Divorce Court-delay, delay, delay...

[Musiccitymess]

Filed 1 year ago from BPD wife (high functioning alc, adderall prescription/addiction), no kids, she has admitted multiple adulteries, short term marriage (4 years at file date). Her discovery was delayed 5 times, finally turned in 7 months late. Deposition... .delayed due to some pathetic excuse. Does the court hold no one accountable? Has anyone actually gone through this? Am I really looking at a 2 year divorce for a 4 year marriage? I should mention, like all BPDs, she is in this for the conflict, not the resolution. Still, do I get points with the court. I mean, I know it depends and all that... .but sheesh, when do we get relief from these people?

On a humor note, I do have her on tape saying that she'll never admit to alcoholism because then she'll lose every argument. That was followed by the ultimate winner, when I'm on adderral alcohol doesn't affect me. I am in a state where I could use that... if the court even cares to hear it? Frustration times infinity!

[Matt]

Have you filed for a trial date?

[Musiccitymess]

My understanding is that I cannot do so yet. We have to get depositions done, then mediation, then the court does their own "in-court" mediation, then a trial date. Judging by the massive delays in steps 1 and 2 (depositions), this has me feeling the same about the legal system that I do about my BPD wife (which is to say, not good). I am hopeful that at some point it moves faster and the court gets tired of her excuses to delay this. Wow, what a legal system, huh. I just cannot believe that the system allowed her 4 discovery delays, then another for depositions.

[Matt]

You might want to double-check that.  Where I live, you can ask for a trial date at any time, and that puts an end to the process (though the other side can always ask for a delay to that too).

Do you have an attorney?  Is she agreeing to these delays?

If you file a response each time the other side asks for a delay, the court might take that into account.

[ForeverDad]

My lawyer always said the court will almost always grant a continuance the first time or two.  But any more and the court gets more and more peeved.  (Yeah, not a legal term, is it?)  Probably at first your lawyer was willing to defer to the other lawyer but by now your lawyer should be peeved too.

You need to file a prompt response to every continuance she or her lawyer files, detailing the past pattern of repeated continuances and request it be denied.

In my current motion before the court for Modification of Parenting Time, my ex's lawyer has made 4 motions for continuance, two granted, two denied.  I recall that the first one stated my ex was under a doctor's care.  But the hearing was just for lawyers anyway  so the judge denied it.  My supposedly quick case - I have custody, I am Residential Parent, all I'm asking for is majority parenting time and recalculation of child support - is now in its 15th month.

[Matt]

Probably at first your lawyer was willing to defer to the other lawyer but by now your lawyer should be peeved too.

This might be an important point - how your lawyer responds.

Some lawyers believe that "professional courtesy" means they should agree to stuff requested by the other attorney, so on some other case that lawyer will grant them the same courtesy.  It makes sense from the lawyer's point of view, but you're paying the bills.  You can direct - and by "direct" I mean, in writing - your lawyer not to agree to any delay without your written approval.

Sometimes you have no control - the court does what it decides - but if your lawyer is agreeing to delays, you can tell her to stop doing that.

[Musiccitymess]

can't ask for a trial date, can ask for the court to set a schedule (which would probably be another 5 months judging by my experience). Thanks for the responses, I guess you're all right, I should just tell my lawyer that we're not doing anymore talking, agreeing to random stuff to allow the delays to go on. I know that one delay was a concession for her agreeing to no longer empty the bank account (what fun that is)? How screwed up is that.

I have learned that lawyer code for "i need to generate more fees" is to say that the court would grant a delay anyway. Sadly, I think there is truth on both sides of that. No kids, 13 months so far... .seriously? For those of you going through this with children, I cannot imagine the pain-honestly. To have to share this with little kids must be my nightmare on steroids. In the end, worth it. But how punishing is the journey for all of us. Good test of fortitude.

[Matt]

So there may be a few things you can look into, to keep it from dragging on forever.  But no matter what you do, it might drag on quite a while anyway.

There are a couple of reasons you need to get OK with this.  First, because if you are too eager to finish it, you'll give in on issue after issue, hoping to expedite the process, but that won't work - the other side will realize they can get what they want by delaying - so it will take almost-forever anyway, and you'll end up with less.

More important, if you let this bother you, you'll drive yourself nuts.

So... .once you know that you've done what you can to limit delays, you probably need to just accept that this will take a while, and move on with your life.  Exercise, regular sleep, and counseling helped me a lot - most of us are dealing with tons of stress during this phase, and that can mean depression (it did for me).  Focus more on that - the acceptance and managing stress - and then each delay will bug you less.

[ForeverDad]

Since there are no child or custody issues, this is limited to financials and property.  Good.  That really does make it simpler, though not simple.

What is the purpose of discovery?  Is she hiding money or is she accusing you of hiding money?  Worst case scenario she'd get half, depending upon your state's laws and the negotiations.

Alimony is unlikely, not for 4 years or so.  Is she getting spousal support from you while the case drags on?  Besides the punishment and negative engagement factors, that may be a big factor.

Draining accounts?  Probably the temp order prohibits that.  Hard to enforce it so your eventual option is to equalize the imbalance during the final stage of financial reconciliation.  If only you could move your money from joint accounts into escrow, or maybe you can't do that if the court has ordered the money not to be moved.  (So don't put any new money into joint accounts, deposit paychecks into personal account and only move over to joint the funds that you have to.

[livednlearned]

I do have her on tape saying that she'll never admit to alcoholism because then she'll lose every argument. That was followed by the ultimate winner, when I'm on adderral alcohol doesn't affect me. I am in a state where I could use that... if the court even cares to hear it? Frustration times infinity!

My ex said the same thing -- he could drink enough to kill a person when he was on adderall. Early in my marriage, pre-adderall, N/BPDx would pass out after drinking a lot. Then he started taking adderall, and he stopped passing out, and that made it possible for him to drink even more. That's when he would release the flying monkeys. He could walk, talk, and operate a tv remote, but was so intoxicated he technically blacked out. Also, adderall exaggerates anxiety and rage. Mix that with alcohol and a PD and you might as well build a nuclear shelter to protect yourself.

Scary stuff.

My divorce was final after 15 months but I'm still in court trying to get him to do what he agreed to do in the consent order. Make sure your order is watertight. Your ex won't follow any of it, but you'll at least have the legal language to help you when you take her back to court for the 3rd and 4th time, trying to get her to comply. Maybe the judge will have her pay your legal fees if it becomes apparent that she's high conflict.

By watertight, I mean have consequences for not complying spelled out in the order. So if she is supposed to refinance the house, have very specific conditions spelled out what happens if she obstructs it. If she is supposed to let you into the marital home so you can get your property, spell out very clearly that you will have domestic assistance from law enforcement escort you to the property and she will not be on the premises during that transaction. If you have not been given access to that property by date/time/year, then she will be held in contempt of court and responsible for paying your legal fees.

That kind of thing. Ask people here what can go wrong so you know what kinds of things you can expect her to obstruct, and how.

Why are you having a deposition? 

[Musiccitymess]

Thanks to all for the myriad of thoughts and advice.We had to do discovery b/c we cannot proceed to court without it. Had to go out of town for a conference-what a relief to get a few days out of the grinder. Depositions are next week. I have over 30 hours of recorded calls and whatnot to go through. Since I've been accused of everything except capital crimes, the depositions should sort out to the court who is telling the truth and who isn't. If you record this stuff, go back through it some day. It's the only laughter I've had in months.

"You committed a felony!". "Me, a felony? What felony did I commit?". "I never said you committed a felony". That is a direct quoted discussion. Just crazy.

The big delay is that there is a business she wants a piece of. She worked there for about a year but had to be removed for showing up drunk-a big mistake! I've offered $$, she's refused every offer (including her own counter-offer). The house was mine pre-marriage, so while I get to keep it, I cannot get her out of it! Talk about awkward. Well, the comments surely helped drag me out of a nasty depression I was lingering though. I am not a group therapy person, so I REALLY appreciate the thoughts and words. GREAT point about having reprocussions (sp) to court orders. We didn't do that on one of them and it was a big mistake. Will make sure that, 4 years from now, we include that in the final paperwork. Really good reminder, thanks.

[livednlearned]

Thanks to all for the myriad of thoughts and advice.We had to do discovery b/c we cannot proceed to court without it. Had to go out of town for a conference-what a relief to get a few days out of the grinder. Depositions are next week. I have over 30 hours of recorded calls and whatnot to go through. Since I've been accused of everything except capital crimes, the depositions should sort out to the court who is telling the truth and who isn't. If you record this stuff, go back through it some day. It's the only laughter I've had in months.

"You committed a felony!". "Me, a felony? What felony did I commit?". "I never said you committed a felony". That is a direct quoted discussion. Just crazy.

The big delay is that there is a business she wants a piece of. She worked there for about a year but had to be removed for showing up drunk-a big mistake! I've offered $$, she's refused every offer (including her own counter-offer). The house was mine pre-marriage, so while I get to keep it, I cannot get her out of it! Talk about awkward. Well, the comments surely helped drag me out of a nasty depression I was lingering though. I am not a group therapy person, so I REALLY appreciate the thoughts and words. GREAT point about having reprocussions (sp) to court orders. We didn't do that on one of them and it was a big mistake. Will make sure that, 4 years from now, we include that in the final paperwork. Really good reminder, thanks.

Depositions can be a really useful strategy -- it sounds like you already know that. My ex was a former trial attorney and did bunches and bunches of depositions throughout his career. I thought he was going to eat me for lunch, given all his experience. But BPD is BPD, even in lawyers. Guaranteed your ex won't be looking carefully over her records and documentation the night before the deposition, studying up on the facts. She'll offload all the icky work to her L, show up with a hangover, and then say whatever she can to inflict as much hate on you without thinking about how she just shot herself in both feet.

How awful that she's living under your roof while divorcing her. Take care of yourself throughout the process -- it can really take a toll, kids or not.

[coffee shop]

Music, I am finishing up on a divorce that started 8/11, divorce final 10/12, with ex to finance the property that I owned before marriage. Our marriage was 6 years and there was no children or major purchases. I worked full time, he worked off and on, during the marriage we paid over $27,000 in his pre marriage debt that I didn't know about until marriage.

Needless to say he didn't get financing and I had to file in court to get him to move forward, Judge ruled in January that ex needed more time and didn't make him move out until April 2013. I paid house payments since Dec. since only my name is on the loan. House was put on the market in May and ex tried everything possible to ruin all contracts. Finally signed in 9/13 after ex was court ordered to sign. Now back to court yet more delays because he wont agree to the costs I had to get the house sold, such as water and septic tank inspections... .

What a mess, yes it can take a long time but I am sure when it is over it will be worth it.

[Matt]

Depositions were very effective in my case, mostly because my wife wasn't telling the truth.  She had made some serious false accusations, including assault - she called 911 and said I "threw her down the stairs".

Before the depositions, my attorney asked me for a list of topics, and for each topic, a list of questions.  She then added to them, and put them in a careful sequence.  So for each topic she was able to lay the groundwork - ask questions about stuff my wife had lied about - get those lies on the record - and then confront her with evidence, either during depositions or at trial.  We were able to show very clearly that she was lying, and if we had gone to trial she would have either lied under oath (again) or changed her stories, thus proving she had lied under oath when she was deposed.  Her attorney saw this happen, and talked her into settling, rather than go to trial and commit a crime.

[livednlearned]

We were able to show very clearly that she was lying, and if we had gone to trial she would have either lied under oath (again) or changed her stories, thus proving she had lied under oath when she was deposed.  Her attorney saw this happen, and talked her into settling, rather than go to trial and commit a crime.

A big part of depositions is exactly what Matt pointed out -- lawyers, yours and hers, are looking to see what kind of witnesses their clients will be. Unfortunately, it's an expensive way to establish who is credible. My deposition lasted 4 hours, so fees for that, plus the preparation. Then you pay the transcriber for transcription services and copies of your testimony. I think I paid about $700 for transcriber services, and then a couple of thousand for the deposition. I put together the binder my L used and that saved me about $1800.

If your ex is high-functioning, maybe she can scrape through a deposition and come across as credible. But if she's an advanced alcoholic, chances are she doesn't have the clarity to make good decisions or have sound judgment.