My BPDs does not feel welcome in our house

[six]

this has been a summer of major changes for me and BPDs26.  we have started to have conversations and I do not get derailed when he has a meltdown and I have set some boundaries and stuck with them even though others found them uncomfortable.  all good.

I told my son that I was struggling with his behavior in the house, in particular ripping apart his younger sister (DD24) whenever they are together.  it is really hard for me bec DD24 has some self-esteem issues and it is painful for me to see DSBPD26 heap criticism and judgment on her.

after some outbursts on his part, he told me something which kind of rocked me to the core.  he said, "I never have felt welcome in our house.  I always feel like she (DD24) is the crown princess and I am unwanted. "  he agreed that his belittling of her has very little to do with her and mostly to do with trying to get me upset (successful tactic).

I have been thinking about this comment, which I suppose has an element of truth in it.  especially bec when he was at his worst behavior (ages 18-21)  I told him many times that I didn't want him to come home bec I could not handle the stress of having him with us.

just wondering what I might do to make him feel welcome .  he has a beautiful private bedroom, ample food cooked and served to him, how do I make him feel welcome?   also with his difficult behavior, how welcome do I want him to be?




 

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Kate4queen]

To be honest, I do think it's you at all.

My son says this to me too, and yet if I asked all his other siblings they'd probably say that BPD son got 200% more of everything from me than they did and that in the process their self-esteem and confidence was trampled into the ground because he couldn't bear anyone but him to be #1.

Also my son knows exactly which buttons to push to make me feel like everything is my fault, so I'd suspect that this is the same for your son.

I once asked my son what I would need to do to show him how much I loved him and suggested maybe if I cut my wrists and bled to death in front of him that would finally prove it and do you know what he said? "You just have to make everything about you, mum'

You said it all you've given him everything, the fact that it isn't enough that it will never be enough is about him and his illness not about how welcoming you are-he's using your guilt against you.

[Reality]

Bottom line is that your son feels unwelcome.  That is a classic BPD feeling.  PwBPD FEEL unwelcome.  Feelings need to be validated, so that the intensity of the feelings diminishes.  Validation is like mindfulness-mirroring.  Notice the feelings and let them be.  When that happens, as we all know, cognition is heightened and there can be amiable discussions.

I think it is bullying to not allow another person to express how they feel.  I would go so far as to say it could be emotionally abusive. 

Reality

[js friend]

Yes I would agress with Reality. It is all about validating your sons feelings.

PwBPD have very long memories because those memories are based on feelings.

My dd used to say that she couldnt wait to leave home becuse of all the memories she has here.It was all she ever talked about for years and she eventually left home at 17yo. I  totally understand and validate her pain. At first she didnt come home too often, but now she visits more.

We still live just round the corner from the  school where she was bullied mercilessly, and she would bumped into her old classmates from time to time which would bring up those feelings again and again. It must have FELT like  torture for her. :'(

[vivekananda]

Hi again 6, good to hear from you... .sorry it's such a sad subject.

I would like you to consider the few things I have to add to the discussion. If we are not validating, it probably means that we are invalidating. An invalidating environment to a pw BPD is abusive. Sadly that's it. For my dd32, she was not brought up in an abusive home, but we weren't validating parents. If my dd had not a predisposition to BPD, then she would have been fine - but she was hypersensitive and goodness knows what else. She now believes she was abused all her life. This is her truth.

When your ds says he feels unwanted, that is a legitimate feeling. Feelings are true. If I feel unwanted there can be no denying that my feelings are not true for me. If you validate that feeling for me, then you are listening to what I am trying to communicate to you. I am saying I want to be wanted. There is an excellent video on Utube from a recovered young woman w BPD called Amanda Wang. In she says that 'love is not enough'. It struck a chord with me who always thought that love was all we needed... .

Validation practice helps us build our relationships with our loved ones. It is not easy to master because it requires us to change the way we think about people. It demands we listen to feelings of others and our own feelings. Ultimately if we master validation we learn how to stop expecting other people to make us happy and we can learn to make ourselves happy by recognising our own emotional needs. Validation is a tool of mindfulness.

Now that's a lot of words to say to you 6, how about delving into the world of validation a bit more than you have and see if it can help you. And tell us how you go with it too! Here's a video to get you started, let me know what you think, ok?

Understanding Validation in Families - Alan E. Fruzzetti, PhD

The other tool to help us as parents, is boundary setting... .that's how you protect yourself from his hurtful behaviour. And there's a whole lot more to that concept than meets the eye too 

our first rule is always to care for ourselves, take care 6,

Vivek    

[six]

HI Vivek

thanks for keeping in touch!

I agree if we are not validating, we are invalidating

well said!

I asked my BPDs26:  "what would it take for me to make you feel welcome?"

he thanked me for asking, said he didnt know, would think about it and get back to me with an answer.

In the last week we have had some very open conversations where he tells me what i have done to hurt him over the years.  I have listened and asked questions without judging (myself or him).  I realize that a different child in his place would have managed fine but his sensitivites make it that what I considered reasonable parenting was torture for him.  These conversations are tough but not nearly as tough as his meltdowns.

[Reality]

I asked my BPDs26:  "what would it take for me to make you feel welcome?"

he thanked me for asking, said he didnt know, would think about it and get back to me with an answer.

In the last week we have had some very open conversations where he tells me what i have done to hurt him over the years. 

six

Your son's response by thanking you brings tears to my eyes.

Open conversations... .

You listening... .

Reality

[heronbird]

Its just BPD being BPD

My dd says she cant come home because its got too many bad memories, she cried in her room for 3 years. She had a traumatic childhood.

Haha, get real, we are the traumatised ones.

She will never realise, so sad because she had a brilliant childhood, it was just everyone else who suffered.

[six]

I recognize there is a difference of opinion among parents on this board in this respect.  Some parents say, we are the ones who are traumatized.  other say that the BPD person is the one who is in pain. 

when I first came on the board a few months ago, I would definitely have been one of the first type.  I was so angry at my DS26 for all the pain and trauma he has caused me over the years.  but thru the guidance of some of the parents I have met here and some of the reading I have done, I am slowly opening to the possibility that while he was causing me pain and wreaking havoc in our house, he was actually experiencing so much more pain inside himself.

I think part of what has helped me get to this point is that my son decided to get some psychoanalysis and has tried to start understanding himself. instead of just lashing out he will try to figure out what is triggering him (still on  a very rudimentary level).  however, this has started many conversations about what his childhood was like...    

much as I would like to remember myself as a super duper mom, I made plenty of mistakes with him and bec of his oversensitive nature, those mistakes caused him pain. 

it doesn't make me a bad person that I made mistakes.  but I can afford to be kind and to acknowledge his pain and what I did wrong.  this does not mean that he has acknowledged his mistakes btw. we are all works in progress.

[Rapt Reader]

when I first came on the board a few months ago, I would definitely have been one of the first type.  I was so angry at my DS26 for all the pain and trauma he has caused me over the years.  but thru the guidance of some of the parents I have met here and some of the reading I have done, I am slowly opening to the possibility that while he was causing me pain and wreaking havoc in our house, he was actually experiencing so much more pain inside himself.

You know what, six? I remember your very first intro post on this site, and the posts you've made during your tenure here... .And I have to say that you have grown and learned, and I've been so happy to see your relationship with your son grow, also. Your son, I daresay, has been the beneficiary of your growth and learning... .when you first came here he had no interest in getting help (Therapists were in it for the money, according to him, right?), and now:

I think part of what has helped me get to this point is that my son decided to get some psychoanalysis and has tried to start understanding himself. instead of just lashing out he will try to figure out what is triggering him (still on  a very rudimentary level).  however, this has started many conversations about what his childhood was like...

 

This is remarkable news to me... .I see that you and your son have made leaps and bounds towards a better life, compared to where you both were just a few months ago. I hope he continues with this treatment, and trying to understand himself. I put a list of books that my own son has read during this recovery period of his own. It's in another thread on this Board: My Husband is meeting with his Daughter 17... ., and if you haven't seen the list you might be interested. Maybe your son would read them?

You have given the basics of what parents of BPD children need to understand, need to come to terms with, and need to radically accept, below: 

much as I would like to remember myself as a super duper mom, I made plenty of mistakes with him and bec of his oversensitive nature, those mistakes caused him pain. 

it doesn't make me a bad person that I made mistakes.  but I can afford to be kind and to acknowledge his pain and what I did wrong.  this does not mean that he has acknowledged his mistakes btw. we are all works in progress.

I am so impressed with the journey you have been taking, and are taking now. You are doing so well, and becoming the person you need to be. And the Mom your son needs you to be, so he can be the man he was meant to be.   

Rapt Reader

[pessim-optimist]

Wow! Six, I want to say: you have made major strides in your relationship with your son!

I think that your ability to listen without judgement even if it hurts, is paying off... .

after some outbursts on his part, he told me something which kind of rocked me to the core.  he said, "I never have felt welcome in our house.  I always feel like she (DD24) is the crown princess and I am unwanted."

... .

I have been thinking about this comment, which I suppose has an element of truth in it.  especially bec when he was at his worst behavior (ages 18-21)  I told him many times that I didn't want him to come home bec I could not handle the stress of having him with us.

... .

just wondering what I might do to make him feel welcome .

Others have already weighed in on this point - what makes us feel welcome is if people seem to be happy to be around us and seek us out, instead of trying to avoid us (which is REALLY hard if the pwBPD's behaviors are unpleasant). So, no wonder your son did not feel welcome - but also no wonder you were not so excited about his presence.

That dynamic has started changing, and I think that as you understand him better, and are able to better validate his experience and are also feeling better yourself around him because of good boundaries, you will enjoy being around each other more and he will feel more understood and more welcome.

At least that's what seems to be happening between my step-daughter and I - in the past we were tolerating each other at best, even though I love her a lot. Before, we were not able to create any kind of real bond - the relationship seemed to be very sterile/empty, which puzzled me for a long time. Now, it seems to be slowly changing.

Baby steps is the motto, I would say.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[heronbird]

Six,

I think they are in much much more pain than us.

But we also need to acknowledge that we have been traumatised by them too, as long as it does not affect our relationship with them. Id NEVER tell my dd that, but its nice to be able to say it.

[six]

RaptR, thanks for the book suggestions.  I will start looking into them. 

my son still does not accept his diagnosis and believes that all the problems were caused by me and that he has been an innocent victim.  So it would be hard at this point to suggest most of those books.  I am careful not to upset the fragile balance that seems to exist between us. but perhaps I will buy them and leave them around the house.  its funny but I have Valerie porrs book lying around and my other children always think we should hide it from DSBPD26 so he doesn't get insulted (I don't hide it but he has never mentioned it).  thanks also for the vote of confidence, it really means a lot.  we have had such a rocky journey these past few years.  it is hard for me to believe that we are at this point.  and I live with the awareness that it could all change in a moment. 

not that everything is peachy all the time, yesterday he had a meltdown (no pun intended)  bec someone left a Ziploc bag on the toaster over and when he toasted his bagel the bag melted all over the toaster.  my DD15 rushed to clean it up so he would not have a full blown fit.   usually I would have said "youre supposed to check that nothing is on the toaster before you turn it on"  instead, I said " wow that really is so annoying when people leave bags on the toaster' I also see myself holding back from making little angry comments at him (so much pent up anger, where should I let it out, my husband perhaps?)

passim, you mentioned the golden word - boundaries. one of the first baby steps I took this summer was setting a boundary (seems so trivial now) that I would not be the only person to contribute to the upkeep of our house.  I was sick of watching him sit on the couch and complain about all of us.  I asked him if he would be willing to water the plants (a 2minute job)  . he agreed.  i must say that the plants are thriving and gorgeous and he has taken his job very seriously.  this had been good for both of us bec I feel less resentful and he feels proud of his role here.  he has even started to take on other small responsibilities.  baby steps

heron, I totally agree with you that we have been traumatized and that this board is a great place to share it.  I also feel that  for me the thing that has done the most to alleviate my pain is to begin to relate to him as a person in pain and not a person causing pain.  i so appreciate the support i have gotten here and the validation i have gotten for what i am going thru

[Reality]

Six,

I think they are in much much more pain than us.

But we also need to acknowledge that we have been traumatised by them too, as long as it does not affect our relationship with them. Id NEVER tell my dd that, but its nice to be able to say it.

As usual, heronbird, you have ferreted out an important piece: the trauma suffered by families.  I think that is why residential treatment facilities are key to helping pwBPD and their families: the family has become too traumatized to function normally.  An ersatz-family is needed for a length of time so that the family can recover itself. 

Reality

[pessim-optimist]

... .I also see myself holding back from making little angry comments at him (so much pent up anger, where should I let it out, my husband perhaps?)

I read somewhere (I think it was one of the first books, R. Kreger perhaps) that it helps to laugh about it here and there, to relese some pressure. If you and your husband can offer that kind of support to each other, that would probably help you. It does help me and my husband, here and there - my step-daughter has her own family, so we can talk freely, and laugh as well - we are not mean about it, but sometimes the sitautions are just plain bizarre... .(Of course I would not advocate for laughing behind your son's back as a family - but I'm sure you know that's not what I mean)

[peaceplease]

six,

My ds would say that about this house.  He is almost 32, and is staying with us. I will not get into it too much here, as I am afraid that I would end up hijacking your thread. Sometime, when I have the energy I will make my own thread. My ds has said that it was always about my dd.  And, in a way, he is right.  My uBPDd  was always and still is very needy.  I and others at time played the role of rescuer.  I have come to the conclusion that my ds has BPD/NPD as well.  He was not needy or clingy like my dd.

For now, I have my ds, staying with us for a bit.  I have my mother with dementia, my demanding dd, age 29,(who lives in her own place) and my dh, who really adds fuel to the fire at times.  He is quite invalidating.  He favors my dd and does not have much tolerance for my ds. 


I do feel like I have been traumatized by my children.  However, this was inherited from their dad.  And, I chose their dad, so I do feel to blame for it.  I was a young, immature, naïve 23 y.o.  By the time I matured, I had two children already.  Fortunately, I left their dad when they were quite young, so they did not grow up in an abusive home.

[qcarolr]

six - so great that you ds is at least doing some kind of T. And able to talk with you about his life in the family. A step forward. You are doing such a good job validating all this for him -- still hard to do though.

Take care of yourself.

qcr  

[vivekananda]

I feel so proud of how far we have all come in our own journeys, how far we have all come. It is the strength we gain from each other with the wisdom of those who are more experienced than we, that can bring us to a place where we can improve our relationships with our loved ones. It is the open and honest and informed conversations we can have here that bring us to a more hopeful situation. And nothing is more pleasing than to see the personal growth both we and others experience when we dedicate ourselves to our own change in thinking and behaviour.

... .I do feel to blame for it... . 

peaceplease, I thought to quote your words and turn them around. When I read them, in relation to the earlier posts, I thought you have got to the nub of the issue.

Blame means guilt and is a part of the FOG that clouds our judgemental and leads us towards being judgemental which is not compassionate. Instead it is acceptance I believe, that we benefit from working on.

Does that mean I don't enjoy some sick, black humour? I could probably put pessi-O to shame there! 

peaceplease, when you can, please post. It does sound that you are up against it at the moment... .we are here for you girl.     

six, it's so good to have you in the fold   

Vivek    

[peaceplease]

Vivek ,

I just lost a long post.   That's okay, it was too long, anyways, and needed much editing. .  Okay, blame is the wrong word.  Perhaps, I should say that I made bad choices.  eg Choosing my exh.   Although, I definitely contributed to things, by not validating feelings, when I did not know better.   My exh whole family has BPD or NPD.  

My ds would blame me for picking my exh and not shielding him from that side of the family when I divorced him.  although, he was sure happy to take my exmil money.  It is sickening how all of the grandchildren are finger pointing on who did the most for their grandmother.  And, who took advantage of her, and who didn't appreciate her.  Yet, I can tell you, they are not breaking the door down to get in to see her.  It is really sad.  She lays in a NH, and nobody to visit her.  Her dd lives 7 hours away.  

My ds blames everyone else.  And, he is always finding fault with people, talking negative. And, my dd is not talking to her brother, now.  A few weeks ago, they got into argument.  My ds spit on my dd.  She was ready to call police to report assault, and says that she regrets not filing report.  She says that she will never forgive him.  My kids are estranged from paternal side of family.

Funny, I asked about, forgiveness being as values.  My kids can hold grudges forever, until they may need something.  Then, they make up, for their own gain.  This is something that really disturbs me.  I tell my kids that you need to forgive.  It does not mean to forget.   And, that forgiveness is for them.   But, my kids have so much hate in their heart for dad and his family.

Anyways, I contributed to the illness by not validating feelings in the past.  And, I want to also, correct, that I have been traumatized by my kids.  That is such a strong word, and I can't say that I was ever traumatized by my kids.  :)epressed and anxiety, but not traumatized.

I do have lots of turmoil, now.  dealing with my dd, ds, and dh and conflict among them.  trying to take care of mom, and dd resents taking back seat to grandma.  She does not understand dementia.  Some day, I will spill.  I must admit to falling back into old habits.  eg.  Letting my dd monopolize my time. (long story)  She is in process of moving, and that meant numerous trips to home improvement store.  And, letting my credit card balance skyrocket.     Yep, I need refresher.  I am trying to keep the peace among everyone.  I hate confrontation.  And, my dd is so condescending to me at times.  I have the right reading materials, I need to read them, again, and put them into practice.

Good news is that I understand what I have to do.  

 

peace

[six]

peaceplease, I so identify with things that you wrote, about making bad choices and also about seeing BPD characteristics in other kids that are not BPD.  I also feel so tired and worn out.  It seems like too much to handle.

Blame is a big word for pwBPD.  I see that whenever something goes wrong, my DSBPD26 will immediately try to figure out who is to blame.  I have spent a lot of his life trying to protect other family members from being blamed and trying to help DS see that there is nobody to blame when things just sometimes happen the way we don't want them to.  has not helped one bit.  he still insists on blaming.  

a few weeks ago, with the help of my T, I started to realize that I am making matters worse bec Ds just perceives that I am protecting his sisters at his expense.  so I stopped doing it.  at first it was torture bec it is such an ingrained reaction on my part.  but soon it got a bit easier.  the fallout was that my other adult kids got angry that I was no longer protecting them from blame. but I told them they could protect themselves which includes not getting so sensitive about what he says.

 life has gotten a tiny bit more peaceful for me bec I am not under so much pressure all the time to protect the family from his verbal assaults.  but I also feel drained from all the drama which I am now allowing to play out and not getting in the middle of.

[qcarolr]

six     

It takes perseverance and practice to keep stepping away from the drama, esp. when you have held the peacekeeper role for so long. Your kids will not let go of this easily -- extinction bursts exist for us all, not just pwBPD. Keep finding ways to limit your contact with the issues that generate the drama. Are you exposed to this by being present or through email/text/phone calls? It is easier to hang up the phone or not answer text or email than to walk out of the room.

My perception of the blaming my BPDDD is projection of her intense and overwhelming emotions onto whatever target is in her sights. If it is a bf or friend, then she comes to me for support in her anger at them. Maybe it also becomes a habit for her -- to not take any responsible for her actions. Or it is connected to her view that others 'owe' her in some way, and this shifts the responsibility away from herself. And maybe she has a very shallow sense of self that just cannot hold the pain of owning her part in situations.

All I can do is guess - mind reading is not a skill that came in my human packaging.

qcr  

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

I do have lots of turmoil, now.  dealing with my dd, ds, and dh and conflict among them.  trying to take care of mom, and dd resents taking back seat to grandma.  She does not understand dementia.  Some day, I will spill.  I must admit to falling back into old habits.  eg.  Letting my dd monopolize my time. (long story)  She is in process of moving, and that meant numerous trips to home improvement store.  And, letting my credit card balance skyrocket.     Yep, I need refresher.  I am trying to keep the peace among everyone.  I hate confrontation.  And, my dd is so condescending to me at times.  I have the right reading materials, I need to read them, again, and put them into practice.

Good news is that I understand what I have to do.  

Maybe you could start with a good look at what your values are. What is the most important thing you can do to take care of your own needs - without regard to how it would impact anyone else in your life? What are you needs? Sometimes this kind of thinking can help me figure out what boundaries I need, and which I am willing to put into place and accept the pain that will come with consisten enforcement. Sometimes what I need is to just leave the house and take a long walk by myself -- taking in all the beauty that my color vision provides (such an awesome gift we humans have to see in color ) And this is a good time of year for color.

peaceplease - hope you find some ways to give yourself a break.

qcr  

[vivekananda]

peaceplease I was just thinking what qcr suggested... .I am thinking if you start with a good consideration of your values and then reflect on how your behaviour is guided by those values, it may lead you to being able to set some clear boundaries to protect those values of yours.

Like you I abhor conflict. Raised with a BPD mum and alcoholic and violent dad and an older BPD sister meant that my childhood home was almost always full of anger and fighting. So one of my personal values is co-operation. This value helps me to remind myself to stay and try to co-operate instead of just running away and burying my head in the sand. It also helps me understand when others are not allowing me to be co-operative (because they are in a defensive conflict mode) and then I can determine what my personal boundary will be in that situation.

The result of these thoughts to guide my behaviour, is to give me a sense of being stronger because my feet are firmly planted where I believe they belong. Of course, mums like us, used to giving in to keep the peace, find this empowerment a bit of a challenge in itself.

thinking of you Cheers,

Vivek    

ps I just picked the word blame out - not to call you out, but to help us all remember that is an unhelpful concept.

pps did I ever tell you all that my dd said she was going to have lunch with me and my mum (with dementia but not alzheimers), just the three of us for mum's 101st birthday - and then didn't show up? Mum's now 103 and she still hasn't been to see her granma - who lives 20 minutes from her. That's BPD ... .NPD (?)