Her interpretation of a discussion

[Zon]

I had another session of EFT MC this week.  I am still processing what I heard during it.

We discussed a recent incident that has happened many times over the course of our marriage (of course not before the marriage ).  I had pointed out an article I had read and asked her about a discrepancy from what I had been told over the years.  She made a comment about what it could be.  I said, "But the article said ... ." because she used a different word and sometimes a word may make a difference in medicine.  However, the way she saw it was that I was belittling her.  She said that I bring up various topics, and have over the years, just to put her down, and it is like a slap to her face.  After my comment, she only let her mind stay in the conversation.  I had noticed she was upset when talking about the article, so I had tried to calm the situation down by quickly explaining that I disagreed with the article too.  I took her side because I agreed with her!  I thought I had succeeded when in actuality, she was no longer in it.

I actually jerked back when she first stated how she took what I said.  Not only did I hurt her without any intention or realization, my attempt and success at helping was an illusion.  It hurt me a lot to hear it.

It seriously makes me believe that there is no hope for the marriage although I have been indifferent/numb to that for awhile.  I have been wondering more about what a healthier marriage is like.  Fights that end, can be forgiven and forgotten.  I want that!  However, it appears worse to me because I cannot even have a civil conversation with her without the fear she will get mad even out of the marriage.

On a related noted, I think this is not just about conversations regarding tame topics but also sensitive topics like my mom.  Asking a question to understand what my wife is saying is interpreted as a smack in the face to her.

Finally, on the bright side, I now have a good way to explain it to family members if/when there is a divorce.

[Mike-X]

Be mindful of providing validation. I suspect that your "But the article said... " was felt as invalidating to her. Did you start by explicitly validating her feelings and thoughts? Then respectfully insert your feelings and thoughts. Then close with more violation of her feelings and thoughts.

[Zon]

Be mindful of providing validation. I suspect that your "But the article said... " was felt as invalidating to her. Did you start by explicitly validating her feelings and thoughts? Then respectfully insert your feelings and thoughts. Then close with more violation of her feelings and thoughts.

Since the discussion was more technical, I was not thinking about feelings being involved.  However, after I said that line and noticed her reaction (15 seconds after I started the conversation), I did validate her by saying that I agreed with her and did not quite believe the article.

Validating her is hard for me and getting harder over time.  For one, I am more the type to insert foot first.  Secondly, I strongly prefer an open conversation instead of one where I have to dance throughout it.  I have watched the counselor do it with her at times.  It seems very overboard.  My S4 and D9 do not need that much validation.  When I explain to my daughter why I am asking questions to understand a situation, she takes awhile to comprehend but does understand without getting mad as often and my wife.

[Mike-X]

Since the discussion was more technical, I was not thinking about feelings being involved.  However, after I said that line and noticed her reaction (15 seconds after I started the conversation), I did validate her by saying that I agreed with her and did not quite believe the article.

Validating her is hard for me and getting harder over time.  For one, I am more the type to insert foot first.  Secondly, I strongly prefer an open conversation instead of one where I have to dance throughout it.  I have watched the counselor do it with her at times.  It seems very overboard.  My S4 and D9 do not need that much validation.  When I explain to my daughter why I am asking questions to understand a situation, she takes awhile to comprehend but does understand without getting mad as often and my wife.

I saw that you had said that you tried to clarify things and even make it clear that you agreed with her. I wasn't judging you. Sorry if it seemed that way. I was responding to what I thought you were asking about what triggered her hurt feelings in the interaction. So I was just pointing out what I thought might have triggered her reaction.

I  also certainly understand the difficulty in trying to judge when a person is needing validation and fighting your own tendencies in conversations. Most of the people with whom I interact don't seem to get overly hurt if validation is not given in a conversation. However, I haven't met a person yet who didn't respond positively to it, BPD or not. I know several sort of chronic validators, and it just feels damn good interacting with them, even when they strongly disagree with me.

It does take a lot of work for me. I have to practice and work on being mindful of needing to do it.

[Zon]

Since the discussion was more technical, I was not thinking about feelings being involved.  However, after I said that line and noticed her reaction (15 seconds after I started the conversation), I did validate her by saying that I agreed with her and did not quite believe the article.

Validating her is hard for me and getting harder over time.  For one, I am more the type to insert foot first.  Secondly, I strongly prefer an open conversation instead of one where I have to dance throughout it.  I have watched the counselor do it with her at times.  It seems very overboard.  My S4 and D9 do not need that much validation.  When I explain to my daughter why I am asking questions to understand a situation, she takes awhile to comprehend but does understand without getting mad as often and my wife.

I saw that you had said that you tried to clarify things and even make it clear that you agreed with her. I wasn't judging you. Sorry if it seemed that way. I was responding to what I thought you were asking about what triggered her hurt feelings in the interaction. So I was just pointing out what I thought might have triggered her reaction.

I understand.  I was thinking that agreeing with her a few times in a row was not validation and was wondering if I needed to write it down for her signed with my blood. 

I also certainly understand the difficulty in trying to judge when a person is needing validation and fighting your own tendencies in conversations. Most of the people with whom I interact don't seem to get overly hurt if validation is not given in a conversation. However, I haven't met a person yet who didn't respond positively to it, BPD or not. I know several sort of chronic validators, and it just feels damn good interacting with them, even when they strongly disagree with me.

It does take a lot of work for me. I have to practice and work on being mindful of needing to do it.

I seem to be able to validate others that I may not even like, but she is triggered in too many ways for me to do it.  I may skip over two landmines successfully but land on the third.  At the far end, I can even say something bad about my mom, and she would trigger on the very mention of my mom, however, not as badly since it was against my mom. 

With that said, I will try to remember to validate first.

There hardest part is that I cannot even begin to explain validation to my daughter for her mom.  My daughter was complaining this afternoon that Mommy is so illogical.  I KNOW puberty will go well. 

Thank you.