Getting Right with my BPD-soon to be-EXW

[Concerns]

So after months of trying to get my wife help for her personality disorder, her discard, and subsequent multiple affairs, she wants a divorce and I want off the crazy train. We are living together still. We are trying to pay down some debt before the divorce. We have a four-year old. She now has a boyfriend,will leave at night and come home before I have to goto work, and spending increasingly more time with him. She isn't very nice to me personally. She acts like she tolerates my presence but wants to be somewhere else. We try to do things together for our son but it usually turns sour. She basically acts like a pissed off teenager that is forced to be at the mall with her parents. Scowl and all. Walks three feet behind me with her arms crossed. I was trying to be light and nice to her for my son but its getting more difficult. She isn't nice to me. It's not enjoyable to be around her. The longer she is in the adoration phase with her new boyfriend, the more I am devalued, painted black further, and reminded over and over how miserable her life is with me. I really just don't want to be around her any longer. I don't really want any contact with her but we HAVE to pay down this debt. I don't want to get a divorce just to declare bankruptcy with a four-year old.

How can I be nice in this onslaught? How can approach getting right with her and keeping my self-respect?

[tryingsome]

Well there is a lot here and a lot to digest, as a result there are many directions we could go.

Just a few questions first:

Is the debt holding you together? pwBPD don't like to give up a loved one even if it is filled with anger. Debt is debt, the sooner you get out the faster you can recover from debt. I can't imagine even trying to get out of debt while being with a pwBPD. You'll never be able to save up enough for all the lawyer fees anyhow, especially together.

Is she helping pay the bills? Is this a mortgage? Are you renting? You could try to rent out your place if you own. Or just break the lease and find something cheaper.

You can get temp court orders for her to have to pay for things (you don't need to be living together).

Do you really want this to end? No problems if you don't, but usually we can justify why we 'have to' stay (like debt).

Why hasn't she moved in with the new BF? If that is her future she should be out. It's not fair to anyone, including to your child if you are living together but she is seeing someone else. This causes a lot of confusion with the children.

What I have learned with pwBPD, you can say almost anything to them and they won't 'change' their opinion especially at the current status of the relationship.

Be nice and she will be mean.

Be mean and she will be mean.

Sometimes we hold onto the notion if we are nice or try to explain it better they will come around. Usually at this stage; nothing is going to matter.

So what you need to do is stand up for yourself. Stand up for the child. This is the perfect time to start flexing those boundary muscles.

I'm not saying be mean, just be firm.

First though, you got to figure out what you want to do. I'd get some temp court orders in your favor.

Threaten to get a CE (or PE in my state); let her know how much is a stake; and that this isn't a game.

Get the temp court orders (which says who is going to pay for what) and separate physically.

Lawyers will say you shouldn't escalate, but I think with a pwBPD you should.

Now if you want to work it out, then you need to figure out something else. You still need to be firm.

Right now it sounds like you are on the fence; which is fine. But this is just going to cause more chaos as you are trying to appease her and be strong for you.

Pick a direction and the boat won't toss as much.

Remember, this should be about the child first. That's how adults navigate this world.

This is the toughest moment in your life; stand strong and when you look back you'll be the more grateful.

[Concerns]

 

Is the debt holding you together?

For me, the debt is holding us together. I do love her. I wanted her effort to make it work but to no avail. When required to put in effort, she will not put it in. She will give up and find something else. I have spent so much trying to make her happy, during times when I was the sole provider for the household, and paying for medical bills for her psych help. I really have no confidence that she would actually pay her share if we split. She has said on multiple occasions that we should just rack up all the debt and declare bankruptcy. And shes a credit underwriter for a major bank. And how she thinks that would be a stable move for our son really is beyond me. Statements like these really make me question her ability to remain stable after we split.

Is she helping pay the bills? Is this a mortgage? Are you renting? You could try to rent out your place if you own. Or just break the lease and find something cheaper.

We are renting. She currently makes more money than I do. She does help pay the bills. We couldn't make it without her. With the debt load, I couldn't really raise him on my own without being in the hole every month. Even though we are in the hole every month with her spending habits. She has at least agreed to pay off the mutual credit debt that's officially in my name. I am trying to find a better job to cover the portion of the bills she is taking care of. The entire family is interested in keeping my son's standard of living. I am almost willing to live in some horrible neighborhood to get out but I know, in reality, it wouldn't be good for him. But as my therapist says it's not good for him to be living in this crazy situation either.  

You can get temp court orders for her to have to pay for things (you don't need to be living together).

Since she makes more, she pays more as a percentage. Can she really be ordered to keep the household? What are these orders called? How can this be done?

We are barely treading water especially with her acting out over the last eight months. Paying for a lawyer, at the moment, is out of the question. If I paid the credit card debt off then it would all go back in to pay for a lawyer. Rough. She will play a guilt card with me. "So you're going to toss me out on the street, make me pay "alimony" so you can keep the house, and I'm going to be living in a dump somewhere, and you're going to take my kid away from me... ." She's a professional manipulator. She's been one for a long time. Problem is that I'm just not having it anymore. She does what she wants. She is accountable to no one.

Do you really want this to end?

I didn't before. I was invested in getting her the help she desperately needs. But that isn't going to happen unless I try to make it part of the custody agreement. I do now. I've already suffered one minor heart attack. The constant suffering she dispels on me with no accountability just can't be managed. The whole household suffers. She has checked out. I keep the house clean, dishes, laundry, care for the dogs, bathe the boy, take care of the yard, trash. She might put clothes in the washer and put them in the dryer for herself but that's it. She is a compulsive liar. When it's easier to tell a lie, she will. She just will and she's narcissistic enough to enjoy it in some regard. I've decided that we just have to break the household up. It's already broken.

Why hasn't she moved in with the new BF?

Soo... .he has a wife and four children. One my wife's age. I have been told they are divorced. They live in the same house. They are wealthy so the size of the house allows them to basically live separately. My wife has even stayed over some nights and leaves early in the morning. But the idea of her moving in with him seems to be not be possible. At this point, I don't really care where she goes but that's not really good for our son without a court order in place. Instead, I'm left to suffer and take care of our son while she goes out and parties with him. I really want to kick her out. I can't legally do that in my state but she doesn't really know that. Plus, she is actively seeking to find a replacement. She has a couple in line. But this man is rich so she is in full adoration mode and he is falling for it. Despite her protestations that "it was over before it started", she is acting like she's in love with him.

So what you need to do is stand up for yourself. Stand up for the child. This is the perfect time to start flexing those boundary muscles.

I'm not saying be mean, just be firm.

Any talk of accountability is totally denied. No reason can be applied to her in order for her to see the effect she's having.

Threaten to get a CE (or PE in my state); let her know how much is a stake; and that this isn't a game.

I tried looking this up and I couldn't find it. At a lower point, I was almost willing to go 50/50 with her on custody. But I've changed my mind on this front. I journal everything and I just don't think him being with her 50% would be a stable thing for him.  

[tryingsome]

I still see a bunch of indescision here. You got to pick the course.

Now I will be Frank, if you do nothing here is what will likely happen. She is going to find someone else, she will then file for divorce, and then try to leave you with nothing but a mountain of debt.

If you want to end this you need to do so sooner than later.

The person who files for divorce ha the most leverage. 'painting he other person black first'

I learned this lesson through my divorce process.

Temp orders are just that, temp orders before the divorce is finalized 

This includes saying who will live where, who will pay for what, how much time with the child.

The person who files usually dictates the 'initial' terms, usually on your favor.

it sounds like you would be in debt on your own

it sounds like you are in debt together (her spending)

so it does not make a difference together or seperate.

even if you get out of debt, the lawyers/divorce is going to put you right back in.

might as well get into more debt now... .you'll never get out of your debt predicament.

but she will leave the relationship as soon as she can and you will be worse off.

living in a crapoy apartment might be bad for your child better it is Better than the Current situation.

standing up for yourself is not making the other person accountable. It is not letting her dictate your life or emotional well being. In my view she is using you until she can leave, be careful.

If you want to stay and make this work, well that is another story.

There are ways... .

I fee like in your heart that is what you want, but can't because of her (from your point of view)

Find a direction soon, indescision is going to make this more difficult than it should be.

[Mr Pink]

Hello Concerns, I don't have any specific advice but just want to pass along to stay strong, focus on your own health and your son's health. The two of  you are what matter now man.   Take care - Mr Pink

[Panda39]

Concerns,

You sound conflicted about whether or not to leave your marriage, you might want to consult a lawyer just to find out what your options are so you can make an educated decision about how to proceed.

You might also want to post on the Family Law Board there are a lot of members there that have been where you are.

I agree with Mr. Pink you need to focus on you and your son. Always default to what is in the best interest of your son.

Panda39

[Concerns]

What are the ways back if I wanted to stay?

I am conflicted.

My heart is with my son's. I don't want to leave my wife but, right now, I don't see an alternative without her help.

If you have any suggestions, please... .

I've been combing the staying board for months.

Staying is my preference but she just moves further away.

[Panda39]

What are the ways back if I wanted to stay?

Staying is my preference but she just moves further away.

I was speaking of being conflicted in terms of your financial situation.  Why do you want to stay?  Is it for financial reasons or is it emotional, you love her and want to work on your marriage?  If it is emotional and you want to get back together I would suggest that you post on the staying board they may have some strategies for you.  But IMO it takes 2 people to be in a relationship and both of those people need to want to be there.  I also believe that we can only control/change ourselves we can't control/change others.  

I would ask yourself some questions... .What kind of relationship do you deserve?  What kind of household does your son deserve to be raised in?  :)oes your wife want to continue this marriage?  Why do you want to stay vs leave?  What do you get out of staying? What are your relationship boundaries? Are you able to see beyond your marriage? (you might not be ready to think about this yet) What kind of life do you want?  What do you want for your son?... .

I was married to an alcoholic for 20 years (I'm here because my SO-significant other has an uBPDxw).  I finally realized that I deserved someone that loved me and cared for me (up until then I thought my value was in how I took care of everyone else) but what about me?  Who supported and cared for me. One of my most pathetic moments for me in my marriage was when I had to have surgery, my first thought was... .finally someone has to take care of me (even for a little while) that is how low everything had sunk.  

Even though I did my best to protect my son from the conflict between his father and I he was still exposed to a lot of dysfunction, my son deserved a father that was present (sober) for him and that didn't constantly initiate conflict with his mom, ignore him, or was passed out in his chair in front of the TV.  

My husband wanted the marriage to continue (why wouldn't he?  I took care of just about everything and he liked the status quo) but I didn't.  I stayed in my marriage way longer than I should have also for financial reasons (did this make any of us happier... .no).  I was also fearful of leaving, after 20 years it was a big change, could I do it, what would not having a partner (even a drunk one) be like? Then their was my co-dependence could I take the car to the mechanic for example? How do you do it? (my husband did this for 20 years and I had forgotten how). So I stayed in my dysfunctional/codependent marriage, for financial reasons on the surface, but it was truly FEAR.  Fear I couldn't support my son and myself, fear I would be lonely, fear of handling everything with no help, fear of not being capable... .FEAR.  But eventually, I pushed through the fear, asked for help from friends and family and received it.

In terms of cheating I did not experience that in my marriage but I did experience that back in my 20's.  For me cheating is a boundary and if that boundary is crossed it is a deal breaker because a fundamental trust in the relationship is broken. (This is my value, my boundary).

My marriage ended in divorce.  

My husband lost his wife, his son, then had his 3rd DUI, and showed up to work drunk, lost his license, lost his job, used his retirement to pay for attorneys... .he hit rock bottom.  He then started the road to recovery and has been sober for the last 4 years. He has rebuilt his life.

My son saw his mother take control of her life and create something better and much more healthy for the both of us.  He also saw his father become sober.  He saw that things can change for the better if you take charge of your life.

A year after my marriage ended I met my SO.  He is a wonderful man who is smart, funny, caring, thoughtful, silly, capable... .I finally have the mutually caring relationship that I deserve.  Our relationship is interdependent and not co-dependent and I am truly happy.

I tell you my story so that you can see that you are not alone in your struggle to figure out what path is right for you, that it can be scary, and hard but also because there is a future for all of you and it may not be what you expect.

My heart is with my son's. I don't want to leave my wife but, right now, I don't see an alternative without her help.

This is exactly why I say consult an attorney (you don't have to retain the lawyer), you don't see an alternative but you might not know all of your options.

Take Care,

Panda39