Looking for some validation on Boundary

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

When we first met, we hit it off like I've never hit it off with anyone before. Honestly, things could not have been any better at all.

When things became physical, I was totally into this person and let my guard down. I thought she was "the one" and she said as much countless times.

Then she pulled away. I was really confused. I pursued. 2 weeks later, about 3 months in, she stood me up one night. I was obviously upset.

Things blew hot and cold for the next month until I caught her in a huge lie where she had no real option but to admit to me she had cheated on me

with a co-worker both the night she stood me up, and a month later on this night I caught her in the lie.  She refused to leave my house, was begging

pleading and offered the most ridiculous yet seemingly plausible excuses. I will take full responsibility I should have seen the writing on the wall and

walked but I stayed. Believing all these promises she made to me. She told me he meant nothing, she would never hang out with him again outside

of work, how she was going to prove this and that to me, etc. 

The purpose of my message is for feedback from you all about my rationale for laying down a boundary.

As with all relationships for people with this condition, things were really great, then slowly unraveled over the past 11 months or so.  I tried, and tried,

and tried, I gave, and I gave until I started to lose a sense of who I was. Nothing was winnable, nothing was ever good enough.  She started to manage down

expectations of us being together, etc. 

Finally, a couple months ago when I was at my mind's end, during a text message conversation she disappears. Stops responding. That night she did not pick

up or return my calls. I heard nothing. Long story short, I found out she was hanging out with that same person again. I found out she has hung out with him once a week the next 4 weeks after. That was it for me. I walked and went no contact. She has since tried making me out to be a person who is possessive and jealous.

She has been hanging out with a guy she cheated on me with twice (that I  know of) until late at night, and drinking the whole time. All at a time when I was trying to see her to talk about "us"  I have never been possessive or jealous, and I never was this way about anyone else. And I wasn't this way even about him until AFTER I got stood up on, cheated on and made a fool of.  That in addition to the fact I caught her doing this, she had to be in a situation where there was no other answer than the truth for me to get the answers previously, oh and she said she would never put me in that position again. Here she is drinking with the same guy, not answering my calls, and doing it 4 weeks in a row. That is why I broke free.

She is giving me the pity treatment. How mean Iam, how untrusting Iam, etc. I guess I'm just reaching out for some validation in my decision. Aside from the fact you all know how these people are and will probably tell me, it's with good reason I did what I did because she probably is doing the things I feared. Assume for a moment she was someone without BPD. Am I out of line in anyway for having a problem with her hanging out and drinking with someone she cheated on me with? Especially when I had no issue until she violated my trust in such a horrible way with this same very person?

[anxiety5]

When we first met, we hit it off like I've never hit it off with anyone before. Honestly, things could not have been any better at all.

When things became physical, I was totally into this person and let my guard down. I thought she was "the one" and she said as much countless times.

Then she pulled away. I was really confused. I pursued. 2 weeks later, about 3 months in, she stood me up one night. I was obviously upset.

Things blew hot and cold for the next month until I caught her in a huge lie where she had no real option but to admit to me she had cheated on me

with a co-worker both the night she stood me up, and a month later on this night I caught her in the lie.  She refused to leave my house, was begging

pleading and offered the most ridiculous yet seemingly plausible excuses. I will take full responsibility I should have seen the writing on the wall and

walked but I stayed. Believing all these promises she made to me. She told me he meant nothing, she would never hang out with him again outside

of work, how she was going to prove this and that to me, etc. 

The purpose of my message is for feedback from you all about my rationale for laying down a boundary.

As with all relationships for people with this condition, things were really great, then slowly unraveled over the past 11 months or so.  I tried, and tried,

and tried, I gave, and I gave until I started to lose a sense of who I was. Nothing was winnable, nothing was ever good enough.  She started to manage down

expectations of us being together, etc. 

Finally, a couple months ago when I was at my mind's end, during a text message conversation she disappears. Stops responding. That night she did not pick

up or return my calls. I heard nothing. Long story short, I found out she was hanging out with that same person again. I found out she has hung out with him once a week the next 4 weeks after. That was it for me. I walked and went no contact. She has since tried making me out to be a person who is possessive and jealous.

She has been hanging out with a guy she cheated on me with twice (that I  know of) until late at night, and drinking the whole time. All at a time when I was trying to see her to talk about "us"  I have never been possessive or jealous, and I never was this way about anyone else. And I wasn't this way even about him until AFTER I got stood up on, cheated on and made a fool of.  That in addition to the fact I caught her doing this, she had to be in a situation where there was no other answer than the truth for me to get the answers previously, oh and she said she would never put me in that position again. Here she is drinking with the same guy, not answering my calls, and doing it 4 weeks in a row. That is why I broke free.

She is giving me the pity treatment. How mean Iam, how untrusting Iam, etc. I guess I'm just reaching out for some validation in my decision. Aside from the fact you all know how these people are and will probably tell me, it's with good reason I did what I did because she probably is doing the things I feared. Assume for a moment she was someone without BPD. Am I out of line in anyway for having a problem with her hanging out and drinking with someone she cheated on me with? Especially when I had no issue until she violated my trust in such a horrible way with this same very person?

[Targeted]

Validated!  I feel the same way And had a similar situation, it is also one of the determining factors why I left, during one of our arguments she threw one of her co-workers in my face and said she was going to F his brains out, I asked her because of what she said to end the friendship and remove him from Facebook and get him out of your phone if you want to stay with me! She told me I was just being controlling and jealous, call it what you will by telling somebody you supposedly love that you are going to F somebody else's brains out is totally unacceptable in a healthy relationship!  She also thought it was okay for her to hang out with others that she has been intimate with in the past with out me around, maybe some people would be comfortable with that but I am not, I do believe men and women can be just friends, but that friendship would look differently because it would respect relationships and their boundaries, hanging out with old F buddies is not healthy for a relationship! I think those actions would bother any non disordered person Who is serious about our relationship, maybe IAM a little tighter then some on the subject but I find it disrespectful to your current relationship to continue contact with exes that you did not have children with or other legal loose ends that need to be taken care of. I think if you want a future you have to let go of the past!

[raisins3142]

Anx,

Of course you were correct.

Her avoiding that situation given the context is totally common sense for the vast majority of the population.

Trustworthy people act in trustworthy ways and are even aware of the appearance of impropriety and avoid it.

There was once a saying about avoiding lingering at the door when the husband is away.

Pretty much smart phones, social media, the culture of toxic expectations (and pop psychology buzzwords), and a "have your cake and eat it too" and the "past doesn't matter" has created a culture here where I don't think monogamy happens very often.  It's sad.

I'm a bit old fashioned, but it was once common sense that when in an exclusive relationship you do not hang out alone with a member of the preferred sex, unless it is a special type of relationship (family, long time friend you both know well and trust, or maybe a gay guy).  The fact that someone can hang out alone and get drunk with a heterosexual, single man (if a female) and think if that raises your hairs that you are just jealous and insecure... .makes me want off this planet.  Those actions make one insecure in the relationship... .naturally and perhaps by design.

My ex was flirting with a man for a long time and claimed total innocence... .my male friend that saw the whole thing with me said "no one is that stupid"... .well some are I suppose.

[Tim300]

When we first met, we hit it off like I've never hit it off with anyone before. Honestly, things could not have been any better at all.

When things became physical, I was totally into this person and let my guard down. I thought she was "the one" and she said as much countless times.

Then she pulled away. I was really confused. I pursued. 2 weeks later, about 3 months in, she stood me up one night. I was obviously upset.

Things blew hot and cold for the next month until I caught her in a huge lie where she had no real option but to admit to me she had cheated on me

with a co-worker both the night she stood me up, and a month later on this night I caught her in the lie.  She refused to leave my house, was begging

pleading and offered the most ridiculous yet seemingly plausible excuses. I will take full responsibility I should have seen the writing on the wall and

walked but I stayed. Believing all these promises she made to me. She told me he meant nothing, she would never hang out with him again outside

of work, how she was going to prove this and that to me, etc. 

The purpose of my message is for feedback from you all about my rationale for laying down a boundary.

As with all relationships for people with this condition, things were really great, then slowly unraveled over the past 11 months or so.  I tried, and tried,

and tried, I gave, and I gave until I started to lose a sense of who I was. Nothing was winnable, nothing was ever good enough.  She started to manage down

expectations of us being together, etc. 

Finally, a couple months ago when I was at my mind's end, during a text message conversation she disappears. Stops responding. That night she did not pick

up or return my calls. I heard nothing. Long story short, I found out she was hanging out with that same person again. I found out she has hung out with him once a week the next 4 weeks after. That was it for me. I walked and went no contact. She has since tried making me out to be a person who is possessive and jealous.

She has been hanging out with a guy she cheated on me with twice (that I  know of) until late at night, and drinking the whole time. All at a time when I was trying to see her to talk about "us"  I have never been possessive or jealous, and I never was this way about anyone else. And I wasn't this way even about him until AFTER I got stood up on, cheated on and made a fool of.  That in addition to the fact I caught her doing this, she had to be in a situation where there was no other answer than the truth for me to get the answers previously, oh and she said she would never put me in that position again. Here she is drinking with the same guy, not answering my calls, and doing it 4 weeks in a row. That is why I broke free.

She is giving me the pity treatment. How mean Iam, how untrusting Iam, etc. I guess I'm just reaching out for some validation in my decision. Aside from the fact you all know how these people are and will probably tell me, it's with good reason I did what I did because she probably is doing the things I feared. Assume for a moment she was someone without BPD. Am I out of line in anyway for having a problem with her hanging out and drinking with someone she cheated on me with? Especially when I had no issue until she violated my trust in such a horrible way with this same very person?

This is a completely reasonable boundary.  You were generous to stick with her through the first round of cheating.  Asking for her to completely cut the other person out, for you to move forward in an exclusive relationship with her, seems completely reasonable to me.  I feel like I went through a similar fact pattern with my pwBPD (replete with her reconnecting with the guy).  I think one of the problems with setting boundaries with a pwBPD is that it gives the pwBPD a playbook on how to hurt you when her Mr. Hyde comes out.

[Trog]

Ahhhh, the old "theres something wrong with you if you're jealous" double-cross! Even if she's cheated before, even if she's cheated with that person before, even if she doesn't answer her phone for days and was love bombing you for days before that... .Its deliberate, its deceibtful, its crazy-making and ultimately it is cruel. The type of A+ cruelty they excel in NAMELY using your own good will and self examination against you. They know you will doubt yourself or check yourself if they protest.

My ex would continually play this game, I don't actually believe she was cheating, I think she was winding me up delibarately and didn't have the opportunity to cheat (not saying she never did IF the opporunity arose). But far more the ability to control me like a puppet by making me feel uncomfortable, she would talk about sex with her exes, lend money from our joint finances to her druggy exes (which we never got back) I am totally sure just to have some tiny control and wind me up.

Really, the more time passes the more ultra pathetic I see this woman and the more I realise how my positive characteristics were actually turned around to hurt me with. She is a loser. Out and out.

[Infared]

Anxiety... .

I could not have done what you did. If we were both in a committed relationship and I was cheated on multiple times (the first round... .and I guarantee you that she probably did it more than you actually know), that would have been it for me right there.  You gave her a second opportunity to be with and honest, faithful man. She does not want that. Her actions tell you that. Unfortunately, based on her behavior you certainly cannot listen to her words.  

You are looking for something much better than she has to offer... .so, unfortunately you need to look in the mirror and recognize that she is not the girl for you, grieve the loss and move on. Any boundary that you set at this point is totally appropriate to protect you.  ... .and just for the record... if my situation is any indication, she will take no REAL responsibility for her behavior and she will blame you for all of it.   I lived with mine for 5 years in a committed mannogamous relationship and she was cheating on me for I-will-never-know how long... .and it was all my fault.

Immature children act this way. Not adults.   You are better off without her. God bless you... .I can feel your pain... but it will get better as you move forward. You owe this woman nothing. Take care of you!     

[raisins3142]

Ahhhh, the old "theres something wrong with you if you're jealous" double-cross!

This made me laugh.

What is really annoying is that they feel clever (and right?) by doing this.

But it is just so rote and simple to do.

It's like if I went to a doctor and he warned me of my high blood pressure, and I smirked and said "the folks with lower blood pressure all have the problem, I'm fine."

Literally, a child can do this in nearly any situation, but this passes for high intellect for a pwBPD.

[raisins3142]

And once you catch them in so many lies, you just can't trust them.  Mine thought that because she said did not betray me (and maybe she did not) that I should be okay with her lying about her past and supposedly small things in the present/recent past while together.  It doesn't work like that.  Once you reach the "lying caught" threshold where you are not dealing with an honest person that bends the truth but a habitual liar, then trust is gone.  You can't keep them strapped to a lie detector test 24/7.

That is what really killed my relationship.  She wanted to talk things out the last time and I just told her "I can't believe anything you tell me now."

[Trog]

Ahhhh, the old "theres something wrong with you if you're jealous" double-cross!

This made me laugh.

What is really annoying is that they feel clever (and right?) by doing this.

But it is just so rote and simple to do.

It's like if I went to a doctor and he warned me of my high blood pressure, and I smirked and said "the folks with lower blood pressure all have the problem, I'm fine."

Literally, a child can do this in nearly any situation, but this passes for high intellect for a pwBPD.

Yes, my ex was incredibly childish in her arguing, then she made a profession out of irritating arguing to win the most pathetic case and became a barrister. Where you get applauded for taking ludicrous, foundless arguments and trying to look half-credible.

It was EXTREMELY irritating to be fighting against things or being accused of things that simply did not happen! Things I was accused of happened before we met! And I was punished for them! Sometimes I just walk around in a daze looking in the air going "whhhhattt whhaaattt". Really, there is NO sense here, my codependent nature wanted to understand her and fix things. I stayed beyond what 99.9% of the population could stand or tolerate! As Im sure many of us did. Nutter!

[anxiety5]

You all are the absolute best. You know the drill. You've been my sanity today, and you've allowed me to maintain no contact. I can't thank you enough. I consider myself an intelligent person. It continues to baffle me how this person can get inside my head and make me start to second guess my own morals and values.

Thank you so much.

No retreat. 

[Infared]

You all are the absolute best. You know the drill. You've been my sanity today, and you've allowed me to maintain no contact. I can't thank you enough. I consider myself an intelligent person. It continues to baffle me how this person can get inside my head and make me start to second guess my own morals and values.

Thank you so much.

No retreat. 

We can all support you because we have all let these dishonest, self-centered manipulative people inside our heads, and because we have caved in ourselves and gone back for more abuse and deception... .which for me always ended with me being alone, and in a lot of pain with low self-esteem... It helps to have support to stop you from doubting your good, honest self and not going back. Good luck! 

[apple2]

When we first met, we hit it off like I've never hit it off with anyone before. Honestly, things could not have been any better at all.

When things became physical, I was totally into this person and let my guard down. I thought she was "the one" and she said as much countless times.

Then she pulled away. I was really confused. I pursued. 2 weeks later, about 3 months in, she stood me up one night. I was obviously upset.

Things blew hot and cold for the next month until I caught her in a huge lie where she had no real option but to admit to me she had cheated on me

with a co-worker both the night she stood me up, and a month later on this night I caught her in the lie.  She refused to leave my house, was begging

pleading and offered the most ridiculous yet seemingly plausible excuses. I will take full responsibility I should have seen the writing on the wall and

walked but I stayed. Believing all these promises she made to me. She told me he meant nothing, she would never hang out with him again outside

of work, how she was going to prove this and that to me, etc.  

The purpose of my message is for feedback from you all about my rationale for laying down a boundary.

As with all relationships for people with this condition, things were really great, then slowly unraveled over the past 11 months or so.  I tried, and tried,

and tried, I gave, and I gave until I started to lose a sense of who I was. Nothing was winnable, nothing was ever good enough.  She started to manage down

expectations of us being together, etc.  

Finally, a couple months ago when I was at my mind's end, during a text message conversation she disappears. Stops responding. That night she did not pick

up or return my calls. I heard nothing. Long story short, I found out she was hanging out with that same person again. I found out she has hung out with him once a week the next 4 weeks after. That was it for me. I walked and went no contact. She has since tried making me out to be a person who is possessive and jealous.

She has been hanging out with a guy she cheated on me with twice (that I  know of) until late at night, and drinking the whole time. All at a time when I was trying to see her to talk about "us"  I have never been possessive or jealous, and I never was this way about anyone else. And I wasn't this way even about him until AFTER I got stood up on, cheated on and made a fool of.  That in addition to the fact I caught her doing this, she had to be in a situation where there was no other answer than the truth for me to get the answers previously, oh and she said she would never put me in that position again. Here she is drinking with the same guy, not answering my calls, and doing it 4 weeks in a row. That is why I broke free.

She is giving me the pity treatment. How mean Iam, how untrusting Iam, etc. I guess I'm just reaching out for some validation in my decision. Aside from the fact you all know how these people are and will probably tell me, it's with good reason I did what I did because she probably is doing the things I feared. Assume for a moment she was someone without BPD. Am I out of line in anyway for having a problem with her hanging out and drinking with someone she cheated on me with? Especially when I had no issue until she violated my trust in such a horrible way with this same very person?

I read this thread today. I am not sure whether mine cheated me. But, that's what he did:

1. Trying to visit his ex who put an end to him in another city. She refused him, then he showed me the messages between him and her.

2. Trying to celebrate the new year's eve with another ex he cut off. Bought her a new year's present using my customer card in front of me, without buying me any present for the new year. Told me she will love him for the whole life. I was pissed off, then he said there is only friendship between them.

3. Asking me back to him while telling me at the same time he would never belong to me alone.

I am always "amazed" at the way he behaves. I am not a sensitive person, I never asked him what he was doing, with whom. I never checked. I chose to trust him. But a normal person would not tell those things to avoid misunderstanding. Even a normal person cheated, he would try to hide. I just feel mine does not care about my feeling at all. Or he wanted to make me jealous?

I knew he has PD, I forgave more, tolerated more, gave more, loved more. Finally I felt my love for him is dead. I have never met a person which is so mean and shameless. I felt so stupid to be abused. I asked myself how can I love a person like this? Thanks God, the story ends.

[jhkbuzz]

You all are the absolute best. You know the drill. You've been my sanity today, and you've allowed me to maintain no contact. I can't thank you enough. I consider myself an intelligent person. It continues to baffle me how this person can get inside my head and make me start to second guess my own morals and values.

Thank you so much.

No retreat. 

I'm going to say this loudly... .

DUDE!

YOU ARE CORRECT IN YOUR PERCEPTIONS!

YOUR BOUNDARIES ARE HEALTHY AND HERS ARE NON EXISTENT!

SHE SLEPT WITH A DUDE AND KEPT HANGING OUT WITH HIM WHILE SHE WAS IN A R/S WITH YOU! 

WHY ARE YOU QUESTIONING YOURSELF?

STOP RIGHT NOW!

YOU KNOW WHAT SHE'S DONE IS WRONG.