I am divorcing my BPD husband and we have a 3yr old, help

[NewLife15]

I have been married for 6 years. I only dated my soon to be ex for a couple months and he PUSHED for marriage. Other than his occasional mood swings and pushiness, he was sweet and made lots of promises, so I finally agreed after only 2 months of dating. Not long after we married, things started getting rocky. Of course part of it was not really knowing each other, but part was that he was wanting me to do things I wasn't comfortable with, he began isolating me, and constantly picking fights with me. I didn't understand the fights because they would start over simple statements. Now, we have a 3 yr old daughter and it has become too much. I was able to leave him and currently have our daughter. At first, I was meeting him with my sister and her husband in a public place so he could see her. Then he wanted to start taking her off alone and I denied. He is now making a lot of threats. I have a lawyer but can't talk to her until next Tuesday. Has anyone else been through anything similar?

[NewLife15]

I want to add that I do allow him to talk to our daughter 2-3 times per day and told him I wasn't planning to meet with him anymore until I talk to my lawyer. He hasn't handled that well. Any advice?

[momtara]

Yes, many of us have been through something similar. 

Has he been physically abusive? Depending on the courts in your state, you may have to allow him unsupervised visitation at some point unless you can prove the child is in danger or has suffered. But it all depends on how much you can fight and what you can show legally. Believe me, I know how scary a person like this can be. So what you do early on matters, and can set a precendent. A lot of us on this page can try to help you.

Have there been any motions so far? Have you seen a lawyer?

Congrats on being able to get away. I know it isn't easy when you have seen the sweet and kind side of a person like this, and they make you feel so wanted sometimes. But the isolation, crazy-making, etc. are typical abuse tactics, even if largely verbal and not physical.

I was married for around the same period of time and have a child the same age as yours. Sometimes you can tiptoe for a long time and then it comes to  a head. In my case my ex has anxieties and it was just hard to keep everything calm when you have a child who can't be controlled.  It is very hard to parent alone but it is still easier than having to keep him calm and take care of a baby!

Tell us more. Hang in there. You did the right thing.

He can try to file a motion to see the child (unless you think he is too intimidated or too broke to bother, for now). You can respond and demand a psych eval. Still, you shouldn't wait too long to understand what you can do legally.

[ForeverDad]

First, if there is no court order then both spouses would have roughly equal but unspecified parenting rights.  More or less, the parent in possession calls the shots until the court states otherwise.  Even if he called the police demanding access the most they would do when responding would be to ask (not tell) you to agree just so they could log the immediate incident as resolved.

I recall - when we had separated but the original order had been dismissed - my then-spouse blocked ALL my contact with my preschooler, not even allowing phone calls.  My son wasn't in daycare or school then so I had no way to find him apart from his mother.  I called the police for help and they told me call back once I had a court order in hand.  They refused to accompany me if I went to see him yet confirmed they'd come rushing if I knocked on her door and she called the police.  I didn't want to risk arrest so I waited.  It ended up being 3 months blocked totally from a 4 year old son and at the long-awaited hearing the magistrate wasn't fazed one bit, he just said, "Well, I'll fix that, I'll reinstate the prior schedule."

I recall - when we had an order - when my ex didn't show up at the daycare to get our child but then came with police to my home, they agreed she should have picked him up at the daycare but then pleaded with me to do the exchange then.  I think the first time I agreed but the second time I refused.  Both times they left saying, "Fix this in court."

So I think you're doing well.  You aren't blocking unilaterally, you are allowing phone contact.  However, be careful not to obligate yourself to too frequent phone calls.  Once you get into court you don't want the court to make the current phone call frequency into part of the order!  A few brief calls a week ought to be enough.  Most orders state "reasonable telephone contact", leaving it somewhat vague to allow the parents to find an equitable balance.  When facing a potentially high conflict case that equitable balance may be impossible to reach and so you don't want to unintentionally 'gift away' too much.

[NewLife15]

Thank you momtara and ForeverDad for the input. Momtara, you asked for more info, so here goes! I was able to leave my STB exH one month ago. He has been abusing narcotics off and on the entire 6 years we've been together. I'd confronted him about it twice and he promised to stop, but only returned to it claiming he was in unimaginable pain in his body. Sometimes I believed him, but most of the time I didn't. He was still functional on the narcotics so most people didn't notice.

As far as abuse, he never physically abused me, but did threaten to a few times during our marriage. The abuse was more mental and verbal. He controlled everything me and our daughter did. We could be having a normal conversation and all of a sudden something I would say triggered a fit. He would start yelling and telling me I was being rebellious. This was the case any time I questioned anything he did.

He expected our daughter to be completely quiet. Most of the time he would have her in front of the TV so he didn't have to listen to her. If she didn't sit down in the living room and watch TV he sent her to her room and if she played too loud in there he would make her lay in her bed and watch something claiming she was "tired" simply because she was acting like the 3 yr old she is! If I commented to this, I was being argumentative and trying to start something.

Since we've left, I stated before, I was meeting with him so he could see our daughter. At first, I didn't tell him I was not planning on getting back together because I wanted to get all of my ducks in a row first. When we would meet, he would follow me around instead of spending time with her. I was also still speaking to him on the phone but I was trying to talk about our daughter and he would start talking about us. Finally, I took my ring off and quit speaking to him but had my daughter call him 2-3 times/day. When I met with him next for him to see her, he noticed the ring missing and out of the 2 hours we were there for him to see her, he talked to me about an hour and forty five mins. It was then I told him I didn't want to work it out and he needed to focus on being her dad.

Then, the threats began. He started saying he could have me kicked out of where I am living and that he would tell the court I don't have a place to live or a job (I am working for a small salary each month and live with my sister and it's completely free). After the threats began, I only took her to see him two more times. I was afraid he had done his research and that he will know once she's in his arms, he can legally walk away. Where I live, he is trespassed from, so he can't come here and get her. The last time he saw her was Saturday and I have still let him talk to her 2x/day. I told him I wasn't going to meet again until I talk to my lawyer. I have an apmt with her next Tuesday, that's the earliest I could get because I am going through legal aid. I do not respond to his texts/calls except to tell him when she is going to be calling him. He says I am not communicating with him about her? I've called around and talked to the police dept and sheriffs dept to see what my rights are and they all made it sound like I am not doing anything wrong.

I just do not trust him to take her unsupervised as he has also threatened suicide since I've left. I also feel he may try to harm her since he is angry about the loss of control.

[ForeverDad]

To discount his claims that you're not sharing information about your child, send the information by email and then keep copies as documentation.  Phone calls are too easy to be diverted onto other topics, aren't easily documented except by recording and the risk of emotional manipulation and pressuring is higher.

We have several acronyms here, one is FOG.  Ponder each aspect and how you are influenced, pressured, sabotaged and impacted.

Fear

Obligation

Guilt

Threats of suicide, are they documented?  Witnesses?  Recordings?  Are they sincere contemplations or manipulative threats?  General policy is to not figure it out yourself, the professionals may say you're not qualified to assess such comments.  Suicide threats are often handled by the emergency responders and passed along to appropriate mental health teams.  Ask your lawyer if that's what you need to do next time.  (If you do report it then be sure you can prove he said it, almost certainly he will deny it to others.  You can' let it become He-Said, She-Said.)

[NewLife15]

ForeverDad, anytime I do respond to him, it is ALWAYS by text. I realized over the past couple of weeks that was the best way to have evidence. The suicide threat wasn't told to me, but to my brother in law during one of our visits. My bil didn't tell me right away because he was afraid I would feel sorry for him and go back.

Thanks for the acronym. Not contacting him too much is relatively easy for me, as I have never been emotionally attached to him. We were married too quickly and I just never developed those kinds of feelings. However, I am an extremely empathetic person which is where he got me. Most of the emotions I struggle with now are feeling bad about not letting him see her for the moment. But it has only been three days since he's seen her and I will be meeting with my lawyer Tuesday.

In his mind, he's done nothing wrong and therefore doesn't understand why I'm not letting him see her. I avoided confrontation when we were together and didn't realize until close to the end he may have a disorder. I stumbled across narcissism, which described him to a T, then I came across BPD and WOAH!

[livednlearned]

Hi NewLife15,

I'm sorry I missed your post and am just seeing it now. I'm glad you are taking steps to protect you and your D3, and that you have a sister you can stay with while you get a strategy in place. It's possible that the lawyer you talk to won't know much about mental illness. In some ways, we have to become experts in the strategy, while our lawyers learn to listen to us. If you want to read a really helpful book about BPD and the family court system, get a copy of Splitting: Divorcing an NPD/BPD Spouse by Bill Eddy. You can download a copy to your computer if you want to read it before you meet with your lawyer.

This is also a really good article -- it's written by a lawyer for lawyers, but in my experience, most of us have to figure out how to get on the same page with our lawyers. Often, we're in a state of fear when filing for divorce, and it's easy to expect a lawyer to understand what we're dealing with. Most don't understand BPD -- I think you have to live it to truly get it. So I hope this article will help you understand the type of strategy you may need to develop: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=270440.msg12566140#msg12566140

Another thing I have found helpful over the years is figuring out the degree to which a BPD person is high-conflict. Not all people with BPD are high-conflict personalities, although all high-conflict personalities have BPD. A high-conflict person, in addition to having a personality disorder, will recruit negative advocates, engage in persuasive blaming, and have a target of blame (you). These are the most difficult people.

Your ex is likely to say a lot of things to scare you, and then not be able to follow through on his threats. There seems to be a trend here with male BPD fathers on this board that they want control over the spouse more than they want time with the children. Your goal, then, is to get the best custody arrangement you can get. Even if you get a good custody arrangement, there is a chance your ex will keep having reasons why he can't spend time with your D3.

It's good that you are documenting as much as you can. And you're female -- there does seem to be a bias in court toward moms, especially when the kids are younger.

Last, if it's any consolation, I left with my son abruptly and went into hiding (for lack of a better word). My L counseled me to make sure S13 (9 at the time) talked to his dad, and I called right away to assure him S13 was safe. I initiated calls every night. That's all the courts cared about. They see some pretty serious stuff, much more than what I brought to court. It would break your heart  :'( what goes through those courts, the trauma and tragedy kids endure. Courts know that divorce is a volatile and turbulent time, and they seemed to cut me tremendous slack to get some distance, probably because they would rather there be no contact than crazy anger contact that S13 might witness.

Given that you are trying to maintain contact, that's good. But don't try to push it too much, otherwise you undermine your argument that he is a danger to D3, which you are going to be saying in your complaint when you file for custody. It's a fine line. If my situation is any indication, then as long as you let D3 and her dad speak, you should be ok until a lawyer instructs you otherwise. The reason for this is to make sure, both to your ex and to the court, that you are not engaged in child abduction. Which obviously you are not.

You have your bases covered.

I hope you end up with a good lawyer who counsels you well. Keep posting and let us know how you're doing. We're here for you.



LnL

[catnap]

"He has been abusing narcotics off and on the entire 6 years we've been together. I'd confronted him about it twice and he promised to stop, but only returned to it claiming he was in unimaginable pain in his body. Sometimes I believed him, but most of the time I didn't. He was still functional on the narcotics so most people didn't notice."

Legally prescribed?  Street drugs? 

You certainly need to mention it to your attorney. . .professional supervised visitation can be ordered with drug testing prior to the visit.  He pays for each test and visit.  I would also ask your L if there was any possibility of asking the court order him to take a hair follicle drug test (can detect certain narcotics up to six months).  Many can clean up for court and pass a urine test, but a hair follicle test will show a pattern of drug abuse not therapeutic amounts if he is having it prescribed by several doctors and going to different pharmacies.

[NewLife15]

Thanks LnL for all of the info. I started reading the book Splitting and found it very interesting. In the book I came across the Antisocial PD, which I haven't previously read about, and he is more like that than even the BPD or NPD. I also read the article you linked for me, very good as well. I am so thankful for this site and the advice I have received!

Catnap- the drugs I mentioned... .No street drugs (at least that I am aware), the pills he would get from his mom most of the time. She is prescribed hydrocodone. Towards the end, he was going to the hospital and getting them prescribed as well. He did this twice. He used to steal the pills from his mom until she started willingly giving them to him (she would give him about 30 10mg and they were gone in 3 days). He has stolen pills from his dad in the past, until his dad stopped getting them, and has stolen them from friends of ours. And, I may have mentioned in another comment, he would practically beg any of our friends that he knew may have some if they would give him some because he was in "tremendous amounts of pain". He has had a drug test, but it was only urine. Someone mentioned to me about the hair follicle and I plan to ask about it, but I believe he has been avoiding taking anything because I think he knows I may try to bring it up.