being in the same town, running into the same people, driving past the same places (which are Everywhere) he used to purchase drugs. I think I subconsciously knew this, and fearing my ability to navigate the conversation, I avoided it.  

He has another NFT session tomorrow (Saturday), so I emailed his NF T this information. She's very perceptive and attentive, and I know it helps her with her treatment of him. He has a double session tomorrow, so that is good... .

And yes, Vivek      It. Is. Never. Easy.  
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« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2013, 08:32:51 AM »

Rapt Reader - this new self-awareness is a huge success for you DS. And his caution. And his being able to share all this with you. And your being able to tolerate your fears and listen.

Tolerating fears - this is my biggest stumbling block with my DD. It shuts me down, sends me away from her, makes the situation feel intolerable - unendurable.

Your ability to lean into the NF T by sharing these conversations that help focus your DS's therapy is awesome support and validation for YOU. I am learning that one of the most needed benefits of our self-care support network is to find validation for ourselves and how hard we work to continue to love our troubled kids.

Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)  

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« Reply #36 on: June 23, 2013, 05:17:07 PM »

qcarolr... . You are right, as usual    About everything you said 

As you are finding out yourself (I've read your latest posts!), when we are able to communicate with our pwBPD's Dr.s and Ts, it is very validating to have our insights acknowledged and acted upon, like we aren't seeing or hearing things about our loved one, but have valid truths to share. And, to have this also move their recovery in the right direction, how much better than that can it get! I'm so glad that things seem to be heading in the right direction with your DD, also... .  

I'm realizing that one of my problems with talking to my son regarding his past substance abuse issues, and the residual emotional issues he is having with his past addictions right now, is because I've always known that his problems with drugs were secondary to his mental health issues. That is still true, but now that his mental health issues are being addressed and treated, I guess I subconsciously just expected the drug abuse issues to dissolve (or something else just as delusional)    It actually confuses and frightens me any time he mentions anything drug-related (as in: things used to be this way, or: in the past I used to just do this [insert something terrible in my mind!] thing... . ). And I retreat into my "safe place in my head" and pretty much stop talking. I do listen, and try not to wince. I don't yell or argue or say invalidating things to him, but it's hard not to freeze up.

I'm just so used to believing that his untreated (for so long!) ADD, Depression, Hyperactive Thyroid, Social Anxiety, and now the newly diagnosed BPD, were all the reasons for his past drug use--that now realizing that his past drug use is still causing him angst and turmoil is hard for me. I will deal with it... .
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« Reply #37 on: June 24, 2013, 01:20:09 AM »

Hi there, just wanted to share this... . many years ago I did some training and part of it was a 'role play' about being addicted to heroin. What it showed us was the buzz that could be got out of just getting the next deal. It was easy to see how you could fall into all sorts of negative behaviours, lying, cheating, stealing in order to get the next fix and how it provided a buzz when you were successful. And how your friends formed a close knit circle of insiders who knew what it felt like... . etc etc just being a part of the social group felt good, there was a place you belonged etc.

So I learnt from that, that there is more to the culture of addiction than you would consider if you just looked at the physical implications.

Rapt Reader, I think your son is very brave to be successfully confronting this - and talking with you about it.

I am so happy for you,

Vivek    
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« Reply #38 on: June 24, 2013, 12:11:35 PM »

Thank you, Vivek , for your words of wisdom (I'm not kidding!) and information... . You are a blessing to me as usual    I appreciate the story you have told here... . It's thought-provoking  Being cool (click to insert in post)

This morning at my son's NFT session, I spoke with his T about this subject, and she said that he just needs time to sort it all out... . That in the past, after rehab (without this new T), he could just go so long without being drawn back into that lifestyle because he wasn't "thinking straight." Now, with this new T, he really IS thinking straight, and he's being more realistic and cognizant of how much that lifestyle has hurt him, and it's causing him to be drawing a bit into himself right now to do his thinking and working it all out in his head.

In fact, after the appointment he even told me (in the context of a conversation regarding NPD vs. BPD), that where the Narcissist doesn't even think that he's got a problem, and therefore won't even seek help most likely, the BPD (and here he meant himself in the context of our conversation) realizes just how much harm his dysfunction and behaviors have caused his life and himself, and he wants to get past it and learn how to make it all better. He really is making progress... .   Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #39 on: June 24, 2013, 02:04:23 PM »

 Smiling (click to insert in post) Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

qcr
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« Reply #40 on: June 24, 2013, 06:24:08 PM »

Thanks you for your kind words  Smiling (click to insert in post)

The thought of your ds coming to grips with his behaviours brings tears to my eyes. How hard is this to go through... . He is processing the harm he has caused himself... . then he can begin to see the hurt he has caused others... . and how I would like to save him from that. Sadly, this is essential for his recovery. These words seem blunt and callous, all I want to do is protect our children... . how misguided is that?

I think of my dd and how it would be for her, if she was to recover. For me, learning to change myself and to acknowledge my complicity in her mental illness has been hard enough, and this process continues on and is painful and almost all consuming. How much harder for my dd would it be... .

RR in the book 'The Buddha and the Borderline' Keira talked about recovery not making sense and not working until there was a 'spiritual' component. Until she was able to connect with the universal energy (aka God) and the sense of community she found in Buddhism. Perhaps having that can ease the pain... . I know it helps for me... .

lots of love to you and your boy   

Vivek      
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« Reply #41 on: June 24, 2013, 07:20:45 PM »

Hi, Vivek      

You are very welcome; your posts here have been really inspirational for me... . Along with so many others here~~Everyone: I thank you all  Smiling (click to insert in post)

I really feel bad for you and your relationship with your daughter; she is high functioning, right? I really find that the HF BPDs in my life just would probably not ever really realize that they have a problem, and need help. For all his troubles, the fact that my son was low functioning (and actually really still is) is probably the only reason he ended up reaching his "bottom" in February 2013, which was the catalyst for all that followed... .

I do see signs that he's starting to process the harm he has caused to our family; he says many times how impressed and surprised he is that my H and I have been so supportive after all he has done, and that he respects us so much for hanging in there when other parents might've kicked their kid out and cut him off from any financial or emotional support. He says often that he realizes he is lucky to have us, and he doesn't know if he would've been able to be as forgiving and supportive to someone like him, if he was in that situation himself.

He's apologized for things that have happened in the past, if there is some reason it comes up... . I do know it is hard on him remembering these things without getting depressed or very sad... . I am lucky that he knows his problems were situational, and not from parental abuse; all abuse came in the form of peers bullying him, or teachers never understanding that he wasn't trying to antagonize them when he was in school  There are times that he still deals with agitation about something we ask him to do or express some sort of emotion that he isn't "reading" right, but he told me today that he's trying to understand when he does that so he can think it out better... .

I actually received "The Buddha and the Borderline" in the mail late last week, and my son grabbed it and is reading it (along with about 3 other BPD-type books!). He's about 3/4 of the way through, and really likes it  Smiling (click to insert in post)  He says that he hasn't gotten to the "Buddha part of it yet" but is finding it really helpful and interesting. He promised he will give me a "book report" after so I can share it here   I am reading Valerie Porr's "Overcoming Borderline Personality Disorder" right now; when we are both done we are going to trade books  Smiling (click to insert in post)  He absolutely loved Rachel Reiland's "Get Me Out of Here" and read it in an all-nighter a few weeks ago; I haven't had a chance to get to it yet, but he is encouraging me to read it. I have to say that our sharing this journey through his BPD treatment and recovery is making it easier for all of us in our family. I don't think it would work as well any other way... .

I truly wish that your daughter would be able to open her heart to realize that both of you need to work on this; her blaming only you for all her troubles will never work for her... . Too bad she can't see that... . I am so sorry that this is a journey you are taking alone 
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« Reply #42 on: June 26, 2013, 12:07:12 AM »

ahh, RR (sounds like a pirate eh?  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)) Thank you for your kind words. To know it is working for you makes me feel good   I am not exactly alone... . I do have my dh who is 'mis-stepping' beside me in this journey. I have to wait for him to catch up.

But I too have you all here 

Another question... . if you can answer it... . I have seen on UTube, people 'playing' games as part of NFT. Does your ds play games, do exercises, or what? ... . does the Neurologist design it for him or is it already included within the software program? ... .

You may have answered this and I have just not taken it in... . maybe you can't answer it... .

Vivek  
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« Reply #43 on: June 26, 2013, 01:24:51 PM »

Another question... . if you can answer it... . I have seen on UTube, people 'playing' games as part of NFT. Does your ds play games, do exercises, or what? ... . does the Neurologist design it for him or is it already included within the software program? ... .

Vivek   

Nope... . No computer games. He started out with "scenery" coupled with soothing music/sounds: Many different species of fish in the ocean; a lake with birds flying overhead and trees in the background; the change of seasons of one tree in a peaceful setting. He graduated to a documentary about migrational bird species with soothing music and minimal narration, then to movies. Everything she has picked for him to watch is keyed to the electrodes (?) and the computer to evoke some emotion to gauge the brain waves. The movies are very motivational; one was about a Dr. with Robin Williams, another was a Hallmark movie: Head of the Class, a true story about a guy who grew up with Tourette's syndrome and made it through many hardships of misunderstandings in his early lifetime (he wasn't diagnosed till he was like 12 or something, and at that time there was minimal understanding of treatment). He ended up making it through college, then getting certified to teach and then getting his Masters, and eventually getting the "New Teacher of the Year" award for his state (don't remember the state). All while majorly exhibiting his symptoms of tics that threw almost everyone "off" and having a very traumatic time of trying to fit into the world and finally get a job teaching elementary school. A VERY inspiring movie that my son reacted to emotionally and LOVED.  Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #44 on: June 26, 2013, 11:18:01 PM »

ta 
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« Reply #45 on: July 04, 2013, 03:05:39 PM »

You're welcome, Vivek   Smiling (click to insert in post)  He really likes these movies (he's seen quite a few of them now; every one of them is inspirational: someone has a disability or issue, and in the end they "make good.". The one with Robin Williams was "Patch Adams" I found out, and he saw recently the one about the young girl who had an arm chewed off by a shark, but continued surfing anyway. For some reason his NF T found that inspirational movies work better with the Cignet Program of Neurofeedback, and that's what she uses. She told me that she does use games, but with kids (with ADD or Autism Spectrum issues), or in one case, a teenaged Autistic boy who always wants to bring DVDs of his own that have too much violence in them for the low-frequency Cignet Program to work correctly. She gently put a stop to that... .

In the spirit of the original theme of this thread, something happened today that I almost messed up by not remembering to constantly validate: Today being the 4th of July, my dBPDs36 was hoping to be able to take it easy (and I would've liked to, too!), but my "yard-work-aholic" Husband was gung ho with his mid-week day off from work, and he had all sorts of things to do to get our 2 Acre yard in shape. He let my son sleep late, since he needed the riding mower to hitch to a cart for him to drag big tree branches over the bank after he pruned many overgrown trees. S36 was supposed to mow the lawn (which he is now doing as I type), but H let him off the hook early in the day so he could use the mower, himself, as I said.

Anyhow, getting used to taking it easy, when my H called for S36 to come out a couple hours ago to help load big branches and do some other yard work before mowing the lawn, my S36 was pretty grouchy preparing for the rest of the day doing work outside. Of course my first inclination was to snap at him: "What's the problem? You've taken it easy all day, and are lucky enough to have a late start, and Dad is working so hard that the least you can do is help him cheerfully!" Anyone on this site reading this will have a great idea how that would've worked out!

Well, something clicked in my brain before I uttered a word, and I remembered the mantra of this thread: "Need to remember to be constantly validating!" (take my word for it, I absolutely have to tell myself this all the time!), and I said instead as he started grumpily heading out the door: "I know just how you feel having to go outside to work when you don't want to... . I feel the same way sometimes!" And with that, he nodded resignedly and has been helping my H this afternoon and is now mowing a very large yard, navigating many trees, flower gardens, vegetable gardens and a 1/3 Acre pond! It's an art, I have to say, and though my H doesn't mind doing it, my S36? Not so much... .

Conflict averted, H happy, S36 semi-cheerfully mowing the lawn, and me getting ready to put country-style spareribs on the grill. Have a good 4th of July everyone!  Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #46 on: July 04, 2013, 05:25:11 PM »

So interesting, Rapt Reader.  The months before my son died, he had me watch Soul Surfer with him at least 5 times and I know he watched that movie over and over again.  He loved the hymn they sang in the outdoor church!  He played it over and over again, probably dozens of times.  Patch Adams was another one and there were many more, I just can't remember the titles.  They were all about the human condition that unites us all. 

The info about neurofeedback is fascinating.

I love your validation.  It works so well and is helping your son recognize his feelings.  A wonderful, inspiring story, Rapt Reader.

Thank you.

Reality

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« Reply #47 on: July 06, 2013, 09:38:46 AM »

Thank you, Reality, for your kind words... . It seems like your son shared the artistic, creative and sensitive qualities that my own son has. The world is sometimes a confusing, cruel place for people like them, and trying to find a way to navigate it safely is such a traumatic experience.

I like how reflective and honest you are, and I'm wondering if there is any advice you can give me? My son is recovering, but is still himself--BPD and all!--and as much as I am trying to learn how he feels, sometimes he's an enigma to me. He's living at home, and starting to fit into our world better (which is a wonderful, happy thing!), but right now he is still leery of the world in general. Stays close to home where he is safe right now... . Maybe it will just take time; the problem with opiates is always something he fears will recur, and I think he is "nesting" with us as protection. I'm sure it will pass; the Therapists he sees tell us so. I'm just rambling now; it is my greatest fear I guess.

Thanks for checking in on this thread; I always value your input   
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« Reply #48 on: July 06, 2013, 06:56:51 PM »

Rapt Reader,

May your wonderful son find one true good friend, who sees his gifts and supports his steps, just as he will surely do the same!

Maybe this wish has already been granted!

I mean, of course, other than you and your husband.

Reality
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« Reply #49 on: July 07, 2013, 07:02:22 PM »

Rapt Reader,

May your wonderful son find one true good friend, who sees his gifts and supports his steps, just as he will surely do the same!

Maybe this wish has already been granted!

I mean, of course, other than you and your husband.

Reality

Wow, Reality... . I truly think you hit the nail on the head! Yes! That is exactly what he needs... . He is doing so well right now with his sobriety and learning about his issues, and realizing what in the past has caused his troubles. But, I see a melancholy in him (not depression so much, so that is good), because he is 36 years old and he feels he has nothing, and he can't see how he can accomplish what he needs to, to live a good life. Now, as you know, my H and I know he is a talented, wonderful person, but at this point his self-image and self-esteem still hasn't recovered. So many years of bullying, trauma, and people not understanding him has made him uncertain of himself and his abilities... . even those artistic, creative abilities that are so unique to him and wonderful that everyone who sees his work will praise him. He doesn't even hear it... .

You are very insightful, and from your keyboard to God's ears 

  Rapt Reader
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« Reply #50 on: July 17, 2013, 10:16:31 PM »

I just want to give an update. Today made my son's 3rd month of NFT; he is now going every Wednesday and Saturday, but going for 2 (one hour) sessions per day. Still intensive, but spread out more. He's been on this schedule now for 3 weeks; he, his T and I discuss his sessions comprehensively to make sure his progress is not slowed down by going twice/week. If at any time any of us feels that he needs to go more often or for more sessions, then we can easily go back to that. But, for now, he feels he's doing well and so do his T and I (and my husband, and his Outpatient T, and his Psychiatrist). In fact, he had an appointment with his Psych just yesterday, and once again Psych came out with my son afterwards beaming and patting my son on the back, and shaking his hand, and telling him how "very well!" he is doing  Smiling (click to insert in post)

My son is now almost 5 months clean and sober. His NF T is still working diligently to help him with that, as is the OP T and Psych. After his last 2 ("normal" rehabs, he was already starting to relapse here and there before the 4th month point; the ONLY difference now is the addition of the NFT to his recovery. Well, that and the fact that I've become a member here and I faithfully apply everything I've learned here since he got out of the Dual Diagnosis Center in April. I always need to remember to be constantly validating~~still! He is still BPD, but less and less each day... . Really! He knows it, too, and apologizes when he surprises himself with BPD behavior. He reads his books about BPD religiously, and we discuss his books, my books, and the books we trade off and read together... .

My son was the brightest, smartest, most artistic and creative kid in the universe until the very first day of Kindergarten... . He was a cartoonist since age 3, an artist as soon as he could hold a crayon, and wanted to be a movie producer since age 4. He left the house that morning (undiagnosed ADD and all!) all excited and confident waiting for the bus to take him to the first day of school (he'd never been to pre-school). He came back that same day, head down, trudging slowly down the driveway back to the house with his brand-new prized He-Man back-pack dragging on the gravel behind him. He was beaten down and his self-esteem had inexplicably (to his Dad & I) plummeted. And it had stayed that way for 31 years... .

A couple of days ago he had a breakthrough: He told me that, that day--the first day of Kindergarten--was the day that he "lost himself." He went to school as an artist, writer, future movie producer; and no one in school saw that in him. The teacher got angry when he daydreamed out the window, didn't get his work done in time; got lost in the hall on the way to the Library, boy's room, and cafeteria. He was the last kid--all alone--on the swing set when recess was over and everyone else was in class. The other kids laughed at him, teased him, bullied him. He came home that day not knowing anymore who he was; if he wasn't the smartest, brightest, most creative artist that his parents and family members had ever met--then who was he? Was he the lazy, crazy, stupid kid everyone in school thought he was? In 1982 where we live no one ever heard of ADD; and it wouldn't be until 1999 that he was finally diagnosed with it. After all the BPD damage was done... .

He has a lot of work to do, to get back that confidence he had when he was 5 and walking excitedly down the driveway on his way to his first day of Kindergarten... . But now, I see the light in his eyes again: my 5 year old son is in there, happily trying to coax his 36 year-old self to be that artist, writer, movie producer... . And for the first time in 31 years, he is starting to find himself again. 









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« Reply #51 on: July 17, 2013, 11:03:36 PM »

thank you RR. I am so happy for you, your son, your family. I must be vulnerable today, the tears are falling freely for you, I think I should be standing up and calling out YES! nevermind, tears will have to do.

lots of love to you and yours,

Vivek    
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« Reply #52 on: July 18, 2013, 10:08:08 AM »

rapt reader  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

So much joy for you and your ds in my  . You are both moving together is such a hopeful direction with new awareness every week. Hoping this processing of these old hurts builds the courage needed to keep moving in our tough world.

I am beginning to acknowledge these same truths with my dd27. she is slowly opening her heart to some past hurts, and staying safe with this. Praying for her intake at the intensive new program tomorrow to be a start of something good for her. She has persevered waiting for a month to get to this point. Maybe NF T will be in her future for the ADD and NLD that plagues her from a very early age.

Constantly validating - or making repairs for invalidating actions.

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« Reply #53 on: July 18, 2013, 12:59:35 PM »

Hi, Vivek    and thanks for your heartfelt well wishes and comments... . I pray that you and your daughter get to the place where you can at least communicate happily, and that she will start on the road to recovery... . Hang in there, have faith in your BPD toolbox, and keep learning. When the time comes for you to use your talents you will be ready! You know way more than I do, so apparently the universe is preparing you for great things... .

Thank you, qcarolr, for your well wishes also... . Your attitude with your daughter is good; I'm so hopeful that her stay in this next program is life-changing for her. We never know the outcome of circumstances that seem so scary in the beginning, but then have the potential to end up happily. "Constantly validating - or making repairs for invalidating actions." Yes! That is exactly what we are here for and able to do... . That is in our control  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

My son has told me that the validation he received at home for his talents and personality traits were always fine when he was young; it was the invalidation (and he used that word) of who he was and the talents he had all throughout his school years, starting that first day of K, that did the damage to his psyche. There's another thing he and I have talked about too... . As the oldest child with a brother 2 years younger, he'd always at least had that "older, wiser, respected brother" image gifted to him by a younger brother who idolized him for the first 5 years of his life. But, as fate would have it, once younger brother started Kindergarten himself, he realized quickly that he and his friends--and every other kid he saw around him--were the "normal" ones, and that his older, talented ADD brother was "lesser." By the time my BPD son was 7, the loss of even that role of esteemed older brother was lost to him. And that invalidation of his self-image, combined with the contempt of his younger brother, has caused the breach between them, that continues on to this day... . A double invalidation whammy that sealed his fate by the age of 7.

Now that these things are coming to light--and at this point I have been able to give bits of information to my younger son, so he can see what's been going on from a different view--both sons are starting to get their "aha!" moments, and I am actually hopeful they will eventually fully reconcile. They are "talking" (if you count email cards and notes), and that in and of itself is major with these 2. Even my uBPD DIL (younger son's wife) is softening up her attitude about BPD son, and I can foresee for the first time in years a reconciliation between the 2 of them, too... . Younger son & DIL have recently had their own infant, and that is changing their attitude and understanding of BPD son. Nothing like a first child to open one's mind to the peculiarities of life  

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« Reply #54 on: July 24, 2013, 07:07:19 PM »

Another update 

Today on our way to my son's Neurofeedback session he told me that he has finished reading "The Buddha & the Borderline" by Kiera Van Gelder. He said that he really liked it, and got a lot from it. He liked it as much as he liked "Get Me Out of Here" by Rachel Reiland. He said that he saw himself in both books, but the most helpful thing for him was that in both books he saw his old girlfriend; the girl who he now believes is BPD (high-functioning). That relationship was the "one" for him; his soulmate as far as he was concerned. It lasted about 2 years with several break-ups, and only ended for good a little more than a year ago. He has been torn up over her for so long--and the trauma of her, the r/s, the break-up & his hope that they would somehow get back together, had interfered with his recovery from drug addiction the last 2 times he went to the "normal" rehabs (she was his "drug buddy".

Now, what is interesting, is that this recovery process is going so well this time and I've been attributing this success to:

1). The Dual Diagnosis Center (instead of regular rehab) & the new BPD diagnosis

2). The addition of Neurofeedback Therapy to his OP and Psych Therapies

3). My finding this website and all the tools we've been using learned here

Now, I believe I have to add another: 4). His reading of these 2 books and finally getting a good understanding of his BPD soulmate girlfriend, so that he can move on in the knowledge that it never would have worked out.

I learn something new every day    Now, he told me that he recommends both of these books to people with BPD and also their loved ones and family members. He thinks that the first one for a family member to read would be "The Buddha & the Borderline" and that "Get Me Out of Here" should be read next. He feels that the first would be less "hard-core" a read, and a good preparation for Rachel's story.

So, there you go... . I promised a "book report" from my son, and I was able to give you one!    I haven't read either book yet (I'm still reading "Overcoming Borderline Personality Disorder" by Valerie Porr, and finding it fascinating and very helpful. I'm taking my time, soaking up every word!), but I will now that he's finished "The Buddha" one (since he advised me early on to wait, and read it first... . ). Thanks to everyone for being interested in my son's story... .
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« Reply #55 on: July 25, 2013, 12:49:15 AM »

Thanks RR, I really like your ds! Such a sensitive young man 

The Buddha book was wonderful. The author Keira can be seen on a video documentary:

Back from the Edge

Which is a 48 minute program about BPD based on interviews with recovered BPD people. An excellent view. And it has great graphics explain about the neural pathways explanation for BPD.

Looks like I have to read Rachel's book too 

Vivek    
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« Reply #56 on: July 25, 2013, 08:33:25 PM »

Thanks RR, I really like your ds! Such a sensitive young man  Smiling (click to insert in post)


Looks like I have to read Rachel's book too 

Vivek    

Well, he does recommend it very highly to parents of BPD children    He says it will help to understand someone with BPD--especially females, so in that case it's right up your alley!

Thank you so much for the link to that video; I told him about it and we are both planning on watching it. You've always got a rabbit up your sleeve, no matter what the subject is! Amazing   You know more about BPD than most of the books I've been reading, and I always learn so much from your posts... . Thanks!

I mentioned way up this thread somewhere that the Neurofeedback Therapist for my son was going to upgrade her equipment to the newest hardware and software available for the Cignet Program. Well, she just got it all in and set up, and yesterday (his last appointment) was the first time she used it, and he was her first patient she used it on. I asked him if it felt any different, and he thought about it and said "I actually do think so... . " I really don't know if he would know that so fast, but he has another appointment tomorrow (Friday; he usually goes on Saturdays, but this weekend we are busy) and he's going to pay more attention to how it all is working and he'll let me know if it really does feel "different."

All I know about the upgraded system is that the frequencies are lower (I believe) and more efficient, and that it is supposed to work better and he should see his recovery (and especially with his drug addiction weaknesses) go at an enhanced clip. He is still clean and sober (almost 5 months now!), and he isn't in any trouble with it, but he is still leery of going out in the "cold, cruel world" because of all the triggers and his fears of relapse. He's a good guy, and is the most verbal, creative, thoughtful and helpful than he's been in years, but is still cautious and lacks self-esteem. His NF Therapist knows all this and is doing what she can to help him with all of that. He's a lucky guy... .  

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« Reply #57 on: July 26, 2013, 02:27:32 AM »

RR: aw shucks, (she says stabbing toe into the ground and putting finger in corner of mouth  ) thanks   . (turns away big smile on face, skips down the road, arms swinging  )

Tell me, how much longer does she think? Any idea?

Vivek    
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« Reply #58 on: July 26, 2013, 02:35:24 PM »

Tell me, how much longer does she think? Any idea?

Vivek ... . First of all, glad I made you so happy    And second, to answer your question, we do have a general idea of how much longer he will be in NFT. Today made his 63rd "Wake-State" Session, and we are going for at least 80 of those; they are being geared to his ADD/Anxiety/BPD symptoms and behaviors. Since he has so many DXes, 80 may do it, and in the end he may feel that he will need more of those Sessions.

To deal with the drug addiction issues, in order to prevent a relapse, she is suggesting at least 30 ":)eep State" Sessions. As of today, he has had 14 of those. So, there are at least 16 more to go of Deep States, and 17 more to go of Wake States. My son, the Therapist, and my Husband & I are all OK about this; he is doing so well that we don't want to stop until he's ready. We are leaving his duration up to him after the prescribed sessions; he is being realistic and open-minded and eager to be in "remission" (his words), and we don't want to discourage him.

He found out more about the new, upgraded equipment that she is now using with him. He said that the frequencies are more "fine-tuned" with lower low frequencies and higher high frequencies, and more options in between. The new program has some more options with the games (which he never did before; he moved from images with sounds to movies--the latest being "'Fly Away Home", and today he took advantage of a brand new one that came with the new upgrade: a painting program where he did artwork using a mouse. He truly loved it (he is, after all, an artist), and is planning on doing it more in the future. He likes the new upgrade, and is hoping it is fine-tuned enough to his needs where his recovery will progress faster.

He and I had a conversation last night about the differences between Men with BPD and other mental illnesses, and Women with these problems. He told me that in his experience in the first 2 "normal" Rehabs and again in the most recent stay at the Dual Diagnosis Center (all of which were co-ed), and also in his outside life with the crew of misfits he used to hang out with, he thinks that BPD, etc. effect men and women differently. Now, this is just my son's opinions, and neither of us are in the medical profession, etc., so it is not gospel truth or anything but just his opinion... .

My son believes that Men with BPD and other mental health issues tend to minimize the traumas, abuse, victimization, etc. that they have been through. Even with bona fide real past abuses, the men he's met in his BPD travels (in the outside world and Rehab world) don't want to be thought of as "victims" in any way; they will minimize the beatings they received from their parents, the bullying in school, the mental or emotional abuses they received. They shrug them off as "no big deal; just a part of life... . It's just the way life is for me; it's just how the past was." Not wanting the "victim" label, they would rather be thought of as "bada$$es" to explain the troubles they've gotten into as a result of their pasts and BPD, etc.

The Women he's observed with these problems (and again, it's just his observations), seemed to him to be more willing to embrace the "victim" label to explain away their problems and troubles and bad behavior. He said that the women will tell their stories with themselves being victimized over and over again; he's sure that most of them were victimized, but he said that some had turned things into victimization, in order to try to justify or understand why they are the way they are, or do what they do. He said he always felt that the Women couldn't explain their problems without seeing themselves as victims; that having mental health problems seemed hard for them to admit to. They'd rather blame their troubles on parents or caregivers, teachers, siblings, etc. rather than accept that they had some sort of mental health issue. Where the Men seemed to minimize their own victimization, the Women seemed to maximize it.

This is just food for thought; whether it helps you to understand your daughter or not, I don't know... . But it does explain my son to me. His lack of blame for anyone, but his own "stupidity, laziness, craziness, badness" for his troubles has always amazed me... . but, like the Women, he also did not want to admit to a mental health issue; he'd rather have been thought of as a "bada$$" than mentally deficient. Now, reading all the stories here on this site, I do know that there are exceptions to this; plenty of Men seem to blame their parents, wives, etc. and plenty of Women seem to want to understand their mental health issues and are willing to believe they have a problem. But my son says this is what his experience has been... .

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« Reply #59 on: July 26, 2013, 05:47:47 PM »

RR that's so interesting. And logical when you think about it... . but of course, I never had looked at it that way.

Gender stereotyping is a powerful thing isn't it? Women as 'victims' is a reflection of their relative powerlessness in society. Men as 'badass' is a reflection of their role as protectors - even though they are often the perpetrators of violence. It is a complex world we live in. 

I am glad you have a sense of where you are going with the length of time involved. I am glad that this is seen as 'remission' not yet recovery.

It is truly like a miracle to read about and I shake my head in disbelief and wonder. I am so happy for you all.

Thanks too for the heads up on the software involved. These sort of details are important I think for those of us able to investigate neurofeedback.

Cheers,

Vivek  
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