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Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits. Practicing lawyer, Senior Family Mediator, and former Licensed Clinical Social Worker with twelve years’ experience and an expert on navigating the Family Court process.
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Author Topic: Some Things My pwBPD Just Said  (Read 422 times)
DaddyBear77
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Divorced
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« on: March 08, 2017, 02:46:18 PM »

I am Machiavellian.
I am a predator.
I have tried to destroy my wife.
I ruined our child's infancy and early childhood, on purpose, to teach her a lesson.
I purposely took out predatory loans to teach her a lesson.
I use fear mongering to inflate the severity of our current financial situation, with the goal of trying to tighten my grip of control.
I have tried to force her back to work out of retaliation for the things I resent her for.
The things I resent her for are also made up and inappropriate - put another way, the things she's demanded and insisted upon are entirely reasonable, and I'm UNreasonable for resenting her for it.

If these weren't actual things that were just said to me 10 minutes ago, I would think this the most ridiculous and outrageous bunch of horse manure I've ever seen.

I post this because
1. I get the feeling that many of you also hear these kinds of things, and
2. Maybe if I see them all written down out of context and while I'm not in the middle of an argument, I can see how utterly insane this is.

DB
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Lalathegreat
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« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2017, 04:02:34 PM »

Monday my pwBPD told me that I TORTURE him. After pulling up articles on google about how harmful torture is (um, duh!) and raging for 30 minutes I was finally able to decipher that he was referring to my facial expressions that he feels imply "scorn".

So yeah - I get what it's like to be told complete and utter BS. Sad thing is that I have no doubt he believes it.
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PeteWitsend
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« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2017, 10:54:06 PM »

DB, I feel ya.

My wife dithered on going back to work for an entire year (she just got a job recently and has been working for about a month).

I always told her the same thing: I know you expected to have a career, and if you want to go back to work now, that's okay.  If you want to stay home with the boys, that's okay too.  I am not pushing you to earn money, and we don't need it.  We're doing fine on my salary.  Whatever you decide, I'll support your decision 100%."

I was very careful and deliberate with my words here because I knew how she liked to twist things.  For a while I would add "You do seem ready to work, and I know with your education and training it's hard staying home with two kids."  ... .but this kept getting interpreted somehow into me "pushing her back to work."

of course even the former, more mild statement got twisted into me "pushing her back to work before our kids were ready, because he's not making enough for us."

You just can't win.
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PeteWitsend
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« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2017, 11:00:42 PM »

Monday my pwBPD told me that I TORTURE him. After pulling up articles on google about how harmful torture is (um, duh!) and raging for 30 minutes I was finally able to decipher that he was referring to my facial expressions that he feels imply "scorn".

So yeah - I get what it's like to be told complete and utter BS. Sad thing is that I have no doubt he believes it.

haha, my wife loves to do the googling articles thing as well. 

she also loves to pick pop-psychology self-help books that frame her as the victim, and dramatically leave them open, lying on her bedstand: What to do When You're Too Nice, How to Deal with the mother in law from hell, How to Stop Being the Nice Girl and get what you deserve, Etc etc.
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Riguez

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« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2017, 07:42:01 AM »

Mine broke up with me a month ago and said that I 'used her', 'devalued her', made her feel like a 'chav', that I  was 'not a gentleman' and 'have all the flaws of her ex husband and none of his redeeming qualities'.  This all followed me asking that she drive to a shop she wanted to go to, rather than me, because I had taken some migraine pills that make me drowsy.  That same weekend she told me that she loved me.

About 10 days after she dumped me, I find out from her son that whilst we were still together, she had been communicating with another guy, who she met online (we were together 3 years+ but had multiple re-cycles).

Roll on another few weeks and she's on holiday in Los Angeles, presumably with the same guy (we both live in England).

I'm still feeling pretty miserable about it all.  Hurtful words are one thing but combined with betrayal... .a double dose of pain.  Ultimately it was all about entitlement.  As she said to me 'I'm a classy woman and if you want that, you have to pay.'  She moved onto someone with deeper pockets than me.  I did so much for her and her sons whilst I was with her but she said some deeply hurtful things to me. 

Ultimately I feel so low for missing someone who was abusive to me and who lined up another lover whilst I was still in her bed.
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Notwendy
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« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2017, 06:53:30 AM »

I think the common theme to these kinds of statements ( whatever the content ) is Victim position.

The Karpman triangle has been very helpful to me. I have found that pw BPD tend to see and say things from victim position. Why is this preferred. Victims don't have to look at themselves for the cause of their discomfort. They project it on to someone else- to blame. Often the Victim is paired with a Rescuer. The Rescuer can be accused of being the persecutor, and then try to fix ( Rescue) the situation. Or a third party can be Persecutor. All people involved in the Triangle can take all three roles and it can be played out with any number of people. If there are three people involved, that can be a classic way to play this out. But one person can do this. A Victim feels bad, blames it on something else, then "rescues" themselves through addictive behavior " I deserve this drink". Shopping " I deserve this expensive item". Cheating " If he/she treated me better I wouldn't   have to look to someone else for love".

For someone with BPD, feelings are facts in the moment, so if your partner feels in the moment that you are the worst person in the world, well to them you are. However, if we can have strong boundaries about who we are, we can not react to this. If you firmly believe the accusation isn't true, then it isn't true, no matter what they say. The temptation is to get on the triangle as a rescuer, and try to sooth or mend their distress. They don't know how to manage their feelings well- but neither do we. They feel bad, accuse us, then we feel bad, and so try to fix things for them to make ourselves feel better.

I grew up with this classic triangle between me, BPDmom, and my father, and alternated roles with my siblings. I didn't even know there was another way to relate to a close relationship. It was all I knew. So, I brought this way to relate into my marriage. Once I could see the Karpan triangle for what it is, and how it was playing out, I could then make an effort to change it. It takes some time and practice. It is very hard to not step in as rescuer- to let someone feel their own feelings and be able to manage our own bad feelings when being accused of causing them distress. But if we can be sure about what is ours ( our issues ) and what is them ( their responsibility to deal with their feelings) we can resist rescuing and trying to set the record straight, and not react to outlandish accusations.
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formflier
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« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2017, 08:15:41 AM »

I am Machiavellian.
I am a predator.
I have tried to destroy my wife.
I ruined our child's infancy and early childhood, on purpose, to teach her a lesson.
I purposely took out predatory loans to teach her a lesson.
I use fear mongering to inflate the severity of our current financial situation, with the goal of trying to tighten my grip of control.
I have tried to force her back to work out of retaliation for the things I resent her for.
The things I resent her for are also made up and inappropriate - put another way, the things she's demanded and insisted upon are entirely reasonable, and I'm UNreasonable for resenting her for it.
 


She is a lightweight wannabe accuser... .

"You got married to another woman in a secret ceremony in our barn... .how could you keep this from me... "

"You messed up and had a love child with one of your affairs, gave her (the female love child) my first name so you could put her on our insurance... ."   (this one used to shock me... .assume my wife's name is Jane FF. If I name my daughter Jane... .and give her my last name FF... .then I can sneak her on my insurance and provide for my child... .)  She had name and address of people that DID have a baby with her first name.  We happened to be in a McDonald's playland when the mom starts breast feeding... .and said her kids name. 

That's obviously how I normally introduce my love children to my wife... .

"You tricked me into taking this child into home daycare.  They are going to put me in jail for making him autistic and you will marry his mom... " 

I could go on... .   

 These type of things slowly died out as I avoided invalidation and stopped engaging with my wife on her "theories".

When I would engage on them and "prove" them wrong... .she would come back with an even bigger theory... .which I would "prove" wrong... .so... .even bigger theory... .and on... and on... .and on... .

FF
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PeteWitsend
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« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2017, 02:01:22 PM »

it's always been tough for me to validate the really nutty stuff.

my failure as a husband. 
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Notwendy
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« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2017, 07:23:20 AM »

I think the advice about JADE on this board is very helpful. I know that it is natural to want to defend oneself against unfounded accusations, but the JADE can add fuel to the drama fire.

I think it is important to see the distinction between validating feelings and validating something that isn't true. Sometimes the accusation can also be an invitation to be rescued. "I feel bad so you have to rescue me" via the drama triangle. Being that my role in my FOO was to do this, it was automatic for me to step in to soothe/fix someone's uncomfortable feelings.

Although the accusations can be outlandish, it is the perspective ( victim) that is behind it, even when the accusations are true. For instance- you may accidentally pick up the wrong item at the store for her. This is true- you made a mistake. The problem is in the interpretation- you made that mistake on purpose because you don't really love her/him and this makes you the most horrible person on the planet and this is the biggest mistake in the world.

A hard part in BPD relationships to me is repair. We are human. Most of us are not terrible humans, but in any long term relationship, we are bound to mess up in some way. We could be in a grumpy mood, have stress with work or kids, not be so attentive, get stuck in traffic and come home late. PwBPD also have difficulty repairing an error or wrongdoing- it triggers a lot of shame in them.

What is our part when faced with an accusation? One is to decide our boundaries. Is is real? If so, a simple apology " I grabbed the wrong can of soup honey, sorry, I can take it back" then stop- don't JADE. Even if the argument continues. Is it not true? Then you don't have to defend it- or validate it. The advice is to validate the feeling, but not the accusation. "Honey, it must feel horrible to think I have a secret love child" You could also let him/her vent the feeling, but say little and just try to not react. If it gets abusive, you can stop the conversation- you don't have to tolerate it.

It is hard to break patterns but with practice, these episodes can escalate less. The thinking doesn't stop, but we can be less reactive to them.
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formflier
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« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2017, 12:03:47 PM »

it's always been tough for me to validate the really nutty stuff.

my failure as a husband. 

Many times it's better of to not even try... .for the extreme stuff.  Critical to understand the "validation target"... .the emotion they are experiencing.

FF
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formflier
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« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2017, 12:15:53 PM »


What is our part when faced with an accusation? One is to decide our boundaries. Is is real? If so, a simple apology " I grabbed the wrong can of soup honey, sorry, I can take it back" then stop- don't JADE. Even if the argument continues. Is it not true? Then you don't have to defend it- or validate it. The advice is to validate the feeling, but not the accusation. "Honey, it must feel horrible to think I have a secret love child" You could also let him/her vent the feeling, but say little and just try to not react. If it gets abusive, you can stop the conversation- you don't have to tolerate it.

It is hard to break patterns but with practice, these episodes can escalate less. The thinking doesn't stop, but we can be less reactive to them.

Notwendy has nailed it.

The times when I was able to listen... .non-judgmentally... .even if it was getting a little edgy towards being abusive, seemed to produce a longer calm.  Especially if I eventually found a good "validation target"... .

The critical part in doing this is to be self-aware.  If I'm getting triggered... it's up to me to step away. 

Even if not triggered, it's up to me to toss in some extra self care.  Take another walk, grab a special meal out... .do something extra with a kid.  Think of it as "filling up your own love tank... ."  (In fact... I'm heading out now... .by myself to get something special)

It will be interesting for me to look back, years from now on this period in my life.  I suspect I may be approaching some sort of "steady state" with the dysfunction.  Periods between outbursts go for weeks.

Usually an outburst is around me holding to some kind of boundary.

There are other times, such as this morning, where I can tell that she is girding for a fight, there was no boundary for me to uphold so I quickly said yes to her request to take kids to her parents for lunch after church.  (some of her extended family is in town)

She seemed a bit shocked that it was that easy.  No need for me to comment on it further... .

So... .to wrap up this post.  Yes the patterns are really hard to break, but it's worth it.  Even if the r/s isn't exactly what I would have chosen, increased stability and less outbursts are worth it.

FF
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