Young Kids, Still Adjusting A Year Out

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

knockitoff's thread got me thinking about depression. I didn't want to hijack, so here's my thread.

Their mom moved out a little over a year ago. We started a 3-2-2-3 schedule (the 3s being Friday evening through Monday morning) while we worked out the legal custody issues. That hasn't changed, though I've ended up with the kids a small percentage more, like this weekend where she has some multi-level marketing scheme training from the afternoon into late night...

My Ex introduced the kids to her affair partner right away after she moved out, and it caused some emotional problems with them within two months. It was sick that she posted pics of the kids with him on FB, my secret squirrel told me later, but nothing I could do about that.

D2 turns D3 in about a month. She was 1 when her parents seperated. These are formative years, fraught with potential attachment issues.

Only in the past month did she finally start crying for "Mommy" sometimes. On the one hand it pains me... .and on the other hand it pains me, like, "it's about time she started missing her mother," because over the past year the kids didn't seem to when they were with me. It's a bittersweet pill. I'm a Leaver. I have lingering anger.

I picked the kids up yesterday from their grandma's house, our baby-sitter,.my Ex's mom. D2 was clnging to one of her uncles. After I was there for a few minutes, she reached out to me and I held her. I was told that she was moody and didn't really eat the whole day. Thisbisnt the first time D2 has acted like this.

After I got them into the car and played their favorite songs, though (which I'm getting sick of... .same songs, everytime we're in the car), she seemed better.

We got home and I cooked dinner. She ate a lot, actually, and I texted her uncle to tell her mom (who may not be BPD, but is definitetly a hermit-waif). D2 was good... she told me this morning that she wanted to stay at my house and not go to grandma's. I validated her, but said I had to go to work, to which she replied, "I want to go to work, too!" I valdated her, "I wish you could come to work with me too, but I have to go by myself, and I'll pick you up tonight, ok?" "Ok, daddy."

Today was fine, no depression or whatever it was.

Earlier in the week, I picked up the kids early in the mrnng to watch them on their mom's day because grandma had to go to the doctor. I noticed a new scratch on D2's face and I asked her about it. She recalled what happened a month ago, "[Mommy's bf] hit me with [toy] car. I crying, Daddy, I crying." I asked S5 what happened, and he replied, "I tell [bf] things, but he doesn't listen!"

What startled me was his tone of voice, far beyond what a barely 5 year old should talk about an adult. He's the same age removed from me as is S5 from him almost 

I didn't comment or pry. Things will change when they get married and move in together. All I can do is focus on the kids.

[Turkish]

knockitoff's thread got me thinking about depression. I didn't want to hijack, so here's my thread.

Their mom moved out a little over a year ago. We started a 3-2-2-3 schedule (the 3s being Friday evening through Monday morning) while we worked out the legal custody issues. That hasn't changed, though I've ended up with the kids a small percentage more, like this weekend where she has some multi-level marketing scheme training from the afternoon into late night...

My Ex introduced the kids to her affair partner right away after she moved out, and it caused some emotional problems with them within two months. It was sick that she posted pics of the kids with him on FB, my secret squirrel told me later, but nothing I could do about that.

D2 turns D3 in about a month. She was 1 when her parents seperated. These are formative years, fraught with potential attachment issues.

Only in the past month did she finally start crying for "Mommy" sometimes. On the one hand it pains me... .and on the other hand it pains me, like, "it's about time she started missing her mother," because over the past year the kids didn't seem to when they were with me. It's a bittersweet pill. I'm a Leaver. I have lingering anger.

I picked the kids up yesterday from their grandma's house, our baby-sitter,.my Ex's mom. D2 was clnging to one of her uncles. After I was there for a few minutes, she reached out to me and I held her. I was told that she was moody and didn't really eat the whole day. Thisbisnt the first time D2 has acted like this.

After I got them into the car and played their favorite songs, though (which I'm getting sick of... .same songs, everytime we're in the car), she seemed better.

We got home and I cooked dinner. She ate a lot, actually, and I texted her uncle to tell her mom (who may not be BPD, but is definitetly a hermit-waif). D2 was good... she told me this morning that she wanted to stay at my house and not go to grandma's. I validated her, but said I had to go to work, to which she replied, "I want to go to work, too!" I valdated her, "I wish you could come to work with me too, but I have to go by myself, and I'll pick you up tonight, ok?" "Ok, daddy."

Today was fine, no depression or whatever it was.

Earlier in the week, I picked up the kids early in the mrnng to watch them on their mom's day because grandma had to go to the doctor. I noticed a new scratch on D2's face and I asked her about it. She recalled what happened a month ago, "[Mommy's bf] hit me with [toy] car. I crying, Daddy, I crying." I asked S5 what happened, and he replied, "I tell [bf] things, but he doesn't listen!"

What startled me was his tone of voice, far beyond what a barely 5 year old should talk about an adult. He's the same age removed from me as is S5 from him almost 

I didn't comment or pry. Things will change when they get married and move in together. All I can do is focus on the kids.

[livednlearned]

My T said that depression is anger turned inward. I was definitely depressed for the first few years after my divorce, and realize that I invalidated my son for most of his childhood, especially trying to egg shell our way around N/BPDx. That's a lot of emotions to stuff, for a very long time -- 10 years for S13, most of his life.  :'( Depressing.

One thing I'm realizing is that it was actually worse when S13 seemed to be doing ok. He wasn't. He was modeling what I was modeling, which was "I got this." Validation -- the really profound stuff -- is rooted in us, in our experiences, our values, how we feel. It's more than the sentences we use. Your kids know that you are the stable parent, and they are watching you like a hawk to see how they should be. They see how your face tightens when you say OM's name, if you don't have eye contact with him, or whatever they are looking at for signs about how they should be. I think kids of divorce are much more vigilant about their parents. They feel that they are on thin ice in the scheme of things, always checking to see if things are stable, if it's safe.

If you are angry, if you are holding in those feelings, your kids will do the same. This doesn't mean that you express anger about their mom to them, it just means that they will learn from you which emotions are ok, and which ones are not. It's stressful to manage emotions, and that might be what D3 is learning and trying to figure out. You validating her is helping her a lot.

I don't have any advice about how to do this stuff well. I hired a pro to help S13 deal with his feelings. I'm lucky S13 felt safe enough to share some of the dark feelings he was experiencing, and that he's self aware enough to know that these feelings aren't going to cut it. I think he got to this place because I started to feel better. It gave him a compass, he realized he was feeling bad, and wants to feel better.

It puts a lot of healing on our own shoulders.  

[milo1967]

"My Ex introduced the kids to her affair partner right away after she moved out, and it caused some emotional problems with them within two months."

I'm very sorry for your situation. Know that you are not alone. Last year, Once I shut down her final attempt to suck me back in and she realized I was going through with the divorce, my XW promptly moved in with her AP. And it's been a year from hell. The kids have suffered so badly. This guy has no kids and ours are not easy. He clearly dislikes our kids and they him. They have begged their mother to move out but she simply cannot be alone--never has been. It's painful to get the pleading calls for me to get them and their declarations that they are never going back. (They are eleven and eight.). XW is in total denial that their misery is due to her behaviors, attributing it to everyone (specifically me and the kids themselves) but herself.

All we can do is be the best parent we can be when they are with us. Time will do its thing and the children will ultimately get a say in where they want to live.

Strength.

[NorthernGirl]

How are things Turkish? How is your daughter doing?

[Turkish]

How are things Turkish? How is your daughter doing?

Thanks NG (and lnl and milo).

I don't think that the kids pick up on my anger. S5 hasn't said anything like the other week when he said "mommy moved out because the house is messy." D2 still asks for Mommy, only when I take them out of the bath and get them dressed. She's looking at pics of us in their room. It switchhed from last week where she wanted to go to sleep in my bed. She's been comfortable going to sleep in their room again, even not wanting to sleep with her brother. Still, she wandered into my room about 3am, so I hugged her tight.  Last week, she seemed desperate to connect with me. This week, she's more stable. Just about 3 is a tough age. S5, despite his emotional dysregulation, has seemed to handle this better on the surface. D2 s more resilient emotially, but she's at the critical attachment stage. I think that if the kids' ages were reversed, we'd have major problems.

After blowing me off on the weekend, their mom called me yesterday, very sweet. She wants to take the kids to Puerto Rico this year (pretty sure that's where her bf's family s from), and she said to Mexico (where she's from) in two years, once D3 is D5. I'm leaning towards yes on the first, and no on the second, until D3 (next month) is D10.

[NorthernGirl]

Hm, I'm presuming she has to have your permission to take the kids out of the country. Is there any risk she would not return the kids? How about that she will make this promise to the kids and not follow through?

Travelling with young kids can be stressful, do you think she will do okay?

In DH's ex case, she would promise trips but never follow through. And it was clear she couldn't really handle the kids for long periods, especially SS20 who has special needs, so I doubt she'd take them away for long. Having said that, there were lots of other things DH wouldn't trust her doing.

[Turkish]

I don't think she's a flight risk, NG. Her job is here, as well as her immediate family. I trust her with what I can trust her with, but she still engages in lies of omission. I still remember her wanting (saying) that she was going to take our son back to Mexico with her when he was a baby and she was scared she was going to get deported. Luckily, her citizenship was approved before I had to deal with that (no way in hell would I have let that happen... .at worst, she would have lost her job though).

The whole thing with her beau's family... .I don't know. I still question a guy so young (23 when this started, just turned 25) who knows he can't have kids of his own with her because she fixed herself after D2. I can't really control that though, can I? He's seperated in age to S5 2 years short of the age seperation between him and I. 

Yes, she needs my permission. Her words, "I just want to be able to take them with me," tells me it's about her, not the kids. They'll barely remember it later, even at 5 and 7.

I made an appointment tomorrow with my T to get an opinion in the right thing to do.