When you have hurt your BPD child: splitting

[Parents! Get help here!]

i could use your help. I *did* do something to make my daughter lose faith that I will always be there for her. She is involved in a relationship with a much older married man--  she's 20 and he's 41. It upset me so much,  that she began to lie to me and told me it was over. I found out three months later it wasn't over and in fact she was pregnant with his child.  I was so hurt and upset I stepped back from her for about 10 days-- no contact-- at a time she needed me most. She says she will never again trust me to "always be there for her" like I had promised her that I would.  So I did fulfill a BPD's worst fear: abandonment.  Now she has stepped away from me. I am devastated. I know I was wrong and I wish I could go back and do things differently.  I want to make amends and rebuild trust but I fear she won't come back to me.  Please help!  What can I do? (Btw, she terminated the pregnancy but is still with the married man and I still have such a hard time accepting it).

[Mary47]

i could use your help. I *did* do something to make my daughter lose faith that I will always be there for her. She is involved in a relationship with a much older married man--  she's 20 and he's 41. It upset me so much,  that she began to lie to me and told me it was over. I found out three months later it wasn't over and in fact she was pregnant with his child.  I was so hurt and upset I stepped back from her for about 10 days-- no contact-- at a time she needed me most. She says she will never again trust me to "always be there for her" like I had promised her that I would.  So I did fulfill a BPD's worst fear: abandonment.  Now she has stepped away from me. I am devastated. I know I was wrong and I wish I could go back and do things differently.  I want to make amends and rebuild trust but I fear she won't come back to me.  Please help!  What can I do? (Btw, she terminated the pregnancy but is still with the married man and I still have such a hard time accepting it).

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[lbjnltx]

Hi Mary47,

Welcome to the Parenting Board, I'm glad that you are here looking for help.  Having a relationship with our adult children who suffer with BPD and traits of BPD is wrought with fears, ups and downs, and confusion.

Taking a step back for your own well being isn't the same as abandonment and our kids will interpret our action as such anyway.  What did you say to your d before you took a time out from the situation? 

Accepting the choices our kids make when we don't agree with them isn't easy and what choice do we really have?

Will your d accept phone calls from you or respond to your efforts to reach out? 

lbj

[Mary47]

Thank you so much for responding. I really need help!  When she first told me about him I got very upset and said that I would need to pull back from our relationship somewhat if she continued bc I couldn't handle knowing she was part of such deception and inevitable hurt for her. That's when my d started to lie to me several times about this "I stopped seeing him this time, really please trust me I know I lied before but I'm being honest now"--  the third time I got so upset and hurt that unfortunately I didn't say much. And that was when she told me she was pregnant. I can't believe, as she says, that I "disappeared" at the worst time of her life!  If only I could do it over!  She says I was being manipulative and maybe I was.  :'(  Prior to this I was the idealized, "white" person in her life (she has no siblings and father is not in the picture).  Now I'm the evil one she will never trust again and she has turned even more to the married man. She has been responding briefly to my occasional texts (we used to talk daily) and the one time we spoke she was open about how hurt she feels and "will never trust" me again. But she doesn't initiate contact. I'm so afraid I'll never get her to see the grey--  that I do love her more than anything but I'm human and I made a big mistake.  Do BPD children who have put you in the "all bad" category ever allow you back in?  I've been distraught for two months and can't think about anything else.  :'(

[lbjnltx]

 

To answer your question... .yes most of the time our kids will allow us back into their lives as a source of support for them.  There are members I have known of that it took a long time... .and in my own experience the splitting only lasts a few days, my daughter is 19.

The best that you can do is own your choice to step back and what motivated you to do it.  I take it that you regret stepping back and did so because you didn't have the skills to cope with her choice to be involved with a married man.  Is this correct?

I think it would be a mistake to try to have a close relationship with her until you can figure out how to cope with this choice of hers.  Separating our relationships with our BPD adult children from the choices they are making is difficult when their choices collide with our core values.  There are communication skills that can help, coping skills that can help, and support here to help you work through this.

lbj

[livednlearned]

Hi Mary47,

I wanted to join lbjnltx in welcoming you here. I'm so sorry that your D is making choices that clash with your hopes and dreams for her.

One of the most difficult lessons we can face as parents is setting boundaries with kids who have a very poor sense of boundaries. Or kids who interpret our boundaries as abandonment. You were taking care of yourself, which is a positive thing for you, and for your daughter. Your daughter senses that your boundaries are not airtight and she is testing them. Does she know that you feel guilty?

She is an adult, making adult decisions, and is in a relationship with someone who, although he is not ideal in your eyes, is a source of support for her. It's possible that she will split him black at some point and come back to you when she needs a soft landing. Use this time to learn how to interact with her -- it's a little different than the way you might interact with others who don't suffer from BPD.

Do you have a therapist to help you handle this May-September relationship that your daughter is in? With my son, I had to learn to get myself to a healthy place so that he could surf off my strength  instead of him taking the both of us down.

The communication skills (validation) and other resources in the sidebar to the right are so helpful. I always thought I understood what boundaries were until I came here and realized they are about taking care of myself, and that includes looking at what my guilt is about. Often, I found myself carrying guilt that was not my burden, and had to work hard to set it down.

[AVR1962]

Did you truly abandon your daughter? Is this her words or yours? Did you cut her out, and why, if so... .OR did she cut you out?

We can be disappointed in our children but realize their choices are their choices. Do you have reason to be concerned? Yes. The biggest lessons in life are those that we learn from ourselves.

I understand your pain. I have a daughter who is soon to turn 19. If she started dating a man 20 years older than her I would be very concerned. If you give her negative attention at this time it could cause for your daughter to move closer to this man emotionally. It might be hard but try your best to be supportive of your daughter and accepting of this new man in her life.

At one point I dated a man who was 14 years older than myself, not much younger than my parents. I did not know initially how old he was and shocked when I did find out and age didn't seem like an issue to begin with til I saw he shard music and history from my parent's generation and I could see he had an old fashion standard for women being in the home. After 4 months I was ready to break up with him. Perhaps something like this will happen with your daughter.

[Mary47]

I can't tell you how helpful to have objective thoughts on this.  If I'm honest, while I do absolutely hate that she's a participant in a deceitful relationship with a man who's cheated on his wife before, I know partly I was/am motivated by wanting to control her--  when she was in her late teens, her suicidality, self-injury and substance abuse were so bad that I was in constant fear.  She was hospitalized 5 times.  I am terrified of her slipping back to that place again so I have been trying to keep her away from any potential land mines. I think that's called "co-dependency"?  Trying to control her bc of my fear? And I know now that I can't and shouldn't try to clear the land mines away. She needs to learn how to care for herself when she steps into bad spots. I think I'm starting to accept that.

I have wondered if I should retreat from my "boundary" and try to be okay with hearing about how happy she feels about her r/s with this man. It's just that it turns my stomach--  I think he's awful for what he (they) are doing to his wife.  I just don't know how to "be supportive" of this. Do I fake enthusiasm?

I have been all over the place with her in the past month and she knows I feel guilty. I've been angry, I stepped away and, tbh,  was probably giving her the silent treatment. I've been crying, asking her to not shut me out. I just don't want to do the wrong thing and make it worse but I fear I've made a complete mess of our r/s.  I'm sure it's made her turn even more to this man. Is there any hope for me to get our r/s back on track? How can that be done? 

[lbjnltx]

Yes, as I stated before there is hope.

If you put yourself in your daughter's shoes what would you want to hear?

Fully owning our mistakes, validating our kids feelings, communicating our boundaries and limits firmly and gently, and learning to speak the truth in love (using SET) is what we can do to have healthier relationships with our kids.

We can provide opportunities to them to have healthier relationships and make healthier choices for themselves... .what we can't do is orchestrate the outcome of those opportunities.

Regardless of where the relationship goes we can take care of our side of the fence and stand in the peace that provides.  Knowing we have done right by ourselves and our children is sometimes all we have.

Letting go of the illusion of control will release you from some of the fear that you experience.  Using the coping skills that are taught in the Lessons like wisemind, mindfulness, and radical acceptance can help you get out of the FOG (fear, obligation, and guilt).  We are here to help you achieve what may seem impossible, it isn't impossible... .it just feels that way. 

[AVR1962]

I can't tell you how helpful to have objective thoughts on this.  If I'm honest, while I do absolutely hate that she's a participant in a deceitful relationship with a man who's cheated on his wife before, I know partly I was/am motivated by wanting to control her--  when she was in her late teens, her suicidality, self-injury and substance abuse were so bad that I was in constant fear.  She was hospitalized 5 times.  I am terrified of her slipping back to that place again so I have been trying to keep her away from any potential land mines. I think that's called "co-dependency"?  Trying to control her bc of my fear? And I know now that I can't and shouldn't try to clear the land mines away. She needs to learn how to care for herself when she steps into bad spots. I think I'm starting to accept that.

I have wondered if I should retreat from my "boundary" and try to be okay with hearing about how happy she feels about her r/s with this man. It's just that it turns my stomach--  I think he's awful for what he (they) are doing to his wife.  I just don't know how to "be supportive" of this. Do I fake enthusiasm?

I have been all over the place with her in the past month and she knows I feel guilty. I've been angry, I stepped away and, tbh,  was probably giving her the silent treatment. I've been crying, asking her to not shut me out. I just don't want to do the wrong thing and make it worse but I fear I've made a complete mess of our r/s.  I'm sure it's made her turn even more to this man. Is there any hope for me to get our r/s back on track? How can that be done? 

So they were having an affair and that is how the relationship came about? Oh, you have every right to be sick to your stomach. The thing that is such a shame in these situations is that this man will do to your daughter what he did to his wife. Sounds like your daughter has found a very manipulative man and you can't feel comfortable with that. You can't warn them though, your daughter will not listen and if you try to come between them it will only make things worse. This might be a hard lesson for your daughter and you might have to be a support when this falls apart but there is not much you can do about it right now except to accept it and let it play out.

[Mary47]

Oh yes. The first night she met him they had sex in his car. He's 41 and married and she's 21. Sadly, an aspect of her BPD has been sexual promiscuity and impulsiveness. She *appears* very confident and more mature than her age, which I think is rare for young adults w BPD?  His previous affair, also with a younger woman, lasted 3 years, which worries me. So a related question:  my D says that she can't possibly communicate or have a r/s with me if I set a personal boundary that I don't want to hear about the day in and day out events of their affair. "But he is so important to me, we are so in love. I can't even talk w you if I have to stifle such a huge part of my life!"  I know you're supposed to validate when communicating w a pwBPD, and I can certainly say "I realize he means a lot to you and that you feel loved and supported by him"  but is it an appropriate boundary for me to set that I don't want to hear about how he brings her flowers or how they're thinking about having children in the next year once he leaves his wife(!)?

[Butterflygirl]

I did some things regarding my son's early years that I regret. I am a recovering alcoholic. I went out to drink and the baby sitter abandoned him. He was screaming when I got home. I often drank while he was in the next room. When I passed out I could not hear him crying. After that I took him to my mother's to keep him when I wanted to go out. I now know that she tormented him. I should have known since she did the same to me.

But after years of analysis, I have come to realize that his split was accidental. He had to go into the hospital for three moths. He still remembers crying  hysterically when I went home in the evening.

Acceptance and faith is how I deal with my remorse and guilt. I know I have been a good mother longer than I was a bad one.

Love yourself. We are here to love you through this.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[lbjnltx]

The boundaries you set are unique unto you and are a product of your values.

My d can say just about anything she wants to me unless she is abusive towards me... .I have set that boundary.  When she tells me something that she is planning on doing that I think is a bad idea I use validating questions to help her verbalize and reason out her plans.  Sometimes she will change her mind (plan) and sometimes she doesn't.  As an adult it is her right, her life, her choices.  I am only there to support, guide, lead by example and love her regardless.

The higher level skills I achieve the more I can tolerate within my boundaries. 

[AVR1962]

I can't tell you how helpful to have objective thoughts on this.  If I'm honest, while I do absolutely hate that she's a participant in a deceitful relationship with a man who's cheated on his wife before, I know partly I was/am motivated by wanting to control her--  when she was in her late teens, her suicidality, self-injury and substance abuse were so bad that I was in constant fear.  She was hospitalized 5 times.  I am terrified of her slipping back to that place again so I have been trying to keep her away from any potential land mines. I think that's called "co-dependency"?  Trying to control her bc of my fear? And I know now that I can't and shouldn't try to clear the land mines away. She needs to learn how to care for herself when she steps into bad spots. I think I'm starting to accept that.

I have wondered if I should retreat from my "boundary" and try to be okay with hearing about how happy she feels about her r/s with this man. It's just that it turns my stomach--  I think he's awful for what he (they) are doing to his wife.  I just don't know how to "be supportive" of this. Do I fake enthusiasm?

I have been all over the place with her in the past month and she knows I feel guilty. I've been angry, I stepped away and, tbh,  was probably giving her the silent treatment. I've been crying, asking her to not shut me out. I just don't want to do the wrong thing and make it worse but I fear I've made a complete mess of our r/s.  I'm sure it's made her turn even more to this man. Is there any hope for me to get our r/s back on track? How can that be done? 

Mary, don't fake enthusiasm, remain genuine but detach emotionally. I would not want the details and I would not want to be involved in this if I were you. Keeping neutral and being supportive presents challenges in itself. She knows this man had a previous affair that lasted 3 years. More than likely this man has her so convinced that she is the love of his life.

This might not happen to you but let me give you an example of what happened with my BPD daughter who also had an affair. My daughter was married and then met up with an old BF and decided to leave her first husband which I mentioned to you. After having two children with second husband she started texting with another old BF. This old BF just happen to had a very close relationship with me years ago, he called me mom, I thought this was the guy at the time. She filled me in daily on what was happening. At this point she had been married twice, has 3 children by 2 different dads an she is saying she is laving second husband for this old BF. Every day she told me how great things were with the affair old BF and I try to stay neutral... .I asked her how leaving would effect the children and that sort of thing, basically trying to get her to think this thru. he husband finally realizes he is being lied to, calls me and asks me if she is having an affair. I tell him I do not know but I do make it known to him that I feel she should not be staying with this man married to him.

He and his mom talk and together they devised a plan to cut off her money supply to bring her back home and he told me about it. It worked, after 3 weeks she was headed back home. She is on the phone to me as she is heading back and she is telling me that she hates her husband and that she is going to pick up her children and leave with them and head back to this guy. I asked her to please consider working things out for the sake of the kids. She gets angry and says to me, "You always do this," and then hangs up.

She got back to her husband and then the next thing that I hear from family is that she is all upset with me because I told her husband that she was having an affair and it wasn't true.

So I was her support, I listened and tried to make her see the light without being too intrusive. I dealt with he husband without being informative and yet I was blamed for something I did not even do. I never told her husband I felt she was involved in an affair. Talk about walking on eggshells, noting I do this daughter is ever right. Just a warning to you being in that situation now. Try as you will to be the best parent you can it still may backfire because of her personality disorder. I do not wish this on you at all and you cannot predict but don't be too hard on yourself if your efforts don't come thru like you would like.

[Mary47]

Wow. What a complicated series of events. I imagine not being able to alter your d's beliefs about what happened has to be so hard.  It seems so difficult to try to convince a child with BPD to see things a different way--  and from what I've been reading, we're not supposed to try to control what they perceive to be true?  Is that accurate?  Do we not invalidate something when it is clearly a matter of factual information? Or or does that only hold for feelings, and not matters of "fact" (if there actually are "facts" and they're not just different perceptions of reality). Do you just wait to see  if she comes back to you, or as parents of children w BPD, should we try to be persistent so they don't think we have abandoned them? I'm guessing the answer might be "it depends on individual circumstances."  I just wish there were a "right" thing to do!  It would be so comforting to be able to know that we are not making things worse. 

[AVR1962]

Mary, I too was told by a counselor not to distort my daughter's perception but truly if my daughter feels she is living and speaking in truth it is truly distorted. The example I gave is the typical struggle I have had to support my daughter. the last situation at 34 now, I have finally said that is enough and i have received a great deal of support from my family for this.