Almost 2 years NC, and tonight an email from her (what to do)

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

Posted by: struggli

Insert Quote

Quote from: seeking balance on Yesterday at 07:49:49 PM

This is key:

Quote from: Slowlybutsurely on Yesterday at 01:20:55 PM

I have come a long long long way, and it feels good and liberating to have this final hurdle behind me--being able to be in touch without feeling devastated and hurt and wanting more. It shows me that I am truly healed.  I didn't need NC anymore. With that said, though, I don't plan to be in touch with her again. I don't want to or intend to be in contact with her, but I don't need walls around me to ensure that this is the case. I'm beyond her powers over me, and it's a good feeling.


Think of this as a master class in BPD Detachment once we have detached:

IF we are truly detached, using SET to validate the emotional response if our BPD reached out with an aplogy - this is not harmful any longer.  As long as we are clear in our boundaries, a simple validation of the apology doesn't hurt.

We cannot control others, only our own boundaries - so a next communication is likely not an apology, but the hook - this is where Not Responding or very bland response followed with DEARMAN of clearly describing the boundaries is actually more important.

NC is to let us heal up the wounds - not necessarily a fortress if we have changed and healed.

This leads to our CORE VALUES:

What is the "right" thing - but for me?  MY personal values for me as a human are to acknowledge and forgive - I do this not just with BPD, but anyone because it is a core value of who I am as a person.  If my ex apologized now, I would acknowledge the apology because it is about me and my core values - not for her.  Those struggling, can you see the difference?

The same values in ourselves that we like, that which was manipulated against us - are also traits that I do like in myself... . learning how to nurture and protect them is key - at least for me.

It is once we have detached and forgiven can we now align our core values of self with boundaries... . not all core values are the same - and that is absolutely 100% ok.  Everything has its time and place.



My core value is not to implement NC when someone seems to be extending a hand, no matter how subtle it may be.  It seems cruel to me.  But against my inclination, gut feeling, what feels natural for me, I have forced myself to ignore multiple texts from my ex.

Now, these texts didn't say "struggli, I made a mistake, I'm sorry, I want to make things better, I want you back".  But they were perhaps a window into opening dialogue that could have led somewhere.  Where?  I don't know.  Maybe just another sh-tty recycle.

So against what feels like my nature, I have forced myself to not respond to such things.  Call them hooks if you will.  I don't know.  I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but I am wondering how your suggestion of going with one's inner nature/core values would apply to those of us who have a rather difficult time implementing NC.

Sometimes we have to deny what feels right to us in order to save ourselves, don't we?  Or are you suggesting following one's core is only "safe" when one has completely detached?



I have to agree with Struggli on this one.  It was my Core Value of kindness, trusting, and in general believing in my exBPD, which turned out to be only lies, that got me into this spiral to begin with, so I don't believe that falling back on what is "Right"  is now going to be what is going to protect and help at a future point of where contact is received.  Once someone has done Everything possible that a person can do to hurt you, regardless of the illness or not, there is no 'help' or pity that I have to give them, or any wish to discuss anything with them that wastes another second of MY life,  they are gone to me like spit in the wind.

[ScotisGone74]

Posted by: struggli

Insert Quote

Quote from: seeking balance on Yesterday at 07:49:49 PM

This is key:

Quote from: Slowlybutsurely on Yesterday at 01:20:55 PM

I have come a long long long way, and it feels good and liberating to have this final hurdle behind me--being able to be in touch without feeling devastated and hurt and wanting more. It shows me that I am truly healed.  I didn't need NC anymore. With that said, though, I don't plan to be in touch with her again. I don't want to or intend to be in contact with her, but I don't need walls around me to ensure that this is the case. I'm beyond her powers over me, and it's a good feeling.


Think of this as a master class in BPD Detachment once we have detached:

IF we are truly detached, using SET to validate the emotional response if our BPD reached out with an aplogy - this is not harmful any longer.  As long as we are clear in our boundaries, a simple validation of the apology doesn't hurt.

We cannot control others, only our own boundaries - so a next communication is likely not an apology, but the hook - this is where Not Responding or very bland response followed with DEARMAN of clearly describing the boundaries is actually more important.

NC is to let us heal up the wounds - not necessarily a fortress if we have changed and healed.

This leads to our CORE VALUES:

What is the "right" thing - but for me?  MY personal values for me as a human are to acknowledge and forgive - I do this not just with BPD, but anyone because it is a core value of who I am as a person.  If my ex apologized now, I would acknowledge the apology because it is about me and my core values - not for her.  Those struggling, can you see the difference?

The same values in ourselves that we like, that which was manipulated against us - are also traits that I do like in myself... . learning how to nurture and protect them is key - at least for me.

It is once we have detached and forgiven can we now align our core values of self with boundaries... . not all core values are the same - and that is absolutely 100% ok.  Everything has its time and place.



My core value is not to implement NC when someone seems to be extending a hand, no matter how subtle it may be.  It seems cruel to me.  But against my inclination, gut feeling, what feels natural for me, I have forced myself to ignore multiple texts from my ex.

Now, these texts didn't say "struggli, I made a mistake, I'm sorry, I want to make things better, I want you back".  But they were perhaps a window into opening dialogue that could have led somewhere.  Where?  I don't know.  Maybe just another sh-tty recycle.

So against what feels like my nature, I have forced myself to not respond to such things.  Call them hooks if you will.  I don't know.  I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but I am wondering how your suggestion of going with one's inner nature/core values would apply to those of us who have a rather difficult time implementing NC.

Sometimes we have to deny what feels right to us in order to save ourselves, don't we?  Or are you suggesting following one's core is only "safe" when one has completely detached?



I have to agree with Struggli on this one.  It was my Core Value of kindness, trusting, and in general believing in my exBPD, which turned out to be only lies, that got me into this spiral to begin with, so I don't believe that falling back on what is "Right"  is now going to be what is going to protect and help at a future point of where contact is received.  Once someone has done Everything possible that a person can do to hurt you, regardless of the illness or not, there is no 'help' or pity that I have to give them, or any wish to discuss anything with them that wastes another second of MY life,  they are gone to me like spit in the wind.

[jollygreen]

scotisgone, I like how you talk about your core values.  They are really important to stick by.  I think if I would have stuck to my core values that I would've ended my relationship a lot sooner.  Over time they were broken down.  But now they help me to maintain NC.  My core values have helped me to put up that hypothetical wall.

[babyducks]

I would've done the same thing by acknowledging the amends.  I know that's what I would want for someone to do with me if I was the one making amends. 

.

Me too.  I would have also acknowledged the amends.  I would have viewed it as another step in letting go.  In this case, letting go of my anger.  My EX isn't a fire breathing dragon, she is a disordered person with some disturbed patterns of behavior.   And she doesn't have the power to hurt me anymore.   

[bb12]

NC only. You owe her no niceties.

I am 18 months out too and would not hesitate to keep nc going.

I now prefer it and know that any contact makes it worse

You have nothing to gain from contact but she does... Ego boost, more supply, mind twisting

The inky way to win is not to play

Bb12

[Newton]

mcc ... . this thread has really challenged me over the past 48 hours... .

My conclusion is that I agree with your choice and position... . and also the original poster... . (postee?    )... .

I don't believe that is sitting on the fence... . it is more a decision that what suits each of us is perfectly ok... . at that point in time... .

Slowlybutsurely feels comfortable with the response she gave... . and feels able to protect herself against any escalation of contact from her ex... . you and I would not take this path for our own reasons... . that is ok too... . I totally understand your need to protect you and your own from this negativity... . currently I would do the same.

We can only act upon the knowledge and understanding we have right now... .

[tailspin]

 

It seems to me that if you have to ask the question (what to do?) there may be a good reason the answer doesn't seem right.  There's no reason why not to (normally) reply with well wishes.  So why the confusion?  Because human nature tells us to not look back when someone hurts us and sometimes this means ignoring their contact... . not because you're still in the "no contact" safety mode... . but because no contact is still the best course of action for YOU. 

From my experience, contact after a lengthy period of time from our expwBPD isn't the same thing as being contacted by a long lost friend who isn't mentally ill.  The motivation is different and our decision to reply or not should consider why they've attempted contact after so long.  We are always one step away from being the trigger for their illness.  Why take the risk?  Why make the effort?   Sure, we may be stronger now, but this doesn't mean we should throw ourselves back onto the flames.  We aren't martyrs.

I think this question has less to do with "what to do" and more to do with having the satisfaction of an apology and contact again even after all this time.  You deserve this satisfaction slowlybutsurely. Just don't get sucked back into the game.

tailspin

[Slowlybutsurely]

Hi All,

I want to make something clear, since it came up in a post above.

My ex's apology was a total half-baked stilted not in keeping with the past "amends." Just to be clear. Her behavior was off the charts in the relationship, and she fit every thing I've read about BPD. She behaved terribly.

In her amends, she says she was drinking when I met her, and now she doesn't, and she's sorry for any ups and downs in her emotions caused by the drinking. Okay. Ups and downs? That doesn't quite cover it, and I have 500 single spaced journal entries (in Word) to prove it. I know, my fault for putting up with it. And Drinking? I never smelled alcohol on her and saw no signs whatsoever of drinking. If anything, I was the lush in the relationship, as I'd hit the bottle (more than normal, which isn't much) to deal with the crazy woman. So, if you can imagine your ex apologizing in this manner, you'll understand that it wasn't a grand apology or amends in any real sense. And that's typical. I wouldn't expect anything different from her. No skin off my back at this point to reply to her nicely and briefly, though. I am OVER her.

No other contact from her since, and my guess at this point is that she won't contact me again.

I am so glad to be done with her, guys. So glad. Done.

[Surnia]

My conclusion is that I agree with your choice and position... . and also the original poster... . (postee?    )... .

I don't believe that is sitting on the fence... . it is more a decision that what suits each of us is perfectly ok... . at that point in time... .

In the beginning of a separation NC is often very important, often for both sides. Later it can be different. And one of the goal here can be to find out, what suits the best for each of us. 

[Neverknow]

Do not reply.

At all.

Stay NC.

It will only lead to you being hurt in the end.

That is the one outcome to any re-engagement that is successful in its attempt.

You will be hurt in the end.

Far worse then before.

That is what happened to me after I allowed my exUBPDgf back into my life.

This.

Mt x BPD w just contacted me out of the blue last week (after a year of NC).  I didn't recognize the number and answered it.  Friendly, but five different lies from her before I could get off the phone.  She has tried to call or text almost every day since.  I'm getting ready to change my number as I like my life without her in it.

[Phoenix.Rising]

The battle is not with the pwBPD.  The battle is with ourselves.  

There is no right or wrong answer to the question. 

A pwBPD has no more power over me than a butterfly, if I don't allow it.

[Learning_curve74]

I decided to (and just did) send her a brief but kind and affirmative email in reply. Nothing that would invite further conversation, but all very nice. It would have weighed on me not to respond. Maybe this exchange will help me to let go of any remaining anger and resentment that I still have (I still have quite a bit, alas). If she writes again, I'll make sure not to let it continue.

I learned so much from this relationship, and I have changed so much, mostly in positive ways.

Sbs, not that it matters to you what I think, but I do think you did the right thing. But yeah, it doesn't matter to you what I think, and it's cool that you realize that. 

[numbr3]

I am 6 years post divorce and 4 yrs NC.  There is no way I will respond.  Yes, I did struggle with the thought I would appear rude but it is nothing compared to the way he treated me for 20 years.  I had mail from him with a piece of paper he thought would be important to me.  Why would I call- to say thanks for thinking of me?  Must have been lonely after breaking up with his girlfriend.

A year later I get a call from a detective saying x had accused me of trying to get him(x) in trouble.  After a small chat with the cop he thought maybe x was really guilty and crying out for help.  I could have opened the door by calling x and being mad, or sympathetic or whatever.  He has dug the pit he is in, it is not my doing and I can't change any of it.  I can't trust him, he will just manipulate and lie to me, twist the knife in deeper and maybe threaten me again.  Some days it just kills me but I have to stay NC no matter what.

[heartandwhole]

I think the key here is detachment.  NC ≠ detachment.  My experience is that it's a tool that can help us get there, as our brains and bodies recover from the stress of the relationship/breakup.

We focus on ourselves, we get help, we change our behavior, we grieve... .   Then, when we are truly detached, like Slowlybutsurely is conveying, contact from our ex partners is not a dangerous and scary thing.  There is a safety, a confidence there.  We realize that we gave our partners so much power over us, but not anymore.

It takes as long as it takes. And we will probably stumble a few times, thinking that we are detached (I did). And if NC forever is the healthiest choice for some of us, so be it. 

We are all individuals, and ultimately so is our healing journey.

[GreenMango]

I think the key here is detachment. NC ≠ detachment.

Spot on.

No contact is like a self imposed time out to get your emotions under control and get your feet underneath you.

If you base you're healing/detachment on no contact you put yourself in a very vulnerable position.  What happens if you cross paths accidentally, or they call, or email - and this throws you back to square one of misery?  Ideally you wouldn't have to deal with this again but life throws curve balls and letting someone else determine your emotional state (especially someone with BPD) can go sideways fast.  Stayers and people actively trying to manage a relationship know this - you can't let someone with a mental illness lead you.

Detachment, healthy coping skills, boundaries and appropriate communication once you are a feeling better can do wonders for self esteem and feeling stable.