Going to see my BPD's Therapist today. What should I do

[hurthusband]

As many of you know, I have been having a really hard time lately with my BPD.  Today is our anniversary we had a nice night out Saturday but past two days she been asking me for terms of divorce and papers...

I am going with her to her psychologist today at her behest.  I know that she is going to try and get the doctor to tell me to quit my job with my family business.  She hates my family, and has isolated me from most of them.  This last one would be my mother who can be overbearing and has spoken up a couple of times the past two months because she has seen me with bruises and its hard to ignore the constant calls from wife blasting me for no reason.  Usually mother stays out of everything, but she has said somethings because its been impossible to hide and she cares.  I wish she had not, but it happens.  At same time, other than a family business I do not know a work place that would put up and not fire me for how much time is spent during a day with my wife.  I do not know one that could allow me the freedom and pay that I afford here even though it is longer hours.

She also hates my mother because my mother missed an art show of hers with my niece and brought my neice to her graduation which she was insulted with.

So I go in knowing that.  I feel that this is a last ditch effort.  I have always held punches and never brought up everything nor all my feeling because it would hurt her to know what she has done or to bring up the long tally of things and slights.  I feel now I have to be honest, talk about how all my identity has been stripped and my job is all that is left.  That she is not willing to work and has offered to alternatives to me to support our family which she is spending into the ground anyways.

Am I right?  Any other advice?  Am I selfish in doing so?

[Wrongturn1]

By all means, feel free to lay out all the details for your w's therapist. There might be a good chance that your wife has the therapist fooled and the therapist believes all the lies your w has been telling about you.  On the other hand, maybe the therapist has caught onto the BPD and would take your side.  Also, the therapist might pass along the details of your conversation to your wife, not that it would necessarily be a bad thing.

[maxsterling]

Here are my thoughts about facing similar confusion within myself:

- the status quo is unacceptable; I am not happy.

- I have no control over whether the relationship fails or succeeds.

- If I don't say something, nothing will change for the better.

- Eventually I will have to speak up about the tremendous hurt and worry her behavior brings to me. One way or another it has to come out at some point.  If I don't speak up, nothing will change, and I will remain unhappy.

-  If she chooses to take what I have to say negatively and end the relationship, I have no control over that. 

-  even though she will probably not like what I have to say, it's probably not fair to her to keep it to myself forever.

And that is what I *logically* have concluded, even though I am not quite emotionally there yet.  But, in the last couples T session, I got frustrated with her complaining about me not doing enough to get a higher paying job.  And I did let loose how I am constantly worried about her hurting herself.  I broke down and cried and said those worries are handcuffing me.  She tried to turn it back around on me, and I rejected that.  So, that's progress, for me at least.

[maxsterling]

Sorry, hit send too quickly. 

My advice, be honest about a few things just to prove you can, and see where it goes.  No reason to unload everything, but a few things. Be firm.  "I like my job the way that it is now.  I will always keep my eyes open for other opportunities, but I have no desire or plan to quit what is working for me now."  If she blows up, she blows up.  You didn't cause that.

[Love Is Not Enough]

Am I selfish in doing so?

NO! NO! NO! If you like working there and feel it is your best option then you are not being selfish. If you have a clear conscience that what you are doing for yourself (not just your job, but anything) is not harmful to her our your rs then you are not being selfish. You are not working as a gigolo and therefore forced to break your vows. Having issues with your mother, who she is just trying to isolate your from, is not a valid reason.

Bring her separation papers and call her bluff. It is unfortunate that sometimes we also have to play games in order to take back control in the rs. Her behavior will never improve until you put your foot down (boundaries) and expect more from her.

[Waddams]

Be prepared for multiple sessions.  Perhaps having patience, seeing what the T says, seeing what your BPDw says, etc.  Get an idea of the dynamic between T and BPDw, get an idea of what has been said, how things have been presented/twisted/manipulated.  Maybe even spend the whole session just getting an idea of it.  Try not to say too much.  Remember Solomon's Proverb (15:28) - The heart of the righteous ponders how to answer, but the mouth of the wicked pours out evil things.

Also, I don't remember the exact verse but something to effect of fools can seem wise when they hold their peace, and the wise can seem foolish when they speak too quickly.  Or better to be thought a fool and remain quiet than open your mouth and prove it!

Then at the end ask for another session, take some time to digest it.  Ponder responses.  Take notes during the session.  Write down what BPDw and T say.  Or even record it.  Any smart phone can have a free recording app.

It's likely to be a blitz of information and you won't be able to absorb all of it.  So don't try.  And don't pressure yourself to either.  That's what notes and recordings are for!

And most of all, relax and try to maintain your composure.  Remember no matter what attacks might develop, you can not respond, not escalate, and just take it all in.  Responding with additional questions is a great way to handle yourself.  "What else do you think? What else is there about this?  What else do you ahve to say?  What's your opinion about that?"  Try to be non-committal but also emotionally neutral.

Do you have your own T?

[hurthusband]

Do you have your own T?

O, yes I have been in therapy since 5 years old .  I go every month.  Big believer in it and pushed my wife to get a therapist of her own.  I want her to have somebody who she feels is hers and to help

scary part is my wife will be there too.  I have no clue how she will react there

[Waddams]

scary part is my wife will be there too.  I have no clue how she will react there

let go of how she'll act.  you're not in charge of her.  just be in charge of you.

[hurthusband]

before we went in i spent 4 hours trying to get together what I thought would be a couple of pages to go over to keep me in track... ended up 7...

doctor thought it would be good if i read it and she just listened.  got through half... I mean I started it off saying that I loved her, how special i thought she was, things I was proud of her, and how talented she was to try and not just make it seem like a bashing, but she took it really really really hard

she certainly acts more calm with therapist.  if i had started on that with her alone we wouldnt have made it even one page and page one was the kind stuff

I am worried cause she has the letter now and has the rest which does get harsher.  Not as criticism, but basically how I view things and as a defense manifesto...

she did sit through it though.  even though she took out revenge later on she let me get through most of it.  time ran out though.  It was hard reading it.  i felt bad for her having to hear it.  cried alot... well i did. she gave me daggar eyes

[Love Is Not Enough]

she certainly acts more calm with therapist.  if i had started on that with her alone we wouldnt have made it even one page and page one was the kind stuff

This shows you she has some control over herself and I believe you could see improvement from boundaries.

I am worried cause she has the letter now and has the rest which does get harsher.  Not as criticism, but basically how I view things and as a defense manifesto...

I am so proud that you did this! I did this once too, but I didn't let her keep it. I think this was the beginning of when I started really standing up to her and I told her I would not take her abuse anymore. I did end up taking some more, but eventually it did improve a lot. I really hope this is a first step to something better for you.

[hurthusband]

she certainly acts more calm with therapist.  if i had started on that with her alone we wouldnt have made it even one page and page one was the kind stuff

This shows you she has some control over herself and I believe you could see improvement from boundaries.

I am worried cause she has the letter now and has the rest which does get harsher.  Not as criticism, but basically how I view things and as a defense manifesto...

I am so proud that you did this! I did this once too, but I didn't let her keep it. I think this was the beginning of when I started really standing up to her and I told her I would not take her abuse anymore. I did end up taking some more, but eventually it did improve a lot. I really hope this is a first step to something better for you.

3

thank you.  She taking rest of letter to therapist today again to talk.  See how it works.  Last night in middle of night i woke up finding her crying.  She was apologizing for all she had done.  It is strange.  While so much now seems to be psychotic, other times angry.  There is like small moments of clarity that seems to come through.  It is like that movie Awakenings when meds work on De Niro.  The strange part is, how do the clarity times completely shut down and reverse... COMPLETELY.  who knows... maybe its BPD and another illness at same time...   Brain is a complex mess

[Love Is Not Enough]

Brain is a complex mess

This is so true. I have seen those moments of self clarity also. The episodes with heaping piles of self-deprecation are frightening. From what I have seen I think that they usually push it back down as a defense mechanism. They do not poses the skills necessary to deal with them as they are just too painful. As my gf has improved lately she has been dealing with negative issues about herself in a more positive way. I hope this continues. I guess she is on the path the greater self-awareness.

[an0ught]

Hi hurthusband,

it was brave to put yourself out like this  . Finding your inner voice again is critical. If you are going to turn this around you need to have a voice and writing the letter and letting it out was important for yourself!

As important as it may be for yourself the details will be less important to your wife. Moving away from BPD behavior is a long process and this was just the start. Your wife is at the moment getting a big dose of reality. Probably needed but going to stress her already weak emotional regulation skills to the max. As the letter she is confronted with somehow reflects the reality of the relationship it may not be all invalidating but stressful nonetheless.  Don't expect miracles straight away. Getting some light thrown on the elephant in the room is good but not something you want to do every day.

What is more important is that you overcame your fear to express yourself  Remember that - you have and can overcome your fears and get issues on the table!

Your wife has an emotional regulation problem. When she is too stressed she will not be able to make progress. Can you - for some time - keep that angle in the back of your mind? Letting the T do more of the confrontational stuff?

   1st priorities: Avoid invalidation, validate and boundaries? - See LESSONS

   1st priority: Self care - find calming stuff to do for yourself. Give yourself high priority!

   3nd priority: Fixing her behavioral issues (high priority behavior issues: boundaries). If addressing them do it in a focused, dosed manner using SET and DEARMAN.

She also hates my mother because my mother missed an art show of hers with my niece and brought my neice to her graduation which she was insulted with.

She may well hate herself, be not aware it and blame the world for it. Most likely she was simply insecure and disappointed but did not regulate the disappointment so it became a declaration of war to your mother and your niece was drawn into it too. Please spend time on practicing validation as it helps you to focus on the emotional side of your wife better. A logical mind which you seem to have starts automatically running and finding explanations when confronted with something that is not explicable. But her actions are not so easily explicable and just looking at her words is NOT enough to do it. Better guides are her behavior and what we can sense in terms of emotions on her side (or their reflections in ourselves).  As a rule of thumb: Emotions >= Facts unless sufficiently calm - so validation is needed a lot to get the Emotions off the table.

Hang in there 

a0

[hurthusband]

Yea it is weird... I never can predict what will happen.  I find that the validation certainly does not fix any problem nor calm her down, but it can stop escalation

SET seems to piss her off as she recognizes what it is when you take the steps and I think she views it as manipulating her emotions as if she is weak minded, or its some routine to go through calm her down.  So she will not necessarily allow it to work, but its still better than not doing it I notice

Yesterday she went to therapist again and was in a great mood afterwards over it when I talked to her on phone which I was shocked at.  Great mood whole day until I got home.  Of course, one of first things out of her mouth was "I am really irritated by everything you say and I cannot explain why"

pretty much acted like it the whole night.  No clue what triggered a 180 in her.  Just put me down every chance she got.  After a couple of hours of trying to be sweet and brush it off.  I just went to bed.  I am going to try and use all the tools in the arsenal, but I do not deserve to be treated like that and I just said screw it... i am withdrawing