If I could just stop two of his behaviors, I could stay...

[frayedseamstress]

Hello, everyone! I'm new here, but I've read a lot of the threads that are on here and I really love the support this community gives. It's so non-judgmental, and I think that's really beautiful.

I'm 22, and I have a daughter with my boyfriend, who has been diagnosed with psychotic depression but who I know for sure to also have BPD. I've spent 6 years with him. When we started our relationship, I probably really fit into the codependency mold, but after the birth of our daughter nearly 3 years ago, I really changed due to my overriding desire to make sure that she was always my first priority, she was always safe, and that nothing I was doing- including keeping her father around -would compromise the quality of her childhood as mine had been compromised by having a psychotic parent.

I guess to cut a long story shorter, since so much of what I've gone through with him is exactly like the stories all of you have... .I know I can never live under one roof with him. I've determined that my daughter can't be in that position. No matter how much therapy he is getting, no matter how good he is doing, it can all change with something as simple as a fluctuation in his hormones, being tempted by weed/alcohol, etc. throwing him off balance and into psychotic episode as a result of his depression. He can obviously still have ups and downs in spite of being treated, just like anyone else, and a slip-up of his during a down period could have very dire and extreme consequences. There's also the possibility of him giving up on therapy. He has done so before. That would mean I'd be in a position to need to kick him out. That would be terrible. I rather never face that than try to move him in with me.

But, I could stay in a relationship with him. I do love him very much. I have always been able to separate that sort of "second mouth" that comes from his mental illness from his "real self". There is a real, genuine human in there, who feels remorse and pain; who, after his episodes, breaks down and cries in therapy in front of his family out of guilt of saying and doing things to hurt me and who seriously could heal if only he turned inward and sought out the real reasons behind his extraordinarily low self-esteem and the childhood issues he's decided to close off from his memory. He could heal if he could just identify why he is so terrified of abandonment that he tries to control "when" he's abandoned by lashing out at me, rather than risk it happening when he might not be prepared.

I'm starting to do well for me and my daughter financially. In the next year, I could potentially rent him a studio apartment nearby to us so he could see his daughter often alongside me, and I could be very happy that way and even, through positive manipulation, have him continue going to his therapy and hopefully get him into some sort of group that participates in DBT in exchange for me to pay his rent exclusively. In theory, as long as we mean so much to him, he'll go to therapy to stay near us, which is certainly beneficial to him on all fronts and keeps boundaries clear on my end so I can keep my daughter and I safe from his symptoms if they were to start going unchecked. No therapy means we're at risk. That's not going to fly.

The only things, though, that are really in the way of me deciding whether or not to stay are these: Will a BPD partner ALWAYS jump to emotional affairs/obsessions with past exes and "one that got away" types, or are there ways for them to get over it? For me, obviously the point of continuing the relationship would be to experience mutual love. I can handle irrationality. I can handle angry outbursts with him under another roof, hold him accountable to his weaknesses regarding substance abuse, etc. But for some reason, even though I know that his preoccupation with a mutual friend of ours only comes up during times of blatantly going into "sabotage mode" and other episodic circumstances, I can't handle hearing about it. Whether during this episode he hates her to the point of wishing harm on her, or during that episode he's wishing he could sleep with her and fell in love with her at first sight apparently and "settled" for me and on and on, it doesn't matter. I know it's a delusion, and yet I can't handle it, because that extra person being used as an excuse to reject my love just becomes unacceptable to me. I have enough self-esteem not to care about the comparison anymore, although a couple years ago, it really did hurt me. The current reason why it breaks my boundaries is that it's the only subject I can't touch. I can't tell him how he feels about another person and tell him he's being unreasonable/episodic as it goes on, because he can turn it around and say I'm just jealous, etc., or that I just don't understand. Everything else is impersonal in every way, so I can reason with him that being violent is episodic. I can tell him that his dissociative behaviour is episodic. I can stay detached. But that one topic, over which I have no control, is a trigger for me to suddenly start taking things personally and become unable to think with a clear head regarding it being "only an episode", etc., mainly because I know his hate/love issue with her so severely detracts from his desire to listen to me that it actually does become personal, because he puts me in a caretaker role while enjoying the emotional turmoil he's created in the image of another woman who has obviously put zero energy into him whatsoever, which tells me I'm throwing my love and energy into a hole.

The second problem is the fact that, someday, he'll be able to get himself a car. When he gets one, I fear that he could pursue physically cheating (which could bring me the nasty consequences of STDs) or that he'll be getting ahold of alcohol and weed more easily, thus sending him into worse episodes that could end up violent or even sexually aggressive. Obviously, that's not okay.

So, is this a handleable issue for those in relationships with people with BPD? Is there a way to talk people through their emotional obsessions with others? Are there ways of incentivizing NOT using alcohol and drugs? Does DBT help with these issues? I want to make a sound judgment, but I truly love the man in there who is hurting and afraid, and I don't want to make his fears a "self-fulfilling prophecy" by "abandoning" him if I can help it, considering I really don't want to. What I want is for him to be able to find a way to heal, begin to accept and love himself, and be able to enjoy watching his daughter grow and to be able to stay with me, as he always does clearly want to do. I want him to be able to accept love and give it back, and for all of us to be safe in the process of his healing. Any advice will be hugely appreciated.

[frayedseamstress]

I've been thinking about my own question today. I've decided that I really think I can do it. I think I can stick with him. I know I'm doing better about maintaining my boundaries, thinking objectively instead of emotionally when he starts acting out, etc.

But I'm still curious about ways to handle his perception of emotional attachments to other people- most commonly that one girl who went to school with us, and thematically those who seem inaccessible and aloof and have never shown interest in him -and how to handle keeping mind-altering substances out of his reach/incentivizing simply not partaking in those activities.

Obviously, threatening to leave on the basis of using those substances or talking about whoever his obsession is during an episode isn't going to help. Especially since I prefer him talking and giving me indicators as to what his state of mind is, rather than teach him to bottle up what he'll be feeling as strong, legitimate feelings. Plus, he'll just purposefully engage in those issues in order to prove to himself that his fears of abandonment are valid and that he "doesn't deserve me", and until he engages in this self-sabotage, he'll simply be obsessing over slipping up out and whether or not I'd actually leave him, which isn't healthy and obviously would be playing on his worst fear as someone suffering BPD. So something rewarding has to come from his overcoming these problems, or else I'll just be enabling continuation of the behaviour/possibly even setting him up for more episodes. Any suggestions?

[patientandclear]

FS--there's a lot of smart thinking and good understanding here. I'd suggest you re-post these on Staying and see what folks there would advise.

[frayedseamstress]

Okay, thank you so much!

[rotiroti]

Remember the likelihood of these behaviors will be there indefinitely. So staying means accepting this is what your bf does when he dysregulates.  With that said -- there are many tools and workshops on the staying board to help you cope with the behaviors. As the non in the relationship, you have the power to adapt to the situation and to accept this reality.

[momtara]

There's a lot of juggling you have to do, and some tiptoeing. In a way, we codependents seek our own sort of control. I understand why you'd fear him getting a car, and getting too close with an ex. It is hard to prevent such things. You may just have to protect yourself, and be watchful, and know what your limits are in terms of his behavior. Renting him an apartment may just help him cheat or something... .or maybe not. I think you have to give yourself a break - you can't control all his behaviors. You can certainly try to see if you can get him to be faithful and safe and hang on as long as you can. Who knows? Maybe he will see the light if you are firm about what you want. Maybe he won't want to lose you and his daughter. But just understand that not everything is in your control.