He wants to change parenting time - what should I do?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

All of a sudden, exH is insisting on more parenting time because he misses the kids.  He admits that he misses me too.  He agreed during our long divorce proceedings last year to just see the kids Sat to Sun every other weekend.  Obviously that's not a lot of time.  He takes them to his parents' house when he sees them.  He has health issues and mental health issues and I figured that's what he can handle, and that's what he suggested, so it's been kinda ok.

SO yeah, going 2 weeks without seeing the kids (who are toddlers) is a long time.  But it was only over the last few weeks that he's been pushing to see them on my weekends.  When I say that it's too much pressure on me, he says, "But I miss the kids."

I could offer Wednesday dinners or even an extra overnight for the older child.  But I'm afraid of setting a precedent I might regret.  What do you think?

Complications:  I really regret never getting a psych or custody eval.  We were both broke.  ExH has mental health issues and wants us to get back together.  He is in counseling but I am doubtful he will get healthy enough for us to get back.  Things were fine until recently when he started pushing, telling me he's been in therapy over a year, he misses me, the kids, etc.  Of course he does.  Who wouldn't want to get back into a nice life?  I miss being married in some ways but it's not a healthy situation with him.  I do worry that he could get revenge on me if I say something he doesn't like.  He makes me nervous.  Hasn't actually ever gotten physically abusive, but I see changes in his personality and how he gets revenge when he's angry at me (canceling kids' doc's appointments in the past, etc)

Bottom line is, I am trying to be open minded toward him and keep lines of commmunication open and I want it to work both ways.  But I am not equipped to negotiate with him.

I suggested that we may have to change anything about the agreement thru lawyers.  We do have a parenting coordinator, so there's that.  I guess she'll have to take it up.

But in the meantime, what should I say or do?  And should I just give in eventually, once this does come up with a PC, and give him more time?

I could insist on a psych eval or custody eval first.  It's a lot to go thru for just Wed dinners, and if I do that, maybe he will be exacerbated and then things will get worse during his parenting time.  seems like exes go off the deep end during custody disputes.

Thanks for all suggestions and thoughts.

[momtara]

All of a sudden, exH is insisting on more parenting time because he misses the kids.  He admits that he misses me too.  He agreed during our long divorce proceedings last year to just see the kids Sat to Sun every other weekend.  Obviously that's not a lot of time.  He takes them to his parents' house when he sees them.  He has health issues and mental health issues and I figured that's what he can handle, and that's what he suggested, so it's been kinda ok.

SO yeah, going 2 weeks without seeing the kids (who are toddlers) is a long time.  But it was only over the last few weeks that he's been pushing to see them on my weekends.  When I say that it's too much pressure on me, he says, "But I miss the kids."

I could offer Wednesday dinners or even an extra overnight for the older child.  But I'm afraid of setting a precedent I might regret.  What do you think?

Complications:  I really regret never getting a psych or custody eval.  We were both broke.  ExH has mental health issues and wants us to get back together.  He is in counseling but I am doubtful he will get healthy enough for us to get back.  Things were fine until recently when he started pushing, telling me he's been in therapy over a year, he misses me, the kids, etc.  Of course he does.  Who wouldn't want to get back into a nice life?  I miss being married in some ways but it's not a healthy situation with him.  I do worry that he could get revenge on me if I say something he doesn't like.  He makes me nervous.  Hasn't actually ever gotten physically abusive, but I see changes in his personality and how he gets revenge when he's angry at me (canceling kids' doc's appointments in the past, etc)

Bottom line is, I am trying to be open minded toward him and keep lines of commmunication open and I want it to work both ways.  But I am not equipped to negotiate with him.

I suggested that we may have to change anything about the agreement thru lawyers.  We do have a parenting coordinator, so there's that.  I guess she'll have to take it up.

But in the meantime, what should I say or do?  And should I just give in eventually, once this does come up with a PC, and give him more time?

I could insist on a psych eval or custody eval first.  It's a lot to go thru for just Wed dinners, and if I do that, maybe he will be exacerbated and then things will get worse during his parenting time.  seems like exes go off the deep end during custody disputes.

Thanks for all suggestions and thoughts.

[Grey Kitty]

I've got questions:

1. Do you think that more time with their father will be better for your children?

You sound reluctant, but afraid of saying no. Can you clarify that:

2. (Assuming I'm correctly) What makes you reluctant?

3. What makes you afraid of saying no?

[ForeverDad]

ExH has mental health issues and wants us to get back together.

You're divorced, right?  "Get back together"?  Why?  For what purpose?  I'm not down on marriage, I'm all for it, but remarriage doesn't sound like a viable solution or even alternative.  Can you honestly look inside yourself and discern if that's what you want?

Sounds like there's some guilting going on.  (Guilting means that he gets two people on his side, him and you.)  "He misses the children."  And that took a year?  I don't doubt he does, but I suspect it's leverage to undo your recent boundaries aided b the divorce.  On his weekends how much is he involved with the children?

For more than 2 years after separation and during my divorce I lived with alternate weekends (and 3 hours in between if my ex showed up).  My court saw that as normal, even after she blocked my parent-child contact for 3 months when there were no orders.

If you do allow an evening in between, that's not a bad thing but stay alert, he's probably chipping away at the official limits.  As for visits and overnights for the older child, it's would be best if the children are not separated.

As for his wanting to get back together, it is not a kindness to say 'maybe' if it never will happen.  A firm 'no' is best so neither of you are kept dangling with what ifs.

[david]

 It's sounds like you are unsure what to do and the questions that Grey Kitty asked are a big part of the answer.

What is best for the kids ? A two household functional family. That ship has sailed.

What has been going on the last year when the kids are with him ?  Do the kids talk about it and like it or do they complain ? Have they asked to be with their dad more ? Have they asked for less time with him ?                                         

Does he actually spend time with them or does he drop them off at his parents house ? The kids may enjoy being with his parents. What have they said about that. Do you get along with his parents and can you talk to them ?

You have concerns and it sounds like you want the pc or someone else to make the decision. That may deflect the revenge away from you but it may not be what is best for the kids. That is something only you can decide. You know the details better than anyone else. Requesting an eval may give you an answer but it won't solve the problem.

[momtara]

Yes, you are right about the guilting and boundaries.

We ARE divorced.  He has been in counseling for a year and a half and that's why he thinks maybe if he changes enough, we can get back together.  I'm not sure exactly what to say about that, but that's a topic for another day.  I told his shrink a year ago I think he has BPD but his shrink, like many I have encountered, kind of shrugged it off.  Shrink is treating the anxiety with meds and talk therapy.  He think the meds will keep him calmer.  I guess that can't hurt, but I don't see it changing his distorted thinking, of course. 

Anyway, back to the issue at hand... .

As for whether it would be better for the kids to see him more, yes and no.  When he is in a good mood, sure.  When he is angry, I'm not sure.  Soo I like keeping it to two weeks.  He seemed fine with it.  What he really wants is to come in the house for a few hours on my weekend and play with them, or take them to the park. 

I try to see the situation in reverse and know how much I'd miss the kids if I were on the other end.  That's what is getting me, I guess.  But I guess that's a mistake, applying rational thinking to a not-rational person.

ForeverDad, yes, alt weekends may be standard, but a lot of people get Wednesday dinners or some such.  I think that would confuse our kids, as they are young.  If I give him that, it will indeed chip away.  On the other hand, the experts all say the same thing - as kids get older, parenting schedules change.  At some point, our kids may *ask* to see more of him.

Maybe what i have to do is assure them that things may change as they get older, and for now I think they are stable and we have a decent plan.  I just think if he brings it up to the PC, she may say, "Well, let's make a plan to revisit this in 6 months."  THen I regret it in 6 months.  I don't know.

[Grey Kitty]

If he wants to play games and ask for one thing when he wants another... . you've been down that road before, right? My reaction is to decide I don't like playing with that person.

What he really wants is to come in the house for a few hours on my weekend and play with them, or take them to the park. 

Your ex spending time with you and your kids sounds like a baaaaaad idea to me. If you are considering it, here's my recommendation:

First start spending time with him alone, w/o the kids as a test.

Only after this is really working well for you, fun, drama-free, healthy, etc. does spending time with him and kids sound like a good next step.

[momtara]

Well, that makes it sound like it'd be a step toward reconciliation, which isn't the way I want to go.  If he really does get better someday, fine, but I see it taking years. 

So my bigger problem is whether to accept that he wants more parenting time.  If what he really wants is to spend time as a family during my alternate weekends, well, part of me understands, but it makes me nervous to be around him for that long.  So the alternative is to tell him, you know, the kids are getting older, maybe you can take them on a Wednesday night.  But even that makes me nervous because I have a good thing going now.  I can deal with him less as it is. 

I know I can't keep this plan forever. 

I tried to express to him that the weekends are my time with the kids.  He pointed out that I have them all week.  I said I work and that's not the same thing, but it's hard to make a cogent argument about that.  The discussion didn't really get anywhere.  I need to frame it better.

[ForeverDad]

Well, that makes it sound like it'd be a step toward reconciliation, which isn't the way I want to go.

Good to get that stated up front now, you can see a boundary has to be there.  Yes, you can both be present for school functions and other similar situations but things such as him coming to your home - except for simple exchange encounters - will not be allowed.  Whether you allow rare exceptions for him to step inside briefly, that's for you to decide.  But if you allow it, expect he will try for more and more.  Boundary creep - computer programmers call it 'feature creep' which can get out of hand.

I have a very possessive entitled ex.  She has never allowed me inside her various apartments.  (Oh, there was one time she was trying to start a home business, she was in a proud mood, she wanted a rare exchange just outside and I declined.)  I allowed her to show her sister's family around my house once.  That's the only time I've allowed her back in.  I've kept a tight boundary ever since.  Of course, holding to a boundary is much easier when for years I've been threatened with police.

Although my county does publish a guideline parenting time schedule, they've told me it's only when the parents can't agree and an order doesn't necessarily follow it exactly.  But it does list the non-primary parent as getting only alternate weekends and an evening or overnight in between.  If the child is under three years old, it allows a couple short visits in between the alternate weekends.  So what he has now isn't that far off from a 'standard' order for a non-primary parent.  And if he has stability and mental health issues then that might be sufficient basis not to have visits in between the alternate weekends.

[Grey Kitty]

Well, that makes it sound like it'd be a step toward reconciliation, which isn't the way I want to go.  If he really does get better someday, fine, but I see it taking years.

I didn't think you were ready for this... . I saw letting him get involved with your weekends with the kids as a way to put you in a closer/more intimate r/s with him... . and I thought that you should go into that intentionally with your eyes wide open, rather than backing into it.

The dynamic sounds a bit like BPD-ish pull behavior to me... . or like a normal person wanting to spend more time with you. You will know when you are ready to take a step in that direction.

So my bigger problem is whether to accept that he wants more parenting time.  If what he really wants is to spend time as a family during my alternate weekends, well, part of me understands, but it makes me nervous to be around him for that long.  So the alternative is to tell him, you know, the kids are getting older, maybe you can take them on a Wednesday night.  But even that makes me nervous because I have a good thing going now.  I can deal with him less as it is. 

I know I can't keep this plan forever. 

I tried to express to him that the weekends are my time with the kids.  He pointed out that I have them all week.  I said I work and that's not the same thing, but it's hard to make a cogent argument about that.  The discussion didn't really get anywhere.  I need to frame it better.

The better way to frame it is with a boundary. "I am not going to involve you during my time with the kids."

You have no good reason to offer him Wednesday night as a way to soften it.

*IF* he accepts this, and still wants more time with the children, you can then negotiate with him about it.

[livednlearned]

If you start playing around with the court-ordered visitation, you undermine its authority, and you undermine your credibility. You covered a lot of ground in your initial order, and you stand to lose that ground if you start giving him more time.

Think of it this way: when someone (say your ex) wants to change custody, he has to demonstrate substantive changes in family court. That's a really high bar, and it's how seriously court takes the authority of its own orders.

Essentially, you have to prove in very convincing ways why the court was wrong. Your bar seems to be much lower than substantive changes. From what you've written, it sounds like the only reason you're thinking he should spend more time with the kids is because he's asking. On one hand, you think he is dysregulating, and on the other, you think maybe he should spend more time with the kids. You are afraid of him, but you are thinking about getting back together with him one day. Can you see how that reasoning might come across if you were having a conversation with a judge involved in your case?

Changing the custody order says: Mom thinks the custody order is not good for the kids. Then you have to explain why (on the defense), when court gave you xyz custody order, and you deviated it from it, are you asking to change it back, or deny your ex what you decided he could handle.  

Counseling would really help you with these kinds of issues, not just when stuff pops up, but in all parts of your thinking when it comes to making decisions about him. Can you see how the push/pull is as much your issue as it is his?

[momtara]

Thanks.  Yeah, that sounds about right.

I guess I worry that him not seeing the kids for two weeks makes him even more dysregulated.  He seems to get worse on the weekends when he's alone.  But I guess that's not my problem.

It is hard to justify keeping them from our kids (who are toddlers) for 2 weeks, though.  It's partly because of my fears, not because anything has happened recently.  A Wednesday night dinner wouldn't hurt our kids or him... . but that would mean I had to deal with him more, and it would hurt *me*... . and I guess it would confuse the kids too.

I have good reasons to want some consistency between his visits, some calm time.  It's just hard to know what to say to him when he wants more time.

[Grey Kitty]

It's just hard to know what to say to him when he wants more time.

Since you think it is best for you (and your kids) to keep things the way they are... . let a few eggshells go crunch when you say "no."

[ForeverDad]

I guess I worry that him not seeing the kids for two weeks makes him even more dysregulated.  He seems to get worse on the weekends when he's alone.  But I guess that's not my problem.

Then why is he alone?  He could go visit his family, relatives and friends, couldn't he?  He could change that if he wanted to.  Let him live his life.

While I hope I'm not disordered, my ex blocked my parent-child contact for over 3 months when we were in between orders.  When we finally got to court, the magistrate wasn't peeved, upset nor angry with my then-spouse.  He confirmed from her that our son indeed hadn't had time with his dad since the last time we had been in his courtroom and said, 'I'll fix that.'  He made a temp order same as the last, I got alternate weekends and an evening in between again.  No increased time, no makeup time, he didn't even wag his finger at her.  About 10 months later the court's own parenting investigator, a social worker, recommended I get 50% time, magistrate didn't increase my time, just went to the next step in the divorce process.  Five months later the custody evaluation report recommended she immediately lose temporary custody, judge didn't change a thing, just went to the next step in the divorce process.

The point is that you think you have to be overly fair to a fault.  You don't.  You just have to be a decent parent and pay attention to your concerns.  You don't have to step up when he falls short.  It's not your responsibility to jump every time your ex wants something.  Leave that to the court.  Believe me, court bends over backwards enough already to cater to the problem parents.

[momtara]

Forever dad, wow, 3 months.  That's ridiculous that they didn't change anything.  But we know how courts are.

Ok, thanks for the reassurance.  I do believe he misses the kids (they are very little and very sweet!) over 2 weeks.

Yes, he should see friends or do something on his weekends.  He's just not very social.  I suppose I knew that when I married him and I'm kind of a homebody too.  So I feel bad in that respect.