BPDw Lies to friends to make me look bad?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Hey all,

I am just wondering if anyone else has had this happen.

I have been going through hell for a while now, not sure it will get better. Verbal abuse, emotional abuse, infidelity... you name it...

Back to point, Have your BPDs ever lied to a group of his/her friends about you... IE: Your Controlling/Abusive/A Ass...

Mine is doing this as I speak, she leaves to head out to drop off her pot dealers laundry (Another female) as I have cut her off financially as far as drugs go, so she does laundry for weed :P She tells me she'll be back in an hour or two. Well four hours later I give her a call, mind you I'm at home with our 11, 7 and 3yr old. I ask her if she can bring home milk on her way and if she's going to make it home for dinner.

I mention that she said she'd be home in an hour or two and it's been four and today is my only day off and (Stupid I know) I'd like to spend some time with her. She then starts ranting out loud in front of her buddies there "I Didn't lie, I'm at ****'s House" so I'm like I didn't say you did... then she starts saying out loud some crazy stuff about "You never trust me, you always think I'm lying... Why are you so controlling!". At this point I'm just sitting there as she is ranting on the phone out loud (Louder in fact than necessary) I'm sure so everyone hears her. I am simply flabbergasted as to what's happening? It was not our conversation, it was crazy?

I just feel she's trying to foster an environment there that she can lie to me (Because I must be abusive and controlling) and so they will lie for her as well. I also think she is meeting one or two guys there occasionally (She has had 2 affairs I know of. And because they think I'm abusive they let her do it.) She went to a concert last week... left at 5pm (With this dealer chick) said she'd be home by 2am, well I'm up till 6am texting her going nuts to see if she's alright because she's been known to drive drunk and if she drinks one she'll drink 15 so I'm worried. No response, finally one of her friends txts me at 6:15am to tell me their all passed out at this woman's house and she'll call me later?

Off topic again! argh... sorry... I deal with this pretty much solo, never vent.

So anyway, anyone else experience a vilification campaign BEFORE a breakup? I know it usually happens After one... but is this in preparation for one? I need to figure this out for the sake of my kids, so I will be alright for them.

Oh and some added info if it helps. I am 38, she is 35 we have been together for 13yrs and she is on meds (Some of the time  )

-MinFL

[Muslickz]

Hey all,

I am just wondering if anyone else has had this happen.

I have been going through hell for a while now, not sure it will get better. Verbal abuse, emotional abuse, infidelity... you name it...

Back to point, Have your BPDs ever lied to a group of his/her friends about you... IE: Your Controlling/Abusive/A Ass...

Mine is doing this as I speak, she leaves to head out to drop off her pot dealers laundry (Another female) as I have cut her off financially as far as drugs go, so she does laundry for weed :P She tells me she'll be back in an hour or two. Well four hours later I give her a call, mind you I'm at home with our 11, 7 and 3yr old. I ask her if she can bring home milk on her way and if she's going to make it home for dinner.

I mention that she said she'd be home in an hour or two and it's been four and today is my only day off and (Stupid I know) I'd like to spend some time with her. She then starts ranting out loud in front of her buddies there "I Didn't lie, I'm at ****'s House" so I'm like I didn't say you did... then she starts saying out loud some crazy stuff about "You never trust me, you always think I'm lying... Why are you so controlling!". At this point I'm just sitting there as she is ranting on the phone out loud (Louder in fact than necessary) I'm sure so everyone hears her. I am simply flabbergasted as to what's happening? It was not our conversation, it was crazy?

I just feel she's trying to foster an environment there that she can lie to me (Because I must be abusive and controlling) and so they will lie for her as well. I also think she is meeting one or two guys there occasionally (She has had 2 affairs I know of. And because they think I'm abusive they let her do it.) She went to a concert last week... left at 5pm (With this dealer chick) said she'd be home by 2am, well I'm up till 6am texting her going nuts to see if she's alright because she's been known to drive drunk and if she drinks one she'll drink 15 so I'm worried. No response, finally one of her friends txts me at 6:15am to tell me their all passed out at this woman's house and she'll call me later?

Off topic again! argh... sorry... I deal with this pretty much solo, never vent.

So anyway, anyone else experience a vilification campaign BEFORE a breakup? I know it usually happens After one... but is this in preparation for one? I need to figure this out for the sake of my kids, so I will be alright for them.

Oh and some added info if it helps. I am 38, she is 35 we have been together for 13yrs and she is on meds (Some of the time  )

-MinFL

[SeekingAdviceinCa]

Yes!

Mine spoke ill of me to my family. To wives of new buddies of mine THE FIRST DAY THEY MET. Saying that I'm controlling, that I say mean things, not interested in her, things like that.

The friends didn't really believe her and came to me months later explaining what happened. I was HORRIFIED. Luckily the friends knew me well enough and knew better. They no longer have contact with my wife. It was easy for them to detach... . I need to follow their lead.

I think BPD people do this to make themselves look better in other peoples eyes and for sympathy. I never said a WORD about any of her crazy behavior for 12 years until it got so bad I had to reach out to friends.

I think in a healthy and loving relationship you build your partner up in the eyes of those around you and your significant other, NOT tear them down in any way.

[karma_gal]

Happens to me all the time. As the poster above me said - on phone, can't see name - I think mine does it to elicit sympathy and to make sure he always has someone who feels sorry for him so he can crash at their place when he has one of his fits and leaves.

I think too he uses it when others start to call him on his behavior or notice he isn't quite what he portrayed himself to be. It is like "man how would you act if you had to live with this constantly?"

His latest was a few months ago when he was doing a three week side job. So he was working 14 hour days. He was telling the guys he was working with that I was such a bi*** that I expected him to come home from working long days and remodel our house all night. Please he never got off the couch and certainly didn't do any household stuff let alone remodeling he hasn't touched in four years. Anything and everything to make himself look good and me look bad.

I get so sick of it but don't see a way of defending myself with people I don't know. In one case a guy needed my help with something so my H gave him my email. At the end he was like you are nothing like he said. No doubt!

At this point I just laugh at the absurdity and his creativity with his lies because he is pathetic. It used to bother me until I realized I don't really give a crap how people he hangs out with - birds if a feather and all that - think of me. They are all losers whose lives have similar issues but none if them will look in the mirror.

The example you gave was so blatant tho that I think I would have to confront if nothing else and let her know you are on to her game and don't appreciate it. It probably won't change her behavior because she is who she is tho. In the one case it might have been easier to get the milk and text her what time dinner is and leave it at that rather than placing yourself in the line of fire.

It has been going on here for years so seems to be a tactic they enjoy.

[waverider]

Its all part of the triangulation persecutor/victim/rescuer dynamics. Bonding with them as a victim and they rescuers, by painting you as a persecutor.

I would not be surprised when you first met if you the rescuer while she was painting some other person as a persecutor.

The whole he said/she said area is a minefield when dealing with pwBPD, and everyone becomes disposable to suit their immediate needs.

It is best just to disengage when you sense this sort of behavior, rather than trying to argue with them.

[blueeyedjess]

Yep- he sure does. He makes it sound so bad too, like he is trying to save me from myself. Sometimes he even manages to convince me that I am the one that has the BPD, but when I run this by my T and my friends, they all pretty much roll their eyes- even the T.

Waverider- I just realized something when you were breaking down the thought process of BPD.

When my stbex met me I was married to the first hubby- not a very nice guy but I never considered myself abused- until I met the stbex. He was pretty convincing that the 1st ex was abusing me and damaging me. While that may have actually been true but I wonder if that part of his MO. Looking back I see that my stbex has been the ideal "white knight" to many women. His polyamorus tendencies always led him to women who needed saving, and his relationships before me were also "white knighting". BUT- after rescuing all of us in some way or fashion- it quickly turned into us "saving" him. Is this something you have come across before?

[Muslickz]

Ok,

So she gets home tonight and is acting very indifferent. I tell her I don't appreciate her doing that to me on the phone, she says she doesn't know what I'm talking about and goes inside. She leaves her cell phone on the table and a txt goes off, so like a dick I read it... it's a number labeled as ****2 (**** is a girlfriend of hers) it says "Why can't you call me now?" so again like a dick I call the number and a guy answers. I got nervous and hung up. Then I notice that every outgoing call, incoming call and txt has been deleted except for the one that just came in. So I walk inside and ask her who ***2 is and that they just texted her. In a flash she had the phone erased the txt, erased the entry in her phone-book and refused to tell me who it was or what is was about?

Luckily I have been through this before and I jotted the number down before I went inside, told her I had it and was going to call it. She freaked out and went into denial mode... "I didn't do anything wrong" "I'm sick of this" meanwhile she's at least 4 tallboys (lrg Beers) in and reeks of booze...

So ya know what I did next, like a dick... I called the number. Wound up being a guy she gave a ride home to on thanksgiving, (some friend of a friend I have met before, he's 23) he tells me she's been txting and calling him for two months. She's showed up at his job, she's told him we were over and just co-habitating? (News to me? We were intimate yesterday)

Man, I can't get a break... . So long story short, he wants to go get a beer with me to apologize and she wants to move out.

Yea, leave the kids and I and as she puts it... Just to be alone.

Her only income is from her disability from the BPD/bp at like $500 a month, I have no idea how she'll make it or what to tell the kids? I know a lot of cases on here have couples breaking up and getting back together every two weeks but we have never been apart for 13yrs. I'll tell ya it's not hitting me like I thought it would.

So she says she's just going to leave and find a place to live and she'll try to get me some child support, I have no idea how I am supposed to do this? I am certainly going to loose my job and so much for the two businesses I was in the middle of starting up :P I have no family here in Florida and no babysitter argh... I met her 13yrs ago just after she left her ex-husband and her little girl,(who now won't really talk to her) a good amount of her issue I had supposed was from guilt about doing that- yet now she's about to do it again to three kids.

It's so crazy... it went from "I love you" and making love to "I Want to leave and hugging you feels like hugging my brother" I mean what the heck? her brother? after 13yrs? She says I am like a father to her? I'm only 3yrs older than her? I do tell her not to drive drunk (Not that it works) I do tell her not to spend the kids food money on weed... and a few other things I guess... I don't want to be controlling... but she's spent the rent on us and gotten hundreds in tickets and cost us allot. Someone tell me I'm not crazy :P

Sorry for ranting... maybe I better sleep on this a bit or at least try. Man I need a Therapist badly, no insurance (Well share of cost :P).

-MinFL

[waverider]

M in FL sorry to hear all of this.

For now I would do as little as possible as emotions will be all over the place and things will be said on the spur of the moment wihout any real consideration.

You need to think carefully about what you really want for you and the kids in the long run

[waverider]

BUT- after rescuing all of us in some way or fashion- it quickly turned into us "saving" him. Is this something you have come across before?

I think it fair to say that is pretty much the way it usually falls. Then someone will be needed to save him from you at some stage.

The trick is to stop trying to save anyone. The problem is that saving someone makes you feel good about yourself... Thats the draw for someone who is vulnerable in the first place we are often "rescuing" for our own sake.

'You are the only one who really understands me"<<sound familiar, eventually followed by "you don't know anything about me"

We teach here how to save ourselves, that helps break the unhealthy cycle

[SeekingAdviceinCa]

'You are the only one who really understands me"<<sound familiar, eventually followed by "you don't know anything about me"

Yep, sounds very familiar. I heard the first part towards the beginning of the relationship and the "you really don't know me at all" towards the end. Quite a few times actually.  And it's always said so snotty and matter of factly.

[Muslickz]

You guys are SPOT on... I'm sure I'll be on here more often now trying to work this out...

Thanks...

-MinFL

[SeekingAdviceinCa]

M in Florida,

We all learn from each other. I signed up 5 days ago and feel the progress already. This site is great for support, validation and advice. Keep posting!

[Southern_Belle]

In one case a guy needed my help with something so my H gave him my email. At the end he was like you are nothing like he said. No doubt!

I've had this happen to me before, too.

And our BPD's don't think about what it is they said and how the person they told is going to figure out the truth. You know what I mean? If you're going to lie, aren't you going to do what you can to perpetuate the lie? It's like BPDs lie and then when you or someone else figures out the reality of the situation, the BPD doesn't really care or is not embarrassed.

I've caught E in lies and his attitude is "Oh… yeah… whatever."

[karma_gal]

In one case a guy needed my help with something so my H gave him my email. At the end he was like you are nothing like he said. No doubt!

I've had this happen to me before, too.

And our BPD's don't think about what it is they said and how the person they told is going to figure out the truth. You know what I mean? If you're going to lie, aren't you going to do what you can to perpetuate the lie? It's like BPDs lie and then when you or someone else figures out the reality of the situation, the BPD doesn't really care or is not embarrassed.

I've caught E in lies and his attitude is "Oh… yeah… whatever."

WOW I know! If it were me and I was caught in a lie like that I would be mortified. Doesn't seem to bother him at all which really disturbs me. This disorder seems to have somewhat of a shame base yet he does things and acts completely shameless.

I suppose this is why I get less frustrated with his lies than I used to. More often than not, whether it is through helping someone he has sent my way or at company functions, most people who meet me can tell pretty quick I am nothing like he portrays me to be. Whether it bothers him or not he isn't smart enough to realize he has made a fool of himself.

I remember one time a friend of his needed to file an emergency petition for custody of his daughter. I am not a lawyer but have been in the legal field a long time. I offered to help the guy file pro se because he couldn't afford a lawyer. I spent an entire day with him, doing paperwork, waiting until the hearing was over, et cetera.

The guy came out with tears in his eyes. Apparently the judge remarked that whoever had helped him do the paperwork did him a huge favor and he rarely sees even lawyers present such an iron clad petition with exhibits and all. He told him to make sure he thanked me.

So we start talking and he is gushing his appreciation. Then he says he hesitated asking for my help because of all the horrid things my H said about me at work during lunch or whatnot. He said he thought he was going to be meeting the spawn of Satan when he met up with me but could tell my H clearly was making up the things he said about me. He then went back to work telling everyone how selfless I was and how much I helped him and even took the day off work to do so. Even then my H was not at all embarrassed at being called out on his mischaracterizations of me... . although he did leave that job soon after. It always catches up with them somehow!

[waverider]

It always catches up with them somehow!

Even then it does not bother them too much as they still blame any consequences on someone else.

A non>>WOW I got found out, I'm so embarrassed , better not do that again I feel horrible for what I did to you. I'm sorry

A pwBPD>>WOW I can't believe you are so abusive as to accuse me like that, its all your fault anyway because (inset new diversionary issue here) you are horrible to me. I hate you.>> escalates into further painting black

[karma_gal]

It always catches up with them somehow!

Even then it does not bother them too much as they still blame any consequences on someone else.

A non>>WOW I got found out, I'm so embarrassed , better not do that again I feel horrible for what I did to you. I'm sorry

A pwBPD>>WOW I can't believe you are so abusive as to accuse me like that, its all your fault anyway because (inset new diversionary issue here) you are horrible to me. I hate you.>> escalates into further painting black

Unfortunately, you are so right.  I just don't get, and probably never will, how stuff like this doesn't seem to affect them. 

I post on a marriage forum in addition to this one and actually just posted something yesterday that ties in with this, so I'm going to ask you, Waverider, because you are so smart. 

The essence of the post was that I could not understand why it is that my H never seems to learn from his mistakes, and continues to repeat the same mistakes over and over and over again.  The example from yesterday was that he asked me where the antibiotics were.  I think I posted about this here before, actually.  I told him, "They are in the cabinet, the same place they were last week when you asked, the week before when you asked; the same place they have been since we moved into this house three years ago."  I get so sick and tired of repeating myself because he "can't remember" anything.  It turned into a gigantic rage, with him making threatening comments, throwing a full-fledged tantrum, and turned into a giant mess... . all because he never learns.

Right after that, he was taking me to the dealer to pick up my car.  He runs a red light -- the same red light he has run before and because of the camera gotten a ticket.  I said, "Will you please stop running this red light.  We cannot afford to keep paying $120 because you can't take ten seconds to stop at the light."  WOW, did he rage at me.  You would think if you KNEW the red-light camera was there, had gotten a ticket before, you would stop running the damn light.  Not him.  His excuse?  "I thought it was a continuous lane."  Now, he drives there EVERY SINGLE DAY and has for three years.  It has never ever ever been a continuous lane, but that's his story and he's sticking to it.

So do they never learn because they just never take responsibility, or does this go beyond that?

[SeekingAdviceinCa]

Karma_gal,

What marriage forum do you post to.  I was looking for one to join that related specifically to marriage and divorce.  Just curious what your experience was with your site.  Thanks.

[karma_gal]

Karma_gal,

What marriage forum do you post to.  I was looking for one to join that related specifically to marriage and divorce.  Just curious what your experience was with your site.  Thanks.

I don't know if I can post the link here, so I will send it to you in a PM.  If it is okay, someone let me know and I can post the site.  It has helped me TREMENDOUSLY try to get my head on straight.  They're a tough crowd, but they've all been through the trenches with nearly every marriage problem known to man and know their stuff. 

[spuds_mckenzie]

I said, "Will you please stop running this red light.  We cannot afford to keep paying $120 because you can't take ten seconds to stop at the light."  WOW, did he rage at me.

The turning tables thing is a big thing that has worn me down.  My BPDw is so good at this and snaps back with an escalation and sometimes raging.  The content is usually some kind of laundry list of all the stress they're under that particular day and my insolence at adding to it.  I have said so many times that I wish we could have civil adult conversations about problems but it just doesn't happen.

My son was supposed to start a new charter school Monday.  She had talked me into it and I agreed it was a splendid idea and complemented her on it.  She texted me (we are separated) about an hour before class started, saying that there is too much stress and she was going to start September instead.  All this without my input.  I only found out about it later that morning after I'd woken up.  I have not even brought it up yet because of the rage that would surely follow.  I'm pretty upset about the change of plans, but I can't do a damn thing about it.

[waverider]

So do they never learn because they just never take responsibility, or does this go beyond that?

I can also give examples of "unlearning"

We got a new vacuum cleaner i told her to turn it on just check out the difference in suction. she asks me how to turn it on. It is exactly the same brand as the old one with the on button in the same place. I said same as the old one. she couldn't work it out. She couldn't remember how to turn the old one on, which was hers that she brought into the RS in first place.

Asking her to open a window because its stuffy, couldn't work out how to open the window. We have been living here 6 years.

We be could 200yds from home and she would be completely lost even though we have passed that way 100's of times.

Any attempt to point out that she should know this is taken as being very rude by me and demands an apology.

A lot of this unlearning comes from not being interested in the first place, their mind is too full of other irrelevant "important" issues. It never sank in, was not important, and so was not retained. There is little curiosity outside their of field of obsessions. All or nothing,

It is part of the disassociation with normal worldly routine.

It is not because they are stupid, they simply don't see it as their responsibility to get things right, that can be left to someone else. Their focus is simply to get their immediate needs met. Its almost like a kind of extreme mental laziness mixed with a huge dose of entitlement. Often they will simply ask without even trying to work it out for themselves.

You are not going to change this apart from not doing stuff for them that they could do if they wanted to, and just not letting it bother you. No point being sarcastic or scolding about it, that justs end up in necessary conflict

[karma_gal]

Waverider,

Wow... . makes you wonder how many of them, and how long, it would take to change a light bulb, huh?

Like, I read what you wrote and I think I get it -- like I understand what the words mean -- but I don't get it-get it in terms of why it is so or how to make friends with it, I guess.  Because I tell you, most of the time, he DOES come across as absolutely, positively stupid with the things he does.

It may just turn out once I've processed everything that I'm not a good partner for a pwBPD because I just can't make all these concessions simply because he can't act right.  If I ignore him when he pulls this crap, he rages.  If I say anything, no matter what it is, he rages.  I have tried every approach I can think of and nothing has worked or is currently working.  I'm worn out with twisting, turning, ducking, bending, squatting, and rolling over trying to find a solution to a problem that appears to have no solution other than walking out the door and saying "enough."

But let me ask... . when you are going through this, say with the vacuum cleaner, how do you handle it so that you don't end up in the line of rage fire?  Maybe I'm just not "getting" the stop the bleeding part, or maybe I just suck at it. 

I can remember a day not long ago where our day went something like this:

He runs a red light in the morning to work and gets hit by the camera, $120.00 fine that I have to pay because he "isn't too concerned about it." 

He forgets to lock his truck and $5,000 worth of tools get stolen.  "It's not a big deal; that's what insurance is for, right?"  Seriously?

He later runs an errand and comes home, blocking my dad in.  Goes to move the car and hits my dad's brand new truck.  "Oops, didn't see it."  Um, it's huge and red and right in front of you and it's brand new.  He hasn't even gotten to drive it 50 miles yet.

I am sure there were at least a half a dozen little things in between there, but those three huge things in the course of 12 hours.  And this happens all the freaking time, on top of the silly crap like "Where are the antibiotics?" 

I'm just not sure how not to freak out and be angry when these things happen with such regularity.  They do anger me, they are clearly his fault, and then he doesn't care, rages at me like it's my fault, and compounds the problem.  This is where I'm getting stuck. I don't know how to deal with these things without every single one of them becoming a bigger issue. 

The other thing I'm starting to pick up on in this same vein is that he will do literally 33 stupid, irritating, ridiculous things a day.  If I dare say something to him, it turns into, "I can't do anything right.  You're always on my case."  And I probably am, because I am the one who has to be the adult and go behind and clean up his messes -- at least the ones that involve me or our finances.  But if I don't say anything or leave him to his own devices, I don't care about him and he escalates his behavior until he pisses me off. 

We are engaged in a really sick dance here, and I don't know how to make it stop.  I want it to stop; I just don't know how to make it stop.  Everything I do is the wrong thing, and I end up being raged at.  So I'm going to read through the tools again, maybe I glossed over something important.  But if the only real answer is to let him keep screwing up at a rapid pace the way he is, don't say anything, and just resign myself to living a life cleaning up his messes, I may be closer to needing to switch to the leaving board than I initially thought. 

[waverider]

Certainly does do your head in at times.

Your RS is unlikely to ever be "normal". Only you can work out if you can handle that. Not everyone can.

The purpose of this board is to enable you to give it your best shot, then even if it fails you will have most of your "whys" and "what ifs" answered, so that leaving doesn't cause the same level of bitterness that you often find on the Leaving board from those who never used the tools to try to make it work.

[waverider]

Wow... . makes you wonder how many of them, and how long, it would take to change a light bulb, huh?

3 to triangulate about it, plus one to get someone else to do it 

[Obibens]

Wow... . makes you wonder how many of them, and how long, it would take to change a light bulb, huh?

3 to triangulate about it, plus one to get someone else to do it 

What about the one to blame you for letting the lightbulb go out in the first place?   

[karma_gal]

You guys are hilarious! Thanks for the laugh. I needed it today.