How do I leave him?

[LizzieD]

I love every inch of this man. He is a caring, loving, but broken soul. I did explain his past before so i won't go into that again, but it was horrific.  Right now he wants us to be friends. No "romance" which means sex. Fine. But when I am not with him i can't function. He calls me regularly so when he misses a day, I freak! Everyone needs time to themselves, BPD or not, but I always assume something is amiss... .and it usually isn't.

In July he had bypass surgery and I told myself i would get him through that and then move on. Well, it's almost October and I'm still here. in reality I have a hard time being just friends and only seeing him twice a week, which is his choice.  The days i am there are fine. We get along so well, have never exchanged so much as a harsh word in almost 3 years and it just feels so right... but then I have to go home.  There is no point saying to take a break because as I see is pretty typical, out of sight out of mind prevails over absence makes the heart grow fonder.

I know this is all effecting my and my moods immensely. I am also job searching and trying to go back to school, so my life is in turmoil in all areas!  How do I tell this man, who is so good to me that I have to go away? or how do I shut off the constant worry and wondering about him and just carry on as we are?

Help  !

[momtara]

I remember hating being apart from my significant other... .are you codependent?  (Sorry if that was discussed on another thread).  It's hard, because they really can be wonderful, or awful.  It messes with your mind.  Not sure how to leave, maybe try to get on dates or something?  Don't rush yourself.

[LizzieD]

I feel like someone has died.  I told him last night - in writing because I knew I would just blubber through it... haven't heard from him yet today and I am sure it will take him a couple of days to digest , but BPD or not, I can't keep on seeing him as a friend when I love him so much... .now, today, I feel awful, but am also worried about him... .what is next, I have no idea, but I wish I could just get in the car and go to him 

[LizzieD]

I also closed my facebook account so I am not tempted to "watch" him... .I have access to all his emails etc and it is very hard not to snoop, but I won't... I might not like what I read, so better off to leave it. all.   I just hope he calls as I asked him to... .

[momtara]

Do you want him back as a lover and not a friend?  Or not at all?

[LizzieD]

I just want him back... .but we were lovers and it is hard to put that aside... .but I still want to be his friend, just not sure how to do that without hurting myself... .I miss him so much... .

[LizzieD]

Well, I've made a terrible mistake and i think I may have caused him to push me aside permanently.  I am devastated.  Last Friday afternoon he called me to tell me about a mutual friend who had been hospitalized. He then seemed rushed, said he would let me go and to have a good day.  I had had things in my own day that I would have like to talk about but he was gone. Well that festered all day and that night I sent him an email saying I was tired of coming last in his life and that while I loved him very much I was going to have to take a break from our visits because they hurt me too much just being a friend.  I pressed send and panicked. I was actually tempted to sign into his email to delete it before he saw it, but didn't. I so should have waited until the morning.  We exchanged a few texts the next day and he couldn't understand what had happened or what he had done and of course I told him he had done nothing, that it was me having a pity party. He said he needed a few days.

We got together on Thursday and while it was friendly enough, he again laid out that we are friends and never will be more than that.  In the same breath he said he cares about and wants to know everything about my life... .except anything to do with my ex (?) He does tend to be a little jealous.  He said that he was thinking of buying me a new car with some money he is expecting (?) and when I left we talked about how the sky was so beautiful and it would be nice to be sitting at a fire so he said he wishes we could go back to the cottage we used to visit so happily! I am so confused.  I won't see him again until next Thursday as he says he wants to get together only once a week for a while as he needs to think.

I know that pushing him away will only cause him to push me first. How do I go back?  He knows I love him and he said that one of the problems is that while I don't nag about it, I apparently do hint at "why don't you love me?" fairly often.  His father, who severely abused him, used to ask that all the time and he said just the thought of it bothers him.

He sent me a text tonight sounding so blue and I just said that while he may feel alone, he isn't - I am always here. I really don't know what else to do. I need to leave him to his thought process, but I am so worried about damage control.  I don't want to lose him... . 

[momtara]

You are in a very hard place.  I get it.  Being with these folks causes so much pain, but it's also painful when we leave.  :)on't think that any one thing you said or did is going to cause him to leave - and they often come back anyway.  But it's  never over one thing you said or did.  We walk on eggshells constantly and maybe that keeps the relationship together a bit longer, but they are sick.  The important thing is, you have gone above and beyond to let him know you love him and care about him.  On some level he knows that.  My ex was horrible during our marriage, accused me of being a bad person and doing terrible things.  Once I left, he kept it up.  A few months later he went to counseling and began to acknowledge his issues and admitted that all along he knew none of what he said was true.  

Understand this:  Their illness makes them have two personalities.  You want the loving, sweet one to stick around.  But it doesn't.  The other one takes over.  The first one doesn't understand the other oine and creates emotional memories (distorted ones) so that they can believe that you are the one to blame.  How else to explain their anger and actions?

If you were constantly pushing away someone who was good to you, you'd be confused too and maybe your brain would get wired to believe the otehr person did something wrong, when deep down you know it's you.

This is a bad time for you, not knowing how it will all play out.  You will constantly second guess yourself and worry if he will write you back, leave you, etc.  I think they often come back, in the end, although the waiting is sucky.  

The amount of pain this person brings you probably makes it not worth it for you to keep trying, but I understand - you love him.  I put up with my ex for far longer than I should have, and still love him despite all he's done.  But the feeing of not having to guess if he's lying, not looking over my shoulder to make sure he won't criticize, not being scared to say the wrong thing - those are very good feelings.  But it took me a long time to detach, because like you, I love him.

YOu aren't at the place yet when you can decide to go (or stay, if things get better).  You're not emotionally ready.  That's ok.  It's ok to mess up and try to leave and then feel bad about it.  Some of us do it for months and years.

If you really miss him, I think you ahve to be clear about what you want.  This, of course, may change anyway.  These people change personalities so quickly that sometiems you hae to look back at old journals just to remind yourself of the worst, and then you will feel better.

Keep me posted.  I understand!

[LizzieD]

Thank you again for your response. You are so right when you say I am not ready.  I am having a horrible weekend because other than a brief answer to a text i haven't heard from him.  I am going to leave it to him now but it is making me ill.   

I know he cares, but the physical side is not there, a lot to do with the abuse he suffered as a child.  I can only imagine the damage that that type of thing does and the scars that are so raw, still at 58.  I could get through that with him if he let me, but he just pushes it away saying he isn't interested. But at the same time, as I said earlier, he wishes for things that we used to have. Sometimes I wish he would show me a nasty side so I might get more fed up, but he is never anything but kind. We have honestly never had an argument or a harsh word. Even this latest drama, which I admit I caused, did not at all show any anger.  I know that my cousin, whose daughter 24, is BPD has to deal with a lot of angry outbursts. Perhaps age has to do with that, as he did have a rather volatile youth.

I keep saying I have cried more over this man that the loss of both my parents and my beautiful golden retriever all put together. 

I will see him Thursday and see what he has to say. I fear that he will say we should go our separate ways, but there is a doubt in a way that he will do that.  I am rambling as I really don't know what is going to happen.  He as pushed others away since i have known him, but in reality this is the first time he has done it to me.  I am always the one he comes to with his difficulties.

Thank you again for listening.  I hope things resolve soon. I was up until 6:00 am last night and can't continue this way... .

[hurting300]

Whatever you do, don't just up and vanish... be open and honest...

[LizzieD]

I don't think I will be able to vanish.  People who don't understand, my family members included just call him a "jerk" or other worse things!  I know he isn't any of those things. I try to give the analogy that if they had a friend with cancer, or MS or some other horrible disease, they wouldn't desert them? Well, I feel the same about mental illness. He has done nothing to deserve his lot in life. He is not happy about how his mind works and how it causes him so much trouble.  I think he wishes things were different with us, but doesn't know how to go about it. There have been so many people in his life who have walked away, including 3 grown children from whom he is estranged.  I know from his sister he did nothing to them but be harsh... unfiltered criticisms because he didn't want them to make the mistakes he made. There was no abuse of any kind. It is all so very sad.   Anyway I can't fix his past, i can't take ownership of the depression, or control the BPD. What I can do is be there with a hand to hold or as a listener, which he needs so badly.   

[momtara]

well, the criticism can be verbal abuse and it can be hard on a kid.  that's part of the disease.

plan carefully what you want to get across on thursday, and don't say anything you regret.  that way, whether it works out or not, at least you'll have gotten across what you wanted to. 

yeah, it's not as simple as "leave him. he's a jerk."  but people don't know the complexities.

follow your emotions and instincts.  it's ok!

i know you are worried about what will happen.  by the end of the week you will feel Much better about this, trust me.  For now, have some wine and rent a good movie and try to put your mind at ease.  If you want, you can write some emails to him and DOn't send them!

[LizzieD]

It is so hard to do this waiting!  When we spoke last week he said there is no reason why i can't call him etc... but i don't know if i should just leave him be to think, or call him or what to do.  Our last communication on Friday was a text. I asked him how his day went and he just said "watched tv, waiting for things to get better"  . I responded that he will feel better when his cardiac rehab starts and that even though he feels alone in all of this, he isn't as i am always here.  Nothing since.  I think I am answering my own question - i should leave him be. I know by my phone that he keeps checking facebook and seems to leave as soon as i do. all I can do is hope that in some "different" way, he will miss me this week... .

My plan for Thursday is to tell him that I do not want to leave him. I can accept being "just friends" and will deal with that in my own way. I have been the one for three years who has been there through all the crap that happens... I'm the one he calls anytime he needs and wants to and I don't want that to stop. (until two weeks ago he was calling 2 - 3 times a day and that seemed to stop which was probably part of the basis for my melt down.)  I just don't want to lose him. As I said, he needs to depend on someone. yes, he has other friends, but gets upset when they are busy or don' t think of him when making any sort of arrangements. I do. Always.  maybe I need to be not so available?  I just don't want to play games! Funny it just popped into my head that a couple of weeks ago we were talking about the week ahead and i said I was just waiting for my date (for an appointment), but his reaction was "your date?", in a rather surprised tone. Whenever i get a text which 99% of the time is from my son, he says, oh, someone is getting a text and i can feel him look over my shoulder. maybe he thinks I have as many things going on as he does, but I don't!  he is forever starting go nowhere, meaningless online things, that never amount to anything but he gets right in there.  NONE of these women are still around, NONE, except on local one, have ever even visited and when he does feel like something is going to happen he has a very guilty look and tone about things when with me. As soon as they are gone, he is back on the phone to me all the time.  He always comes back. 


I did write him a very long letter, with many changes, but no in an email to avoid any problems.  There is so much I would like to get across, but i think it might be too much.

Ok, I am going to take my dog to the beach and get out of here.  Thank you, as always, for listening to my rant!

[momtara]

I understand how hard it is.

You don't want to lose him, but you sent an email trying to sever ties in some way - right?  Or was it meant to set boundaries?  Was it that you realized you are kind of better off without him, in a way, but now you regret that?  This is also typical.  I've been divorced since last year and still clung to small hope that he will change.  But I also realize that when there are long periods when I'm not talking to him, I feel SO much better.  My head spins after I talk to him, trying to figure out if I said the right thing, what he said, what he lied about, what he meant, etc... .

Sometimes the toxicity and drama and self doubt is not worth it.

But then, you still love this person.  If you are secretly trying to manipulate him into a relationship or something else, that may not work as you want it to.  If you want to tell him "Hey, I want to be in your life, I am just confused a lot.  I care about and love you but it's hard to love you."  And then figure out what you really want.  Are you really ok with a friendship?  Do you want to cut him off completely?  Sounds like you really don't want to cut him off, but part of you thinks it's healthier.  I think you may not be ready to do that yet.  Just be honest with yourself and gentle with yourself.  Understand what you really want.  And allow yourself to be human and confused about it, too.

[LizzieD]

Well, either you are in my head and I don' t know it, or our stories have a lot of similarities!

I have been thinking over the last few months that I need to move on. It is hard to be friends and "not wanted' but then I spend the day with him and I am fine... but then I go home and mope again. It is quiet a cycle.  When he is in touch I am fine. When I don't hear from him, I'm not!

I did send that email because i had been thinking that way, because i do know, in many ways, I would be better off, but my regret is huge now.  I can't get away from this man and i went about it in totally the wrong way. i have added to his confusion and his usual mood drop at this time of the year seems to have been started now.  I could really kick myself. 

I know he is pushing back now and I am going to have a hard job not letting him win.  We did speak tonight on skype - he called me.  He is so down, i can see it in his face and his demeanor. We didn't really get into "us" but when i asked if he was alright, after the health part, he said that he was told many years ago when hospitalized after a suicide attempt that when something continues to happen in your life you do eventually have to take ownership for its cause, that things can be your fault.   I know he was referring to us.  There was a coolness about him and evidence of him distancing himself from me in just day to day things that I have always been a part of.  Then he wanted to know if "we" had any more rolaids!   

I feel better having spoken to him and sad because he is cycling.  I will have to be very clear on Thursday. I am willing to accept being friends, but not distant ones. i want the calls and the involvement. 

While what I did as far as the email was concerned was bad, I also realize, as I said before that fall is here and down goes his mood. He has always "dumped" me in the fall, every year and we are usually apart for a few days. It is like he feels things get to close and has to back up ?  It is all so complicated.

As you say i do love him and sat looking at him tonight thinking of how nice it would be to be there sitting beside him as we have done for so long. In the almost 3 years there have been very few days that we have not been in touch or together and I think he wants that as much as i do.

I suppose there is some sort of manipulation on my part, but i agree, I don't think it will work. Can I cut him off completely? No... .not yet... .

Better get some sleep now  ♥

[momtara]

You are being hard on yourself about the email.  I don't think it was a mistake.  It got him to realize, at least a little, that he is not doing the right thing.  You also said that he dumps you in fall.  Maybe you showed a little backbone toward him this year.  You had reasons to send the email, so try not to beat yourself up.  From my standpoint it seems like you did the right thing.

And he is still talking to you and saying 'we.'  So he needs you.

But it seems like you want to be more than friends.  You want a 'friendship' but he has to be consistent and constantly contact you and stuff.  Isn't that kind of more than a friendship?  It's actually fine to have whatever relationship you are both comfortable with, maybe a nonthreatening romantic relationship with no physical stuff for now, or whatever you agree on, but I think you have to be clear about what you want, at least to yourself.  Not that that's easy with a person with BPD!

[LizzieD]

Well I suppose it is good in a way that it is all out on the table. He isn't happy, but change never makes him so.  I want him as my man, my partner,  I know that is probably not going to happen, but I do know he needs me. He is trying to show the "big boy"independent side right now and I know for sure that when we do get together Thursday he will not be telling me to get out of his life.  Now I have to truly decide what i am willing to settle for and be clear about it, like you say. I know what I want, but what will i take?  I know I have to be the strong one, not the needy one. that's him. i have had a lot of other changes, job related etc that have put me through much more stress than has been good for me so I know i am not as strong a person as i was.  I need to get that back as well. It is a must for me as well as whatever form "us" takes.

Thinking about all the other people in his life, there are many who are troubled and he does what he can to help them, but can't deal with my problems very well. My cousin's daughter is very loving with other people but when the cousin fell down the stairs, the daughter was of no help. It seems that it is common not to be able to handle the main support weakening in any way?  A few months ago I had an issue with a cel phone bill and i fixed it quickly but he was there while I dealt with the calls to get the service reinstated. He didn't tell me right away but later said that he was really very upset and actually wanted me to leave... .all because he couldn't fix the problem for me.  He is on disability because of his heart, and emotional problems, so add to the rest of the mix, he has very little money and pride has gone into the dumpster.  In January, he put together the money to give me a new laptop for combined Christmas and birthday. I was shocked. No chocolates for Valentine's Day, because that is romantic though!

There are just so many facets to this story!  Who knows what will happen today 


Have to do some serious thinking this week!

[momtara]

BPD people need lots of attention and have trouble when someone else is the center of it, especially their significant other.  He is used to you doing everything for him.  You may not even realize how little he gives you in return.  He could probably be doing a lot more.  if you tell him you are having a rough day, does he offer a backrub?  Do you?

This is not to say that you shouldn't get back together with him - just be mindful of what you want and need.  Many people should be able to depend on their significant other to be there all the time, n ot just some of the time.  Of course, that is a tall order.

It seems like you feel you are in a better place today and have a better idea of what will happen.  that's great!  You don't have to make every decision now.  Seems like you want to be in his life.  You may have to give up on some things to do so, and coax him on others.  Or you may have to be honest and say you want to be in his life but you would like him to be more supportive (not state it like an accusation) and be clear.  Sometimes BPD people just don't get it the way you think they would - their emotions are clouded.

[hurting300]

BPD people need lots of attention and have trouble when someone else is the center of it, especially their significant other.  He is used to you doing everything for him.  You may not even realize how little he gives you in return.  He could probably be doing a lot more.  if you tell him you are having a rough day, does he offer a backrub?  Do you?

This is not to say that you shouldn't get back together with him - just be mindful of what you want and need.  Many people should be able to depend on their significant other to be there all the time, n ot just some of the time.  Of course, that is a tall order.

It seems like you feel you are in a better place today and have a better idea of what will happen.  that's great!  You don't have to make every decision now.  Seems like you want to be in his life.  You may have to give up on some things to do so, and coax him on others.  Or you may have to be honest and say you want to be in his life but you would like him to be more supportive (not state it like an accusation) and be clear.  Sometimes BPD people just don't get it the way you think they would - their emotions are clouded.

this is spot on! Mine never cared about my bad days hers was always worse. I gave the back rubs and consoling not her... they are very selfish minded.

[LizzieD]

He doesn't offer back rubs any more, though did when we were still "touching".  He is very supportive in areas where he is able to do something  to help.  When I had to say goodbye to one of my dogs, he was wonderful.  He was able to help me, but it was only emotional support. There was nothing else that could be required.  As I said though, when my cel phone bill was a problem he ran because he didn't have the funds to pay for it.  There is a lot about pride involved, too.   

I am feeling  bit better today, realizing that I do want to keep him, but for now it will have to be on his terms. I do plans to set some boundaries though as I need him to be "into" the friendship as well.  He called today for no reason really and we spent about an hour on the phone talking about day to day issues. Nothing deep.  It was nice.  Hopefully we have gotten over the emotional side of my infamous email and can get back to being the friends that we have been.  We will see.

[LizzieD]

Now here is a question... .when I sit down and check emails and facebook, etc., I often wonder what I should do about his posts like "I can't help it, I was born this way"  or "if life is a test, I am failing" . Obviously he gets all sorts of sympathetic women gushing about how wonderful he is and and he shouldn't be talking that way. Is it better that I leave that alone? He knows, even from our conversation today that I have the utmost respect for him as a good person who has been dealt a lot of bad cards.   It's a silly point, but I just wonder what I should do.  My gut tells me to just let him bask in the light of his online supporters... .

[hurting300]

Would you rather have the type of relationship with someone that doesn't require you to be on a support group forum? He is immature, he is mentally ill. All the love and understanding in the world won't change him for the better. I would sit him down and give one last chance. After that you will have your answer.

[LizzieD]

Well, I suppose in some ways it would be easier... .but who knows.  As I have said before, I wouldn't desert him because of any other health diagnosis, so this is no different and it certainly could be a lot worse!  It will ultimately be up to me, what I accept. I just sometimes question the best way to handle certain things based on "typical" reactions.  There do seem to be a lot of behaviours that are very similar with most individuals...

[hurting300]

Well I respect what your trying to do. I pray it turns out ok with you. But please watch your step.