Making a decision. Need advice/support

[Toph]

This is my first post, but I have been using this site as a resource for a long time. Thank you all for being here, it's helped me through some really tough times.
My wife was diagnosed with BPD a few years before we met.  We have been together for the past eight years (married for last two years). It's been a rocky road to say the least.
A few days ago, I made the decision to go no-contact and leave. This was the result of her falsely accusing me of harassing her and then calling the police. While she has often threatened to call the police, she never had until the other night. This has been a theme throughout our relationship - just when I think there is a line she won't cross, she blows right through it.
It's been eight years of every type of abuse imaginable. It's been eight years of slowly having my life stripped away from me. I have reached a point where I feel like my only purpose in life is to serve her and her never ending need for attention and validation. If and when I take time for myself, I am punished for it. If she feels I am enjoying myself without her, she will do whatever it takes to sabotage it. No matter how much I give, it's never enough.
It's now been almost four days since I left. I find myself going though the same stuff each and every time. At first, I am certain it is the right decision. But, after a few days, I start to question myself. When I talk to family and friends about it, they just tell me I need to leave and never look back. If it were only that easy!
I love her and I so badly want things to work. But, she refuses to seek help. She has been hospitalized a number of times and talked to numerous doctors, but now has convinced herself she no longer has BPD.
I really don't know what to do. If things go the way they have in the past, she will expect me to return in a few days and we will go on as if nothing happened. But, I can't keep doing that. I want her to get help, but I don't think she will. Do I give her an ultimatum? Or do I take my out and just move on?
Thank you for listening, just getting it out is helpful. 

 
 

[Pook075]

I really don't know what to do. If things go the way they have in the past, she will expect me to return in a few days and we will go on as if nothing happened. But, I can't keep doing that. I want her to get help, but I don't think she will. Do I give her an ultimatum? Or do I take my out and just move on?
Thank you for listening, just getting it out is helpful. 

Hi Toph and welcome to the family...officially!  I'm really glad this site has helped you in the past and hopefully we can be more helpful in a two-way dialogue.  It got me through quite a lot as well when things were at their worst.

First, a few questions.  Eight years together.  Any kids?  Are you a homeowner?  Give us a basic idea of the family dynamic, who works, etc.

Next, I could have written your story when I broke things off with my ex.  I felt like I was invisible, that I didn't matter, until I didn't do something my wife expected.  Then I was punished.  The sad part was, I couldn't see it though, I didn't recognize the cycles and I didn't even understand that it was an abusive relationship.  I figured all couples were like that...I was clueless.  So you're light-years ahead of me from that aspect.

My situation was unique though in that I had a BPD daughter with my BPD ex-wife.  So I was reading the books and learning about ending conflicts, standing firm on boundaries, etc while also always leading with love and compassion.  The second part of that sentence is key- it's not being kind when they're kind and tough when they're tough.  That leads to war.  It's about understanding that they're sick, that they have unimaginably bad days, and how we react will untimately decide the outcome.

Your path forward is incredibly simple.  Choose your own mental health first at this time.  Be kind to her and try to have productive conversations about what you need, and truly listen to her as she tries to explain what she needs.  She might not be able to put it into words because she's sick- but you know what emotions look like in someone sad, scared, angry, etc.  Soothe those emotions to make her feel understood, and that alone works wonders. 

Meanwhile, do not argue over anything.  If things get heated, be the adult in the room and step away gracefully.  Tell her that you love her and you don't want to argue, then stand by that.

Mainly though, this must be about you and allowing yourself to heal.  You'll see things after two weeks of separation that you can't see today.  That's your body normalizing once again and processing everything that's happened.  Focus on eating well, getting in some exercise, and dedicate a little time to hobbies or friends.  Maybe even consider counseling for yourself.  All these things will help you mentally heal and that's crucial.  The better your headspace, the less you'll be drawn into arguments over who let the dog out or who was supposed to pick up shampoo last week.

One last thing- there's no good way to ask anyone to consider therapy.  I just did with you because I understand the situation you're in and what it did to my mental health when I was there.  You can look at my words logically and see that yeah, maybe it makes sense.  But for your wife, she's only going to see the unsiad implication- that she's crazy and you hate her.  That's because BPDs think emotionally when they're in distress; logic all but turns off for them and they're ready to fight.

I wish you luck, my friend.  Please ask all the hard questions you can think of and we'll do our best to answer from our knowledge and experiences.  If you just need to rant a bit, we understand that too.  Just let us know how we can help!

[ForeverDad]

I too am asking whether you have children together.  Why?  Children can give a disordered spouse immense leverage.

Typically I would say, Please don't have children until you are confident your spouse is well on the way to substantive recovery.  Reading your brief summary makes me feel even more strongly that you don't gift her that control over your future... it would be devastating for for not only you but especially for any children from the marriage.

That you spouse hasn't improved over the years is a severe lesson for you to accept... that it is not going to get better.  If you return...

The general pattern of BPD on a person with such traits is that it worsens over time.  Not even "But I love her..." is powerful enough to overcome the disordered perceptions and behavior.

By most reports here...

• more years with a disordered spouse does not reverse the devastating consequences of that close relationship.
• Sometimes... if you're very lucky... an experienced therapist can do a balancing act between gaining trust and guiding a patient toward a measure of recovery.

Why weren't you able to aid your spouse to better perceptions and more positive objectivity?  It's not your fault.  Rather, it's the close proximity of the closest of relationships - spouse and family - that makes it so difficult for the person with BPD traits (pwBPD) to get past the years of emotional baggage of the relationship.  BPD is a disorder of intense emotional dysregulation.

You simply can't fix her.  She would have to truly want to fix herself.  Compare it to taking your spouse on a boat ride and she keeps jumping into the water and you keep jumping in, risking your life and safety to try to save her, but she repeatedly keeps leaping overboard.  At some point you have to accept the grief of losing a troubled relationship.  The other isn't changing for the better, so positive change is up to you.

I and many others here were once in your shoes.  At some point we had to accept the reality that what we wanted so much just wasn't possible.  Two decades ago... My then-spouse made many unfounded allegations against me when we were nearing a huge crisis similar to your current crisis, into separation, into a divorce and even beyond.  Cautious professionals (police, court officials, children's services, etc) barely stepped in, often reluctantly.  Although every allegation was unfounded (false) the most they would venture was to state the allegations were "unsubstantiated" (without any documentation) and so they basically remained neutral and somewhat passive defenders of the truth.

Should you return?  I guess you can sense my perspective.  The real question is whether you have the determination to accept reality and are finally ready to listen to yourself...  Can you accept reality in your head and give your heart time to regain equilibrium and catch up later?

[Toph]

Thank you for taking the time and responding to my post. I really appreciate it !
No. We don't have children together. I have two kids from a previous marriage. As you can imagine, this is a huge challenge for her. We don't own a home together. She has had 5 different jobs over the past 7 years. It's a bit complicated, but we have spent a number of years having two separate places but spending most of our time together. For the past 3 years we have lived in the same home but we were renting. More recently, she got a new job and is now renting a place in different town. My income is what supports us for the most part. 
When things started to get bad early in our relationship, I spent a lot of time educating myself on the disorder. Surprisingly, she was very open with me early on. In fact, she came right out and told me about her diagnosis not long after we met. Looking back, I find this strange because I don't think she has ever shared this with anyone since I have met her.
As you know, it's not easy. I think most people that know me would consider me a patient and understanding person. But, there are certainly times where I have had enough and haven't handled situations in the best way. This is especially true when she threatens my safety.
I know how to respond when she is experiencing strong emotions etc. And typically I handle these situations well. So much of what I have learned is spot on when it comes to her behavior. But, with her, I feel like there is more to it. Maybe it's more typical than I know, but she is incredibly critical of everyone. And this is especially true when it comes to me. If I say or do something she doesn't agree with, it's a guaranteed argument. And we aren't talking about major issues. We are talking about what I suggest having for dinner. That's all it takes. If I so much as use a tone that is perceived as disagreement, she will lose it on me. I still remember her saying to me only a few days after we met "you will find we will get along just fine as long as you agree with me." At the time I thought she was joking. But, now I know just how serious she was.
I think you (ForeverDad) hit the nail on the head when it comes to accepting reality. Logically, I accepted reality years ago. But, my heart is having a really hard time letting go. I cling to the good times and what I imagine our life could be. But, I am starting to seriously question if that is possible. If I am being honest with myself - I don't think it is.
I am going through it right now. I recognize there is a strongly established trauma bond that is going to take some time to get over. I have spent the last 8 years on pins and needles. I know I need to heal and I know I can't do that if I am in contact with her. So far, she has been quiet, but I don't think it will last. I am hoping for the best but preparing for the worst.
Again, thank you !
 
 
 
 

[ForeverDad]

It's been eight years of every type of abuse imaginable. It's been eight years of slowly having my life stripped away from me...

At first, I am certain it is the right decision. But, after a few days, I start to question myself. When I talk to family and friends about it, they just tell me I need to leave and never look back. If it were only that easy!

Around here we truly understand the tendency or weakness to fall back into past patterns.  That's why it is often mentioned here that we do truly need all the support we can get.  Left to our own devices we tend to lapse back into old habits and patterns.  It's often called a three legged stool, the minimal number of support legs needed to sit on a stable stool...

• trusted friends and family
• local counselor or therapist
• peer support such as here

Since it seems you're finally at a threshold decision, though with a risk of relapsing, you need a fourth leg to that metaphorical stool.  An experienced lawyer is vital to assist you to unwind the marriage with the least legal and financial damage.  Be sure to emphasize to the lawyer that the home environment has degenerated to the point that your spouse has started making allegations and now called the police.  (BTW - an allegation of "harassment" is a legal term taken very seriously by the courts, so beware.)

[Toph]

Thank you for the advice.
I have the support and the therapist. It definitely helps! But, it's still a lot to work through.
As I have mentioned, I blocked her number and removed all connection via social media etc. The only way she can reach me is via email. Over the years, she is typically the one to block me. I have tried to stay away from playing this game with her, so I typically don't block her. Rather, I just wait for her to come around and eventually she will reach out and we will move on as if nothing happened.
I am a bit stuck right now as to what to do next. On one hand, I see the benefit of staying no-contact. On the other, it is nervous making not knowing where her head is at right now. We have gone through this so many times. Typically it takes a few days and she will reach out in one way or another. I haven't heard a thing from her in over four days. While this isn't totally out of the norm, it isn't the typical pattern.
There are things we need to figure out. I am in a tough spot right now because we moved out of our place after she took a new job in another state. My plan was to stay with her until I found a new place closer to where I work. Now I am staying with family in another state. But, I need to get back to work soon and don't have a place to live. That is my top priority right now.
I still have things at her place that I will eventually need. So, at some point, I know I will need to contact her. I am not sure if I should do that sooner or later. Part of me wants to get it over and done with and figure things out from there. That way I really don't have a reason to go back to her apartment. But, I also feel like it may make sense to just stay away right now.

[PeteWitsend]

...
It's now been almost four days since I left. I find myself going though the same stuff each and every time. At first, I am certain it is the right decision. But, after a few days, I start to question myself. When I talk to family and friends about it, they just tell me I need to leave and never look back. If it were only that easy!

...
I really don't know what to do. If things go the way they have in the past, she will expect me to return in a few days and we will go on as if nothing happened. But, I can't keep doing that. I want her to get help, but I don't think she will. Do I give her an ultimatum? Or do I take my out and just move on?
Thank you for listening, just getting it out is helpful. 

 

I feel like I just gave this advice in another thread.  It's helpful to write things down, or save screenshots or emails, or some hard evidence of past fights so you can "hold on to those feelings" and remember how miserable she made you.  That helps you stay the course.  Look back on those times when things were bad and you were telling yourself "All I want is to be out of this, and be done with this."  That's what you need to remember. 

And when you're out and working on healing, you don't need to do that anymore; you can truly just move on.  But when you're still in this gray area, with your perception of the world still warped by the pwBPD & the way they intentionally mislead you and deny your own experience to suit their interests, it's helpful to hold on to what you know & felt. 

I do think the effect of being in a relationship with a pwBPD - and a marriage no less - does do some deep harm to our worldview and ability to perceive things.  I remember having a lot of ups and downs the week I was moving out and filing for divorce, but then we had a child together and what really tore me up was the feeling of leaving her, not my soon-to-be-ex-wife.  Earlier in our marriage though, I had a lot of the same feelings and would second guess myself like you were.  I think by journaling and taking stock of how I felt, why I felt the way I did, and what I could and should do, it helped me move through it in the end without having any second thoughts. 

[PeteWitsend]

I wanted to add: the bottom line is, you're not happy in the marriage, and you've identified why.  You tried to make it work, and you don't owe her anything more than that. 

You can simply leave; you don't need any further justification of that.

[Pook075]

I still have things at her place that I will eventually need. So, at some point, I know I will need to contact her. I am not sure if I should do that sooner or later. Part of me wants to get it over and done with and figure things out from there. That way I really don't have a reason to go back to her apartment. But, I also feel like it may make sense to just stay away right now.

Question- is there a mutual friend you could ask to grab what you need?  Or even a relative on her side that you get along with?  That would allow you to avoid direct contact and still move quickly.

Like you said, the priority is finding somewhere to live so you can get back to work.  It sounds like getting your stuff back (in another state) will be complicated, so maybe it doesn't have to be a priority.  I agree with you though that getting it over with would feel like an accomplishment!  My worry would be things disappearing.

There's no set rule to reach out or remain no-contact...each situation varies depending on the person.  There's no telling how she might react if you do reach out, so it's hard to give advice there.

[ForeverDad]

It sounds like you're expecting a divorce to happen?  However, waiting for her to do something next, to actually divorce you, not just disparage and reject you, is not a strategy.  Yes, she's unhappy (and worse) over so many things about you but ponder that over the years she has never actually gone so far as to end the marriage.  She evidently is comfortable having someone to vilify and to argue with.  That's an unbelievable comfort zone.  But that's not you.

If she were file, can you expect what all the vitriol and false insinuations and allegations it might contain, seeking to get all assets, claiming you should get all the debts, etc?

Wouldn't it be best to get a decent and realistic paperwork filed first?  Sure, she would respond and file her version of reality but at least you would have laid the groundwork.  Fortunately, there are no custody and parenting complications.  Your spouse would try to deflect it into sour grapes and still claim extensive emotional whatever.  But the fact is the divorce should essentially just be simple... dividing assets, debts and various jointly owned items.

A surprising aspect is that you two already have separate residences.  That removes the risk that one of you would have to seek a protection order to force an eviction of the other.

As for items left at her place, ask the police for an escort to reclaim your personal items.  It called a peace or civil standby (?) where an officer of the court is present to ensure an incident doesn't occur.

A "civil standby" refers to a situation in which a deputy is present at a location to help maintain peace and order during a civil dispute. The deputy is there to prevent any conflict and ensure safety when the parties involved in the dispute need to interact, often to retrieve personal belongings. While the deputy does not intervene in the dispute itself, they ensure that the exchange occurs peacefully.