The more I grow the bigger the fight

[3 children]

Does it ever feel like to anyone else that the better person you become the bigger the fight from you Bpd spouse (partner).   Almost like they have to go to greater lengths to prove your crazy, selfish, a jerk, sexist, etc...

So many articles talking about change starting with you first and you leading the way.  Seems to me (at least in my situation) like the more considerate, and selfless I become the more my wife has to fight to prove I'm an $&.  But the less ammunition she has.  Almost like she feels like she's loosing control and so the "crisis" modes I like to call them get worse.   More irrational more criticism more personal attacks more name calling. 

And ya she is in full crisis mode... .   Again.  Locked in the room won't talk to kids.  We are all against her... .

I love my wife and have faithfully for 15 years.  And I know deep down my feelings for her are leaving.  I feel pure sadness for people like this.   Life is short, to much time spent in "crisis"

Just wondering if anybody else is or has experienced this.

[enlighten me]

Yep been there.

My ex wife wasn't so bad when I was having a go at her but once I stopped rising to the bait she got worse. She went out of her way to let people know how bad I was. The more she did it and didn't get a rise out of me the worse she got until people around her started abandoning her.

Im waiting to see the fallout from my ex gf. When her and her ex husband split up she said he was stalking her, had tried to break into the house and had threatened her. I am now wondering how much of this if any is true.

[OutOfEgypt]

Yes, of course.  That is because they need to remain in control of the relationship.  They will do whatever to make sure you know you are the loser.  That way, they remain in control.

When our last recycle ended, it was because I confronted my ex on some things and said they needed to stop (things involving other men, back to a totally one-way relationship with zero respect for my feelings or wants).  She countered by saying she "just wanted to be friends" and then verbally condemning me for disappointing her all over again (i.e. "all of this happened because YOU were disappointing again".  Notice how that was basically he maintaining control of the relationship by a) ending it, b) blaming it all on me, and c) keeping it open-ended and saying we can be "friends".  No sadness.  No desperation.  Very matter-of-fact.  

A day later, I found out some things that really went on behind my back and told her I was done.  Like really done.  I told her she needed to get out of my house.  And she felt it.  She would sleep all day.  She stopped going to her college classes (and blamed me for failing and dropping one of them).  She would call me in the middle of the night (I slept in another room), and one time told me in a sad, crying voice "I'll love you forever!" and hung up.  That didn't work.  I remained committed to her getting out and to me moving on.  She would call me at work and cry about how she can't imaging growing old with anyone but me.  One night I heard lots of banging at like 3 or 4am.  She had smashed some things I'd given her over the years.  Later, I found that she smashed other things I gave her in the closet in the master bedroom where she was sleeping.  I mean literally smashed to pieces.  Glass and pieces of wood everywhere.  It took 3 and a half months to get her out.  I had to threaten eviction, bribe, etc.  And I stayed away from her because I know how she can be when she feels desperate (not that she would physically hurt me, but she might try to say I tried to hurt her and lie to get legal matters filed against me).

Well, eventually she started going out with her friends (even when she lived with me still) and met a new guy.  She was dating him probably within a week or two of moving out.  And now in spite of all the talk during our co-parenting classes, and personal talks, about how she would never introduce the kids to someone she's dating until she knows it is someone "long-term", she hangs out all the time with her new guy and the kids.  She's decided that this is "her time", since she has "given so much" to the kids over the years (which is totally laughable).

The point is that my ex has done whatever she can to re-establish control.  She gets my money, she has a new guy, she got a new car, she has a new dog, she is "happy as can be".  It even sickens our daughter, because it makes it seem like mommy didn't even care about the family she had.  If we argue, my ex says very nasty things and projecting things at me, to tell me that basically I'm depressed and miserable and always will be, and its my fault not hers.  She'll drop passive aggressive "jokes" on me, and she'll say little accusing things that tie to our past, even in front of a crowd of people (but... . "innocently", of course).  

The other day I gently and kindly asked her if she would consider lowering the spousal support because I'm having a hard time financially breathing and getting on with my life because of the severe financial limitations.  She wrote back and told me I should be "ashamed of myself" for even asking, because she is trying to get back on her feet.  She told me that the reason I can't move on with my new life is because of me, not her.  Where did I say anything about not being able to move on?  I didn't.  But see where her head is?  She wants to put her finger right where the wound is (and of course, that is probably projection underneath it all... . who is the one who is ashamed?  who is the one who will likely never move on, truly?  her)

It's about having the emotional upper-hand to her.  She's constantly trying to make sure I stay in the "guilty, beaten-down, ashamed loser" role, where she has control and can believe she's the winner who walks away.  Of course, if she knew I was saying this she would laugh and tell me what a loser I am for "thinking the worst" of her again, and that obviously "I can't move on" and that's why I really writing this.  But no.  It's true.  This is what they do.  We have to reach a point where we listen to our perceptions.  There is a large degree to which they don't even know what they are or how they are.  What will really kill her is when I finally completely heal and move on and she sees she no longer holds that string to my heart.  I look forward to that day with utter glee.

[mywifecrazy]

Yep been there.

When her and her ex husband split up she said he was stalking her, had tried to break into the house and had threatened her. I am now wondering how much of this if any is true.

My God it seems like most pwBPD operate out of the same PLAYBOOK. My uBPDxw said the same EXACT thing to me about her ex boyfriend. He was stalking her and he broke into her apartment. He also raped her and beat on her. 20 years later she was saying the same things about me beating on her and raping her... . Very Sick minds!

[enlighten me]

My God it seems like most pwBPD operate out of the same PLAYBOOK. My uBPDxw said the same EXACT thing to me about her ex boyfriend. He was stalking her and he broke into her apartment. He also raped her and beat on her. 20 years later she was saying the same things about me beating on her and raping her... . Very Sick minds!

The thing is its a proven formula. If it worked on you and it worked on the person before you then why wont it work on the person after you.

[OutOfEgypt]

From what I understand, they don't really have a sense of self.  That is ironic, actually, because my ex would constantly blame me and condemn me and tell me how I "have no identity of my own."  There was partial truth to that -I did become enmeshed with doing everything to keep the relationship alive, but it was also largely exaggerated.  She made it sound like I was constantly smothering her, which is not true, especially not in the last four or so years.  But I'm sure she needed me to believe that.  

Despite how they may condemn us, they are guilty of the same thing.  It's like a weird parasitic relationship.  They need us to lose ourselves completely into them in order to feel like they have a "them" for themselves.  Or better.  They are dependent on us in order to feel a sense of self and avoid that horrible emptiness.  At the beginning, it may be for the infatuation and attention. In the end, it is in us taking on the role of the "loser."

Not sure if this matches all of your experiences.  My ex is likely a combination of NPD and BPD.  My wife definitely has the "false self" that needs to be in charge, center of attention, and appear so strong and charismatic.  But man oh man... . it is a lie!  So next time you start feeling down about yourself, like you are the loser and they seem to stride right along, don't believe it.  It is an act.  A total lie.  At least you have a sense of self that is allowed to feel pain and anger and sorrow and love and true gratitude and happiness.  Theirs is buried where the sun doesn't shine.

[OutOfEgypt]

20 years later she was saying the same things about me beating on her and raping her... . Very Sick minds!

mywifecrazy, I've been blamed of similar things.  Not beating, but she claimed I tried to rape her once.  Of course it's a lie, but it's like... . how do you even respond to that kind of accusation?  Awful.

[3 children]

20 years later she was saying the same things about me beating on her and raping her... . Very Sick minds![/quote]
mywifecrazy, I've been blamed of similar things.  Not beating, but she claimed I tried to rape her once.  Of course it's a lie, but it's like... . how do you even respond to that kind of accusation?  Awful.[/quote]
Wow I get that... . it is amazing how similar they are almost like they all grew up in the same cult!     My wife has threatened all kinds of similar things.   Very serious and the ultimate threat of killing herself.   I don't know what to do.   She says how she has let everyone know about it and that she has told people things that would hold me responsible.   What do you do with that?    I feel so trapped.   I don't care about the other stuff she says about me, and maybe that's why she goes there now. 

[enlighten me]

3 children I would seriously think about protecting yourself. I take it you have children with your wife?

If she is spreading these allegations around and god forbid something happened to her then maybe you will be the one blamed. If it ever got back to you kids that you drove her to it then who knows how they would react.

Maybe invest in a Dictaphone and capture her behaviour on it. Or start a journal recording her behaviour. See a therapist and let them know about your concerns. 

[3 children]

3 children I would seriously think about protecting yourself. I take it you have children with your wife?

If she is spreading these allegations around and god forbid something happened to her then maybe you will be the one blamed. If it ever got back to you kids that you drove her to it then who knows how they would react.

Maybe invest in a Dictaphone and capture her behaviour on it. Or start a journal recording her behaviour. See a therapist and let them know about your concerns. 

Thanks for the advice.  Yes I have 3 children 18, 12 and 5.  The older one is very aware of the problems.  My wife has very much involved her in this (including the suicide talk).  Our 12 year old is already showing signs of damage because of her and openly says "I hate mom when she's like this".   Yesterday was horrible the kids were more involved than ever before and my wife said things to my oldest that would make most people sick to their stomach.   Amongst other things she told me to leave and turned to our 18 year old and told her to leave with me.   All because she is starting to stand up to her.  18 year old sees there is no real communication with her and no resolution.  Unless she gives up her own thoughts and feelings.   My wife proceeded to tell her how she betrayed her by standing up to her and how she has protected our daughter from me for 15 years. 

As you can imagine I have been criticized for just about everything I've done.  If I'm soft with my kids then I am labeled as "coddling".  So in the past I will give in and handle it the way she does and I'm labeled as a "nazi".  As you know this is the short version.   

I think my wife knows how serious I am about leaving and is scared to death to loose the house.  So the game escalates on her side. 

The counselor we have seen together has heard her suicide threats first hand.  He hasn't  diagnosed her but is aware that something is wrong.  She has been to the ER multiple times recently and stayed a night at the university psychiatric hospital.  All my fault of course.


I am ready to leave but still figuring out the best way to do it.  Scared  to death of the outcome

Thanks for the support 

[HopefulDad]

Yup.  You are changing and they don't like it.  With my BPDw, the extinction bursts of verbal abuse towards me took a while to subside, but have been replaced with silent treatment and a firm conclusion that I don't care about her.  She told me she would start telling our friends about "the truth" on how I "treat her", but I never heard much after that.  A couple of her friends I can tell distanced themselves from me so she obviously said something to them.  I had a conversation with a friend whose wife is quite close to mine and he said, "Okay, we've heard her side of the story, but I and the other guys can tell there's a lot more to this story that we're missing.  You want to fill us in?"  People aren't stupid.  They can figure out when something isn't right.

And no, I didn't fill him in.  I basically told him, "I hate to sound like a tease, but it's not right that I give all the details at this time.  But yes, you are correct that you clearly only have part of the story."

[enlighten me]

Its a tough one.

Firstly I would sit down with the kids and have a good talk about things when she's not around. Maybe not the 5 year old but the older 2 definitely. Ask them about how theyre feeling and what you can do to make it better. Explain about why your wife behaves the way that she does.

They will probably say they want out and don't want to be around her. By asking them and explaining to them whats going on it will prevent them from having future regrets. You don't want them finding out she is ill and then blaming you for not telling them as they would have stayed and supported her if they had known.

You also need to tie up any loose ends. Loans, credit cards ect ect. You do not want to leave and then have her run up massive debts to burden you more.

As I said before gather as much evidence against her as possible. You might not use it for attacking her in court but it could protect you against false allegations.

Then decide whether your moving her out or you will be going.

If your staying then how will you do it? Is she violent towards you? If so then having her arrested and getting a restraining order against her could work well. One thing that seems certain is that she wont leave without a fight.

Maybe speaking to a therapist about her suicide threats. In the UK you can get someone sectioned if they are a risk to themselves.

Whatever you decide good luck and remember to involve the children in the decision but not to involve them in the war.

[3 children]

Whatever you decide good luck and remember to involve the children in the decision but not to involve them in the war.

Thanks.   

The two older are involved at this point.  My wife has fully involved them in the war.  To the point she has told them both to "leave with their dad".  Who says that to their kids?   

Now that the kids are involved and her anger has turned towards them,  she is now saying we are "all" against her.  The kids have started to fight her back and call her on her behavior.   Of course she blames it all on me.   They are beginning to see clearly how ill she is.   And I have no doubt they will choose at some point to live with me.  Which I would obviously welcome.  Not as a "game" to turn the kids against her.   But because I love them.  (Obviously)  And want to be with them.

I have started to record things only for the purpose as you said for "defense" of needed.  Not to charge into court and attach.

I think today may be the day.  No resolution in site,  out of hope!

[losinghope97]

3 children,

It is almost unbelievable how close our stories are.  The crazy ex-boyfriend (my uBPDstbxw said hers would sit in a tree outside the house amongst other things), the accusations of rape, but the hardest of all is the older children’s struggle dealing with the BPD parent.

To your original point though, I think that our nature to try and be better in the face of the storm that is 'BPD', speaks to how it is we find ourselves member on this website. It seemed the better I was and the more I committed to making her happy (while losing myself), the harsher were her reactions and symptoms.  After all, they don't feel as though they deserve love, and when someone genuinely tries to give it to them, then there must be something wrong with that person and we know where it goes from there... .

As it relates to your older kids, be glad she is putting them on the outside with you.  My uBPDstbxw is triangulating me out of the family structure.  It is sad to say, but no matter how strong my relationship is with my kids, the nature of BPD when they have people isolated, can and will break any bond, much as it did between me and my family of origin.  So if you can keep them from being isolated from you, that is huge.

Stay strong,

LH97

[myself]

The more balanced we become, the more unbalanced they see themselves as being. Their way of facing it is by not facing it. Project/rage/etc.