meeting his ex for coffee. ?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

My ex of 3 weeks told me yesterday he is meeting his ex for coffee today. No surprise there you might be thinking but this ex had been painted to me as a psycho woman - manipulaive, cheating, deceitful etc. He completely cut off from her for the 2 years we were together because of the treatment he received. He says he wants to have her as a friend, forgive and forget .

I am now questionning everything. Was he lying the entire time?

I know I cant get answers but am so confused.

[pavilion]

My ex of 3 weeks told me yesterday he is meeting his ex for coffee today. No surprise there you might be thinking but this ex had been painted to me as a psycho woman - manipulaive, cheating, deceitful etc. He completely cut off from her for the 2 years we were together because of the treatment he received. He says he wants to have her as a friend, forgive and forget .

I am now questionning everything. Was he lying the entire time?

I know I cant get answers but am so confused.

[Infared]

... .and ask yourself this question:

Why is he telling your this?   

[Suspicious1]

Suspect she was split black for those two years, and now she's being split white.

My ex split his ex-wife black while we were together (18 months). I expect her to be split white any moment.

And yes, he's telling you this for a reason. He's going for a reaction or trying to prove a point.

[Recooperating]

I agree... .Why would he be telling you this? His business is none of your business!

I know how you feel tough... .My exBPD also told me horrible stories about his ex-wife for years! Clearly seeing things from a different perspective I think she just reacted to his BS. She's probably not as bad as he made her out to be. I never spoke to her in person, so wouldnt know! I am sure he's saying the same things about me now. Quite funny how all his exes turn out to be complete psychos, isnt it?

But its not my problem anymore! Hooray! I dont have to care anymore!

[pieceofme]

my ex cheated on me and has since returned to his ex. he always made her out to be crazy, drama-filled, manipulative, obsessed with him, etc. i never really believed it, until she started attacking me and my relationship with him. she faked a pregnancy. she continues to publicly cyber bully me (and he lets her). regardless of what he says about her, she truly is a vile individual to me. i now wonder if they were ever really broken up. it is a bitter pill to swallow.

[Popcorn71]

My ex kept in touch with his ex wife all through our marriage/relationship of 9 years.  They had no reason to be in contact.

He always told me how terrible she had been to him.  How she had aborted his child and spent all his money.  He compared me to her and at the start he would say how much better I was.

As time went on, little comments came out like she was a much better cook, she always took pride in her appearance and dressed well, etc.etc.  All designed to chip away at my confidence and keep me in my place.  He even told me about their sex life which I found to be repulsive and weird.  I believe he was trying to make me compete.

Your ex is telling you this for a reason.  That reason will be of benefit to him only.  Just don't listen to him and don't give him the satisfaction of showing any interest in it at all.  That's what he wants.

[Caredverymuch]

My ex of 3 weeks told me yesterday he is meeting his ex for coffee today. No surprise there you might be thinking but this ex had been painted to me as a psycho woman - manipulaive, cheating, deceitful etc. He completely cut off from her for the 2 years we were together because of the treatment he received. He says he wants to have her as a friend, forgive and forget .

I am now questionning everything. Was he lying the entire time?

I know I cant get answers but am so confused.

Ppl are attachments.  They never fully cut their attachments free. And, they triangulate constantly in order to be seen as the victim. Its always the other persons fault for not giving them enough. He will complain about you the same way. This is common behavior. When they triangulate they are seeking attention and there is nothing more delicious to a pBPD then the two others in the triangle battling for the " win".  This is why he had told you about the " coffee."

[Blimblam]

This must be incredibly confusing for you and painful. Indicated by the ?  I'm sorry. It hurts

Where does it hurt?  Where do you feel the pain inside?  Go there within you self if you want to find who you are.

In a round about way it his way of showing you one day he will forgive you if you create the space you need to heal and decide to reconnect.

[pieceofme]

He always told me how terrible she had been to him.  How she had aborted his child and spent all his money.  He compared me to her and at the start he would say how much better I was.

As time went on, little comments came out like she was a much better cook, she always took pride in her appearance and dressed well, etc.etc.  All designed to chip away at my confidence and keep me in my place.  He even told me about their sex life which I found to be repulsive and weird.  I believe he was trying to make me compete.

my ex compared me to his ex, too, and said the same. recently however, he has turned that i am now "worse than her." strangely, SHE told me about their sex life... .rather, posted it publicly on instagram for me to see. it disgusts me   i often wonder if she has BPD herself.

When they triangulate they are seeking attention and there is nothing more delicious to a pBPD then the two others in the triangle battling for the " win". 

this is my experience, as well. my ex loved playing me and his ex against each other. he would often complain, "y'all are driving me crazy! i'm just going to be alone!" as if he hadn't created this very situation himself. i never understood that one.

[pavilion]

Thank you for your replies.

I have an update. I didnt ask but he told me last night that the meeting with his ex allowed him to feel empowered. He has been reading BPD self help books and has decided that he needs to stop cutting people off. He told me that she is still as screwed up as ever and cheating on her current boyfriend ( she is going to leave him).  They are going to stay friends and remain in contact and he is not in the least bit attracted to her sexually.

He says he only wants me. I am the only one he has truly loved. I have helped him more than anyone etc. My response is to keep saying "I can't do relationships".

I want to believe he is being honest and is becoming a better person but part of me feels that is naive.

I would appreciate your thoughts.

Thank you

 

[pieceofme]

i had the same experience with my ex. he said almost the exact same things. what i have learned is that what they say is what they feel at that very moment. it's not necessarily a lie, but it's not the truth as you and i know it. his mind may well change just as quickly in the other direction. in my case, my ex did just that.

i know you want to believe him. i still want to believe my ex. it's hard when you feel such love for someone and would do anything to make it work. it's almost impossible, though, because we're living in two separate realities.

[pavilion]

i had the same experience with my ex. he said almost the exact same things. what i have learned is that what they say is what they feel at that very moment. it's not necessarily a lie, but it's not the truth as you and i know it. his mind may well change just as quickly in the other direction. in my case, my ex did just that.

i know you want to believe him. i still want to believe my ex. it's hard when you feel such love for someone and would do anything to make it work. it's almost impossible, though, because we're living in two separate realities.

And that is what I have to hold in mind... .that his reality could change at any moment. At the moment I am idolised and he is trying to win me back. It's as if he has read a text book all about what I want and need from a man and is doing exactly that. I can see exactly why NC is best but don't feel ready for that yet.

[Infared]

i had the same experience with my ex. he said almost the exact same things. what i have learned is that what they say is what they feel at that very moment. it's not necessarily a lie, but it's not the truth as you and i know it. his mind may well change just as quickly in the other direction. in my case, my ex did just that.

i know you want to believe him. i still want to believe my ex. it's hard when you feel such love for someone and would do anything to make it work. it's almost impossible, though, because we're living in two separate realities.

YES,... .that's PERFECT! ... .think 3-year-old. How a child just changes their mind for whatever reason... the wind blew? (Which is the wonderful enjoyment of the free beauty that is a child... .but it really doesn't cut it for an adult in a relationship).  

[pieceofme]

i have been in your shoes and completely understand your feelings, confusion, apprehension, ec. the last time my ex begged me to take him back, it was literally non-stop begging ALL day. he said he wished he had one more chance to start over so he could do it again and not take me for granted. he admitted all his wrong-doings (although only after i pointed them out to him, so i assume he was just mirroring). he said he would never give up or lose hope, that he would try forever to get me back. even left long-stemmed red roses on my doorstep. that same night, i caught his ex sleeping at his place.

NC has been difficult for me. it's hard losing my best friend, my lover, the person i spent all day, every day talking to. yesterday was the first day that i actually had the strength to ignore his attempts at contact. it broke my heart to ignore him. i still love him so much.

the good thing about this board is that everyone understands. we've all been there and will support whatever decision you make (staying or leaving)

[Mutt]

Suspect she was split black for those two years, and now she's being split white.

My ex split his ex-wife black while we were together (18 months). I expect her to be split white any moment.

And yes, he's telling you this for a reason. He's going for a reaction or trying to prove a point.

His ex is now split white and he used to denigrate and devalue her to you.  He has difficulties seeing the grey areas in life and people. He will overvalue or undervalue people. It's in his mind. Splitting - a primitive defense mechanism for anxiety / stress. It is so confusing and painful pavilion. You suffered a loss. I'm sorry  

[Infared]

i have been in your shoes and completely understand your feelings, confusion, apprehension, ec. the last time my ex begged me to take him back, it was literally non-stop begging ALL day. he said he wished he had one more chance to start over so he could do it again and not take me for granted. he admitted all his wrong-doings (although only after i pointed them out to him, so i assume he was just mirroring). he said he would never give up or lose hope, that he would try forever to get me back. even left long-stemmed red roses on my doorstep. that same night, i caught his ex sleeping at his place.

NC has been difficult for me. it's hard losing my best friend, my lover, the person i spent all day, every day talking to. yesterday was the first day that i actually had the strength to ignore his attempts at contact. it broke my heart to ignore him. i still love him so much.

the good thing about this board is that everyone understands. we've all been there and will support whatever decision you make (staying or leaving)

Yes, it is soo hard to accept that the person is NOT who they say they are. They are their actions.  Painful, painful adult stuff. Absolute NC I was my only salvation and sanity... .I would have given anything for that not to be the case... .but if I was going to love myself, it was my only choice.

[seeking balance]

He says he only wants me. I am the only one he has truly loved. I have helped him more than anyone etc. My response is to keep saying "I can't do relationships".

I want to believe he is being honest and is becoming a better person but part of me feels that is naive.

I would appreciate your thoughts.

Thank you

 

My honest thoughts based on this thread alone are that you are in still a "relationship" with him, since you are having real, serious conversations about his life.

As such, I wonder if Leaving is going to give you the tools necessary for a friendship of sorts.

What are your goals for him in your life?

[pavilion]

My honest thoughts based on this thread alone are that you are in still a "relationship" with him, since you are having real, serious conversations about his life.

As such, I wonder if Leaving is going to give you the tools necessary for a friendship of sorts.

What are your goals for him in your life?

This is a good point to make Seeking Balance. My aim was to still have him in my life as a friend. The reasons behind that are because I enjoy his company and get intelligent conversation (as long as he's not going off on a rant), I am not feeling ready to let go of him from my life completely and because he has nobody (apart from his ex now!).

This week I am alone because my children have gone on holiday with their dad so it is a particularly vulnerable time because we would usually be spending it together. I must point out that I do realise that most of our time spent together over the last 6 months was not fun or enjoyable but the mind has a funny way of reminding you of the good parts.

[seeking balance]

This is a good point to make Seeking Balance. My aim was to still have him in my life as a friend.

What is your AIM now?

No need to justify whatever you choose to do; just the tools you need for detaching and dealing with grief are here on the leaving board.  The tools necessary for being friends with a pwBPD are staying - boundaries, communication skills, depersonalization, understanding triggers, etc.


Best,

SB

[pavilion]

This is a good point to make Seeking Balance. My aim was to still have him in my life as a friend.

What is your AIM now?

No need to justify whatever you choose to do; just the tools you need for detaching and dealing with grief are here on the leaving board.  The tools necessary for being friends with a pwBPD are staying - boundaries, communication skills, depersonalization, understanding triggers, etc.


Best,

SB

My aim is to detach but I feel myself being pulled back in because of his behaviour and my difficulty with holding boundaries in place.

I loved this guy so much and it is hard to let go of the fantasy of what could have been. I have 2 children, 1 of whom was treated as his scapegoat for the time we lived together and I know I meed to detach for their sake as much as my own


I apologise if I am sounding flaky and uncertain. Rationally I know what I need to do but my emotions aren't so sure.

[seeking balance]

My aim is to detach but I feel myself being pulled back in because of his behaviour and my difficulty with holding boundaries in place.

What are your specific boundaries? 

I apologise if I am sounding flaky and uncertain. Rationally I know what I need to do but my emotions aren't so sure.

No need to apologize at all - there is no judgment here only trying to understand what you want so we can help.

Your emotions are not your leader right now... .sometimes this gets confusing because we say "feel your feelings".

Feelings are not facts and right now, your actions are what matter.  Boundaries - clear ones - give you a guide so you can act in accordance as you navigate this emotional spiderweb.

It is in the state you are in right now that I think we can most get a sense of how a pwBPD feels all of the time - leading with emotions and making the facts fit.

Are you in T for yourself right now to help you with your own behavior and emotions?

[LettingGo14]

Thank you for your replies.

I have an update. I didnt ask but he told me last night that the meeting with his ex allowed him to feel empowered. He has been reading BPD self help books and has decided that he needs to stop cutting people off. He told me that she is still as screwed up as ever and cheating on her current boyfriend ( she is going to leave him).  They are going to stay friends and remain in contact and he is not in the least bit attracted to her sexually.

He says he only wants me. I am the only one he has truly loved. I have helped him more than anyone etc. My response is to keep saying "I can't do relationships".

I want to believe he is being honest and is becoming a better person but part of me feels that is naive.

I would appreciate your thoughts.

Thank you

One of the first things that truly helped me -- about 4 months months after abandonment -- was the suggestion that I turn the mirror on myself alone.  It did not mean that I "forgive and forget and move on."   Instead, it meant that I needed to take back the power I gave to my ex-girlfriend with thoughts and ruminations.

We spend hours on our exes as our brains try to figure out motivations and "what ifs" -- it's natural.  However, it's like a 10,000 piece jigsaw puzzle.

Your motivation ("I can't do relationships" is to protect yourself and heal.  You also seem helped by Limited Contact ("LC" which is giving you some perspective.

I encourage you to spend time envisioning what you want for yourself, and perhaps writing a gratitude list for the things in your life, right now, that you value.  Your perspective will give you freedom (not answers from the ex).

So glad you are here sharing the journey with us.

[Rifka]

i have been in your shoes and completely understand your feelings, confusion, apprehension, ec. the last time my ex begged me to take him back, it was literally non-stop begging ALL day. he said he wished he had one more chance to start over so he could do it again and not take me for granted. he admitted all his wrong-doings (although only after i pointed them out to him, so i assume he was just mirroring). he said he would never give up or lose hope, that he would try forever to get me back. even left long-stemmed red roses on my doorstep. that same night, i caught his ex sleeping at his place.

NC has been difficult for me. it's hard losing my best friend, my lover, the person i spent all day, every day talking to. yesterday was the first day that i actually had the strength to ignore his attempts at contact. it broke my heart to ignore him. i still love him so much.

the good thing about this board is that everyone understands. we've all been there and will support whatever decision you make (staying or leaving)

I could have written this myself! Are they all following a book that I have not found yet?

I just keep reminding myself it's all lies, putting the cheese in the trap.

He also wanted to be friends with his ex girlfriend, no kids together. We were having so many issues on our own, there was no room for his ex. I thought stupidly that he would focus on fixing our problems. I asked him choose between the two of us, I won or really lost. However I have always encouraged him to some how try to have a civil relationship with his first ex wife. They have two kids together, so it's important in my eyes for the children. He spoke horrible about his exes our whole relationship. I know it was all him after reaching out to the first wife and speaking to her daily. We have become great friends over the past 4 months. Mom to mom since the kids are in another state, I reached out to her so that she knew her children were not with a crazy woman when they stayed in my home with me and their dad over his visitation 2 week periods a few times a year. I felt she deserved the peace of mind. We never told him that we were friends. He used to always say call my exes, so I did! I got a big earful. The 2nd wife said if he was on fire and a running hose was near by, she would let him burn. So much anger, but I had no clue at that time. I am not angry at anybody but myself, but working to correct the problems of what I did wrong in accepting this type of behavior and abuse. Not paying attention to all of the red flags even though they waved in my face daily as the relationship progressed in time.

I know this is so difficult! I still love and desire the man he created to originally suck me in ( that I allowed) he was so charming and so loving and so sexy and the most amazing lover! Then to remember this man was the same man who ripped my heart to shreds by the end and was so vile and horrible. Yes I remember it is the same man!

The man that people say WHAT! He was so cute and sweet! Yes I know the game plan! Hook and sink!

I wish you so much luck in whatever you do. I broke our title of boyfriend and girlfriend about 4 months in to mentally ( mine ) believe it was going to change by changing the title but still doing everything the same. It never changed except to get worse. Time was not on our side as time allowed him to become more comfortable to push the envelope further.

Again I am just sharing my experience and getting all of this crap off of my chest. I am not saying anything that happened to me is what will happen to the next victim/survivor. I am just saying I have seen my last 9 months almost word for word and experience after experience all over these threads and am shocked! I have chosen n/c and thankfully I feel he has possibly accepted it by telling the children that we broke up last week. That was the last time I received a text! Thank goodness! May peace and quiet come to all of us ready for that heart wrenching step! May our egos not get the best of us to cave in a start day 1 again. May those who give in to our emotions know, we are all just human and it's okay to start trying to count those nc days forward again. For those who have decided to stay, May strength and support of people who understand help hold your hand and strap you safely back on to the roller coaster. Peace to you all and many hugs. We are all in the same boat here, just in different seats!

[pieceofme]

i have been in your shoes and completely understand your feelings, confusion, apprehension, ec. the last time my ex begged me to take him back, it was literally non-stop begging ALL day. he said he wished he had one more chance to start over so he could do it again and not take me for granted. he admitted all his wrong-doings (although only after i pointed them out to him, so i assume he was just mirroring). he said he would never give up or lose hope, that he would try forever to get me back. even left long-stemmed red roses on my doorstep. that same night, i caught his ex sleeping at his place.

NC has been difficult for me. it's hard losing my best friend, my lover, the person i spent all day, every day talking to. yesterday was the first day that i actually had the strength to ignore his attempts at contact. it broke my heart to ignore him. i still love him so much.

the good thing about this board is that everyone understands. we've all been there and will support whatever decision you make (staying or leaving)

I could have written this myself! Are they all following a book that I have not found yet?

I just keep reminding myself it's all lies, putting the cheese in the trap.

He also wanted to be friends with his ex girlfriend, no kids together. We were having so many issues on our own, there was no room for his ex. I thought stupidly that he would focus on fixing our problems. I asked him choose between the two of us, I won or really lost. However I have always encouraged him to some how try to have a civil relationship with his first ex wife. They have two kids together, so it's important in my eyes for the children. He spoke horrible about his exes our whole relationship. I know it was all him after reaching out to the first wife and speaking to her daily. We have become great friends over the past 4 months. Mom to mom since the kids are in another state, I reached out to her so that she knew her children were not with a crazy woman when they stayed in my home with me and their dad over his visitation 2 week periods a few times a year. I felt she deserved the peace of mind. We never told him that we were friends. He used to always say call my exes, so I did! I got a big earful. The 2nd wife said if he was on fire and a running hose was near by, she would let him burn. So much anger, but I had no clue at that time. I am not angry at anybody but myself, but working to correct the problems of what I did wrong in accepting this type of behavior and abuse. Not paying attention to all of the red flags even though they waved in my face daily as the relationship progressed in time.

I know this is so difficult! I still love and desire the man he created to originally suck me in ( that I allowed) he was so charming and so loving and so sexy and the most amazing lover! Then to remember this man was the same man who ripped my heart to shreds by the end and was so vile and horrible. Yes I remember it is the same man!

The man that people say WHAT! He was so cute and sweet! Yes I know the game plan! Hook and sink!

and i could have written this! it's amazing how similar our experiences are. when i doubt myself or my ex's BPD (or that it's just an excuse for otherwise bad behavior), i spend time on this board and realize BPD is real and i'm not alone.

i still love and desire my ex, as well. i hope that these feelings will one day pass. for now, i tell myself i can love him from afar. but to think i will never kiss him or sleep next to him again... .it breaks my heart. no other lover will compare.

i am glad to hear you are getting closer to peace and quiet. i am still receiving texts, but they are slowing down. i figure i'll be painted black once and for all soon.

[pavilion]

I agree this is a very good place to remind ourselves of the cold hard facts - BPD is a force that will always come through and dominate the relationship.

The jealousy was overwhelming for me for a good few days but it has calmed down and I am feeling strong again for now.

The question about my boundaries is a good one. I think I need to clarify that for myself. How can I possible draw the line when even I don't know where it is?

I am now awaiting his plan D to get me back. Plan A was verbal attack and tell me that I haven't tried etc. Plan B was the tears and guilt trip. Plan C was meeting ex for coffee. All of them have succeeded in eliciting sadness, jealousy and guilt within me. None of them have made me think that it was all a mistake and we can live happily ever after. That's not to say I haven't thought that in times of high emotion but so far my rational brain has won.