I suppose this is a positive sign.

She reached out first.  Sent me an email of autopay items that she normally paid... and would need to be switched over.

There was a bit of snark in it as she described one bill as tied to "YOUR" house... .(her to me)... .other than that... it was just factual.

FF

Wow, now THAT'S a subject line!

Do you now have three accounts - his, hers and ours? Or is it now his and ours?

My DH is a financial advisor and recommends the his, hers and ours any time a couple has differing spending styles or financial beliefs. He has mediated couples on how funds are paid into the joint account for household bills.

Would having her own account be an option, with an agreement on what goes into the joint account and what is paid out of that account? Would she contribute to the joint account?

When you say, the bills that she pays, are the payments coming from her account?

She apparently had 4 regular bills that she funded from my retirement.  Monthly autopay type thing.

She sent me all the info for those.

FF

The email I sent her...



and she responds (formatting is same as I sent and she sent to me).   The formatting she used is typical of when she is "pounding out" an email.



She got back to the house with kids around 9ish... .  The couple times we spoke she was stressed... .a time or two was sharp and nasty.  I didn't take any bait.  Didn't really offer any solutions or support either.

FF

Money has an emotional component, and so is a difficult topic to resolve where "feelings" equal facts.

Money is also power, and can be abused in marriage- both ways.

I have found that the feelings about money in marriage can be different from the wage earner and the lesser or non wage earner in the family.  I also think the concept of "financial infidelity" ( not being honest or open with money) is real and can hurt a marriage.

As the stay at home parent, I didn't earn a paycheck. It also set my earning capacity way back. My H was able to advance in his career unencumbered by worrying about child care, being called at work if a kid had a virus, parent teacher conferences or any responsibilities for the day to day care of kids, cooking, cleaning the house. But there was no paycheck for this, so it didn't seem to "count" in the bank account and he could still say he earned all the money.

The law accounts for the inequality. Marital property including retirement accounts is 50-50 in many states, but emotionally this may not feel this way. In addition, to share things 50-50 requires trust, accountability and maturity. I think many couples have different ideas about money, but basic trust has to be there.

Having a spouse not recognize that the unpaid labor as an at home parent has been an important contribution to the well being of the family and the wage earner's career can be hurtful, just as taking advantage of the wage earner's money can be.

Your wife did betray a trust, and is now forgetting history. However, she also has a point- she doesn't have a high earning job and if she was a stay at home parent for years, this did hurt her earning potential and retirement savings. If you made this money change without discussing it with her, then she is taken off guard and hurt by it. Yet, if she isn't responsible with money you have the right to protect yours and your family income.

I think this is at the heart of the decision- if a person is irresponsible with money, then they should not have access to a large amount of it. This doesn't need to be Biblically justified, it is simple action/consequence. She doesn't like it? Well, too bad. She isn't trustworthy with money.

Stick to your boundaries with this. But in addition- realize the emotions and inequality connected with income between two spouses. Her feelings have some validity. But actions are actions. If she couldn't drive reliably - would you hand her the car keys even if she wanted the car? I hope not. Privileges require responsibility. She isn't reliable with money.

The accounts are set up cleanly. To me, the question now is what amount goes into the joint account to pay household bills and joint investments, and then what FF autopays from the account that covers investments in his own name.

All great ideas.  I'm not a financial advisor... .but am pretty savvy with money.  Very comfortable with multi-million dollar line item budgets... .etc etc. 

I get it that having an outside set of eyes is great... .  All of those ideas come down to compliance with any agreement or budget... .as Grey Kitty and others keep pointing out... .expecting compliance... .long term on ANY agreement... .is a pipe dream.

More later.

FF

As someone facing a near bankruptcy situation, I can say with some authority, do the most responsible thing with the finances, and trust yourself when you feel like you've come up with the best answer. As you said, you're savvy.

As for what's "fair" or "right," trust in the greater good here. I didn't hear you say anything about forcing her hand with the money she earns, nor did I hear you say you intend to shirk your responsibility to be equitable (note: that's different from equal).

To that point, it's exceedingly rare that both partners in a relationship contribute equally to the financial picture. But it's necessary to a healthy relationship that we consider the equitable contributions each side makes to the functioning of a household.

It would appear that she is realizing today the impact of this change... .

Basically very emotional... .lots of overtalk.  I walked away from several conversations when she got abusive in her speech.

I engaged on a few things I shouldn't have... once I realized what I was doing... disengaged.

She ended the evening with a 15 minute long "command session" where she sounded like a drill sergeant... .ordering the kids around to clean and pick up things.  At 10pm... .1 to 1.5 hours past their bedtime... .depending on the kid.

I recorded most of it... .my question for my P will be is there greater harm in the confrontation where the kids get sent to their rooms "so Mommy and Daddy can speak privately... " or to let her get her need to "be a queen" out... .

There was nothing directly abusive in the way she did it... .but it was a horrible example... .kids are robots to be commanded.  A kid displeasing me will be corrected with a louder and louder voice... .compliance is mandatory... .  Ugg... .

Hopefully things will seem better after a good night sleep... .it would appear she has moved back in the kids room

FF