oh the drama

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

My BPD expects me to have boundaries. I am an artist and a chef. I have a lot of female colleagues and she claims I sleep with all of them. I am very set on not hiding my emotions and don't have any pretenses. This is very contra her behavior of lies and deceit. I have a very set of rules as a public figure of who I allow into my space where as she always mixes with degenerates which can be damaging to my career. When I tell her they are not welcome I step into a minefield. I am going through her umpteenth break up. I don't even bother to pack up or to stay out of 'her' bedroom after she told me to leave. I just ignore her mood swings. Even my step children are tired of her treatment of me.

[adaw]

My BPD expects me to have boundaries. I am an artist and a chef. I have a lot of female colleagues and she claims I sleep with all of them. I am very set on not hiding my emotions and don't have any pretenses. This is very contra her behavior of lies and deceit. I have a very set of rules as a public figure of who I allow into my space where as she always mixes with degenerates which can be damaging to my career. When I tell her they are not welcome I step into a minefield. I am going through her umpteenth break up. I don't even bother to pack up or to stay out of 'her' bedroom after she told me to leave. I just ignore her mood swings. Even my step children are tired of her treatment of me.

[adaw]

Our latest fight was her allowing a gay friend to get into bed with her. When I told her I do not appreciate it I was told I'm unreasonable and jealous.

[adaw]

Well now I'm laying on the couch processing the insults, verbal and physical abuse. She recently took up acting using my agent and got severely angry when she heard I got a big role and she will be background. What makes a f loser like you so special. I will tell the agent what a f up you are and get you kicked from set. She once succeeded in getting me fired from set by interfering I changed agents and had to start at the bottom again but soon my experience showed and I went back to where I was. I told the agent if my BPD badmouths me to fire her. I'm not a big star but get good offers. She then got her friends to spread rumors I challenged them and exposed them in public damaging her standing. She was peed off as they now realize they got played. She had a succesful army and business career but gambled it all away.
Her gambling addiction ptsd and BPd all goes untreated and she is failing I am supportive and pulled some strings to get a new background role. I hope she doesn't screw it up and damage my standing in the entertainment industry

[once removed]

She then got her friends to spread rumors I challenged them and exposed them in public damaging her standing.

what kinds of rumors, and can you elaborate on what you did as far as challenging them and exposing them, damaging her standing? it seems counterintuitive, but you may be playing directly into the drama and making matters worse for yourself.

[adaw]

That I am a cheater, liar, gold digger, lazy sloth, alcoholic and drug addict. I spoke to the sources face to face.

[schwing]

Hi Adaw

My BPD expects me to have boundaries.

No. I think she expects you to take responsibility for her (disordered) feelings, which is unreasonable.

I have a lot of female colleagues and she claims I sleep with all of them.

When her disordered feelings (e.g. fear of abandonment) flare up, she imagines that you must be intending to abandon her.  So she rationalizes these feelings by believing that you will sleep with all of your female colleagues.  This is the source of her jealousy.  

I am going through her umpteenth break up. I don't even bother to pack up or to stay out of 'her' bedroom after she told me to leave. I just ignore her mood swings. Even my step children are tired of her treatment of me.

One of the criteria for the diagnosis is "a pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation." This sounds like an apt description of what you are going through in your relationship.  You need to decide if the "idealization" part is worth the "devaluation" part.

Our latest fight was her allowing a gay friend to get into bed with her. When I told her I do not appreciate it I was told I'm unreasonable and jealous.

Consider that she created this situation specifically so she could accuse you of feeling exactly what she feels; and in a way make you the owner of her feelings.

She is the one who is "unreasonable and jealous." But she cannot deal with this aspect of herself.  So she provokes you into acting the part, so that she can accuse you of such. In her mind, someone is disordered, and she prefers to believe that it is you.

I hope this is helpful.

Best wishes,

Schwing

[Notwendy]

Hi adaw,

It is understandable that being in a relationship with a pwBPD is very frustrating. One of the first goals of improving a relationship is to try to stop the conflict, or at least dampen it down. It is hard to work on improving when feeling angry, resentful. Surely being badmouthed to others, and insulted is crazy making. Although you have little control over what your SO says and does, when couples are in the throes of conflict, someone needs to step back at least for a bit.

This explains the idea

https://bpdfamily.com/deciding_guide/01.htm

What are your goals for improving the relationship? I am sure you have several wishes that your SO would do differently but for any changes to happen, we have to start with ourselves. We can't really change another person. It helps to start looking at ourselves, trying to be less triggered.

It can be a relief to vent, but venting doesn't lead to solutions unless we get into the situation with more detail. Please post what your wishes are so that other posters can share what works for them.

[waverider]

Unfortunately reactive badmouthing out of frustration and temporary childish spite is a common BPD trait, fighting it gets you nowhere, often just ups the anti.

If you appear to "defeat" the issue, the issue just transfers and it is like playing whack a mole as you run around trying fix dramas.

Your interaction in these dramas is often the result they want, even more so than winning any particular points. It is the drama process. Processes are ongoing and have no end point.

Better to find a more diplomatic version of 'whatever" and display your own qualities by example. If you are both involved in the dramas it is less obvious who is to blame , and so you both get tarnished as drama queens.

[waverider]

Our latest fight was her allowing a gay friend to get into bed with her. When I told her I do not appreciate it I was told I'm unreasonable and jealous.

Can you think of a way of making a boundary about this rather than justa a demand/request? What are the consequences other than futile fight about it?

Often these types of behaviors are a way of testing whether you have boundaries or just empty threats.

If she tells you to leave and nothing happens then it teaches her that she can make these sorts of comments with no consequence... It becomes simply an easy shot behavior to release frustration.

[adaw]

I am known for not being PC and diplomatic. This drives my PR up the wall. I say what I feel. Yes I am self righteous but have earned it. As a critic I do not wear gloves and the same rule apply in my personal life. If you attack my character and integrity I do not walk away. I know this is not good traits to have around a BPD, and this might sound unempathetic but it is the BPD's problem not mine. I am in the unfortunate position of being in the public eye and cannot afford to have secrets or blotchy traits in my personal life. It annoys my BPD and she loves the limelight. She will try to steal the show and I have to fix the blunders as my PR said she won't fix my BPD's screw ups as I am her client not my BPD. 

[adaw]

Two incidents happened and I had to step back. Firstly her late husband's brother embezzled his clients out of hundreds of thousands and she asked me to get him out of the country. Obviously I refused. Secondly a homeless guy came begging at my car door. She handed me money to give to him. I did not. 'You will die on the streets of terrible diseases.' She told me. There is several institutes within a four block radius that I support and they take care of the homeless. I worked extensively with homeless people for years and know hand outs don't help them. I won't sacrifice my beliefs to make her happy.

[waverider]

I am known for not being PC and diplomatic. This drives my PR up the wall. I say what I feel. Yes I am self righteous but have earned it. As a critic I do not wear gloves and the same rule apply in my personal life. If you attack my character and integrity I do not walk away. I know this is not good traits to have around a BPD, and this might sound unempathetic but it is the BPD's problem not mine. 

But it has become your problem by association, hence why you are here. This is the Improving board, how do you think you can improve things if you simply continue to directly combat and challenge everything the way you are?

Often a pwBPDs aggressive defensiveness is fueled by the knowledge, or expectation, that your reactions are likely to be equally aggressive. As stated previously, it is the drama process. Without reaction there is no process and it becomes wasted energy. Everybody eventually gives up wasting energy for no reward.

For things to change, we have to change, as that is all we can control, otherwise things stay the same.

Being a critic you do it for a reason, to provide unbiased educated informed reviews, not out of self importance and ego protection. That is the difference between a good critic and a bad one. Bottom line does a particular criticism benefit anyone, does it have a purpose. If it degrades your own environment it is not even benefiting yourself

[SamwizeGamgee]

So, I'm guessing at the post title that she called you heartless.
If it helps, I adopted the attitude that I am talking with a toddler when I listen to my wife.  Sometimes the anger explodes, she says things she doesn't even understand, and then it's over. 
It's like water off a ducks back at this point and gets nothing from me.  And maybe that's why she doesn't explode much anymore, I just don't react or engage.

Put another way: don't wrestle with the pigs. They like it, and you're going to get muddy.

[VitaminC]

Two incidents happened and I had to step back. 

Ok, how did you "step back" exactly, adaw? What did you say or how did you react? And what was the outcome? Have you read the lessons available here in the 'Tools' section?

How can members help you with the situation you described? What is your question?

I won't sacrifice my beliefs to make her happy.

I don't believe anyone should sacrifice their beliefs to make another person happy. I don't think anyone on this site counsels such a thing.   How we express or articulate or live those beliefs and where we see them being challenged is an interesting thing to look at, however. 

[formflier]

I say what I feel. Yes I am self righteous but have earned it. As a critic I do not wear gloves and the same rule apply in my personal life. If you attack my character and integrity I do not walk away.

Not sure how you set up one of those "poles" or voting things... .  but if we put this to a vote... .how many of the long timers here would say that this sounds like a young FF.  (young in the sense of not being on the boards very long... .being new to learning about pwBPD)   

Adaw,

A lot of what I'm going to say... .can be seen as what I would have said to myself if I could go back in time.  Since I can't go back in time... .I'll have to use my magic time travelling arrow to send myself a message.

https://youtu.be/hpm6UWyU5IM


in order of importance

1.  Gain understanding of healthy boundaries and boundary enforcement as fast as you can.  Focus on holding the boundary and not "pushing back".  There is no "punishment" involved in a boundary incursion.  The visual here is that they "bounce off" the boundary and it's over.  It's up to them to figure out how many times they want to smash their head into the boundary.  While it is satisfying (and unhealthy) to taunt them a first... .second and third time about their actions... .don't.

https://youtu.be/wSGkBWYDmrM

In BPD land... .it's better for you to not be on top of the boundary, you don't care if they are 1 inch or 1 mile from the boundary.

2.  Respond... .don't react.  A response takes time and wisdom to formulate.  If you lack either of these two elements... .keeping mouth shut is a winning strategy.

3.  Keep reading the article about drama triangle.  Be deliberate in your "response" (see above) to get off the triangle.  This is your decision.  Other people can hop on and off all they want.  Ignore this.  You will claim that you aren't "into" drama.  You are... .you just don't understand the power of the dark side yet... .drama is not good.  Understand it and run the other way. 


4.  This is going to be like learning a foreign language and the language is spoken by people with a totally different culture.  Everything will be backwards... .this is ok.  Learning the language and culture will help you communicate with them. (pwBPD)

5.  Be selfish and focus on self care.  (I was raised to think of others first)

FF

[Cat Familiar]

Yes, FF, you've come a long way!  And I see great positive changes since you've been working with your psychologist!

Adaw,
I'm a lot like you too. No nonsense. But here's the deal: you're in a relationship with a person where honesty, straightforwardness, directness doesn't work. In fact, it's counterproductive.

What does work is not catering to them, not walking on eggshells, but being strategic. And to be strategic, you have to learn their language, which is really different than the language those of us without personality disorders use. It's much like someone going to a foreign country and trying to communicate with a native speaker by speaking English, just louder! They're not going to get it and they'll think you're rude.

Start by reading the lessons and practicing. It takes a while to acquire the skills. If you don't do it and continue on your current path, you'll just have more of the same. She's not going to change her ways and if you want to continue the relationship, it's up to you. It's not fair, it's a total pain in the ass, it's a lot to learn, but it works.

[adaw]

I finally cracked tonight after she kept on hammering on a very sensitive topic and kept on doing it until I lost the whole plot of not jading it worsened the whole scenario to the extend that it almost got physical.

[schwing]

Hi Adaw,

In my experience, sometime people with BPD (pwBPD) try to provoke us to exhibit the very same emotions they are trying to project upon us.  For example, if they are angry and cannot accept that they are angry for no good reason, they might try to provoke anger in us. Now suddenly in their mind, it is not they who have an anger issue, but us.

This is a way for them to past responsibility of their own feeling onto other people.

One way of dealing with this, is the minute you realize you are being provoked, just walk away.

Hope this helps.

Best wishes,

Schwing

[lovenature]

PwBPD have core shame and hate for themselves, they will pick up on and remember what is sensitive and hurtful for their partners (attachments) so they can take the opportunity to feel better about themselves at times. Remember that they make up their own reality to fit their current emotion of the moment; sometimes it makes no sense in reality, and this is a big reason why it is so painful.

Remember who you were, and know that is who you are; we can all get better if we learn from our experiences.

[adaw]

I walked away but cannot leave the house because she has violent and destructive tendencies. Even her daughter who is uBPD, said she wants her mother out of her life.

[sweetheart]

Hello adaw,

What is it about her violent and destructive tendencies that prevents you from leaving the house?

[formflier]

I walked away but cannot leave the house because she has violent and destructive tendencies. Even her daughter who is uBPD, said she wants her mother out of her life.

"Switch lenses"... .this is how she controls keeping you there.  Once the realizes that her "violent and destructive tendencies" don't control you, perhaps they will get better over time.

pwBPD rarely put energy and time into things that "dont' work for them".  They are getting some sort of dysfunctional result from the things that they are doing.

Our hope and goal is to "reward" their "healthy" or "functional" behavior and not reward behavior that is dysfunctional.

Bottom line:  Boundaries can help this situation.   She gets to decided what comes out of her mouth.   You get to decide what goes in your ears.

If you don't like what is going in your ears... .it is up to YOU to fix that... .NOT the person that is saying those things.

 

Hang in there!
FF

[adaw]

We are both art and antique collectors. We live in a house with museum status. She previously destroyed valuables and poured flammable liquids over herself and the furniture. I do love her and is very concerned for her own safety. She has reckless and dangerous behavior traits and I know sometimes she just acts to see if I will come to her rescue 

[Lucky Jim]

Its hard but I suggest you refrain from engaging.  Leave the room, leave the house.  Insure the valuables.  My Ex would goad and bully me until she got a reaction, then she could point the finger at me, exactly as Schwing notes.  Not a fight you are going to win so don't play the game.

LJ

[Lucky Jim]

PS Don't beat yourself up -- it's normal to "crack" or react the way you did.  LJ

[adaw]

I'm not sure if I am posting this in the right place.
I have a friend who is a manual laborer and he makes a living out of dumpster diving, recycling and salvaging. He helped her to remove building rubble and to take some furniture to her daughter, who also suffers from BPD. The friend called her sexy and played with her hair and stroked her back in front of the young lady. She was so upset by this that she told her husband that she wants her mother out of her life. He phoned me and ask if I were aware about this behavior. I lost it and asked them both separately what happened. She went into attack mode and he just ignored me. I know this can be an attempt to ruin a 20 year old friendship. She didn't consider her children and start rumors in the neighborhood that I'm verbally physically and mentally abusive (yes I know she is gas lighting. So today I went NC as far as possible but still cleaned the house while being bombarded with threats and insults. I could not even share that I had a major breakthrough iin my career. She bragged that she got a job through my agent for the weekend. I calmly replied so did I. But I dare not mention that about the new opportunity that I got offered. I am at wits end.

[formflier]

She has reckless and dangerous behavior traits and I know sometimes she just acts to see if I will come to her rescue 

Yes... .and the answer is... .don't rescue her.  This kind of behavior is best left to professionals. 

Call 911.

Make sure your insurance policies are up to date.

Do NOT insulate her from her choices.  If insurance or police determine that she is liable... .that is her issue... .not yours.


FF

[adaw]

I just told her son in law that I am going to ride this wave they asked me to move in with them because they are tired of seeing me being abused by their mother. I said I will not play her game and abandon her

[Moselle]

Do NOT insulate her from her choices.  If insurance or police determine that she is liable... .that is her issue... .not yours.

Let me echo FF here. I spent a lot of time and effort defending mine successfully from her own Fraudulent activities. I and my lawyers successfully defended her on a technicality.

It was very poor judgement on my part. Because she got worse!

Hang in there Adaw. It's tough

[sweetheart]

Its hard but I suggest you refrain from engaging.  Leave the room, leave the house.  Insure the valuables.  My Ex would goad and bully me until she got a reaction, then she could point the finger at me, exactly as Schwing notes.  Not a fight you are going to win so don't play the game.

LJ

What are your thoughts about changing the relationships current stuck dynamic and trying a different approach to your wife's dysregulated behaviour?