Boundaries --- small backlash but hurts :(

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hi there,

I have been on this board for a few months.

Recently we were discussing boundaries. My counselor and I were speaking on wednesday and I told her how I was having "jokingly" suicidal thoughts.

A BPD women impregnated herself after lying about fertility and pinning me down during sex, impregnanting herself. (Not that she would frame it like that).

Her parents convinced me to be supportive of her and go to doctor's appointments, even after she showed up at my work and home and the police were called after she frightened me with harassment and boundary busters. My counselor advised me to see her once or twice a week and see how it goes after I didn't file for a stalking order.

Well I couldn't take it anymore. She wasn't being abusive, but I just felt pressured and afraid of backing off the "dates". I could feel her obsession for me, and her idealizing was making me uncomfortable. That I wanted things to move more neutral... .and she just wanted to kiss me and have sex with me and coddle me, and I don't want that from her.

This week my therapist suggested that I take some space. I told her I needed some space and the next day I got texts from her mother, telling me it was abusive to her and the baby and to leave them alone.

I didn't respond. That night, she sent me a page long text telling me that I was lying and abusive and that she had boundaries too and that her and her daughter (5 months pregnant) deserved better than me. And that she would put her daughters interests first in making decisions. That a good man would sacrifice all for his child.

Anyways, I just asked for some space because of how depressed I am. I didn't want to talk to her or see her, because she has harassed me, committed reproductive coercion, lied about being married, lied about being pregnant, and as my counselor puts it, totally "mind fvcks" me.

It's honestly gotten to the point where my health is rapidly deteriorating... .even only seeing her once or twice a week... .the phone calls, and the drama, and the neediness are slowly killing me of my spirit. Feeling attached to her forever, and now going to lose all my spending money to her for life, essentially (I make 3 times as much as her, making the potential CS payments extremely harsh).

At work, I was so unhappy today. I could barely work. Just knowing that my future is going to involve child support, her, and involuntary servitude kills me.

Men without custody, who pay for the entire upbringing of the child and rarely see them... .are the most slighted creatures on this planet. I can't believe I overlooked how sad it is for these men. I don't envy myself for joining their ranks.

I don't have much of a chance for justice here. When the reactions for me taking space start to happen, I get hypervigilant and scared. I can't relax. I don't know if she's going to show up at my house. Or what kind of messages she will send to scare me.

Man this sucks... .sometimes it's easier just to go along with what she wants. If it weren't for the depression and suicidal thoughts.

Stoic

[stoic83]

Hi there,

I have been on this board for a few months.

Recently we were discussing boundaries. My counselor and I were speaking on wednesday and I told her how I was having "jokingly" suicidal thoughts.

A BPD women impregnated herself after lying about fertility and pinning me down during sex, impregnanting herself. (Not that she would frame it like that).

Her parents convinced me to be supportive of her and go to doctor's appointments, even after she showed up at my work and home and the police were called after she frightened me with harassment and boundary busters. My counselor advised me to see her once or twice a week and see how it goes after I didn't file for a stalking order.

Well I couldn't take it anymore. She wasn't being abusive, but I just felt pressured and afraid of backing off the "dates". I could feel her obsession for me, and her idealizing was making me uncomfortable. That I wanted things to move more neutral... .and she just wanted to kiss me and have sex with me and coddle me, and I don't want that from her.

This week my therapist suggested that I take some space. I told her I needed some space and the next day I got texts from her mother, telling me it was abusive to her and the baby and to leave them alone.

I didn't respond. That night, she sent me a page long text telling me that I was lying and abusive and that she had boundaries too and that her and her daughter (5 months pregnant) deserved better than me. And that she would put her daughters interests first in making decisions. That a good man would sacrifice all for his child.

Anyways, I just asked for some space because of how depressed I am. I didn't want to talk to her or see her, because she has harassed me, committed reproductive coercion, lied about being married, lied about being pregnant, and as my counselor puts it, totally "mind fvcks" me.

It's honestly gotten to the point where my health is rapidly deteriorating... .even only seeing her once or twice a week... .the phone calls, and the drama, and the neediness are slowly killing me of my spirit. Feeling attached to her forever, and now going to lose all my spending money to her for life, essentially (I make 3 times as much as her, making the potential CS payments extremely harsh).

At work, I was so unhappy today. I could barely work. Just knowing that my future is going to involve child support, her, and involuntary servitude kills me.

Men without custody, who pay for the entire upbringing of the child and rarely see them... .are the most slighted creatures on this planet. I can't believe I overlooked how sad it is for these men. I don't envy myself for joining their ranks.

I don't have much of a chance for justice here. When the reactions for me taking space start to happen, I get hypervigilant and scared. I can't relax. I don't know if she's going to show up at my house. Or what kind of messages she will send to scare me.

Man this sucks... .sometimes it's easier just to go along with what she wants. If it weren't for the depression and suicidal thoughts.

Stoic

[ImaFita]

Hey Stoic.

I've read your posts over the past few months and am in a similar situation.

I wasn't held down as such, but was told she was on the pill and couldn't have kids.

I got angry, frustrated, depressed, annoyed, etc... The more I fought it, they just framed it that I neglected my son.

Now I've had to do supervised visits. Then I will do mediation and court, but... I understand that you are depressed.

Having actually lived in this situation, suicide now enters my mind on a daily basis.

I don't know whether I'd be less suicidal walking away... .Or whether I am suicidal by fighting an unjust and unfair system.

In my case, I can't even take time away, because the moment I do - they just say I'm inconsistent and neglectful.

When in reality I've tried to be involved, and the more I push - the more aggressively I get alienated.

So I feel your pain, I have no answers though, I am also on my last stand, don't underestimate how hard this is and keep talking to others about it:)

[stoic83]

Hey Stoic.

I've read your posts over the past few months and am in a similar situation.

I wasn't held down as such, but was told she was on the pill and couldn't have kids.

I got angry, frustrated, depressed, annoyed, etc... The more I fought it, they just framed it that I neglected my son.

Now I've had to do supervised visits. Then I will do mediation and court, but... I understand that you are depressed.

Having actually lived in this situation, suicide now enters my mind on a daily basis.

I don't know whether I'd be less suicidal walking away... .Or whether I am suicidal by fighting an unjust and unfair system.

In my case, I can't even take time away, because the moment I do - they just say I'm inconsistent and neglectful.

When in reality I've tried to be involved, and the more I push - the more aggressively I get alienated.

So I feel your pain, I have no answers though, I am also on my last stand, don't underestimate how hard this is and keep talking to others about it:)

Hi friend,

I am sorry that this has happened to you. I don't think anyone who hasn't been through this understands. I received 40 unanswered text messages from her last night. She is only 5 months pregnant, and she is raging over my "neglect". She is threatening me, and trying to get me to acquiesce to her obsession of me. I walk around with a ghost-face, on auto-pilot, and spiritually sick. Asking me how long "she has to go" without seeing me... .how long "she's going to have to make it".

This all stems from me wanting to be alone this weekend, and not needing a ride to the airport. She tells me she's going to give the little girl my last name, and there's nothing I can do about it. That there's no way she's raising her and putting all the work in, so that I can come see her.

She talks about the fetus as a mature and developed human being. That I am wronging her and neglecting her right now. That I am "leaving them".

Anyways, I think this is why my counselor advises me to leave the state before she gives birth. My counselor is worried about me, says suicidal thoughts are a red flag... .and that it's time to take space.

I refuse to fight over a child until it becomes necessary. I will leave the state and fight from abroad, making any of these claims against me impossible. If this child is going to be healthy, I will need sole custody. In my state I can refuse joint custody. At that point I will fight for sole custody, if I lose... .I will run and hide.

I may go live in Hawaii near my aunt and uncle. They are PHDs psychology and work for the state. They have a number of clinics that help children with autism. They can possibly get me involved in state legislature and help buffer the financial abuse and bolster my self-esteem.

I am seeing them over Christmas. Thank god:)

I am so sorry you are going through this. Sometimes I wish we lived in the old days, so that the righteous could take justice in to their own hands... .or there were no umbrella laws that rewarded rapists or con artists.

This family court system is not justice. It's a moral "mind fvck" that incentivizes adversarial mindsets and emotional torture.

Stoic

Stoic

Stoic

[stoic83]

Just an update... .harassed all weekend. Major backlash. Sister called and spewed threats of violence, anti-semitism, harassment, and 18 years of child support unless I supported her sister.

The BPD with child wants to do counseling. I want to get away from all this. I can't take it anymore.

[ImaFita]

Just an update... .harassed all weekend. Major backlash. Sister called and spewed threats of violence, anti-semitism, harassment, and 18 years of child support unless I supported her sister.

The BPD with child wants to do counseling. I want to get away from all this. I can't take it anymore.

I understand, that sounds about right.

When you choose to get away, she'll drive a hard stance for neglect later on.

But on the upside, getting away will give less weight to any other allegations she would make up about you.

In my situation, after 4 years of getting no where, I've walked away. She still controls my family - because they want to see my son, and have to go through her, I have to suck that up. But she no longer controls me. After 4 years of going through the right channels, I got to see my son for 20 hours.

I could've kept fighting and went through court, but every process I've been involved in the past 4 years, takes 6-8 months to even get into. So even going through the process, doing the right thing, there were times I didn't see my son for 2 whole years. If the women don't get you - the process will. In my instance, I was slow to act upon visitation, so I had to do heaps of extra crap, then with allegations, had to do more crap.

I had psychologists try and intervene in my process to help me - but they weren't allowed, even they said it was a joke. I was being treated as I murdered someone, I don't even have a record. So get in early, be relentless, don't back down, do not even give an inch. That was my fault, I was too nice, and by being too nice, I got completely bent over and got treated like a criminal, just like she wanted.

Good luck fighting, just be ruthless, don't be nice and just tell the truth.

[ogopogodude]

Just an update... .harassed all weekend. Major backlash. Sister called and spewed threats of violence, anti-semitism, harassment, and 18 years of child support unless I supported her sister.

The BPD with child wants to do counseling. I want to get away from all this. I can't take it anymore.

oh, ... people,... people... .please learn from me and my methods.  DOCUMENT using video tape and audio tape and informing any persons that are about to lash out at you...

You accomplish this by out right interrupting the person and frankly stating that: "for everybody's protection and so that there won't be ANY  misunderstandings, ... .you are being videotaped (or audio-taped (if it's a phone call) so that the proper authorities will have access to this, ... okay?"



  i don't get any more "non-sense" garbage phone calls or texts or emails  or unwanted and unexpected arrivals of nut-bars at my front porch anymore.

Mount a video cam above your door.

It works.  This is a boundary that you are establishing upon nut-bar behaviour.  Once everyone knows that they are being "documented" then you will pleasantly surprised at how peace and calm becomes mainstream.

(BUT do not, ... and I mean DO NOT mention that you are going to use the video tape or whatever damaging behaviour that you have got that  against them and that they are now "screwed" , ... .as this will in itself spark conflict.  Think of obtaining video tape or incredibly damaging emails etc as a country obtaining more and more refined uranium 235 for future "use".   Remember, ... as an analogy: radioactive material can be used safely for nice purposes (electricity) or for more destructive purposes (atom bomb).

The whole idea is to create peace and calm.

Become powerful: you can do this by simply documenting with today's technology 

[stoic83]

Just an update... .harassed all weekend. Major backlash. Sister called and spewed threats of violence, anti-semitism, harassment, and 18 years of child support unless I supported her sister.

The BPD with child wants to do counseling. I want to get away from all this. I can't take it anymore.

oh, ... people,... people... .please learn from me and my methods.  DOCUMENT using video tape and audio tape and informing any persons that are about to lash out at you...

You accomplish this by out right interrupting the person and frankly stating that: "for everybody's protection and so that there won't be ANY  misunderstandings, ... .you are being videotaped (or audio-taped (if it's a phone call) so that the proper authorities will have access to this, ... okay?"



  i don't get any more "non-sense" garbage phone calls or texts or emails  or unwanted and unexpected arrivals of nut-bars at my front porch anymore.

Mount a video cam above your door.

It works.  This is a boundary that you are establishing upon nut-bar behaviour.  Once everyone knows that they are being "documented" then you will pleasantly surprised at how peace and calm becomes mainstream.

(BUT do not, ... and I mean DO NOT mention that you are going to use the video tape or whatever damaging behaviour that you have got that  against them and that they are now "screwed" , ... .as this will in itself spark conflict.  Think of obtaining video tape or incredibly damaging emails etc as a country obtaining more and more refined uranium 235 for future "use".   Remember, ... as an analogy: radioactive material can be used safely for nice purposes (electricity) or for more destructive purposes (atom bomb).

The whole idea is to create peace and calm.

Become powerful: you can do this by simply documenting with today's technology 

My counselor is advising me to walk away. Honestly, I will never meet my daughter until she is grown and I will pay for it all. I am accepting this, because I don't want to go through any of this. I have it all recorded and I will share with the courts... .but it won't do any good, because none of it is quite damning enough and Im sure she has me on tape yelling at her for what she has done to me.

I will just focus on living well off of very little and paying the ransom. I guess it's all I can really do. I'm not going to waste any more energy fighting her.

Stoic

Stoic

[ImaFita]

Just an update... .harassed all weekend. Major backlash. Sister called and spewed threats of violence, anti-semitism, harassment, and 18 years of child support unless I supported her sister.

The BPD with child wants to do counseling. I want to get away from all this. I can't take it anymore.

oh, ... people,... people... .please learn from me and my methods.  DOCUMENT using video tape and audio tape and informing any persons that are about to lash out at you...

You accomplish this by out right interrupting the person and frankly stating that: "for everybody's protection and so that there won't be ANY  misunderstandings, ... .you are being videotaped (or audio-taped (if it's a phone call) so that the proper authorities will have access to this, ... okay?"



  i don't get any more "non-sense" garbage phone calls or texts or emails  or unwanted and unexpected arrivals of nut-bars at my front porch anymore.

Mount a video cam above your door.

It works.  This is a boundary that you are establishing upon nut-bar behaviour.  Once everyone knows that they are being "documented" then you will pleasantly surprised at how peace and calm becomes mainstream.

(BUT do not, ... and I mean DO NOT mention that you are going to use the video tape or whatever damaging behaviour that you have got that  against them and that they are now "screwed" , ... .as this will in itself spark conflict.  Think of obtaining video tape or incredibly damaging emails etc as a country obtaining more and more refined uranium 235 for future "use".   Remember, ... as an analogy: radioactive material can be used safely for nice purposes (electricity) or for more destructive purposes (atom bomb).

The whole idea is to create peace and calm.

Become powerful: you can do this by simply documenting with today's technology 

My counselor is advising me to walk away. Honestly, I will never meet my daughter until she is grown and I will pay for it all. I am accepting this, because I don't want to go through any of this. I have it all recorded and I will share with the courts... .but it won't do any good, because none of it is quite damning enough and Im sure she has me on tape yelling at her for what she has done to me.

I will just focus on living well off of very little and paying the ransom. I guess it's all I can really do. I'm not going to waste any more energy fighting her.

Stoic

Stoic

I understand that, I've had to do the same thing. It gets to a stage where you think about suicide on a daily basis - that is my cut off line.

But even walking away, you are still over a barrel, if you better your life and get a decent job - you'll still have to pay through the teeth.

Pay through the teeth to a person who manipulated the reproductive process - only to benefit handsomely on every level, the incentive is ridiculous.

Then when you are working, they don't even want you to see your son - because that lessens the maintenance they get...

So again, even if you do better yourself and try and see your kid - the incentive is once again there for them to prevent that.

And society wonders why blokes are taking their lives at record rates.

[stoic83]

[/quote]
I understand that, I've had to do the same thing. It gets to a stage where you think about suicide on a daily basis - that is my cut off line.

But even walking away, you are still over a barrel, if you better your life and get a decent job - you'll still have to pay through the teeth.

Pay through the teeth to a person who manipulated the reproductive process - only to benefit handsomely on every level, the incentive is ridiculous.

Then when you are working, they don't even want you to see your son - because that lessens the maintenance they get...

So again, even if you do better yourself and try and see your kid - the incentive is once again there for them to prevent that.

And society wonders why blokes are taking their lives at record rates.[/quote]
I guess I'm going to just have to try to negotiate with her for a lower ransom.

Counselor advising me not to establish contact with child, as my feelings will be used against me in similar manner.

She says best hope is that she finds someone else and forgets about me.

I have to do everything I can to stay out of family courts. That will trigger a war.

It may be better just to negotiate a settlement to minimize the damages to my life.

I don't want this "accident/crime" whatever it is to harm my life.

I was once a child too, and people invested their energy and resources in to me so I could have a good life.

Is my life not worth anything, since I am not a child?

I understand that parents are emotionally attached to their children, but the logic of sacrificing all for your children is based on a slave labor mentality.

Do other mammals sacrifice their well being for their children? Or do they merely provide some extra scraps... .and show them how to hunt, whatever.

Maybe they would kill for their children... .well in this country, the state justice department gives these "crocodile moms" a pretty big hatchet.

I would be an idiot to think that she will have mercy after  her child is born.

It's getting to the point where I'd rather live like an animal than be a slave to this screwy system.

At least I'd be free.

Stoic