Please help me

[roslinda]

Dear all,

I am seeking some advise here of what to do with my husband. I think he is a petulent BPD. For the past 3 weeks i was spending day and nites in the hospital looking after my one year old baby that suffered from pneumonia and heart complication. My BPD husband for the past few days had showed her rage towards me by accusing me having affair and the baby is not his. As much as i got really hurt with his accusation i also know he is behaving ridiculous all because of his disorder. After few days attacking me with rage, blaming and accusation finally i cannot take it anymore. Last nite i said i want a divorce and he put down the phone. That was the last conversation and i still in hospital. I said out of frustration and deep hurt. And no longer feel like to accomodate his unlogical sickness. But i have one weaknesses that make me feel like to amend the relationship because i cannot take the hurt when he starts to flirt around while i'm making a distance from him. Being disordered and petulent the moment he felt i'm serious of leaving him... .he will then immediately to start looking for a women for comfort... .and also most probably for sexual satisfaction in order to soothe his pain. I just cannot accept that. And that is my only weaknesess now. Please advise me... .or give me some kind of enlightment of how to check and balance of my own thoughts... .whether it's distort or normal? Please help me... .thank you very much.

As

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Mutt]

 

Hi roslinda,

I would like to welcome you. I'm sorry for what you and baby are going through  It's hard. It's frustrating, confusing and unsupportive when a loved one is showing disproportionate anger towards you she you're worried about your 1yr old. Not very compassionate or sympathetic. I'm sorry.

Has he show more hostility when you threatened divorce? Are you living together? Seperated? Are you getting help from family?

[roslinda]

Dear mutt,

Thank you for replying. We are currently staying together with my other children from my previous marriage... .10 yrs old boy and 5 yrs old girl. We currently have a family dynamic. Where also his two daughter from his previous marriage came to stay with us 3 days in a week. We have children at stakes at the moment which mostly my utmost concerned everytime i'm considering separation.

also at the same times we just got married a year and half ago and just got a baby. I still not strong enough to leave the relationship. And also i cannot take the facts that he will replace me on instant basis once i ignore him.

those 3 reasons are my biggest weaknesses at the moment.

no he is not hostile yet to me because i still inside hospital. Do not know once i go back home though. But he is currently keeping a distance and ignoring me. He is usually will start flirting once i ignore him. This is a usual pattern. He can do it on instant basis. Which will hurt me tremendously.

[livednlearned]

Hi rosalinda,

I wanted to join Mutt in welcoming you to bpdfamily, and I'm glad you found the site. You've been through a lot, worrying about your baby's serious health condition, and like you said, your husband is not behaving the way you would expect the father of an ill baby to behave. He is not able to cope with his fears and instead creates drama that only makes things worse.

There are specific tools (communication, validation, boundaries, timeout) that everyone in a relationship with a person suffering from borderline personality disorder needs to master. People with this disorder tend to perceive the world differently than you and I, but there is an order and the rationale within that perception - it's not just random craziness as we might sometimes think. Our senior members on [L5] Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner are very good at helping apply these principles to everyday life problems. The educational material associated with that group is based on the work from leading experts in the disorder.

I hope your baby is doing better, and that you find some peace as you and your husband work on making things better for the whole family.



LnL

[roslinda]

Dear LnL,

Thank you very much for your encouraging words. Lucky I was a psychology student before. So this kind of thing are in my basic knowledge though still very tough for me to understand when it comes to the real thing compared to theory.

Now I am asking for divorce today he becomes very hostile. Start to attack me with all kind of harsh words and start accusing me wanting to go out with other men, wanting to start another affair. Wanting to betray him. All kind of craziness and madness came out from him. facing it in reality is really shocking and challenging at the same time. But the most important thing is I have basic knowledge. But I would love to further understand this sickness.

I would really appreciate if you could explain me more about these sentences that you replied me... .

"but there is an order and the rationale within that perception - it's not just random craziness as we might sometimes think."

What is his rationale for behaving like that? And why it's not just random? You mean there already series of thoughts before came to this stage? Anyway, he always behave like this whenever he got jealous with me.

But this time his craziness came after i stayed in the hospital for the past 3 weeks and not at home beside him.

I would really appreciate some enlightenment with regards to this madness. Thank you very much.

[Mutt]

I would really appreciate if you could explain me more about these sentences that you replied me... .

"but there is an order and the rationale within that perception - it's not just random craziness as we might sometimes think."

What is his rationale for behaving like that? And why it's not just random? You mean there already series of thoughts before came to this stage? Anyway, he always behave like this whenever he got jealous with me.

Hi roslinda,

I'll explain with the example that you provided. He became hostile when you mentioned divorce. The rational is at the center of the disorder is abandonment, abandonment fears, a narcissistic injury, the core wound of abandonment. He's acting out because he fears abandonment perceived or real. I hope that helps.

[livednlearned]

Good explanation from Mutt! I also noticed that anytime my ex husband was dealing with any difficult feelings (ie. shame, humiliation, rejection, abandonment, loss, inferiority) that he became abusive. If my attention was focused on my son, N/BPDx would experience jealousy. Even if I showed my dog love, he had a hard time.

But like Mutt said, extreme fear of abandonment is at the heart of BPD, so mentioning divorce would be particularly hard. In general, I found it best to treat N/BPDx as though he was a young child. When I filed for divorce, I already had a full plan in place. There was no discussion.

roslinda, the articles on validation and communication techniques like SET and DEARMAN might be very helpful to you right now. These tools can help minimize the conflict because they provide emotional validation to the feelings your ex is experiencing, even if you do not agree with his logic. There are so many tools like this on the Staying board. Even if you are certain that you'll be divorcing your husband, the tools and understanding how BPD works will help you understand the underlying dynamic, and this can help you feel a little less disoriented by the behaviors.

[Pou]

I am sorry about your situation.  If you want my honest opinion, I think it is too late to be concerned about what you are worrying about him looking for someone else … if your husband indeed has PD as you think he has, then the reason that he is accusing you having an affair is probably because that he is projecting his own behavior on you.  I am not 100% certain, but that could have been the case.  You are doing the right thing as a mom to care for your child and you should not let your husband's irrational behaviors and accusations affect you.  It is not easy to do and no doubt he will affect you and how you feel about yourself.  Look for support on this forum, friends and relatives, start to talk about your situation… not many people can understand or even believe what nons have to go through, but you must make a connection with someone who would listen ... that would help you anchored.  You would think a normal husband would be by your side in the hospital with you … you have my positive thoughts and I hope that your child will be well soon.  Warm wishes. 

[roslinda]

Dear Mutt, LnL and Pou,

Thank you very much for everybody advise. Through reading and case study I can understand the fear of the abandonment as Mutt mentioned though I cannot rationalized the action and respond towards it. But at least I can understand. The only part that I cannot understand why mere fear can be soo real to them? Why a mere imagination can be soo real to them? Fear I can understand because we all have fear. But fear is not reality. So most of us will try to concur fear. That is normal. But for BPD fear is reality to them and it's felt soo real as if it's really happening. As for this I really having a hard time to comprehend. I would really appreciate someone able to enlighten me here... .really really appreciate such effort.

I may assume was it because of his soo many numerous times of failed relationship? which many of them left him? Of one prominent experienced usually first love? and which he never talk about those hurtful event? or as classic as any cliche for BPD that those already precipitated from his childhood?

Will talking about his hurtful event in his life will help him? But of course it's like open up his pandora box and when he started to go wild then I really do not know how to do the closing. Think about it also not a good choice.

Thank you very much LnL... .i really never knew that attending to my children, dog and cats also will bring about his inferior... .but i totally agreed with you when he is facing many other problems in his life such as debt, not enough money, stress at work, boss critique, frens comment also will make him looking for me as his punching bag.

When I highlighted this to him of course he will honestly deny it. To him he is attacking me with accusation because he is valid. Honestly, this is insane and madness to normal people. I think I will bargain with God a place in heaven if I really survived this marriage and make it success. heeeeeeeeeee

Dear Pou, thank you very much for your kind empathy with my situation. My baby today will be discharged after one month admission. Thank you God. Pou... .it's really hard. Nothing make sense... .everything is insanity. Total madness. hahahahahahaha... .... .because it's soo madness until I am laughing at it currently. I think I agree with LNL that I finally look at him as a child. A wounded child. But the problem is how on earth am I going to make love to a child sooner or later? this feeling will disturb me in bedroom eventually I think. Because I need a man not a child... .worst still not a wounded child.

But put joke aside... .I still want to make this marriage success. I am taking up the challenge simply because I think I can. It just that I need more information of how to navigate and comprehend the whole mystery.

Please help me to achieved my goal. And thank you very much for standing by me... .

[livednlearned]

Thank you very much for everybody advise. Through reading and case study I can understand the fear of the abandonment as Mutt mentioned though I cannot rationalized the action and respond towards it. But at least I can understand. The only part that I cannot understand why mere fear can be soo real to them? Why a mere imagination can be soo real to them? Fear I can understand because we all have fear. But fear is not reality. So most of us will try to concur fear. That is normal. But for BPD fear is reality to them and it's felt soo real as if it's really happening. As for this I really having a hard time to comprehend. I would really appreciate someone able to enlighten me here... .really really appreciate such effort.

I was reading today that there are many more neurological connections in human that go from feelings to thinking. There are far fewer connections that go from thinking to feeling. So it's largely biological, but in people with BPD, for whatever reason, feelings = facts most of the time.

Another issue is that emotionally, people with BPD return to baseline much slower. Whereas you and I might experience an irritant and feel annoyed, once that irritant has been removed, we return to baseline fairly quickly. For people with BPD, they become emotionally aroused (and not in the good way) quite quickly, and then return to baseline much slower.

To me, that is partly why they seem like children.

[Grey Kitty]

Hello and welcome, roslinda!

I may assume was it because of his soo many numerous times of failed relationship? which many of them left him? Of one prominent experienced usually first love? and which he never talk about those hurtful event? or as classic as any cliche for BPD that those already precipitated from his childhood?

If I had to guess, I'd guess that the sort of behavior he's showing now does a better job of explaining prior failed relationships than the other way 'round.

But that doesn't help you. What will help you is trying to "stop the bleeding" in your relationship.

The first two things to focus on are not invalidating him, and enforcing boundaries to protect yourself from abuse, even if it is only verbal abuse.

You probably invalidate him in ways you don't even notice. One tip is never JADE. Never Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain. You will be accused of all sorts of fantastic crap by him. Stuff you didn't do, and would never do. You naturally WANT to convince him that it isn't true, and you will reach naturally for JADEing. And you will see that when you do it, he just gets worse. Saying nothing works better.

Here's a boundary enforcement tip: If he's verbally abusing you on the phone, just tell him that you won't listen to that, then say goodbye. (No need to tell him you want a divorce.) It will benefit you a LOT to be consistent with this.

[believer55]

Hi Roaslinda - my heart goes out to you and your children. I think at this stage you need to make sure you are in a safe place and have a lot of support around you. You cannot rescue him or fix him. Is there any chance there is more involced here - ie substance abuse etc? I remember being pregnant with my second child and my ex ringing me at work to say our daughter was not his etc. He was at the beginning of a psychotic episode (brought on by substance abuse). Just a thought. Your number one priority is you and your children and then when you feel strong and supported look at ways you may communicate with him. I understand the thought of him being with another woman is a strong motivator to stay - but nothing will change for you and your children and you deserve better.  

[Pou]

Dear Pou, thank you very much for your kind empathy with my situation. My baby today will be discharged after one month admission. Thank you God. Pou... .it's really hard. Nothing make sense... .everything is insanity. Total madness. hahahahahahaha... .... .because it's soo madness until I am laughing at it currently. I think I agree with LNL that I finally look at him as a child. A wounded child. But the problem is how on earth am I going to make love to a child sooner or later? this feeling will disturb me in bedroom eventually I think. Because I need a man not a child... .worst still not a wounded child.

Roslinda, Hope your baby is doing well.  For over 4 years, ever since my wife's PD escalated … every year I thought it would get better and it didn't.  Then it took another 3 more years for me to accept this is what I have to live with as long as I stay.  So I prep myself for all the madness in my situation … so I can better take them psychologically.  True to its form, her behaviors are eerie similar (if not identical) to the books about PDs (NPD in particular).  I am not prepared for the endless drama, but I am educated … so I won't lose my mind.  My advice to you is to weigh your situation carefully … are you better with him or without him.  Who and what are the collateral damages?  Do a mock "divorce" scenario in your mind and see how that will play out.  You can not worry about him being with another woman, because … trust me, it is not within your control and therefore, you should not concern yourself over that.  No matter how good or how bad you treat him, if he is going to be with another woman, he will. Nothing you can do to stop him and you may never find out … and that is also not important.  What is important to you is how you are being treated.  Warm wishes.

[roslinda]

Dear LnL,

Thank you for your opinion. Yes feeling = our primitive limbic systems... .now I remembered. Was first to developed. Stored in pituitary gland became memory. And logical and wise mind was last to develop at our frontal lobe. Thank you again for reminding me.

To interrupt the pattern... .we must first break the wave pattern... .the thoughts pattern... .we can do it painfully via emotion... .or we can do it painfully via physical. either way will break the wave pattern.

Now I'm getting somewhere... .please give me more of your opinion LnL... .I know you have abundant in you... .

What we are doing now is long and lengthy process of validation, empathy, sympathy,understanding, boundaries, values... .though after years it shows improvement. we are finding alternative.

Will be great ya if we can find a solution base on abrupt distortion of emotion and feeling.

Let say they fear abandonment... .abrupt distortion is to love extremely consistently further than their equilibrium breakdown cycle. But of course difficult to coil them... .

I love exploring this mysterious people... .thank you LnL

[roslinda]

Dear Grey Kitty,

Thank you very much for your JADE tools... .this is very useful. Thank you very much.

[roslinda]

Dear Believer,

Thank you for your advise... .yes he was intoxicated with alcohol.

[roslinda]

Dear Pou,

Thank you very much for your advise Pou. I will keep your advise in my mind. I will ponder upon it. Thank you very much.

[Grey Kitty]

Are you still staying at the hospital with your baby?

What is your husband doing today, and how are you coping with it?