Can't do anything right, think I'm switching to this board

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

It would have been funny if it wasn't so sad. Tonight I took out some hamburger vas was making into patties to put on the grill. I was struggling for some reason, patties just weren't cooperating. S8 was watching me and I commented that I was just not good at doing this, and that dad would come and redo all the burgers anyway. S8 told me "it's not you mom it's dad, you do lots of stuff right". I took the burgers out to the grill and came back in for something, sure enough H comes in with the burgers and starts redoing all of them. S8 walked in right then and we looked at each other, he said you were right mom. At that point I didn't even bother to cook, and lost my appetite too. I am so close to being done, I can't do anything good enough for him and don't care anymore, what kind of relationship is that? And my S8 can even see it, to the point where he sees it too, feels the same way, and feels the need to reassure me that I do lots of things right and I'm a good mom. Just a sucky feeling all around, and I think it's time for me to move to this board.

[mace17]

It would have been funny if it wasn't so sad. Tonight I took out some hamburger vas was making into patties to put on the grill. I was struggling for some reason, patties just weren't cooperating. S8 was watching me and I commented that I was just not good at doing this, and that dad would come and redo all the burgers anyway. S8 told me "it's not you mom it's dad, you do lots of stuff right". I took the burgers out to the grill and came back in for something, sure enough H comes in with the burgers and starts redoing all of them. S8 walked in right then and we looked at each other, he said you were right mom. At that point I didn't even bother to cook, and lost my appetite too. I am so close to being done, I can't do anything good enough for him and don't care anymore, what kind of relationship is that? And my S8 can even see it, to the point where he sees it too, feels the same way, and feels the need to reassure me that I do lots of things right and I'm a good mom. Just a sucky feeling all around, and I think it's time for me to move to this board.

[Ceruleanblue]

Hugs to you. Kids notice a lot more then we sometimes give them credit for. Of course you do lots of things right, probably even most things right. Just remember, this isn't YOUR issue, it's just inherently part of BPD to find faults in others, mainly the one closest to them. Knowing that though doesn't make it easier to deal with.

My uBPDh drives me crazy with the criticism, and at times I feel like he feels he is doing me an immense favor if he actually compliments me. Sometimes he'll compliment me, but then critique me, saying what I could have done differently... . .

We all just have to decide how much of this we can put up with, and what is healthy for us.

[mace17]

Hugs to you. Kids notice a lot more then we sometimes give them credit for. Of course you do lots of things right, probably even most things right. Just remember, this isn't YOUR issue, it's just inherently part of BPD to find faults in others, mainly the one closest to them. Knowing that though doesn't make it easier to deal with.

My uBPDh drives me crazy with the criticism, and at times I feel like he feels he is doing me an immense favor if he actually compliments me. Sometimes he'll compliment me, but then critique me, saying what I could have done differently... . .

We all just have to decide how much of this we can put up with, and what is healthy for us.

Thank you, ceruleanblue! I know what you mean, he rarely compliments at all, but very quick to offer criticism.  Just the night before, we were going to S8's baseball game, and I didn't drive the route he thought I should have taken so he was putting me down and saying something about me being dumb.  S8 started repeating what he said, so I gave him a little talk about not talking disrespectfully to mom.  First thing he said was "well dad said it" so I asked S8 if he thought it was right to talk to me like that and he said no, and I explained that grown-ups are not always right and we make mistakes too.  Of course H was completely silent through the whole conversation. 

I just get so frustrated sometimes, I know its not me but it is discouraging.  And then to have my son assure me that its not me, that dad is always that way, really hit me. 

[Forestaken]

my S8 can even see it, to the point where he sees it too, feels the same way, and feels the need to reassure me that I do lots of things right and I'm a good mom. Just a sucky feeling all around, and I think it's time for me to move to this board.

My D20 & S24 saw it too for many years.  :)uring their middle school years, they wanted me to divorce their momster.  Like you, I couldn't do anything right with her, but in addition,  I did it all despite she being a stay-home-mom.  

Is you S8 the oldest or the only child?  My concern is that someday, he'll become the target.

[mace17]

S8 is actually the youngest, but all the others are grown up and out of the house already, so its kind of like he's an only child. He has been a target of criticism too probably since he could talk and walk.  He is starting to understand that it's not him, so that's a good thing.

[mace17]

This morning H sends me a text wondering what he did wrong last night.  I replied that I just felt frustrated because it felt like I couldn't get anything right.  H said he hadn't given me a hard time about anything, and that he just redid the burgers and the raking that I had done because he wanted them done right.  at that point I just replied it's ok because I didn't want to discuss it, and then he sends back "no actually its not, and I can't say anything about it either because you'll take that the wrong way too".  I really didn't understand what he meant, so I asked what he meant, and he said to ask him sometime when we have time to talk.  Guess I'm in for an interesting evening soon... .

[Forestaken]

S8 is actually the youngest, but all the others are grown up and out of the house already, so its kind of like he's an only child. He has been a target of criticism too probably since he could talk and walk.  He is starting to understand that it's not him, so that's a good thing.

It's good and bad.  My kids know it's not them yet there are days (we are struggling now due to the cost of divorce and alimony) that S24 relives events of physical and emotional abuse.  He blames me sometimes for not acting sooner or protecting him better.

Tricks I learned with my X was

1) Learn their triggers - what sets them off.  My X hated single moms.

2) Don't take the bait.  Example: Her "I'm thinking about plastic surgery - what do you think?"  Me: "Ok, I haven't thought about it" Her "What do you mean you haven't thought about it?" Me: "I just haven't - It's not on my radar for spending money.  Vacation!" Her "You wouldn't want some kind of plastic surgery? or do you think you're perfect? (the bait)"  No, but I would like to get this skin tag removed from under my eye - I hate looking at it. Somedays I would like to razor it off" - deflect

[tiredndown]

IMO Your son is right... .

I remember that light bulb moment like it was yesterday, the minute that I was done. My suggestion for you would be to stop any and all thoughts about 'fixing' the marriage, and focus instead of your child. Spend every second from this point forward in showing him how to share ideas in healthy ways, etc, show him that he is THE . MOST . IMPORTANT . PERSON . IN . YOUR . LIFE

Take this time to put a stop the abuse cycle with YOU in the hopes that he will have happy & healthy relationships.

[enlighten me]

Hi Mace

That has really made me think about myself. Im slightly OCD and spent 12 years with a woman who left me to do everything. Im so used to doing stuff for myself or trying to help others that I now realise that what I saw as me being helpful was actually smothering.

I guess I need to chill out and let others do things even if the result might make my OCD cringe.

Thanks for the reality check.

[Zon]

2) Don't take the bait.  Example: Her "I'm thinking about plastic surgery - what do you think?"  Me: "Ok, I haven't thought about it" Her "What do you mean you haven't thought about it?" Me: "I just haven't - It's not on my radar for spending money.  Vacation!" Her "You wouldn't want some kind of plastic surgery? or do you think you're perfect? (the bait)"  No, but I would like to get this skin tag removed from under my eye - I hate looking at it. Somedays I would like to razor it off" - deflect

I am pretty slow.  It took me time to not reply to a question like that with humor with her.  Others would roll their eyes at:  "Perfect?  You can look me up in the dictionary under that word."  I will stress for other people on the board that the tone of the pwBPD may not match how they are feeling with that question.  That makes the bait stronger.

[mace17]

I agree that not taking the bait is really hard. It's almost like a challenge, and it's difficult not to take it on. I am slowly learning, if I do take the bait I never "win" anyway, and I end up being convinced I'm the crazy one. Even the text that H sent earlier was bait, saying he never told me I can't do anything right and that if he tried to explain it to me I would just take that the wrong way too. How else am I supposed to interpret it when he calls me stupid for not following the route he would take, or when he has to do everything over that I did? Of course I've been sitting here wondering all afternoon if maybe I am too sensitive and I'm the one who's misinterpreting. I really don't think so, but his comments like that make me question my perceptions. What do you guys think?

[tiredndown]

Of course I've been sitting here wondering all afternoon if maybe I am too sensitive and I'm the one who's misinterpreting. I really don't think so, but his comments like that make me question my perceptions. What do you guys think?

NO ! ! !

From one of Patricia Evans books on verbal abuse.

Any statement that tells you what, who, or how you are, or what you think, feel, or want, is defining you and is, therefore, abusive. Such statements suggest and invasion of your very being, as if to say, "I've looked within you and now I'll tell you what you want, feel, etc." Similarly, threats are verbally abusive because, like torture, they attempt to limit your freedom to choose and thus to define yourself. Verbals abuse is a lie told to you or told to others about you.

[mace17]

That's the thing though, he never did verbally say that I didn't make the burgers right or didn't rake the yard right, just gave me that exasperated look and did it over again.

Of course I realize that makes him be able to say he never actually SAID I didn't do it right, didn't actually criticize me, so now he can turn it around and accuse me of taking everything wrong. UGH! This is crazy-making!

Do you think people like him actually plan stuff like this out?

[enlighten me]

Do you think people like him actually plan stuff like this out?

I do think they plan it out.

I'll give you an example that happened to me.

I got up one morning and made myself a coffee. There wasn't much milk left so I had it black so that the kids had milk for their cereals. I then waited for everyone to get up and my morning reprimand for whatever crime I had commited. This could vary from leaving a glass out to being in the way.

My ex came down and saw me drinking coffee and went into one sying "That's ok you have yourself a coffee. Don't worry that theres not enough milk for the kids cereals". I showed her the coffee was black and she just stopped mid flow. This really flustered her.

Thinking about it at the time she must have gone to bed knowing there wasn't much milk but rather than say about me grabbing some more she baited the trap.

[Ceruleanblue]

Well, he didn't have to say you "didn't do it right", because HIS ACTIONS told you that. Don't get fooled by the fact that just because he didn't say something, that his actions are okay. They are not, and I think you've caught on to that fact.

If someone hit you, but didn't say they hated you, it would still be wrong, right? Well, his redoing your burger job, was a great big old, "I do it better", and "you can't even do burgers right". If it was just an isolated incident, related only to burger making, no biggie, but he clearly does this kind of thing to you on a regular basis.

Always judge someone on their actions. Actions don't lie.

[Forestaken]

Do you think people like him actually plan stuff like this out?

I do think they plan it out.

I'll give you an example that happened to me.

I got up one morning and made myself a coffee. There wasn't much milk left so I had it black so that the kids had milk for their cereals. I then waited for everyone to get up and my morning reprimand for whatever crime I had commited. This could vary from leaving a glass out to being in the way.

My ex came down and saw me drinking coffee and went into one sying "That's ok you have yourself a coffee. Don't worry that theres not enough milk for the kids cereals". I showed her the coffee was black and she just stopped mid flow. This really flustered her.

Thinking about it at the time she must have gone to bed knowing there wasn't much milk but rather than say about me grabbing some more she baited the trap.

I think they look for opportunities to attack.  The coffee siuation with me was that "I spill coffee all over the kitchen floor".  Until I told her we've been out of coffee for a week.

My divorce was tough on me but living with her was tougher.

Has he physically abused you?

[mace17]

No, no physical abuse.  The talk last night actually didn't go too bad, I think I have learned some stuff about communication from being on these boards.  I stayed calm and just told him how his actions made me feel and validated that he was frustrated because it hadn't been done the way he would do it.  He tried to argue that he didn't mean it that way, and that he had never actually criticized me, I just repeated how I felt.  I did get to hear how both me and our son are too sensitive and crazy for taking it that way, but he did apologize. I asked him to put himself in my shoes, I said what if you had mowed the lawn and I came out, didn't say a word, but just got out the lawnmower and did it over again, how would that make you feel?  He kind of got it at that point, realized that he would feel like I thought it wasn't good enough even if I hadn't said that. 

Hopefully this was progress, maybe I am learning how to communicate better too.

[Cat21]

No, no physical abuse.  The talk last night actually didn't go too bad, I think I have learned some stuff about communication from being on these boards.  I stayed calm and just told him how his actions made me feel and validated that he was frustrated because it hadn't been done the way he would do it.  He tried to argue that he didn't mean it that way, and that he had never actually criticized me, I just repeated how I felt.  I did get to hear how both me and our son are too sensitive and crazy for taking it that way, but he did apologize. I asked him to put himself in my shoes, I said what if you had mowed the lawn and I came out, didn't say a word, but just got out the lawnmower and did it over again, how would that make you feel?  He kind of got it at that point, realized that he would feel like I thought it wasn't good enough even if I hadn't said that. 

Hopefully this was progress, maybe I am learning how to communicate better too.

Hi Mace,

Boy can I relate on this front! My uBPDh has OCD (also undiagnosed, but based on what he's told me of his childhood and what I see now, it has to be OCD). Not a day goes by that he doesn't "help me" by "just pointing out" something I've done that I could do better. I've lost my cool many times over this hyper criticism and control freak behavior; we've talked about how much it bothers me and how it is really the farthest thing from "helping". Little by little, it's getting better. I don't get angry about the little things (at least, not visibly!) because I've set a boundary. I can ignore small things like "You didn't load the dishwasher properly" or "this dish isn't clean- I'll have to wash it again myself". Instead, when he goes into micro-manager mode, I let him. If he wants to take over the cooking because I'm not doing a "good enough" job, I step aside and do something else. If he wants to make the bed (it drives him bonkers that I don't "put on the fitted sheet properly", I let him. And when his nagging becomes too much for me to handle, I say, "I understand you're just trying to help and you are wonderful at doing many things. However, you're being overly critical and that isn't helpful to me right now. So, either (actually) help me or go have a seat and relax." Of course, he can't help but to make a few comments about how I'm wrong and he is always right, but it usually avoids an argument and I feel like I've asserted myself. He forgets about it 3 minutes later. Do you think it would help you to set a boundary on the excessive control?

[mace17]

I have set some boundaries, when he scolded me for doing his laundry wrong I told him to do his own laundry. I used to make his lunches, but when I was criticized for not shredding the meat small enough so there was exactly the same amount of meat on each square inch of bread, I said fine make your own sandwiches. At that time he accused me of not caring enough to make them right, and I told him that no I don't care that much, I would make sandwiches for him but not go to those extremes.

But other things I haven't had as much luck with. As much as he criticizes the way I do dishes, he also rarely does them, so if I want them done at all I have to do them myself. He has cleaned the litter box maybe 3 times in the last 9 years but still says I don't know how to do it right, since he's done it a couple times and is now an expert. Again, I can't just stop doing it because with 3 cats it needs to be cleaned every day.  So some of these things I can't really set boundaries, just ignore the criticism.

[Forestaken]

I used to make his lunches, but when I was criticized for not shredding the meat small enough so there was exactly the same amount of meat on each square inch of bread, I said fine make your own sandwiches. At that time he accused me of not caring enough to make them right, and I told him that no I don't care that much, I would make sandwiches for him but not go to those extremes.

So some of these things I can't really set boundaries, just ignore the criticism.

Making meals hell? My uBPD+dOCDXw threw a hot plate of food at me when her portion was slightly smaller than our S16 (teenage boys eat!)

My X rarely helped in the house, even though I worked 1 FT + 1 PT. 

How is you S doing? 

[Cat21]

Yes, Mace you're right- some things you have to do yourself, knowing there will be critiques. I hear ya!

Just now, my husband came home and saw the clean sheets sitting on the bed (since he has such a terrible time with the way I put on the fitted sheet- who knew there was a right way and a wrong way?- I leave it for him.) He said, "I guess I'll have to put on the fitted sheet, but you know, if you watch the way I do it, you can learn. It's little things you can do to improve yourself." I said, "Right. But since you already do it perfectly, I'll just let you." He continued to mumble about how I don't like to apply myself, which is why- apparently- I can't put a fitted sheet on the bed. I ignored it the best I could. Then, he said, "do you ever notice how I line up the pillows perfectly? Or is that not something you notice?" (I had to hold in my laughter, since 8/10 times, I make the bed- not him. I said, "Sorry, no- not something that I've noticed." He said, "Well, it just takes an extra moment- and DON'T say this is perfectionism. That has NOTHING to do with it." Again, I had to stifle the laughter.

Never a dull moment.

[Forestaken]

Then, he said, "do you ever notice how I line up the pillows perfectly? Or is that not something you notice?" (I had to hold in my laughter, since 8/10 times, I make the bed- not him. I said, "Sorry, no- not something that I've noticed." He said, "Well, it just takes an extra moment- and DON'T say this is perfectionism. That has NOTHING to do with it." Again, I had to stifle the laughter.

Never a dull moment.

Can't hold my laughter... .

My Xw: The towels in the linen closet were so perfect, no one could touch them but her (her only job - since it involved TV watching).  You had to ask for a new towel, she had her own "special towel" that no one else could use.  -> it's now the bath mat 

[mace17]

Yes, Mace you're right- some things you have to do yourself, knowing there will be critiques. I hear ya!

Just now, my husband came home and saw the clean sheets sitting on the bed (since he has such a terrible time with the way I put on the fitted sheet- who knew there was a right way and a wrong way?- I leave it for him.) He said, "I guess I'll have to put on the fitted sheet, but you know, if you watch the way I do it, you can learn. It's little things you can do to improve yourself." I said, "Right. But since you already do it perfectly, I'll just let you." He continued to mumble about how I don't like to apply myself, which is why- apparently- I can't put a fitted sheet on the bed. I ignored it the best I could. Then, he said, "do you ever notice how I line up the pillows perfectly? Or is that not something you notice?" (I had to hold in my laughter, since 8/10 times, I make the bed- not him. I said, "Sorry, no- not something that I've noticed." He said, "Well, it just takes an extra moment- and DON'T say this is perfectionism. That has NOTHING to do with it." Again, I had to stifle the laughter.

Never a dull moment.

This cracks me up - I had no idea there was a wrong way to put on a fitted sheet  . I can relate though, I never knew there was a wrong way to put meat on a sandwich either, or a hundred other little things.

[MammaMia]

Mace

Sounds like OCD which is frequently paired with BPD.  My son has both.  It is IMPOSSIBLE to do anything correctly.  He has to do or re-do everything EXACTLY the way he wants.  Example, if anything is moved 1/4 inch from where he wants it, he will notice and flip out.  It causes him great anxiety.

He simply cannot understand how others can be so "stupid" and "sloppy".  He is a total control freak.

Living with someone with OCD is very, very difficult and stressful.  And yes, it applies to everything imaginable.

[mace17]

Mace

Sounds like OCD which is frequently paired with BPD.  My son has both.  It is IMPOSSIBLE to do anything correctly.  He has to do or re-do everything EXACTLY the way he wants.  Example, if anything is moved 1/4 inch from where he wants it, he will notice and flip out.  It causes him great anxiety.

He simply cannot understand how others can be so "stupid" and "sloppy".  He is a total control freak.

Living with someone with OCD is very, very difficult and stressful.  And yes, it applies to everything imaginable.

I do see some elements of OCD but many things he just doesn't care about.  The dishes could be piled up, there could be laundry all over the house, the floor could be dirty, and he wouldn't notice that stuff.  So its like selective OCD or something.

[Forestaken]

Mace

Sounds like OCD which is frequently paired with BPD.  My son has both.  It is IMPOSSIBLE to do anything correctly.  He has to do or re-do everything EXACTLY the way he wants.  Example, if anything is moved 1/4 inch from where he wants it, he will notice and flip out.  It causes him great anxiety.

He simply cannot understand how others can be so "stupid" and "sloppy".  He is a total control freak.

Living with someone with OCD is very, very difficult and stressful.  And yes, it applies to everything imaginable.

I do see some elements of OCD but many things he just doesn't care about.  The dishes could be piled up, there could be laundry all over the house, the floor could be dirty, and he wouldn't notice that stuff.  So its like selective OCD or something.

Selective OCD - Is your H my Xw?

Her OCD dealth with what I or the kids did.  Or anything she did / wanted to do.

[mace17]

Yes it is strange - it seems to apply to doing dishes, laundry, mopping the floors, sandwiches, and cars.  Its frustrating because in many of the instances, it is about household chores that he does not do or rarely does, but he can criticize the way I do them.  I feel that if he's not willing to do it then he should just accept how I do it.  Case in point - we used to live in a very nice apartment complex where there was a dishwasher in the kitchen.  He has a thing against dishwashers, and used to complain if I used it.  He would go through all the dishes in the dishwasher when it was done, and usually end up putting at least half of them back in the sink and telling me I had to wash them by hand because the dishwasher didn't do a good enough job.  Eventually I gave up on the dishwasher, it just wasn't worth the fight.  I did try to tell him that this is how I prefer to do them and that if he wants them washed by hand he should do them that way, but it never worked.  When we bought a house, that was one thing he specifically looked for - one that did not have a dishwasher in it.

[MammaMia]

Mace

Oh yes, pwBPD spend their time looking for ways to make unnecessary extra work for us. 

It is a CONTROL issue. They love to supervise, bark commands, and tell us how incompetent we are.  Even when things are done EXACTLY as they want, they will find fault.  I have learned that it helps to prepare myself mentally, anticipate the criticism, and then just let it go.  Do not waste time arguing.

They crave feeling superior and in control of others... .perhaps because their own lives are so out of control. I do know two things:  It is part of the disorder, and it is frustrating as Hell.

[Forestaken]

It is a CONTROL issue. They love to supervise, bark commands, and tell us how incompetent we are.  Even when things are done EXACTLY as they want, they will find fault.  I have learned that it helps to prepare myself mentally, anticipate the criticism, and then just let it go.  Do not waste time arguing.

Gawd, how I wanted to shove that wet mop in her face.