False restraining order.

[rapror496]

My ex is filing a restraining order for harrasment. She kicked me out with no warning and wouldn't let me back in to get my stuff. When I told her I had 30 days to move out she threatened to have me arrested for some kind of scam if I didn't leave immediately I told her that was extortion and I needed my stuff. I have all the conversations in text messeges. When I asked to get my belongings she Sent me a cease and desist letter. I have since stopped all contact. She then reblogged my posts online. And sent me another email telling me to stop stalking her. Or she would file a restraining order and go to the police with this alleged scam. She has also called my workplace and had her mother send threatening emails. If she does get a restraining order can I keep it from going against me?

I'm also not entirely  sure if it's her or her new boyfriend threatening this. as she was saying the new guy is afraid of me. Her father is also a police officer, so it's not adding up. Why go to the police when she could have him call me?

[SlyQQ]

Dad probably knows whats going on the mum could be BPD herself

[rapror496]

Thank you sly, I'm pretty sure the mom is. When I met my ex I was saving her from alleged abuse from the father. The mother claimed abuse and tried to move in with a friend. The friend got custody of my ex because the mother was installable, not to mention the. The alleged abuse.im now 100 percent sure that there was no abuse and her whole backstory for the last 5 years is a load of b.s

[ForeverDad]

While we all hope it doesn't get worse than it already has, around here we've learned that 'hope' too often is not enough.  Our ending or ended relationships typically end with us targets being blamed for being abusive in the relationship.  That's the blaming and blame-shifting since a person with BPD (pwBPD) can't or won't admit fault.  That's also the extreme perceptions of the pwBPD, in the beginning we are saviors, at the end we are villains.

If you (1) stop initiating all contact including electronic and (2) be very careful not to say anything that could be distorted into control, aggressive, stalking or harassment, and (3) end encounters promptly if she initiates them or you encounter one another in stores, restaurants, etc, then your risks should be lower.

A lawyer is an officer of the court and so would not be risking harassment charges if trying to ask for your belongings back.  Since you aren't sure whether her father, the police officer, is reasonable and not a problem as well if his family is involved, probably best not to go to him except as an officer?

If she hasn't filed for an RO yet but you think she will, then maybe a lawyer can file something for you to get your things back, perhaps a letter requesting them.  That way if she later filed for an RO you could take the position that it is a retaliatory response.  However, the downside is that getting a lawyer could trigger her to ramp up the legal conflict even higher when before it was just verbal threats and might not have gone anywhere.

Do you know if she's ever filed charges against past relationship partners?  If she has then your risks are higher that she might do it again.  On the other hand, it would also give you a potentially weak defense that she has a habit of punishing her exBFs with court action.

Good that you've been documenting and recording.  Courts often don't want to listen to recordings but other professionals might and they can be invaluable to prove you weren't the one behaving poorly.

[drummerboy]

Welcome to the club, I got hit with a restraining order after I told my ex that I'd tested positive for an STD and that she should probably get herself checked. She claimed it was "emotional abuse"

Never underestimate the vindictiveness of these poor, suffering little souls.

The way I look at it is, no biggie, I never want to have anything to do with her ever again, there is zero risk of me violating it so I sleep well at night. Hopefully she has another poor fool to lay her act on and she'll never contact me again.

[rapror496]

She has never filed against anyone in the past. Her mother on the other hand has accused multiple people of things. She has been sued multiple times for slander. And settled all of them out of court.

The other thing is she knows I'm about to go to law school. The letter she sent me is the same one I made against her mother when the mother was threatening us.

That's why I have a feeling it's her new boyfriend. He is extremely narcissistic but is also afraid of his own shadow. I'm assuming she told him things and he is trying to keep me away. Last time she called she said they were getting a restraining order then talked to me like nothing happened. She also wants to go after me for damages for the alleged harrasment which is a joke as she took everything I have. Pretty much making me judgement proof

[livednlearned]

If she does file an RO, there will be a temporary hearing. I'm not sure how accurate this is, but in many areas, if a person waits longer than 3 days to file, that seriously weakens the chance for an RO. If she manages to get an RO at a temporary hearing, there will be a second hearing in which she has to appear, and you'll have a chance to defend yourself. The fact you have all those messages will help -- it shows that she is not afraid of you, and is in fact the one bullying.   The temporary filing does not necessarily mean that the court thinks you are a threat, it's just a precaution based on her being able to meet the minimum requirements for an RO.

However, you have to be really really careful. She probably found a negative advocate in her new BF, and to recreate herself as a victim, you have become the abuser. If you need to get your things from the apartment, you could call law enforcement and ask for domestic assistance. They'll go with you to the home and stand there to make sure everyone behaves. You'll be able to remove your personal belongings, but if there is anything that is considered joint property, police might not let you leave with it.

Even if you don't end up needing a lawyer, it's a really good idea to just consult with one, or two. When people with BPD triangulate you with the legal system, you need to understand how things work so she cannot manipulate the system in her favor. The best way to protect yourself is documentation, and that means keeping all of your emails and texts, but it also means understanding the recording laws where you live. If it's a one-party consent state, you can record her without getting her permission. Some people here record regardless of the laws, because if she calls the police and you have a recording, they may be less likely to believe her story.

Stay as far away from her as you possibly can right now.

[david]

I would use email communication only. If you text make sure you get an app that lets you put it on your computers hard drive. Also whenever you will be physically near her make sure you a have a recording device. Depending on the state it may not be allowed in court but it can be used when the police come to lock you up. It will keep you out of jail. Trust me, I know from experience.

I was in jail for two weeks four years ago. The day I got out I purchased a video and an audio recorder. I let ex know. She has complained about it for the last four years. Prior to me purchasing them I had three protection orders and an assault charge filed against me. I haven't been accused of anything since that time except breaking the law by recording close encounters of the BPD kind.

[Tim300]

Thank you sly, I'm pretty sure the mom is. When I met my ex I was saving her from alleged abuse from the father. The mother claimed abuse and tried to move in with a friend. The friend got custody of my ex because the mother was installable, not to mention the. The alleged abuse.im now 100 percent sure that there was no abuse and her whole backstory for the last 5 years is a load of b.s

The similarities in the stories here are remarkable.  My BPDex-fiancee and her mom alleged that my ex's biological father was abusive, etc.  Now that I'm out of the FOG I believe their claims are 100% baseless.

One of the worst parts about dealing with a pwBPD is when she always turns to her BPD mom for reality checks -- in my case her mom would not only validate her absurd positions but would also add in additional paranoid thoughts and power plays.  Good luck.

[rapror496]

Thanks for the responses. Another question I have is if it a good idea to press charges for their several attempts at extortion? I feel like if I have the prosecutor behind me for them commiting at least 2 felonies. Then they would lose any power that they might have in future drama.

The only concern I have with this is more crazy retaliation.

[Tim300]

Thanks for the responses. Another question I have is if it a good idea to press charges for their several attempts at extortion? I feel like if I have the prosecutor behind me for them commiting at least 2 felonies. Then they would lose any power that they might have in future drama.

The only concern I have with this is more crazy retaliation.

I would absolutely not escalate things unless it is necessary.  The mother has a slander problem and you are about to go to law school ... .wow... .stay away and don't do anything to set them off in any way.  Cut your losses and let them "win" if need be.  Good luck.  Sorry you are going through this.  Don't try to go toe to toe with psycho -- psycho will win.

[ForeverDad]

My lawyer said slander and libel cases often don't get very far, you have to prove intent.  Maybe you can document they did wrong, but can you really prove intent?

And yes, there is the retaliation factor to consider.  It's a fine line we have to walk, weighing the various factors pro and con, benefits versus risks, holding to firm boundaries yet not needlessly poking the wild beast.

[livednlearned]

If you can address the false allegations with documented proof that they are false, and it connects to the false RO in a way that helps you during those hearings, then that's appropriate. If anything worse happens, you have court documents where the falsehoods are documented. That might be worth something, although hopefully this doesn't continue beyond what you're dealing with right now.

You don't want to escalate anymore than you have to -- it's draining, expensive, it keeps the conflict going, and it often feels like everything comes down to the judge. Bill Eddy, a former therapist turned family law attorney, writes about how the adversarial court process has some things in common with BPD. Black/white thinking, adversarial, a punitive parent, potential for dramatic/emotional testimony, and an outcome in which there can only be winners and losers.

In general, it would be best if all of us could resolve things in mediation or settlement. The only reason it makes sense to go before a judge is when mediation absolutely fails. Many times pwBPD will settle before going to court, either because they have an L who spells out how things won't go in their favor in court, or because the other party gives in way too much.

Also, judges hate frivolous law suits, so you have to be sure that the slander and extortion is taking a serious toll. Otherwise you're just jamming up their docket and wasting their time.  

[rapror496]

Thank you all for the replies. I may be mistaken but a big difference between slander/ libel and extortion is that extortion falls into criminal law.

I understand that she has smeared me. I'm not as much worried about that as the extortion.

In this case she said if I do not move out she would have me arrested on false charges.  Ie denyingy legal right to something by holding a false crime over my head. A crime that if I in reality did would make her complicite. i have e the text and email saved proving this. With my future career would it be safer to file a police report for extortion giving the police a copy of the texts and emails? At that point as they have clear evidence of a crime being committed they have the responsibility to make an arrest. And can work out who actually sent the messeges. Regardless of the situation sending those messeges is a crime. In my area a severe one. My thoughts where with it being a felony. And me being the victim of a felony any restraining order or other false inquiry would then be looked at as retaliation. If they can even retaliate as a mandatory sentence is involved.

I really don't want to do this. But they keep escalating things. I left my belongings their to avoid a fight and haven't called since. But keep getting threats About cpos and lawsuits

[SlyQQ]

Wow my ex had at least the sense to make her death threats an extortion attempts wout a paper trail ask a lawyer if you threaten retaliation ( i.e. if you do this i will charge u with ) will weaken your case your x doesnt seem very savy this must be a huge plus

[rapror496]

Slyqq, that's the reason I don't think she did it. She's good about only making threats on the phone. I'm assuming as he is extremely wealthy that he thinks he can say stuff like this and have "daddy"  pay for a lawyer.he also threatened to sue me when he was a minor the first time she left me for him.  It's part of the reason I'm planning on prosecuting. I have no resources and can't afford civil court. However if a can get a criminal conviction I wouldn't be using any of my resources other than time. And can use that when or if it needs to go to civil court. I have to be careful because if I take it to civil court I will be doing it pro se. The advantage to doing it this way is if I lose, his legal fees won't affect me. As he will bring in a corporate lawyer and the way our court system works I will be given a lot of leeway.

I'm assuming that, if I threaten retaliation, it would make the extortion harder to prosecute. As doing that is basically extorting her. If you don't meet my demands I will press charges... as I have the responsibility to report a crime if I am victimized. I would be doing the same thing she is.

It would make the situation easier but I don't want to stoop to their level.

[SlyQQ]

Thats why i mentioned a lawyer they will no how to legally word a cease and desist request the right way but it seems you have got the legal advice an a course of action wrapped up good luck ( i am not sure how the legalities of stop your death threats or I will take appropriate legal action regarding such sits legally )

[livednlearned]

Definitely talk to a lawyer before you do anything. Pay for a consultation and ask questions -- you are probably plenty smart and can figure out a lot on your own. But my N/BPD ex was a former trial attorney who was apparently very competent in his area, but knew nothing about family law. He represented himself and bungled the whole thing. Did the same thing with the appeals he filed. Each area of law is so specialized and like you said, this is also your future career. You don't want to create problems for yourself because your confidence outweighed your knowledge.

Also confused about whether the extortion is about your ex threatening to file false charges? Or is it the other man extorting you?

If you genuinely think that the two of them are breaking the law and you have a case, talk to a lawyer. You don't get justice in court, and you might escalate the conflict in ways you can't even imagine. My experience is that the stakes have to be very high to justify going to court.

[rapror496]

With the false charges. A text was sent on her phone telling me to leave the house or she would report this alleged scam to my employer and the police. It just doesn't sound like her. Her father is a sergeant for our police department so all she would have to do is talk to him. She never really threatened me just used the new guy to protect her. I'm assuming the new guy wrote the texts and emails as their is a different writing style in these messeges than what she would use. Her written communication skills are terrible while these messeges where written perfectly

[livednlearned]

I made a point to be proactive when I received threats from N/BPDx. If you are genuinely concerned, go to the police and tell them that you want your stuff, and your ex's BF has made the following threat. If they think you should file something, take a day or two, talk to an L and decide what you want to do. When it comes to people who have a PD, you have to really weigh this stuff.

If you think it will protect you to let your employer know that you have been threatened, whether that means going to HR or directly to your supervisor, then do it. This worked well for me, but I have a very supportive work place with a boss who had a lot of knowledge and experience dealing with loose cannons like N/BPDx. 

[rarsweet]

It is very easy to get a temp order. The plaintiff must only state there has been abuse and they have fear of future abuse. It is harder to get a permanent order. The plaintiff must prove with a proponderance of evidence that the abuse occurred on more than one occasion and there is a credible future threat. The plaintiff is limited to testifying to what they wrote in the original complaint. They can't just start saying anything in court. The defendant should read the complaint carefully and break it down.

Look for weaknesses in that complaint, if the plaintiff puts down a date of the abuse, figure out where you were then, if anybody was around, look back at your Facebook even and see if you were chatting with friends then, etc. If they said you injured them, point out lack of hospital records , if they said you threatened them in email print your email, silly little details will help you, if they say something like I can't remember the exact date but I remember it was raining, look up the weather that day to prove it was really sunny, etc.

The credible threat means most people would consider it credible, if the plaintiff is a 250 lb man with a black belt, a car, and a gun permit, and the defendant is a 100 lb woman without a car or weapons there is no credible threat. If the plaintiff doesn't have any actual physical evidence and the claim isn't credible, when the judge asks you whether or not you did x, y, and z, all you need to say is no. The defendant doesn't carry the burden of proof.

When my ex filed for a protection order he wrote on x day I was physically aggressive and on x day I threatened him while I was holding the baby and he feared I would hurt him and the baby, poof I got served a protection order.  First I realized on the first x day I was really in the next state at a lactation consult. So I got my medical records. When it came to court my ex stated on x day I was sitting nursing the baby and pumping and that I went crazy. I flew up out of the chair so quickly that the pump cord wrapped around the babies neck and I was throwing household objects at this time. First I showed my medical records showing I wasn't home then, and then I stood up and physically showed the judge, I demonstrated holding a baby to nurse and holding a breast pump at the same time didn't leave me a hand to throw anything. Then I pointed out that actually the baby was only 4 days old and that I had a c- section so I wasn't flying out of any chair. When the judge asked him what exactly I threw my ex said he couldn't remember it was just household items, the judge asked me if I ever threw anything, I simply said no. Then the judge asked him how I was threatening the baby, and my ex said well she cosleeps with the baby and that causes SIDS. The judge told him that isn't a threat. Then he asked why he was in fear of me, and my ex said well she yells at me. I stood up again and pointed out that my ex was 230 lbs, had a car, and guns, and I was 110 lbs, no car, no weapons. The judge dismissed it. I learned just break down the complaint, stay calm, and let him burry himself.

Also look up vexatious litigation.

And I have to point out this is why it is so important for real victims to do the proper things when they really need a protection order because it is really easy to get one it is harder to get one that sticks.

Ask the police to do a civil standby while you retrieve belongings, they will contact the other party to arrange a time. The other party can absolutely refuse, but then you have a police report of the request and refusal. Ask the police to do a written report, don't just assume they will, sometimes this isn't the case.

Restraining orders stay on your record, even employers can see them, don't just accept the order because you don't want contact anyway. Also a restraining order means you can't own any guns or weapons, you can't buy them, and near me is a gun manufacturing plant, people with restraining orders can't even work there. For people who hunt they wouldn't be able to. I know a guy who was a martial arts instructor, his wife got a permanent order and he was not allowed to teach anymore because his legs were considered a deadly weapon. She even got it in their parenting plan that he couldn't teach their son martial arts.

I also know you can't get housing assistance here if you have a history of DV.