terminating a supervised visit

[suffering_parent]

So I have full custody of my kids.   BPDmom has only 3 visits per year supervised.   Her first one is coming in two weeks.

She is already causing a lot of issues.   The supervisor is just a neutral third party I am paying for.   I suspect mom will be out of control and emotionally abusive to the children on her visit.

I believe the supervisor has the right to terminate the visit at any point.   I can't find anything about the legalities of it here in this state though.   How would we even terminate it peacefully?   Will law enforcement help?   Her visitation is in my home.

Thanks.

[Nope]

If the supervisor is a paid professional then they will have an idea of how to handle such a situation. I would ask them directly.

[suffering_parent]

Ya, the problem is it is not a professional.   My order stated it had to be a neutral 3rd party.   Since the visit is for 7 days no professional was willing to do overnights.   Plus they wanted outrageous amounts of money.

It was suggested to me to have some friends help me remove the kids from the home if I have to terminate it.   I am just scared of what might go down in that type of situation.

[ForeverDad]

Yes, probably best to go with friends, helpful to have more than two hands.  Check with the police in the area where the supervised visits would occur and determine under which circumstances and how you could call them for assistance.  If you can arrive with a police presence, it would likely reduce the risk of an incident.  While under normal exchanges and visits they may be reluctant to intervene, supervised is different, in any case they can keep it from getting out of control.

[Waddams]

Is it an option at this point to have the visitation somewhere besides your home?  Someplace easy to grab kids and leave if things go bad?  Also some place public with lots of witnesses?

If you have to do it in your home, can you set up equipment to record everything?  It's in your home after all.

Where is BPDxw staying during the visitation period?  Is this multiple days or just one day?

Also, since it's your home, if she doesn't behave and you end visitation, can you just order her to leave and then if she refuses call the cops and have her arrested for trespassing?

[suffering_parent]

The visit is ordered to be 4 - 7 days.   She lives 6 hours away.   She is staying at my house with the kids for the visit.   I don't know where else I could do it plus it keeps the kids in their environment.    I am staying at some friends in town.

The fun part is I live in a very rural area and she has no car.   So they will be stuck here at the house.   I have never ever seen BPDmom stay home for more then a day.   I suspect she might just go crazy from that.

I debated putting up a security system.

I plan on calling the local sheriff if any issues come up.   Sadly I have spoken to them to many times already.   They won't come unless a "crime" of some sort is happening.   Trespassing might work with this...

[Waddams]

Does the order state her supervised visitation has to be at your home and she has to stay there during it?  That seems a bit out of sorts if so.  If the order permitted me, I'd tell her to stay at hotel, and come visit the kids during the day.  Seems kinda outta whack for her visitation to require you to vacate your own home.  If she can't afford a hotel, that's her problem.  You're divorced, you don't have to provide accommodations for her.

[broken3]

waddams,

Get used to this phrase " not my problem".

It will do you a whole boatload of good now and in the future.

[Waddams]

broken3 - not my thread, !

i assume you're comment is directed at the OP.   

[suffering_parent]

Does the order state her supervised visitation has to be at your home and she has to stay there during it?  That seems a bit out of sorts if so.  If the order permitted me, I'd tell her to stay at hotel, and come visit the kids during the day.  Seems kinda outta whack for her visitation to require you to vacate your own home.  If she can't afford a hotel, that's her problem.  You're divorced, you don't have to provide accommodations for her.

The order allows me to choose where the visit takes place.   I already asked my lawyer about making it waking hours only.   She said it would require another trip in front of the judge to make that happen .   At the time I was just so happy to get sole custody I didn't put much thought into the arrangement.

The visitation schedule was recommended by the GAL.   Since mom missed 50% of her visits in the temp order and lives so far away she thought more days less often might work.   She has 3 visits of 4-7 days per year.

The hardest part of this was finding someone with a schedule who could supervise something like this.   It is just absurd and everyone involved thought I wouldn't find anyone.    I did, but I fear she will only last one visit.

[confused_dad]

Is she going to be able to snoop through your papers, your desk, your computer, your laundry, your medicine cabinet, etc?  Look at the mail that happens to get delivered during the time she is there and you are not?

How will the supervisor stop her from doing that?

[Waddams]

Just wanted to say I think you are taking a risk allowing her into your home.  Not only what she could find, but what she could plant.

If the order doesn't require it, then I'd require her to find her own place to stay, some local hotel or condo rental for week.  The kids can stay there with her, along with the supervisor.  And she can pay the costs for renting the accommodations.  If she can't afford it, that's not your problem. 

If she can't afford suitable accommodations for overnight visits on her visit, then she can get herself a hotel room, and the kids can come home at night. 

The thing about court orders is if they aren't performable, then they aren't enforceable.  At least theoretically.  It should be perfectly reasonable to tell the judge overnights didn't happen because mom couldn't afford it.  I can't see a judge ordering you to clear out of your own home and risk exposure to so much to facilitate visitation.  It's asking too much.

[ForeverDad]

It sounds like the visit scheduling is too far along to make major changes now?  Then do take some time to look toward the future.  For example, don't put anything in writing where you would obligate yourself to continue providing your home for her visits.  In other words, don't go above and beyond the court order or else at a later court appearance you may be obligated to continue the same pattern.  Past generosity risks becoming a future obligation.

Is there some way to start phrasing this upcoming visit as a one-time event at your home, that she will need to find her own accommodations on future visits.  If she doesn't have friends nearby then a week's stay at an inexpensive or extended stay hotel shouldn't be too much of a cost.  If not possible to keep the kids overnight, then she could just have day visits to take the kids to parks, amusement parks, events, movies, wherever.

Frankly, as the others noted, this is your home.  You can be reasonable but there are limits, whatever they may turn out to be.  It's not unreasonable to say she can't take it over for one week, well, not unless the settlement, order or judge says so.  And I doubt a judge would rule that "supervised visits" must include overnights.

[Waddams]

Frankly, as the others noted, this is your home.  You can be reasonable but there are limits, whatever they may turn out to be.  It's not unreasonable to say she can't take it over for one week, well, not unless the settlement, order or judge says so.

Even if the order says so, I think that's still unreasonable.

[suffering_parent]

The order says I get to chose the location of the visit.   It has to be in the county I live in as she isn't allowed to take the kids out of it.   She really doesn't want the visit to take place at our home.   She asked some friends, but everyone is fed up with her.

She has no job, no money, no car, no home to speak of.   She has been "couch-surfing" for almost a year.   She actually said that in court.  I am still in fear of not facilitating some of the visit.   She is filing a lot of lawsuits against me.   The kids are also excited to see her and I think sleeping in their beds, having their pets etc is worth the risks for now.

I have all important documents in a safety deposit box.   I am a little worried about her taking things from the home.   She is super greedy when it comes to money and she is broke.    Taking most smaller valuables with me.

This is her first visit with them in 5 months and her last visit she only stayed 3 hrs.    If it goes really bad I am not sure what I will do yet.   Her next visit is end of June and then not until Christmas.

[GaGrl]

So you are under no legal obligation to turn your house over to her for 7 full days?

Methinks you are going too far, too fast -based on history.

She has SOME obligation in the scenario - the entire burden is not on you. If she is incapable, she is incapable. That might not change for years to come.

What can you offer that is a reasonable compromise (understanding that little is reasonable in a PD's mind)? Can you give her days with your area get supervision, but she needs to find her own night g http accommodations? Can you give her 3 days/nigh r s in the house but an entire week is not reasonable?

[suffering_parent]

I am allowing her to use my house, buying all the food, and paying 100% of the supervision.

And she is literally flipping out I won't pay her transportation costs to get here!   Who chose to live so far away and not get a job?

My lawyer insists I can't deny her the overnights.   If it goes badly I might have to try to adjust the order to only daytime hours.   It would make finding a supervisor a lot easier also.

[Nope]

I am allowing her to use my house, buying all the food, and paying 100% of the supervision.

And she is literally flipping out I won't pay her transportation costs to get here!   Who chose to live so far away and not get a job?

My lawyer insists I can't deny her the overnights.   If it goes badly I might have to try to adjust the order to only daytime hours.   It would make finding a supervisor a lot easier also.

Does it say in the order you have to pay for anything? It sounds to me like if you won't pay 100% of the costs and burdens of doing this visit than it may not happen. You've already tried to work with her and she is making things even more difficult. If it were me, I'd tell her you'd made an honest effort to help but that if she was unwilling to make an effort to make this visit work on her end then you've done what you can do. She should let you know if she's still coming.

You are only in contempt of court if you do not follow the order, which from what you've said just means you have to allow the access for the 7 days. Everything else is on her. If she doesn't pull it together so that she can exercise parenting time, there is nothing you can do about that.

[suffering_parent]

Does it say in the order you have to pay for anything? It sounds to me like if you won't pay 100% of the costs and burdens of doing this visit than it may not happen. You've already tried to work with her and she is making things even more difficult. If it were me, I'd tell her you'd made an honest effort to help but that if she was unwilling to make an effort to make this visit work on her end then you've done what you can do. She should let you know if she's still coming.

You are only in contempt of court if you do not follow the order, which from what you've said just means you have to allow the access for the 7 days. Everything else is on her. If she doesn't pull it together so that she can exercise parenting time, there is nothing you can do about that.

Order says I have to pay for supervision which is the biggest cost.    She literally is coming with no money.   I would love not to help at all, but still have to do what is best for the kids.   There is no chance I will pay transportation costs.

Sounds like her Dad is driving 6 hrs one way to pick her up at the end.   He lives another 6+ hours from where she has been living.   So she must be desperate.