confused

[Parents! Get help here!]

Today I think my feelings are hurt more than anything, but I don't know.

Last evening I was sitting and playing with gs5,  he was snuggled against me and we were just giggling and being silly. DD30 tells gs it's time for night night.

I said, tell mommy your a big boy and it's time for bed... . so he giggled and said it. She was instantly angry, she started telling me to stop making him grown, he's just a baby, he's only etc. in the process she was taking him by the arm and trying to get him to his feet, he had been nestled under my arm, and he kept pulling back and cuddling against me, she actually slapped my arm and screamed for me to let go of him ( I was not holding him, and was astonished  by this outburst ). I stood up and walked from the room a little bit teary eyed, and she got him to bed. I am unsure of this inter action, but I think my feelings are more hurt than anything, and I am so confused about why she got so angry. I do  know this, I will never again tell him he is a big boy and she should stop using infantile terminology with him.

I also worry though about gs and how this affects him. 1st off he saw her slap my arm, and in my mind that is teaching him it's ok to act out aggressively when angry, not only that, but is he not supposed to grow and mature? He will be going to Kindergarten in the fall and I worry that he will struggle to fit in, he is very bright, but she does not allow him to explore and play normally because she is afraid something bad will happen to him, and she also uses very infantile type terminology when speaking with him.

Any advice on any of these counts. Im so lost at the moment.

[tristesse]

Today I think my feelings are hurt more than anything, but I don't know.

Last evening I was sitting and playing with gs5,  he was snuggled against me and we were just giggling and being silly. DD30 tells gs it's time for night night.

I said, tell mommy your a big boy and it's time for bed... . so he giggled and said it. She was instantly angry, she started telling me to stop making him grown, he's just a baby, he's only etc. in the process she was taking him by the arm and trying to get him to his feet, he had been nestled under my arm, and he kept pulling back and cuddling against me, she actually slapped my arm and screamed for me to let go of him ( I was not holding him, and was astonished  by this outburst ). I stood up and walked from the room a little bit teary eyed, and she got him to bed. I am unsure of this inter action, but I think my feelings are more hurt than anything, and I am so confused about why she got so angry. I do  know this, I will never again tell him he is a big boy and she should stop using infantile terminology with him.

I also worry though about gs and how this affects him. 1st off he saw her slap my arm, and in my mind that is teaching him it's ok to act out aggressively when angry, not only that, but is he not supposed to grow and mature? He will be going to Kindergarten in the fall and I worry that he will struggle to fit in, he is very bright, but she does not allow him to explore and play normally because she is afraid something bad will happen to him, and she also uses very infantile type terminology when speaking with him.

Any advice on any of these counts. Im so lost at the moment.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Thursday]

hi bp514eterson,

Sorry you are having a hard time right now.

One thing I always try to remind myself is that my pwBPD (my dxSD23) has a thin skin due to low self-esteem and that she is super sensitive to certain things.

In the situation you describe, I see that you are afraid that your DD is infantilizing her son. She says night-night and you want her to understand that you think your GS should be hearing "time for bed". To get your point across, you guide your grandson within her hearing to repeat your words to her.

This may seem like a challenge to her mothering to your DD. What if you had just said to your GS, time for bed without asking him to say it to her in the way that you did.

Your grandson could have then heard your point about not using such babyfied terms for going to bed but would have heard it without the power struggle being so front and center. Does this make any sense?

Kids are resilient. Chances are he will come to understand, through socialization,  which words are not cool for big boys and he will tell his Mom himself. It will only help him to deal with her if he sees his grandma using skills that better help his Mom stay regulated. And he will be better able to stand up for himself if you are seen being more straightforward.

thursday

[tristesse]

Hi Thursday,

Thank you for the insight, I didn't see it like that at all, but after you make some very valid and obvious points, I believe you are correct.

She probably did see my statement as a challenge to her parenting abilities. I know that I meant no harm, but how was she supposed to perceive it?

Sometimes I think my own feelings and emotions dictate my actions, and I should know better.

I am very glad to have found this sight with so many other people in the same boat as I am. I get relief just being able to voice my situation, and then I always get such helpful words of wisdom. so Thank you.

God Bless You Thursday.

[Thursday]

bp514eterson,

It is soo easy to get lost along this very hard path of parenting someone with this mental illness.

There is so much to learn, and so many great resources here. It's clear to see you are trying!

Try to do something for yourself today... . you've been going through so much.

thursday

[tristesse]

Thank you Thursday

[HealingSpirit]

Dear bp514eterson,

The sudden outburst you dealt with last night sounds all too familiar.  It is soo disheartening and frustrating, especially when it leaves you wondering, "What did I do wrong?"  I think looking at myself for the cause of her outbursts has been MY biggest problem so far in dealing with my BPDd.  Coming to this site has really driven it home... . It hasn't been ME all these years!  Our therapist has been telling me that, but it's hard to undo a lifetime of socialization that says otherwise.  This week, it is finally sinking in that my BPD has a very real mental illness, and so does yours.  You can't keep blaming yourself.  You did nothing wrong! 

I have a few ideas for you... .

1. Can you talk to your GS privately later about how it made him feel when his mother slapped you?  Perhaps you could let him know "No matter how angry you are, you may not hit or kick another person."  (I said this like a mantra when DD was little.)  Also let him know that grown-ups aren't perfect and sometimes even his Mommy forgets this when she gets mad.  Then you could offer him a better skill:  It would have been better for Mommy to take a time-out to cool off when she was mad, rather than hit.

2.  Remember what you can and can't control.  I personally think it's brilliant that you talk to your GS person-to-person, rather than using baby talk.  And like Thursday said, GS will eventually figure out for himself that he prefers person-to-person rather than baby talk.  Frustrating and sad as it is to watch DD treat him so poorly, you can't change that. (My heart goes out to you!) But you CAN continue being a positive example and influence on GS's life.

3. Some children (and adults) have trouble transitioning from one activity to the next.  It's not right or wrong.  I believe it's partly an inborn temperament trait. so, I wonder if there is some way to explain this to your DD when she's calm and receptive so that she can try giving GS a "5-minute alert" before bedtime, or ANY sudden change in activities, for that matter.  Kids are so in-the-moment, it's hard to switch gears from an activity they're enjoying or immersed in to a different activity.  I found the "5-minute alert" tool very helpful and I still do, even though my DD is 17.  To be honest, I also appreciate it for myself, as I find it hard to switch gears when I'm engrossed in an activity. Thank heaven for Smart Phones.  LOL!

I agree with Thursday.  Do something nice for yourself today.  You'll feel better after you "lick your wounds."

BIG HUG!

 

[tristesse]

Thank you Healing Spirit.

I appreciate what you have suggested, and Will make an effort to implement this when dealing with gs. He is a sweet loving boy.

I am struggling through this day, dd is texting some not so nice messages to me today, and try as I might not to take it personally, today I am failing in my efforts.

I feel like she could smell the blood of my wounds and has gone for juggler.

Im at work, so there is no way for her to even witness a reaction from me, and I AM not responding to her loathsome messages, but she is relentless anyway and they just keep coming.

Logic tells me she is hurting and that's why she is so out of control, but my heart tells me she hates me and is out to hurt me. 

A very tough day for me today, just feeling sorry for myself.

[HealingSpirit]

You poor thing!  Some days are just worse than others.  It sounds like today is one of those bad days for you. Hang in there!  It is so hard to have our spirit crushed every day, especially when we have given our best effort.

It's amazing how the BPD's can sense where your wounds are and keep pouring salt on them, isn't it?  It sounds like the intellectual part of you understands that your DD's constant attacks are because SHE is in pain, and not because YOU have done anything wrong.  With that said, I know all too well that the feeling part of you still feels very hurt.  I think we all have the right to feel sorry for ourselves sometimes.  It isn't fair that BPD's are so good at finding our most vulnerable places and then going for the jugular, as you said.

It's awesome you're not responding to her barrage of abusive texts.  Our therapist says, ":)on't stick your sail in her wind!"  Hang in there! 

[pessim-optimist]

A very tough day for me today, just feeling sorry for myself.

It's ok to feel sorry for ourselves sometimes. I am so sorry yesterday was a hard day, bp514etersen.

Logic tells me she is hurting and that's why she is so out of control, but my heart tells me she hates me and is out to hurt me.

Interestingly, both of those statements are true: the first part is more of an objective description of what was going on, the second part was your correct reading of how she felt at the moment. That is the important part - because of BPD, the person lives in the moment ruled by their overwhelming emotions. Not unlike a toddler - one moment they can hate you and mean it, and a few moments later, they might adore you.

Does that make it less painful to know this?

 

Im at work, so there is no way for her to even witness a reaction from me, and I AM not responding to her loathsome messages, but she is relentless anyway and they just keep coming.

I think your dd probably knows you enough to be able to guess what your reaction to her texts would be.

Not responding is one of the strategies that you can employ.

How do you usually get back to normal after these kinds of exchanges?

[tristesse]

Pessimoptomist,

The only way we ever get back to any sort of calm normalcy is to just go about our lives as normal. It doesn't get discussed because that just starts it up all over again. I was unable to move on as usual last evening and cried over everything. I cried unloading groceries, I cried putting them away, and I cried just because. My dh was so concerned he called from work today to check on me. But today is a better day, and I feel better. Thank you for your keen observations and wisdom.

[HealingSpirit]

Dear bp514etersen,

You've been on my mind today.  I've had too many of those particularly bad days to count, so I know what you're going through.  Even on my good days when I feel good, centered and strong, a single encounter with my DD's rage directed at me still wears me down and the hurt gets in, no matter what positive things I say to myself.  It's like being the target of a firing squad.

My question for you today is what have you done for yourself?  Do you take time out for YOU regularly?  Do you make time to do things you enjoy?  The worst period in my life was a few years ago when all the things I was doing to take care of me ended due to circumstances beyond my control.  (Pilates & Yoga instructors quit teaching in our town, the community band I was in dissolved, my singing group dissolved, DD's carpool to her school -30 minutes away- ended, etc.)  I lost too many of the things that lifted me back up and centered me back then, and the worst part was I had nothing left of myself to give my DD.  (She still uses this against me.)

I cared for my elderly MIL before she died.  The first thing they tell you when you are a full-time caregiver to another person is to take care of yourself first.  Much harder to do with a BPD in the family. 

Taking care of myself first is still a struggle for me, but I work on it every day.  I have hunch, this is also difficult for you too.  :-)

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[enlighten me]

This is an interesting one for me as my ex gf gets uoset at the thought of the children growing up too quick. Our son who is now 13 months old is getting big. I once said "He's growing up so quickly" and she had a moment. Snapped at me that she didn't want him growing up too quickly as she wanted to enjoy him being a baby.

She also babies her 8 year old son. She even spoon feeds him as he is a slow eater. Im sure half of his problem is her wanting to baby him.

I have thought about this a bit and the only conclusion that makes sense to me is that she is afraid of them growing up and leaving her. She gets the children (S8 D9) to say they're never going to leave home and puts thoughts into their heads about them all living together. Classic abandonment issue if you ask me.

[pessim-optimist]

But today is a better day, and I feel better.

That's really good... .    

Relax a bit and do something fun, ok?

And if you'd like to explore this situation some more, let us know... .

[tristesse]

Healing Spirit, thank you.

I also care for my elderly father, who is quite trying himself. I have tried to take time for myself, but for some reason am unable to let go and just engage in any activity that could be perceived as fun.  I am really struggling with depression right now, and I know it is due to the struggles with my dd. Taking care of myself is quite difficult, as I am sure you are aware.

I so appreciate all of  the kind words and wisdom that comes from this site. People who know and understand are such a great help.

[madmom]

I am so sorry to hear of your struggles with your daughter and gs.   I agree with everyone, take some time for yourself, even if you only get to go out and take a little walk around the neighborhood.  As for your grandson and the baby talk I have more than 30 years teaching experience, and degrees in early childhood, masters in ed. etc.  It would be better if your daughter did talk to your gs in adult terms, but I wouldn't make a big deal about it with her, instead model the appropriate talk to him when you can.  It is my experience that when he goes to kindergarten the teacher will let your daughter know if there is a problem.  Most children adapt better than you think and can/do understand the difference between baby talk and "grown up" talk.  I agree with others, your daughter's feelings are probably stopping her from being able to see him as growing up but that is not something you can control at this time.  Best wishes to you.  Please take care of yourself, you have so many responsibilities and people depending on you, that is you MUST do something for yourself on a regular basis.