more time with kids doesnt mean more time

[whirlpoollife]

x2b h (uNPD BPD sociopath) convinced the GAL that he wanted more time with kids. S14 and D12 also told the GAL they wanted more time with dad. ( I feel much influenced by h.  They still spy on me , lie to me, cover for h but not as bad as it was  ) It was 64/36 now 57/43. My L fought to keep it from 50/50.  My opinion ... . h did not want to pay c/s  and taking the kids away from me is his control and its hurts me)  Over a month ago was first c/s hearing. I filed for divorce over a year ago, separated eight months. H paid some, very little amount, in support during those eight months. since two weeks before the c/s hearing he has not paid support. My L said he does have till the end of this month to do so. H has not paid the medical ins premium for last month. 

When we were first separated, kids on his time, he worked and left the kids ad they covered for him. I got first right of refusal, with him having to give me ahead of time notice, but he did not follow it. He knows I now work when kids are on his time or I go out to wherever. Could not do either in the years with him and I enjoy both now. 

I get texts from him now making up some story about he had to go into work and can I watch kids. He knows he's going to work but makes it like he didn't know. so they spend the overnight with him but I would get them during the day with no set time for pick up (in past he would pick up kids 11 pm with pick up time  6pm)  I felt bad saying no the first time but that' s what he and the kids wanted. They fought me for it.  He does this now  each time he  has kids.  I get full of anxiety when I see a text from him. I feel scared saying no because I don't know how he will get even with me. (he was very vindictative for 27 yrs of marriage). At the same I don't feel I have to drop my plans/work to help him. A new boundry for me.  His last text was saying " now that this is the new normal, let me know your plans on drop off"  How do I respond to this?

[sfbayjed]

There may not be anything you can do that will change things immediately.  but there are some things you should be doing. First cooperate with him, have the kids with you as much as possible.  Get a calendar or a planner and use two highlighters different colors, one for your time, one for his. and keep track how much actual time the kids are spending with each of you.  The calendar will be a great visual aide if you are attempting to modify custody in the future.

[livednlearned]

I think there are two things.

One is your new boundary and wanting to enforce that boundary, which is great. We don't often talk about this, but with boundaries come costs. When you're a non leaving a long marriage with an abuser, the cost of setting a boundary is usually worth it, because it's a milestone that says you're getting healthier and stronger after being the opposite for a long, long time. But you have to decide where you want to draw the line with your boundary, and at what point the pay off ends up hurting you.

Because like sfbayjed mentions, you can use this to your legal advantage. Document every single time he leaves the kids with you when it's his time, and how much lead time he gives you. Also, if you express great delight and enthusiasm about having the kids, he might stop doing it so much. If your longterm goal is to get your time back, then maybe adjust how you deal with him in the short term. If your goal is to get the kids, say yes when he offers, and document the hell out of it.

Also, on a side note -- the alienation stuff is clearly an issue. Saying yes to them means they spend more time with you, which means less time being poisoned. And it also means he can't use your refusal against you.

It will be super hard for a while, but I do think it kind of settles into a predictable form of crazy that gets easier to navigate. It's psychologically taxing and emotionally challenging, and yet like anything hard in life, you'll get better at managing him with time and practice.

[whirlpoollife]

Thank you LnL and sfbayjed for your advice. I do have a calendar and journel. However I did not put the time of day for H's request I will now.

I found work that conforms to the time I don't have kids. So it is not in my best interest to call off at a last minute. Work is so good for me mentally too.

As for other plans of going out it is minimal , so I can cancel them.  its just that  I feel like a doormat again and controlled  I don't want to have to tell him my work schedule so he then knows when  I am or not at home.

There was just recently a custody hearing so I don't anticipate one in the near future. The documents that I did have , the calendars, journals, copies of his texts, his delays, helped me from loosing to 50/50 which H wanted. It showed his pattern of behavior. So for anyone new in this... . keep documenting.

[whirlpoollife]

Kids are with me this weekend. H texts me many times to tell me he is not working for four days, wants to know if I'm working and when because he wants  kids. ( I m not working this weekend)  But on his weekends he works and wants to know if I m working or not to take kids.

[livednlearned]

Kids are with me this weekend. H texts me many times to tell me he is not working for four days, wants to know if I'm working and when because he wants  kids. ( I m not working this weekend)  But on his weekends he works and wants to know if I m working or not to take kids.

He wants kids when they are with you on your time?

[whirlpoollife]

Ok H doesn't say he "wants" kids but every time they are with me he texts to tell me that if I am working or go out for whatever reason he has first right of having the kids and that he is home and available to get them.    And if they are at a friends house on my time,  where am I?   Last year I have asked the kids if he was working all day... . only answer I would get back from them is "I don't know".   so I learned/adapted not to worry about if he was working or not and I don't ask kids and I don't ask H. When he has kids, he always seems to have an emergency to go to work.  Knowing him, he is jealous of my time with kids and very jealous of my job. He doesn't have the control he once had. I'm rambling now.

[ForeverDad]

Right of First Refusal (ROFR) is probably what he's demanding.  But if you have a parenting time order and it doesn't state that, then his demands are weak for now.  Probably best not to be informative to stbex or then the next time you two are in court he might want ROFR added.  Also, the length of time it might be triggered is also flexible.  I had ROFR for a few years and it was was set at 5 hours.  For some people, that's too long, for me it was too short and helped my ex more than it helped me.

[whirlpoollife]

Yes FD its ROFR.  It was in order last year and he ignored it because it was worded just for the mother.  Its in current order, worded now for both parents. Its for when kids are alone for more than 3 hours.   

Another topic but a new thread not needed, in future I have a vacation week. He choose his vacation week  immediatly after mine. Kids and I will get back late on my last night. He wants kids at midnight  that night. He orginally wanted them at 10 pm. I said that's imposible. So do I make kids unpack and repack in a matter of minutes to get them to him. Or do I practice using my backbone and tell him he wiill get kids when they are ready... . which might be 3 am or in the morning. 

[Ishenuts]

Whirlpoolife - I am dealing with the same 2 issues. My ROFR is 5 hours. My children are 10.8 yo twins. During the summer he works 9+ hours. He hires a babysitter, but comes home at lunch time so they are not with the babysitter for 5 consecutive hours - no, 4 1/2 hours before and 4 1/2 hours after his lunch break! My L wants to go back to court. I think I might.

Re: vacation, what is your normal transfer time? Is it Sat morning? Why does he want them at 10 pm? If so, that's when I'd get them to him. Do you really want to make the poor kids go to him at 3am?

This year, my vacation is Sat-Sat, starting 7/20. His vacation is Sat-Sat, starting 7/27. Our normal transfer time is 8 am Sat morning. He asked if he could have the children Friday night, 7/26 at 9 pm, to maximize their vacation time (with him) by taking an earlier flight Sat morning, which would cut my vacation short! So apparently only his vacation was worth maximizing? (a little backround - he's made early flights in the past without telling me, thereby forcing me to give up the children early, cutting into my parenting time. The parental coordinator said I should be flexible, and allow it. BS! I had to go to the GAL to get him to stop this covert practice. When I asked him to do it for one of my vacations he fought it vigorously) So, for this upcoming vacation I said, "OK, but I want them Friday night 8/2 by 9 pm" He said, "Fine. I'll look into return flights to get them home by then." So he gives me 3 flight choices - one getting home by 6 pm, one home by 11:30pm, and one home by 1:45am Sat. Which one did I want him to book? I said, "If you want to abide by our agreement of 9 pm 8/2 you'll have to take the one getting home at 6 pm" He freaked, and said, " FORGET IT! I'll just get them at 8 am Sat 7/27 if you won't compromise!" Ok. Works for me!

Never a dull moment with a pwBD - unfortunately! Good luck!

[livednlearned]

Yes FD its ROFR.  It was in order last year and he ignored it because it was worded just for the mother.  Its in current order, worded now for both parents. Its for when kids are alone for more than 3 hours.   

Another topic but a new thread not needed, in future I have a vacation week. He choose his vacation week  immediatly after mine. Kids and I will get back late on my last night. He wants kids at midnight  that night. He orginally wanted them at 10 pm. I said that's imposible. So do I make kids unpack and repack in a matter of minutes to get them to him. Or do I practice using my backbone and tell him he wiill get kids when they are ready... . which might be 3 am or in the morning. 

Wow. That just gets me angry thinking about it. That he would A) insist on having his vacation week right after yours and B) that he would make the kids start their time with him at midnight. Sorry you have to deal with this.   

After a while, I think you'll get a sense of how your court professionals respond to this kind of thing. My judge would think he was being a jerk, not just to you, but to the kids. Common sense should prevail, not the exact minute of his parental time.

Could you write an email to him saying:

Kids and I are returning at X:XXpm. I will drop them off at your place in the morning so they can get a good night's rest.

If you are traveling by plane, there's a 50/50 chance it won't arrive on time, and you don't want him to hold you accountable for something entirely out of your control.

[whirlpoollife]

After landing, I got a text from H that he did  not want kids at midnight, the start date of his vacation. So I had kids till the following night, late.  While away he texted everyday to tell me to tell the kids to call him. They each had cell phones and a land line phone to call him whenever and vs versa. Knowing him, it was like he was purposely doing that so I don't forget he was not with us.  I did not respond to his texts.

[livednlearned]

After landing, I got a text from H that he did  not want kids at midnight, the start date of his vacation. So I had kids till the following night, late.  While away he texted everyday to tell me to tell the kids to call him. They each had cell phones and a land line phone to call him whenever and vs versa. Knowing him, it was like he was purposely doing that so I don't forget he was not with us.  I did not respond to his texts.

Good for you! That's a good boundary -- not responding, and even important, being able to figure out when to respond and when not to. 

[GaGrl]

This is my evil twin talking... . I'd be tempted to transfer the kids at the 10 PM time with their dirty vacation clothes still packed in their suitcases.

[ForeverDad]

A midnight or wee hours of the morning exchange sounds unreasonable, especially for young children, unless there are exceptional circumstances.  In my county's standard guideline schedule, all holidays are scheduled no earlier than 9 am and no later than 9 pm.  Of course you can agree to other times - 11 pm or 7 am may be late or early but appropriate sometimes for the circumstances - but if a requested/pressured/demanded exchange hour is unreasonable you can require it to be a little earlier in the evening or later in the morning.  IMO

[livednlearned]

Next time he does this -- and changing plans at the last minute is classic narcissism -- remind him that he already did that and was unable to manage that schedule, therefore you will be exchanging the kids at a reasonable hour, one that is better for the kids.

[GaGrl]

What is the childrens' bedtime(s)?  Can you set/follow a guideline that the children will not be exchanged after bedtime or prior to their usual waking hour?

[whirlpoollife]

Last weekend, kids with h, I had work.

He texts asking if I want kids because he has to work late.

I could not call off work to take kids

This weekend, kids with me, no work for me.

He texts telling me he is not working and can take kids if I choose to work.

(I can't tell my employer I choose to work today)

A pattern has been made by pd h.

I want to tell him that  what he is doing is so obvious but if I do he will explode back to me with continous texts. I get anxiety ,still ,reading his texts and spend time thinking of the shortest response back . 

[Ishenuts]

Whirlpoolife - What is he trying to do? Does he think you have to "make up time" because he offered them to you.

Can't you just send him an email/text stating that you are aware of the ROFR and intend to always comply, and then insert the exact wording of the ROFR in your court order? Every time he sends one of his emails, just copy/paste the wording and send it back to him?

If your ROFR is written anything like mine, if either one of you is going to be away from the children for more than # hours (ours is 5), you must first offer the children to your ex before anyone else. The custodial parent contacts the other parent. The other parent doesn't contact the custodial parent and say , "Hey, I'm available"? Does he think you won't comply?

My uNPDexH has filed a motion to have our ROFR changed from 5 hours to 24 hours! Back ground - we've been divorced since 2/12. He NEVER asks me for any help - getting them to sporting events, picking them up from camp, etc. He has always used a paid babysitter. Until this summer, he was using his 20 yo nephew, so I cut his some slack because it was a relative that he was "helping out". This summer his nephew isn't around so he has started using a paid non-relative. Two weekends in a row he was away from our DD for 7 and 8 hours, respectively. He did not offer her to me first. I brought it up with our parental coordinator. He freaked out! He will need a babysitter Thurs & Fridays for 9 hours during August. Last year he would come home for lunch to make sure they weren't with a babysitter for > 5 hours at a clip. My L says the court will see right through that. So now, he's filing a motion to change it to 24 hours "to allow the children to have sleepovers" What the heck? Our children have had sleepovers at their friends houses forever. It has NEVER been an issue. I would never think to deprive our children of the opportunity for time with their friends because of ROFR! And if he wins this fight, then he will never have to ask for my help. (He said to me, in the PC parking lot, "You already get the children 50% of the time. You are not getting them 1 minute more!) He doesn't travel for business, which would require him to be away for > 24 hours. In his sick NPD mind, a babysitter is the same as being with their mom.

I know it's another example of his vengeful behavior. But I also wonder if he's positioning himself to introducing another woman into the mix, and with 24 hours he'd never have to offer them to me? I hope the court sees through this tactic - our hearing is 9/16 - conveniently after his August needs. We'll see!  

[scraps66]

Amazed that some have a ROFR clause that is actually followed by the BP.  Mine has never been followed.  As soon as she got a bf, the kids were with him anytime she had to work on her weekends.

[whirlpoollife]

When we were first seperated towards end of last year , there was no ROFR. He worked Saturdays and never once let the kids be with me. At a first custody conference I got a ROFR. He never once complied. Last May he had it put in the court order for him also. At the same time I got work that involves nights and weekends. He knows that as it was brought up at the support hearings.  When I'm at work he offers the kids to me. This might pass over as he goes OCD on a matter and eventually it eases.  His being nice always had an agenda so he's not being nice from the bottom of his heart. 

It was through text not email. I did not respond.  ( I'm worn out from him and have my own words of response in my thoughts) I said nothing to kids either.

Ishenuts , your ex is just keeping your kids from you.  Like a spoiled brat.  The 24 hr is nuts. In other words, you would have no ROFR.  With pwPD I wonder if its worth it. (Maybe that's what my h or your h wants?) Careful of the way far out wants so you compromise to what they actually want

[ForeverDad]

We had ROFR and I actually did get my an extra day or two here and there.  I think one year I got as much as 20 extra days.  But of course the GAL and others didn't see that as basis for us to adjust our official parenting schedule.

The problem I had with ROFR was that I have a regular 5 days a week job.  I can't just set my own schedule and cut back my work whenever.  However my ex has always worked an irregular schedule, she's chosen those types of work.  So if she didn't want to do ROFR, she just didn't work and stayed with our child, especially in the early years of separation & divorce, she worked comparatively little.

My ROFR was 5 hours.  Sometimes I wished it would have been 10 hours so I would have had time to get to work and back and still not have to inform my ex.  I was fortunate to think ahead and have the settlement include language that daycare was treated just the same as school, so it didn't trigger ROFR.

I've come to conclude that ROFR does not fit everyone's circumstances, just as a shorter ROFR is fine for some but for others it should be a bit longer.  When I got custody a few years ago, the new order dropped the ROFR clause.