1st post. BPD Soap Opera: chance of more contact & maybe what to expect?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Like many situations on here, this is clearly complicated, so this is way longer than I’d like. But to anyone who might take the time - thanks! First, I’ve been reading here a while. As well as on my own (adult university/psych student). I’ve been successfully treated for CPTSD with no diagnosed comorbidity. I now see my therapist purely for ‘regular’ talk therapy. I’d also note I diagnosed myself/got my own referral to experts in the field who did a month long laborious clinical diagnosis before confirming this. My point: while it may seem pop ‘psychologizing’ to see my ‘friend/ex’ as BPD (or as I believe, maybe CPTSD trauma with heavy BPD & some NPD traits); I've technically 'known' him for years, know much of his life story, and may have a bit more experience than the average ‘norm’ (if I actually qualify as that?) to back me up on this theory, though I admit I’m simply guessing based largely upon how he presents around me. Also, a mutual friend/family member who's known him as long as me and finds his behaviour very perplexing at times, credits me with understanding him 'much better' than her. For what that’s worth. *sigh*

Three years ago I became physically involved – unexpectedly & briefly (2x) – with this man who is an old family friend and whom I now strongly believe is upwBPD/CPTSD. I've technically known him since he was 12 (I’m a few years older). We saw each other maybe weekly/monthly for a few years in a friend/family circle when he was younger. He would seek me out and talk openly while the other boys were busy giggling in their own crushing ways. I liked him. By 14, he seemed much older than his age, and his interest in me was apparent. I was attracted to him at that point, but only then did I learn how young he actually was. I remained friendly, but kept him at arm’s length. He got bad acne for a time, and between that and a horrendously abusive upbringing, I knew his self-esteem was low.  Yet I genuinely liked him, remained attracted to him, and always treated him as that ‘friend’. By the time we were in our 20’s (by then I saw him only at occasional parties over the years and until 3 years ago) his skin had cleared up and he’d basically turned into a sex addict for validation, with women in his circle now throwing themselves at him. At that point he donned a ‘mask’ personality, loud and seemingly full of himself. I always saw through it and tried to talk to the real person (who is much quieter, kinder and more gentle) under any sexual innuendo and nonsense. I’d also note that I was always perceived as the ‘classy’ girl in the circle who’d elevated herself beyond ‘the hood’ (his environment) and didn’t sleep around (like many women of questionable ethics he knows).

Now we are both in our 40’s now (he just turned 40 recently). He lives with/has been involved with (for 17 years)/& has 2 children with a woman (he also has 2 adult children from an earlier relationship). He finally decided to marry her after 7 years engagement (and professing to at least one close mutual friend he never wanted or intended to ever do so) – but notably- only after 21/2 years of roller coaster interaction with me, in what I now classify (as best I can) as an unintended emotional affair. This culminated in a ‘bad’ letter that he didn’t like that immediately preceded his sudden change of heart/marital decision making, and planning the wedding almost exactly a year from when we had our biggest last exchanges (AND one week before his 40th birthday). The marriage took place 2 months ago. His wife, not so incidentally, is by all accounts, nice, but uninterested in sex (her own words to a mutual friend NOT info from her hubby) and obviously 'a doormat'. I... .am not. Well, usually I'm nice!

Four other things that might also be helpful to know about the situation:

1. While I struggled financially in returning to school, and was at the same time diagnosed with MS, I moved in with a ‘relative’ (my late uncle’s common law wife) to help her in a large old house and likewise lower some of my expenses/overhead/stress. Notably she also acts as a ‘stepmom’ to him (his real mother died when he was 15). Moreover, she assumed we continued having a sexual affair and silently disapproved of it/me (I learned long after fact). She often dysfunctionally supports his bad behaviour while he aims to please her. I also believe she is a full-blown Narcissist. Yet, she did intervene to keep us apart, unknowingly to both of us for a long time. And it contributed to chaos. His best friend also threw a wrench in the mix early by hitting on me. 3rd party intervention has really further contributed to misunderstandings. Not to mention we’re both poor communicators (me if upset – as was often here) and him, generally.

2. After the 2nd time we slept together, I realized he was either reconciled or never really separated from SO and I abruptly cut him off without explanation from hanging out more or ever sleeping together again. We’ve had many misunderstandings and each learned – often after the fact – from our mutual friend (my aunt’s daughter/his ‘sister’ of sorts) details that clarified one or the other had not done something as bad as it seemed. He originally (while angry) told her he had no feelings for me…but that evolved as did his behavior and personal questions to her about me. I tried unsuccessfully to be friends. I tried to ignore him. He pursued me on and off behind his ‘momma’s’ (and SO’s) back for 21/2 years. At times I responded a little communication wise... .but would not cave to anything physical again. He often refused to treat me as a ‘real’ friend, and I resented being treated as a mistress or ‘secret friend’, especially as I’d given up sleeping with him! Unfortunately, we spent enough time together that my feelings deepened. I knew they were real (and remain so). I wish he’d just stayed away. I'd have managed better.

3. So. He refused to hear me out after the letter, though I tried twice. In a nutshell it said he was making me crazy, I didn’t get what he was doing, if he was single it might be one thing, but it wasn’t. Figure out what you’re doing or (basically) leave me alone. I also used the word friend’ 3x’s and said I didn’t want to take advantage of a friend when he was vulnerable (referring to when he’d recently come to me one evening after his friend died). Our mutual friend said it frustrates him to no end that he can’t understand me the way he prides himself on being able to do with most people (esp. women, as this has always given him the .edge’. In our last conversation in which he brought his kids (I believe as a shield) to the house but allowed his 5 year old daughter to spend time with me for the first time ever (she loved it and didn’t want to leave. I tried to avoid it all, it was inappropriate, and hurt me heart). I told him I’d talk to him another day…alone. He practically begged me to ‘just give (him) a clue’ what I was going to say. I said some personal things I think he should know. The day ended angrily, but he finally said he’d return to ‘deal with’ me later.

4. A month went by, during which I overheard something hurtful going on with his 2nd oldest daughter (who is 18 this year, lives on her own now, and I know casually through our circle. She’s always sweet to me, despite I know hearing rumours about her Dad and me). I originally heard about this through our mutual friend last year, but then I overheard my ‘aunt’ talking to him and realized it was still going on. Basically it deals with an accusation his SO was making that daughter was ‘doing drugs’. According to our mutual friend his daughter did not want him to marry SO as she believes he is very unhappy and this accusation just alienated her further as it is just not true. I sent her a FB message to offer empathy/sympathy. I also clarified for her that contrary to the ‘kids’ beliefs, we were not involved now, but had been briefly, and that I did have feelings for him, had spent time together, had been hurt, and likewise understood how complicated he may be for her to understand sometimes, etc. Well, of course, he found out and blew a gasket. My ‘aunt’ called me ‘evil, vindictive and driving a father/daughter apart’. It was a mess. A mistake? Maybe. But deliberately hurtful, NO. That was six months before the wedding. He didn’t speak to me, went ahead & got married.

Here’s the (arguably) most messed part that inspired me finally writing. Every year he drives his ‘momma’/my aunt up north for a month for her yearly vacation. He’d been avoiding the house to my knowledge (and/or she’s also discouraged him from coming) for some time. So I heard him downstairs (this was mid-Aug). Keep in mind he was just married one month prior to this. I was in my main/bedroom. He was loud. She was trying to speak in hushed tones. Seems he was demanding something about me. Normally I help her a little/say good-bye as she’s going and he sees me. Not this time (I did but only after he eventually stomped out to porch, pacing and chain smoking with a furious look on his face as I saw through door). It was “Why isn’t she…? What do you mean you don’t know if she’s here? Don’t know if she’s up? Go get her. Go look.” I have no idea if he was going to rant at me for who knows what reason or was just emotionally dysregulated in general post wedding and expected to see me to gloat and couldn’t. Or what. He was apparently suddenly lurking in the area one week later after months of avoidance as he spoke to someone we both know near the house (but I did not see him). He refuses to call direct and knows I will no longer p/u house phone. Unbelievably I miss him. I hurt. I’m frustrated. I’m trying to remain NC, and it’s working, but under the circumstances eventual contact seems inevitable. When, for what reason, and why is the question mark. I can't be his friend yet. My emotions remain too real and I doubt he can only be that with me. I can't be anything else, because he's now married. Yet I've known him a lifetime. If you care to offer any thoughts after all this, that would also be appreciated. Believe it or not, I tried hard to abbreviate by leaving out many other specifics that also lend perspective.

[moxietonic]

Like many situations on here, this is clearly complicated, so this is way longer than I’d like. But to anyone who might take the time - thanks! First, I’ve been reading here a while. As well as on my own (adult university/psych student). I’ve been successfully treated for CPTSD with no diagnosed comorbidity. I now see my therapist purely for ‘regular’ talk therapy. I’d also note I diagnosed myself/got my own referral to experts in the field who did a month long laborious clinical diagnosis before confirming this. My point: while it may seem pop ‘psychologizing’ to see my ‘friend/ex’ as BPD (or as I believe, maybe CPTSD trauma with heavy BPD & some NPD traits); I've technically 'known' him for years, know much of his life story, and may have a bit more experience than the average ‘norm’ (if I actually qualify as that?) to back me up on this theory, though I admit I’m simply guessing based largely upon how he presents around me. Also, a mutual friend/family member who's known him as long as me and finds his behaviour very perplexing at times, credits me with understanding him 'much better' than her. For what that’s worth. *sigh*

Three years ago I became physically involved – unexpectedly & briefly (2x) – with this man who is an old family friend and whom I now strongly believe is upwBPD/CPTSD. I've technically known him since he was 12 (I’m a few years older). We saw each other maybe weekly/monthly for a few years in a friend/family circle when he was younger. He would seek me out and talk openly while the other boys were busy giggling in their own crushing ways. I liked him. By 14, he seemed much older than his age, and his interest in me was apparent. I was attracted to him at that point, but only then did I learn how young he actually was. I remained friendly, but kept him at arm’s length. He got bad acne for a time, and between that and a horrendously abusive upbringing, I knew his self-esteem was low.  Yet I genuinely liked him, remained attracted to him, and always treated him as that ‘friend’. By the time we were in our 20’s (by then I saw him only at occasional parties over the years and until 3 years ago) his skin had cleared up and he’d basically turned into a sex addict for validation, with women in his circle now throwing themselves at him. At that point he donned a ‘mask’ personality, loud and seemingly full of himself. I always saw through it and tried to talk to the real person (who is much quieter, kinder and more gentle) under any sexual innuendo and nonsense. I’d also note that I was always perceived as the ‘classy’ girl in the circle who’d elevated herself beyond ‘the hood’ (his environment) and didn’t sleep around (like many women of questionable ethics he knows).

Now we are both in our 40’s now (he just turned 40 recently). He lives with/has been involved with (for 17 years)/& has 2 children with a woman (he also has 2 adult children from an earlier relationship). He finally decided to marry her after 7 years engagement (and professing to at least one close mutual friend he never wanted or intended to ever do so) – but notably- only after 21/2 years of roller coaster interaction with me, in what I now classify (as best I can) as an unintended emotional affair. This culminated in a ‘bad’ letter that he didn’t like that immediately preceded his sudden change of heart/marital decision making, and planning the wedding almost exactly a year from when we had our biggest last exchanges (AND one week before his 40th birthday). The marriage took place 2 months ago. His wife, not so incidentally, is by all accounts, nice, but uninterested in sex (her own words to a mutual friend NOT info from her hubby) and obviously 'a doormat'. I... .am not. Well, usually I'm nice!

Four other things that might also be helpful to know about the situation:

1. While I struggled financially in returning to school, and was at the same time diagnosed with MS, I moved in with a ‘relative’ (my late uncle’s common law wife) to help her in a large old house and likewise lower some of my expenses/overhead/stress. Notably she also acts as a ‘stepmom’ to him (his real mother died when he was 15). Moreover, she assumed we continued having a sexual affair and silently disapproved of it/me (I learned long after fact). She often dysfunctionally supports his bad behaviour while he aims to please her. I also believe she is a full-blown Narcissist. Yet, she did intervene to keep us apart, unknowingly to both of us for a long time. And it contributed to chaos. His best friend also threw a wrench in the mix early by hitting on me. 3rd party intervention has really further contributed to misunderstandings. Not to mention we’re both poor communicators (me if upset – as was often here) and him, generally.

2. After the 2nd time we slept together, I realized he was either reconciled or never really separated from SO and I abruptly cut him off without explanation from hanging out more or ever sleeping together again. We’ve had many misunderstandings and each learned – often after the fact – from our mutual friend (my aunt’s daughter/his ‘sister’ of sorts) details that clarified one or the other had not done something as bad as it seemed. He originally (while angry) told her he had no feelings for me…but that evolved as did his behavior and personal questions to her about me. I tried unsuccessfully to be friends. I tried to ignore him. He pursued me on and off behind his ‘momma’s’ (and SO’s) back for 21/2 years. At times I responded a little communication wise... .but would not cave to anything physical again. He often refused to treat me as a ‘real’ friend, and I resented being treated as a mistress or ‘secret friend’, especially as I’d given up sleeping with him! Unfortunately, we spent enough time together that my feelings deepened. I knew they were real (and remain so). I wish he’d just stayed away. I'd have managed better.

3. So. He refused to hear me out after the letter, though I tried twice. In a nutshell it said he was making me crazy, I didn’t get what he was doing, if he was single it might be one thing, but it wasn’t. Figure out what you’re doing or (basically) leave me alone. I also used the word friend’ 3x’s and said I didn’t want to take advantage of a friend when he was vulnerable (referring to when he’d recently come to me one evening after his friend died). Our mutual friend said it frustrates him to no end that he can’t understand me the way he prides himself on being able to do with most people (esp. women, as this has always given him the .edge’. In our last conversation in which he brought his kids (I believe as a shield) to the house but allowed his 5 year old daughter to spend time with me for the first time ever (she loved it and didn’t want to leave. I tried to avoid it all, it was inappropriate, and hurt me heart). I told him I’d talk to him another day…alone. He practically begged me to ‘just give (him) a clue’ what I was going to say. I said some personal things I think he should know. The day ended angrily, but he finally said he’d return to ‘deal with’ me later.

4. A month went by, during which I overheard something hurtful going on with his 2nd oldest daughter (who is 18 this year, lives on her own now, and I know casually through our circle. She’s always sweet to me, despite I know hearing rumours about her Dad and me). I originally heard about this through our mutual friend last year, but then I overheard my ‘aunt’ talking to him and realized it was still going on. Basically it deals with an accusation his SO was making that daughter was ‘doing drugs’. According to our mutual friend his daughter did not want him to marry SO as she believes he is very unhappy and this accusation just alienated her further as it is just not true. I sent her a FB message to offer empathy/sympathy. I also clarified for her that contrary to the ‘kids’ beliefs, we were not involved now, but had been briefly, and that I did have feelings for him, had spent time together, had been hurt, and likewise understood how complicated he may be for her to understand sometimes, etc. Well, of course, he found out and blew a gasket. My ‘aunt’ called me ‘evil, vindictive and driving a father/daughter apart’. It was a mess. A mistake? Maybe. But deliberately hurtful, NO. That was six months before the wedding. He didn’t speak to me, went ahead & got married.

Here’s the (arguably) most messed part that inspired me finally writing. Every year he drives his ‘momma’/my aunt up north for a month for her yearly vacation. He’d been avoiding the house to my knowledge (and/or she’s also discouraged him from coming) for some time. So I heard him downstairs (this was mid-Aug). Keep in mind he was just married one month prior to this. I was in my main/bedroom. He was loud. She was trying to speak in hushed tones. Seems he was demanding something about me. Normally I help her a little/say good-bye as she’s going and he sees me. Not this time (I did but only after he eventually stomped out to porch, pacing and chain smoking with a furious look on his face as I saw through door). It was “Why isn’t she…? What do you mean you don’t know if she’s here? Don’t know if she’s up? Go get her. Go look.” I have no idea if he was going to rant at me for who knows what reason or was just emotionally dysregulated in general post wedding and expected to see me to gloat and couldn’t. Or what. He was apparently suddenly lurking in the area one week later after months of avoidance as he spoke to someone we both know near the house (but I did not see him). He refuses to call direct and knows I will no longer p/u house phone. Unbelievably I miss him. I hurt. I’m frustrated. I’m trying to remain NC, and it’s working, but under the circumstances eventual contact seems inevitable. When, for what reason, and why is the question mark. I can't be his friend yet. My emotions remain too real and I doubt he can only be that with me. I can't be anything else, because he's now married. Yet I've known him a lifetime. If you care to offer any thoughts after all this, that would also be appreciated. Believe it or not, I tried hard to abbreviate by leaving out many other specifics that also lend perspective.